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Baba Yaga
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: mushroom_gnome] 1
#28193139 - 02/18/23 02:20 PM (11 months, 4 days ago) |
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Relative many estero grows are showing these weird deformed caps.
here is just a couple:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27793722#27793722 https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28042510#28042510
This particular phenotype seems just to happen with estero, haven't seen it any other pan yet.
The darkening stems and caps more likely to be caused by additional contamination in my opinion rather than also by a genetic factor. IIRC the spawn for these was still inoculated with a syringe? So chances are high that contam is causing this.
Quote:
mushroom_gnome said: Contam or something different? These pancakes colonized fantastic with no seeming signs of contam. Fruits in multiple jars are expressing in this way.


That's contam IMO. Not sure what exactly causes this but you could try keeping them dryer and see if new fruits are looking happier. See, if you can track it back in your cultures or if other grows from other plates/LC are doing the same.
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mushroom_gnome
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga]
#28193177 - 02/18/23 02:42 PM (11 months, 4 days ago) |
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Hmmm.. I suspect my casing material. Time to re-pasteurize.
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old_fart_out_west
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: mushroom_gnome]
#28193209 - 02/18/23 02:53 PM (11 months, 4 days ago) |
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Thank you Adas and Baba Yaga! Really helpful information and context.
The two sources of fresh air in my martha are 1) the humidifier (placed outside the tent) and 2) slits cut in the tent. I'm going to experiment with a small computer fan, attached near the top, that pushes fresh air in, to see if that improves my fruits.
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Scotay
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Quote:
old_fart_out_west said: Thank you Adas and Baba Yaga! Really helpful information and context.
The two sources of fresh air in my martha are 1) the humidifier (placed outside the tent) and 2) slits cut in the tent. I'm going to experiment with a small computer fan, attached near the top, that pushes fresh air in, to see if that improves my fruits.
I'll be watching old fart!! I'm just glad there's people cool enough on here to share their knowledge and experiences. Happy Sunday you panheads!! Peace and chicken grease!! πβοΈ
-------------------- Just chillin like a Villain and talking to like minded individuals!! Mush Love!! πβοΈ
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SirPsycho
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Scotay] 7
#28194127 - 02/19/23 06:28 AM (11 months, 3 days ago) |
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Cyan huasteca RDU and bispo in rye and straw bottles. Cased with sterilezed peat/verm, no pH adjustment.
Cyan was g2g using colonized millet, took 6 days to colonize bottles. Bispo was A2G and took upwards of 20. They've both been consolidating for about a week now
Plus bispo in rye and coir bottles, A2G a week ago and shaken on day 4.
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Timestop413
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: SirPsycho] 1
#28194383 - 02/19/23 11:22 AM (11 months, 3 days ago) |
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Do these jars have too much condensation inside of them? They still have a day or two left of colonizing. Recovered within 24hours of shaking but I am concerned of bacteria or spreading bacteria if I spawn bad jars. Pan Cyan Estero on rye inoculated with small ketchup cup (from spore print) on 2-2(17 days ago).
Edited by Timestop413 (02/19/23 11:26 AM)
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Baba Yaga
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Timestop413] 1
#28194448 - 02/19/23 12:16 PM (11 months, 3 days ago) |
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I would spawn this and keep a record in which tray or tub this went.
What I have found is that if you shake a jar which is close to full colonization then it can produce a lot of condensation from all the mycelium recovering all at once. Especially with pans where it is happening fast.
I don't see any bacterial wet spots in this jar. If it looked alright beforehand then it should be still alright.
Found an old post about this.
Quote:
Baba Yaga said: Final update on the poorly recovered jars:
So just to recap I spawned these two jars which wouldn't recover growing out nice and fluffy but looked like this which often happens for me when shaking a jar that is almost done.
Two weeks after last shake:

I was throwing jars like this out at the beginning but after a few of them I questioned whether this was actually contamination as there were no signs of any contam before the shake, no mold, no creamy dense mycelium, no syrupy wet kernels or suspect looking bald spots. Yes they do recover poorly and they look wet after the shake but there is a difference to bacterial wet and condensation wet IMO. The final push to give them a go was reading a statement of member conicr saying that this happens sometimes but its no deal breaker. Now I spawn jars like this whenever I get them and have no problems. Also sitting in the jar for 2 weeks doesn't seem to make a difference. I still do throw jars out though just not when totally fine almost done jars recover poorly after a shake.
Both tubs received FAE during colonization and were put into full fruiting condition one day after full colonization. Temps plummeted for a couple of nights while fruiting and went down to 68F in the room, I've got the heater going now.
First clone C4T3 which was a day behind but turned out to be an OK tub. This is also the least productive clone out of the 6 I got going.
236g wet. 1 myco quart @ a spawn ratio of ~1:2.5

Second clone C3T3, pretty good and I used the other style tub for this which I like only downside is you can't see through the plastic.
327g wet. 1 myco quart @ a spawn ratio of ~1:3.5

If you have a jar like this and there was no sign of contamination before the shake then try spawning it. You might be surprised and I sincerely hope it will be in a good way.
Edit: update photo and weight
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Timestop413
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga]
#28194484 - 02/19/23 12:44 PM (11 months, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Baba Yaga said: I would spawn this and keep a record in which tray or tub this went.
What I have found is that if you shake a jar which is close to full colonization then it can produce a lot of condensation from all the mycelium recovering all at once. Especially with pans where it is happening fast.
I don't see any bacterial wet spots in this jar. If it looked alright beforehand then it should be still alright.
Ok thanks, I will send it.
I'm also going to make some water agar plates. I see Hindsight mentioning using PF jars to clean things up, would water agar basically do the same thing without the added step of having to make pf jars?
Edited by Timestop413 (02/19/23 12:46 PM)
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Baba Yaga
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Timestop413]
#28194493 - 02/19/23 12:56 PM (11 months, 3 days ago) |
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Water agar is working really well. I like to let the sample grow out a bit more like 30mm in diameter and then go back to regular. I have poked straight to LC too but doing the extra step of checking on regular agar feels better.
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psilocybist
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 4
#28194496 - 02/19/23 12:57 PM (11 months, 3 days ago) |
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 Same panaelous cyanescens goliath, germinated from 8yr old spore print. Now cleaned on agar. Will make a reliable LC out of this plate.
Also, just not to waste other germinated spores (which were directly injected into nutrient lc media, and showed fast growing mycelium in a week, no off smells, and liquid was clearest with floating mycelium) last night I inoculated 25 buckets of properly pasteurized coco+peat+urea+straw substrate, using those LC bottles. I like this gamble. No big loss, but surely the win will be big. (Each bucket holds around half liter substrate.)
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Adas
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: psilocybist] 1
#28194594 - 02/19/23 02:18 PM (11 months, 3 days ago) |
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8 years.. holy cow
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mikeybox
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So I'm currently fruiting pan cambo Goliath in a humidity tent in aluminum cake tins.
They're growing the second flush now, and the substrate has shrunk significantly. I'm thinking it could use some water.
Is bottom watering safe to do with pans? Can I dump water in the tin so that the substrate is floating in water for a few hours, to rehydrate it?
Or is that a risky move?
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Adas
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: mikeybox]
#28194636 - 02/19/23 02:37 PM (11 months, 3 days ago) |
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Bottom watering is fine but I'd personally focus more on keeping the casing wet.
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Timestop413
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: mikeybox]
#28194783 - 02/19/23 04:13 PM (11 months, 3 days ago) |
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I noticed my trays would shrink quite a bit as well, wasn't sure how to keep them from doing it. Also, Baba Yaga I know you just referenced some of those jars not recovering the best but if jars are recovering..do any of you grain to grain transfer with pans or do you individually inoculate each jar you are going to spawn with agar or LC?
Edited by Timestop413 (02/19/23 05:08 PM)
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Baba Yaga
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Timestop413]
#28195280 - 02/19/23 08:58 PM (11 months, 2 days ago) |
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Did grain to grain a few times. It works like with any other mushroom.
I am running more smaller batches for the last years and use LC for everything. Have a lot of 100 and 250 ml jars and use those to inoculate 2-5 jars so I can run a variety of different genetics. Would only do g2g again if I wanted to produce a shitload of pans with good performing clones but that's not my goal. I am more into having fun with experiments and throw out most of the stuff I grow.
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Baba Yaga
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: mikeybox] 1
#28195290 - 02/19/23 09:03 PM (11 months, 2 days ago) |
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Quote:
mikeybox said: So I'm currently fruiting pan cambo Goliath in a humidity tent in aluminum cake tins.
They're growing the second flush now, and the substrate has shrunk significantly. I'm thinking it could use some water.
Is bottom watering safe to do with pans? Can I dump water in the tin so that the substrate is floating in water for a few hours, to rehydrate it?
Or is that a risky move?
I bottom water but only if a good pin set is present and the fruits are already 2 inch or so tall, that is when they really start taking off and suck up a lot of water.
Quote:
psilocybist said:
 Same panaelous cyanescens goliath, germinated from 8yr old spore print. Now cleaned on agar. Will make a reliable LC out of this plate.
Also, just not to waste other germinated spores (which were directly injected into nutrient lc media, and showed fast growing mycelium in a week, no off smells, and liquid was clearest with floating mycelium) last night I inoculated 25 buckets of properly pasteurized coco+peat+urea+straw substrate, using those LC bottles. I like this gamble. No big loss, but surely the win will be big. (Each bucket holds around half liter substrate.)
What is the urea for? That is the first time I'm hearing about it being used. Nitrogen source?
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psilocybist
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 1
#28195377 - 02/19/23 10:34 PM (11 months, 2 days ago) |
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Yes, a natural source for nitrogen. It doesn't shift pH of media, and all my agar preparations contain a sub-percent amount of urea. Plus, since pancyans are dung-loving species, urea wouldn't be toxic to them at all. Stamet lists urea as a ingredient for substrates as well, (composted)
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Scotay
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: psilocybist]
#28195402 - 02/19/23 10:59 PM (11 months, 2 days ago) |
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Quote:
psilocybist said:
 Same panaelous cyanescens goliath, germinated from 8yr old spore print. Now cleaned on agar. Will make a reliable LC out of this plate.
Also, just not to waste other germinated spores (which were directly injected into nutrient lc media, and showed fast growing mycelium in a week, no off smells, and liquid was clearest with floating mycelium) last night I inoculated 25 buckets of properly pasteurized coco+peat+urea+straw substrate, using those LC bottles. I like this gamble. No big loss, but surely the win will be big. (Each bucket holds around half liter substrate.)
Wowww brother....8 years.... That's amazing!!! Just goes to show how resilient these little beasts are right!?!? Makes me hopeful for some of the prints I have. I do have a Goliath print. I'll just be happy when I get my first pansπ― I hope everybody had a pantastic weekend. Happy Monday to y'all friends and neighbors. πβοΈ
-------------------- Just chillin like a Villain and talking to like minded individuals!! Mush Love!! πβοΈ
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psilocybist
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Scotay] 2
#28195581 - 02/20/23 04:06 AM (11 months, 2 days ago) |
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Well I wasn't so hopeful about this spore prints too. They're certainly older than 8 yrs, cuz I received them in a trade here, in 2015. God knows how old they already were back then.
Also have a Semperviva mycelium going, this also sat in my fridge for 8 years, but not as a spore print. It was a spore syringe, which when I took out of fridge, inside the syringe, the spores were turned into a small dark floating globe  So I dumped out almost all the water, and then using a needle poked into the little globe, it kinda fell apart immediately. Then I poked the spore-bearing needle into agar. First petri was clean AF. Though I transferred twice. This is T2:

That little colony @ 6 o'clock is bacillius. But I've seen Semperviva mycelium running over such colonies like tanks go over toy cars
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ekabpils
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Timestop413]
#28195615 - 02/20/23 05:21 AM (11 months, 2 days ago) |
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Hi Baba,
the main drawback of placing it just after the spawn is that mushrooms grow on the side a lot. Some of them will stay small and will never grow further. This is the waste of substrate nutritious resourses. I see it on your first picture and had the same in mine. I never had this when used the more common approach to wait until the substrate will taken and only then place it for fruiting.
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