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Nautious1
Newbie

Registered: 01/10/23
Posts: 8
Loc: Up North
Last seen: 8 months, 23 days
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 1
#28232227 - 03/16/23 03:23 PM (10 months, 9 days ago) |
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So here's some more pics.
Tweezed off the big blob - it definitely isn't myc piss. It's gelatinous and held its shape pretty well. Slime mold? I only see it in one of my 6 trays.
Other pics has a jar of grain spawn - inoculated with agar 2/7/23. I don't see any contam or excessive myc piss all my jars looked similar when I put them to bulk roughly 3.5-4 weeks ago.
I also have my martha set-up and humidifier tote. There's a bathroom fan at the bottom of the tent as well on a 2 minute on / 10 minute off cycle for FAE. I did have the tent RH swinging from 75-95% RH to induce pins - but I read once pins appear to try to keep the RH steady at a higher level.
Lastly there's some more tray pics. You can see there are some pins that look healthy - and a lot that aborted 
This is my 4th try at Pans and the first time I got pins so even if I just get a bunch of aborted pins I guess it's still progress!
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Baba Yaga
β₯ coir grower

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,958
Loc: Hyperspace Chicken Coop
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Nautious1]
#28232236 - 03/16/23 03:33 PM (10 months, 9 days ago) |
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The substrate surface is looking dry so best case scenario is that this is causing your fruits aborting. At least it does in this photo.

Try dialing in your martha and go from there.
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Nautious1
Newbie

Registered: 01/10/23
Posts: 8
Loc: Up North
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga]
#28232241 - 03/16/23 03:39 PM (10 months, 9 days ago) |
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I'll try hand watering the casing a bit to moisten it up and bring the RH up a bit to keep it wet. Does the ultra sonic misting cause pins to abort? I've read so many places that the pins abort due to misting but Gordo TEK seems to disprove that.
Thanks again for the responses!
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Baba Yaga
β₯ coir grower

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,958
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Nautious1] 1
#28232284 - 03/16/23 04:19 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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It's better to maintain certain moisture level, pins don't like it if they are getting too dry between misting, especially not if this is happening repeatedly. I "mist" fruits directly with a spray bottle without being detrimental. Sometimes you get cultures that will not tolerate any misting which are not worthwhile keeping IMO. Those weak cultures might either be contaminated or have a genetic predisposition towards this behavior, I haven't figured the reason for this out yet.
Since your trays seem to get dried up and wetted repeatedly there is a good chance that adjusting the conditions in your martha will resolve your problem. Don't be shy when spraying these trays as it is actually really hard to drown pans but easy to run them too dry.
Not sure about those blobs and your jars look somewhat unusual as well but not in an instantly alarming way, could just be the grain prep or how it recovered after a late shake. Hydrating the subs and dialing in your conditions is your best bet at this stage, then see what happens. Might work, might not.
Edited by Baba Yaga (03/16/23 04:29 PM)
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sporemaster420
Stranger


Registered: 02/11/23
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Re: Which method should I use to grow these??? [Re: Baba Yaga]
#28232289 - 03/16/23 04:23 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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hey, can someone tell me if this would work for a pan cyan grow?
I read the JCM method and I think Iβll try it, but Iβm going to add perlite, by doing this, I we should we able to use a smaller pump right? The perlite should help boost humidity and only 2-3 chambers flushes of air per hour are required?
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Baba Yaga
β₯ coir grower

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,958
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Re: Which method should I use to grow these??? [Re: sporemaster420]
#28232297 - 03/16/23 04:36 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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Let us see a plan/drawing of what you were thinking. Generally speaking: a lot of things can potentially work, but the fruiting set up is just one part of the puzzle. Culture work and sterile technique are equally important.
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sporemaster420
Stranger


Registered: 02/11/23
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Re: Which method should I use to grow these??? [Re: Baba Yaga]
#28232324 - 03/16/23 05:02 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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Itβd basically be the same as a JCM bubbler but with perlite and less airflow. The drawing doesnβt show a heater, I may or may not use one depending on ambient room temperature.
Edited by sporemaster420 (03/16/23 05:03 PM)
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Baba Yaga
β₯ coir grower

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,958
Loc: Hyperspace Chicken Coop
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Re: Which method should I use to grow these??? [Re: sporemaster420] 2
#28232341 - 03/16/23 05:16 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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I assume that the perlite will be submerged in water? In that case I don't se how it would improve keeping humidity and help with a smaller air pump. Perlite works the way it does by providing a large surface area which it won't if submerged. You will have to run it to see it it works but it seems the perlite is just complicating things without bringing any benefit. I personally would just run the JMC with the smaller pump or try a regular mono tub instead.
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karri0n
Mind Traveller



Registered: 08/29/20
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Re: Which method should I use to grow these??? [Re: Baba Yaga] 3
#28232343 - 03/16/23 05:19 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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The primary purpose of the pump and air stones in a JCM setup are to bring fresh air in, though they also contribute to the humidity of the chamber in not really fully understood ways.
Wet perlite is a passive method for providing humidity in chambers that don't have active systems. It won't do anything at all submerged in water, because it works by having large surface area exposed to air.
The main source of humidity in a JCM is the aquarium heater warming up the water. The aquarium heater is an active system and will put far more water into the air than perlite can.
Adding perlite to the chamber won't do anything to change how much air the pump is putting into the chamber, so it wouldn't change anything in regard to pump size.
--------------------
Panaeolus Bisporus
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ruawakeyet

Registered: 05/03/21
Posts: 1,862
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Re: Which method should I use to grow these??? [Re: sporemaster420]
#28232455 - 03/16/23 06:32 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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I agree with Baba and Karrion. The heater is an important part of it, and would not work correctly with perlite surrounding the heating element. (The perlite would act as an insulator and create a hot spot.)
A smaller pump may still work, but in addition to the fresh air exchange aspect, the amount of bubbles created by the more powerful air pumps create a splash effect. Nearly every time a bubble pops, a tiny droplet of water splashes upward, in some random direction. Those tiny droplets add up, and help supply water to the casing layer and fruits. A small air pump just doesn't create many bubbles and that effect is lessened a lot compared to the more serious pumps.
One option to keep it quiet would be to add multiple "cheap" aquarium air pumps, but they would add up in cost pretty quickly.
Please keep us updated with what you end up doing and how it works!
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Murphy07
Stranger
Registered: 08/22/21
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Nautious1]
#28232661 - 03/16/23 07:39 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
Nautious1 said:

So here's some more pics.
Tweezed off the big blob - it definitely isn't myc piss. It's gelatinous and held its shape pretty well. Slime mold? I only see it in one of my 6 trays.
Other pics has a jar of grain spawn - inoculated with agar 2/7/23. I don't see any contam or excessive myc piss all my jars looked similar when I put them to bulk roughly 3.5-4 weeks ago.
I also have my martha set-up and humidifier tote. There's a bathroom fan at the bottom of the tent as well on a 2 minute on / 10 minute off cycle for FAE. I did have the tent RH swinging from 75-95% RH to induce pins - but I read once pins appear to try to keep the RH steady at a higher level.
Lastly there's some more tray pics. You can see there are some pins that look healthy - and a lot that aborted 
This is my 4th try at Pans and the first time I got pins so even if I just get a bunch of aborted pins I guess it's still progress!
Hey nautious do you mind sharing a pic of of the hepa filter set up younhave for this one?
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ruawakeyet

Registered: 05/03/21
Posts: 1,862
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Murphy07] 2
#28232860 - 03/16/23 08:44 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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I don't see any mention of a HEPA filter on Nautious' setup.
I run one as an intake filter for my fogger tote, it helps keep the fogger water clean and really reduces the maintenance.

That's a 6" to 4" duct reducer attached using silicone adhesive. I hook up an inline 4" booster fan on a speed controller using a short length of dryer duct, then the rest of the flex duct runs to the fogger unit.
I'm currently rebuilding my fogger to maximize it's efficiency, I only have one more major step before it's done. I will post it once complete.
Back to the HEPA intake filter: To preserve the life of the air purifier's filters, I enclose the entire thing inside a cardboard box. I cut a hole for the duct reducer to stick out of, and cut out one side of the box and tape a furnace filter in it's place to act as a pre-filter. If I ever need to replace the pre-filter, I just cut the tape, pull out the old furnace filter, and tape in a new one. I use silicone adhesive to seal up any gaps or holes in the box to prevent unfiltered air leaks.
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Nautious1
Newbie

Registered: 01/10/23
Posts: 8
Loc: Up North
Last seen: 8 months, 23 days
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Murphy07] 1
#28232895 - 03/16/23 09:14 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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Hey Murphy - this is what I use for HEPA filtration. Some air purifier filters from Amazon taped to the top of the tent.
I definitely get some airflow coming through the fan on my homemade humidifier tote so I put a coarse filter on that - but some filtration is better than none I suppose!
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Murphy07
Stranger
Registered: 08/22/21
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Last seen: 4 months, 18 hours
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Nautious1]
#28232944 - 03/16/23 10:01 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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Nice man just trying to get a visual, I'm gonna be making one this weekend.
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TheDoobsker
Amateur


Registered: 05/22/20
Posts: 799
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Re: Which method should I use to grow these??? [Re: karri0n] 1
#28233000 - 03/16/23 10:53 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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I have definitely ran my jcm with the aq heater unplugged (when room temp was pretty high) and they did well. hygrometer still read in the high 90s. I am convinced using the aq heater does improve results, but not essential.
As far the perlite, this has been mentioned before but i don't remember what thread. I don't see how it could improve humidity at all if it's submerged
Quote:
karri0n said: The primary purpose of the pump and air stones in a JCM setup are to bring fresh air in, though they also contribute to the humidity of the chamber in not really fully understood ways.
I think the bubbling just increases water evaporation. water vapor diffuses into the bubbles and then those bubbles break through the surface, pushing all of this water vapor into the chamber
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sporemaster420
Stranger


Registered: 02/11/23
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Re: Which method should I use to grow these??? [Re: Baba Yaga]
#28233019 - 03/16/23 11:20 PM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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I was going to only fill it up about β
of the way to the top of the perlite. But I agree with everyone that the heater may not work if itβs submerged in perlite. Iβm not sure if perlite+air stones will add extra humidity.
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rockyfungus
dirty


Registered: 03/01/21
Posts: 1,062
Loc: Front range
Last seen: 21 days, 1 hour
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Cased wild coast and inserted into the tent. Little test batch before I fill her up with diff varieties. Still not happy with tent performance and have had to spray a few times. I always seem to run pans at the worst time of year with all the crazy spring shifts.
Next up Nec D, BVI, cambo, and maybe estero.
Edit: did someone mess with the thread name or have I not been on here for a moment. Or did I DO THAT?
Edited by rockyfungus (03/17/23 04:47 AM)
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Baba Yaga
β₯ coir grower

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,958
Loc: Hyperspace Chicken Coop
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Murphy07] 1
#28233200 - 03/17/23 05:34 AM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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Shit yeah nah, can't have that happening.
Good luck with your pans rocky.
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ekabpils
Exploring Exotics



Registered: 10/20/21
Posts: 167
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 9
#28233273 - 03/17/23 07:24 AM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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Good Texas culture:
Edited by ekabpils (03/17/23 07:25 AM)
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Murphy07
Stranger
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ekabpils]
#28233312 - 03/17/23 07:49 AM (10 months, 8 days ago) |
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Nice canopy dude!
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