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Baba Yaga
β₯ coir grower

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,958
Loc: Hyperspace Chicken Coop
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: FriedEgg]
#28138556 - 01/13/23 07:18 PM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Haven't fruited a Jambo clone yet and after a quick search through my photos/posts it looks like I haven't fruited Jambos uncased yet. We will have to see how these 4 tubs will perform.
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mistermushly

Registered: 01/11/20
Posts: 192
Last seen: 10 days, 3 hours
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga]
#28138576 - 01/13/23 07:27 PM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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hey YAGA...
Quote:
If your fruits look like this then you will have to go back to spores and try again. This is either contamination related (which I think is more likely but don't have absolute prove) or genetic. Either way means back to spores. Pans can be as forgiving as cubes but one has to hunt for these cultures which makes more sense in my book than trying to tailor conditions to suit a weak or picky culture. I had good results with Goliath and Jambo and I have to admit that cambos seem to be less of a raw egg so there is potential to find something good with what you have. Nec-D is treating me well too.
Hang in there and try some more culture hunting, go back to spores if things don't turn out well and take lots of clones once your fruits look healthy.
I have been using the same flow that has been successful with cubes...
MS syringe ( or print) > agar > biopsy or cut wedge to LC > LC to oats or WBS > colonized spawn added in open air to pasteurized steer manure substrate / and or straw.
Wondering if I should go straight from an agar wedge to spawn?
What spawn do you use or think is the most prone not to go bacterial? oats? WBS? Rye berries?
Thanks YAGA!
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Baba Yaga
β₯ coir grower

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,958
Loc: Hyperspace Chicken Coop
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: mistermushly]
#28138597 - 01/13/23 07:43 PM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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If you have problems with trich and contam then cutting out the LC and going from agar to grain might help reducing contamination of your grain spawn.
If your spawn is prepped and sterilized correctly then it doesn't make a difference which type you are using. They are all the same in regards to contam resistance, if contamination is introduced during inoculation or together with a non axenic culture then contamination will be present in your spawn and subsequently in your substrate.
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mushroom_gnome
Stranger


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 3
#28138694 - 01/13/23 08:49 PM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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A method which I think might be helpful is to not isolate too far initially on agar. As soon you have a clean plate send the agar directly to grain with many genetics included- essentially closer to a MS. This diversity will allow the genetics that are better suited for your particular environment to prevail and hopefully fruit. At this point CLONE the first substantial, healthy, fruit. In theory this fruit will hold the genetics that are better suited to fruit in that given environment... in theory.
-------------------- Mystery Mushroom
Edited by mushroom_gnome (01/13/23 08:50 PM)
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ruawakeyet


Registered: 05/03/21
Posts: 1,862
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: mushroom_gnome] 1
#28138704 - 01/13/23 08:57 PM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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I concur.
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Baba Yaga
β₯ coir grower

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,958
Loc: Hyperspace Chicken Coop
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet] 2
#28138736 - 01/13/23 09:29 PM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Yes, that is essentially how to go about it but I would clone more than just the first good looking substantial fruit if I was looking for good genetics and had enough time on my hands. I would clone the first fruit that pops up, fruits from a cluster fruits that grow the biggest up until harvest and so on. You will also have to take into account that a clone is not a mono culture but still a group of strains. This means that when you are in the process of cleaning up a clone on agar then you might reduce the number of strains that are originally making up the clone and thus changing the properties/grow characteristics compared to the original clone material. This means that a culture that originated from a formerly promising fruit will not represent the same characteristics anymore. It often comes down to playing the numbers game and raising the odds by taking a few or more.
This time around growing I was only taking one or two clones per variety that I was growing cause I didn't have enough time to do more. Out of the 5 I only got good material from two of them. Even the Thai Cambos I had great success with the last years due to more variation in my cultures were not doing that well this time. IMO that was because I didn't hit the jackpot in the clone lottery which is not surprising considering the low numbers of clones I worked with.
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Scotay
The Mad Mush Guy

Registered: 05/14/22
Posts: 228
Loc: United States
Last seen: 4 days, 15 hours
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Mycolorado] 1
#28138801 - 01/13/23 10:25 PM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
Mycolorado said: That should do. I tend to go 2 transfers from germ plate but that could be overkill, especially if all is looking great. FYI, streaking is what you do with spores or LC. Literally making a streak of spores or solution on the plate to spread out the material so you can see individual cultures to choose from as opposed to having them all bunched up. Iβm guessing you made transfers?
Yes you're correct. I streaked ten plates from a print and just did my first transfer from the 2 best plates. 4 transfers for each of the two. Hopefully it stays nice and clean. I made the original plates on the 7th or 8th so relatively fast. Now it's hurry up and wait. Happy Friday to you!!! πβοΈ
-------------------- Just chillin like a Villain and talking to like minded individuals!! Mush Love!! πβοΈ
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ekabpils
Exploring Exotics



Registered: 10/20/21
Posts: 167
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 4
#28138848 - 01/13/23 11:51 PM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
Baba Yaga said: Is yours an Ez-Dialed Pasty Tub or an older style mono? I had the best results with older style when taping the bottom holes with 2 layers of MP tape and the top holes open or half open. When leaving bottom holes open from the start the sub near them would dry out as shown at the top of this page. Then reduced the tape on the bottom holes to one layer once knots started to form.
In my experience when giving FAE from the start the substrate will often start fruiting/forming knots before the surface growth thickens up. This keeps the surface more open and it doesn't form a thick mat during the first flush. This is to some degree culture and variety dependent though from what I have seen so far. Some cultures do better when you give FAE right from the beginning because they have a tendency to form thick top growth others you can let go for a couple of days before introducing fresh air which means less maintenance/misting in that time.
The Thai Suphan Buri Cambos always have a tendency for thick top growth for me and it was beneficial to give FAE right from the start. Like you can see in the examples below which are all clone grows.
Here is the difference in surface colonization of Thai Suphan Buri between conventionally colonized substrate, fruiting conditions given from 3rd day after spawn and a tub with fruiting conditions right from the start.

This Jambo clone is not forming that much top growth and the surface stays more open. The following photos are showing 4 different tubs 6 days after spawn. First one fruited at spawn, 2nd fruited one day after spawn, 3rd fruited two days after spawn and 4th fruited 4 days after spawn. It shows nicely how the top grows has been affected by the point in time that FAE was given.

Same thing with this Nec-D clone which does really well in both the unmodified and the old school tub. Photos below are showing both tubs 6 days after spawn. 1st one fruited at spawn in old school tub and 2nd lid flipped two days after spawn in unmodified tub.

Hi Baba )
Do the same experiment with isolated Texas culture. Have placed it in fruiting conditions right away after mixing grain spawn with sustrate. 8 day. Looks very promising.
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Baba Yaga
β₯ coir grower

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,958
Loc: Hyperspace Chicken Coop
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ekabpils]
#28138876 - 01/14/23 01:00 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Cool! Does your setup require additional misting or is the bubbler enough to provide ample conditions?
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Shrimps
Traveler



Registered: 10/13/22
Posts: 2,501
Loc: Under the sea
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 1
#28138924 - 01/14/23 03:10 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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It's an ez-dialed pasty tub. But since I have my pans now in the trays I don't have any problem with the substrate getting dry. And for my (pan-beginner) eye they look quite happy with the FAE from the start.
Thanks alot for your explenation! I really appreciate you taking always the time replying to my questions
-------------------- I am not crazy, I prefer the term mentally hillarious. Agar - The way to go! Clean spawn checklist Proper Surface Moisture Recognizing and dealing with contamination π
π΄ π° πΌ π² π» πΈ π½ πΆ π
π
π° πΏ
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ekabpils
Exploring Exotics



Registered: 10/20/21
Posts: 167
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 3
#28138942 - 01/14/23 03:55 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
Baba Yaga said: Cool! Does your setup require additional misting or is the bubbler enough to provide ample conditions?
No additional misting needed - the bubbler is enough. Grew about 10 different pans - worked great for all.
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Baba Yaga
β₯ coir grower

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,958
Loc: Hyperspace Chicken Coop
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ekabpils] 1
#28138952 - 01/14/23 04:31 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Looking forward to see how this turns out ekabpils. Haven't seen a substrate being fruited at spawn in a setup like this before. It does look good.
Quote:
Shrimps said: It's an ez-dialed pasty tub. But since I have my pans now in the trays I don't have any problem with the substrate getting dry. And for my (pan-beginner) eye they look quite happy with the FAE from the start.
Thanks alot for your explenation! I really appreciate you taking always the time replying to my questions 
I hope it will work out and is starting to show some movement soon. Please post some pictures when it does.
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RoscoeReturns
Crotchety chode man



Registered: 02/12/18
Posts: 1,738
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 4
#28139224 - 01/14/23 09:31 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Nec D spawn yesterday. Mixed 1:3 with hpoo/straw/coir/verm.

Today itβs moving fast.
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Shrimps
Traveler



Registered: 10/13/22
Posts: 2,501
Loc: Under the sea
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 4
#28139345 - 01/14/23 10:38 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
Baba Yaga said: I hope it will work out and is starting to show some movement soon. Please post some pictures when it does.
Well it's now day 4 after I spawned it and showed growth from day 1:

Fun thing is, the tray on the right is actually a 1:2,5 spawn/sub ration and the left one 1:3. Would have thought the growth would be faster on the 1:2,5 one. Think I will case it in a day or two.
-------------------- I am not crazy, I prefer the term mentally hillarious. Agar - The way to go! Clean spawn checklist Proper Surface Moisture Recognizing and dealing with contamination π
π΄ π° πΌ π² π» πΈ π½ πΆ π
π
π° πΏ
Edited by Shrimps (01/14/23 10:39 AM)
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cooleko
Augmentum provocatus

Registered: 08/15/22
Posts: 1,010
Loc: Seattle
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Shrimps] 2
#28139349 - 01/14/23 10:41 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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It's all about the grain distribution, sometimes randomness puts more grains towards the surface so you get faster surface colonization. It should take longer to fully colonize the whole substrate on the left but only by about half a day.
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Shrimps
Traveler



Registered: 10/13/22
Posts: 2,501
Loc: Under the sea
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: cooleko]
#28139361 - 01/14/23 10:48 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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yeah, I thought so aswell but still find it kinda funny^^ btw. this is actually my second attempt with pans, since the first ones failed. So hoping for the best here, but compared to the first grow, I don't think I've done any of the mistakes I made before and it feels like this time will be the charm Let's see
-------------------- I am not crazy, I prefer the term mentally hillarious. Agar - The way to go! Clean spawn checklist Proper Surface Moisture Recognizing and dealing with contamination π
π΄ π° πΌ π² π» πΈ π½ πΆ π
π
π° πΏ
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trippleblack
Stranger

Registered: 12/01/19
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Shrimps] 1
#28139372 - 01/14/23 11:01 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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dropping these to grain bags today 
several p. bisporus monocultures, ttbvi, necD,, ect..
anyone ever have a pan plate like that pan bisporus one on the left pic? usually these cultures don't cover the entire plate, but the bisporus on the left did. I don't know if it's good or bad, will know soon enough. It's clean and has been checked under the scope.
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Adas
Lonely Dreamer



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: trippleblack]
#28139390 - 01/14/23 11:11 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Looks way too thick for a Bisp. I think it's a contam.
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cooleko
Augmentum provocatus

Registered: 08/15/22
Posts: 1,010
Loc: Seattle
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: trippleblack]
#28139393 - 01/14/23 11:13 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
trippleblack said: dropping these to grain bags today 
several p. bisporus monocultures, ttbvi, necD,, ect..
anyone ever have a pan plate like that pan bisporus one on the left pic? usually these cultures don't cover the entire plate, but the bisporus on the left did. I don't know if it's good or bad, will know soon enough. It's clean and has been checked under the scope.

Is ttBVI the same as the BVI everywhere else or did you collect that isolate from a special source?
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trippleblack
Stranger

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: cooleko]
#28139399 - 01/14/23 11:18 AM (1 year, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
cooleko said:
Quote:
trippleblack said: dropping these to grain bags today 
several p. bisporus monocultures, ttbvi, necD,, ect..
anyone ever have a pan plate like that pan bisporus one on the left pic? usually these cultures don't cover the entire plate, but the bisporus on the left did. I don't know if it's good or bad, will know soon enough. It's clean and has been checked under the scope.

Is ttBVI the same as the BVI everywhere else or did you collect that isolate from a special source?
i thought they where all the same, but can't confirm.. tamarand tree british virgin islands.. "far as i know" only one guy from the virgin islands is the source for a lot of the bvi going around.
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