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ruawakeyet


Registered: 05/03/21
Posts: 1,862
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight]
#27993313 - 10/11/22 08:28 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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That's good to know about the spawn to bulk ratio. That's yet one more thing I'm going to change for the next grow.
I read your write-up on the steam pasteurizer, I like that a lot!
I was doing some reading the other day on some older threads and I came across this picture posted in an old user's signature.
https://files.shroomery.org/files/15-001/025726232-2015-01-02_22.53.21.png
I realize this user, (Azur) was banned, and that photo is old, but it is still bugging me. It claims that pasteurization temperatures should be between 131 to 140 degrees F. Can I get some reassurance, (from anyone), that this is plain wrong and old information? As far as I know that picture was reference material for a milk dairy, so it might not apply to mycology at all. I don't know what got that user banned, but maybe it was posting inaccurate information... I'm just trying to sort out the BS.
I see almost everybody using around 160 degrees F to pasteurize, and that is what I used as well. I also lost approximately half my trays to trich, but I honestly suspect my own sterile technique is at fault instead of the pasteurization temperature.
Thank you in advance!
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Hindsight
Mad Scientist


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet] 2
#27993346 - 10/11/22 08:53 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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I spent months researching this forum and other sources for ideal mushroom pasteurization temps. You will find MANY answers that range from 130 to 180 and you will find many answers on the timing as well. The problem is, few have conducted any scientific experiments on it to conclusively prove the best temp and timings. But that gives me an idea of yet another trich experiment to add to my current paper I've been working on to share here. It's all about trich.... what it looks like, what it does, how it gets in, why you sometimes get it in a tray and sometimes don't. All backed with with detailed tests. I will add pasteurization to the list of experiments to include in it. I have some agar plates growing pure trich, with tons of spores. I will knock up several ziploc bags of pan substrate with the trich spores, then pasteurize them at various temps and durations, then mix clean pan grain spawn in and see what happens when I grow each of them out. Updates to follow.
But having said that, I switched from Instapot to steam, which meant 12 hours in the instapot to a max core temp of 140-145F (in the pot brand I used - the brand JOC uses go higher), and note that the core temp is not held a full 12 hours - I don't know how long it takes the IP to get the core temp to 145 nor how long it stays there on a 12 hour cycle. In my team setup, with a steam chamber temp of 163, I hit 160 core in about 4 hours and then leave it there for another 2. Stovetop is faster, but sterilizes the outer portions of the substrate that contact the boiling or near boiling hot water. I can say from personal experience that the difference in contamination rate of my substrates since switching to steam has been dramatic. It isn't the steam - it's just the numbers: slowly heat sub in a 163F bath until core hits 160 then leave for 2 hours then remove. You could do that with sous vide or however else you like. I know it works.
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Adas
Lonely Dreamer



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight] 1
#27993365 - 10/11/22 09:03 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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PanMax, welcome!
I'll just say this: A lot of things work. You can grow them almost as easily as Cubes, and my Bisporus TEK proves that even the lowest of low-tech setups work great too. Don't sweat the substrate either. I'm personally quite far out there - using pelletized horse shit and sawdust as my sub. Works flawlessly. That's not to say there aren't better options, just that it works fine.
60°C is definitely not enough for pasteurization. I aim for 72-75°C, otherwise grey mold shows up very quickly.
Edited by Adas (10/11/22 09:05 AM)
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kirkeng
Stranger


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Adas] 1
#27993400 - 10/11/22 09:20 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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I gotta chime in, Many ways do work, I’ve been rocking bucket tek in a cooler for all my pasteurization with manure for a few years now, once I got past the hiccups shit works like clockwork for large amounts. I think the near 16 hour cook time in the cooler helps with the variable temps inside, though it tends to hold 160 for a good few hours before trailing off the following 10. The only downside to it is manually busting up manure nuggets and coir dry, sometimes my hands get sore..
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ghiajake
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Adas]
#27993458 - 10/11/22 09:59 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Adas said: ... pelletized horse shit and sawdust as my sub.
Pelletized horse shit and sawdust? Do you have a pelletizer? I must know more!
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ruawakeyet


Registered: 05/03/21
Posts: 1,862
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ghiajake]
#27993626 - 10/11/22 11:57 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Thanks guys! I got mentally hung up on that picture and just needed some reassurance to completely ignore that. Hindsight, I'm really excited to see you publish those test results! How do you not have a TC tag already?! (Hint hint, moderators)
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Hindsight
Mad Scientist


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet] 2
#27993636 - 10/11/22 12:03 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Hahah thank you for the kind words.
On another note, I just finished my tent write-up for anyone interested in seeing how I made and run mine: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27993602
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Adas
Lonely Dreamer



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ghiajake]
#27993690 - 10/11/22 12:40 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
ghiajake said:
Quote:
Adas said: ... pelletized horse shit and sawdust as my sub.
Pelletized horse shit and sawdust? Do you have a pelletizer? I must know more!
No no. The shit I buy comes as pellets. The sawdust comes as bricks. It's unfortunately not the same quality as HWFP, but it's cheap and available.
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Asura
Cyantist


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: YoshiTrainer] 1
#27993819 - 10/11/22 02:13 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
YoshiTrainer said: Pan cyan 'Hunter Valley' from Australia.

Looks like some big ones there. Did you weigh any of them? When I grew Hunter Valley they produced the biggest fruits I had ever seen. One tray had two 11g fruits and a bunch around 9g. Never dosed them though. I was kinda scared lol.
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YoshiTrainer
Onion tied to belt



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Asura]
#27993831 - 10/11/22 02:25 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Thank you Asura! No I didn't weigh any of them, I should have. They were very meaty with solid stipes. They did dry down to about 5% of fresh mass. I was tempted to try some but am saving myself for the zaps.
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Scotay
The Mad Mush Guy

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 1
#27993847 - 10/11/22 02:41 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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I appreciate you trying. I'm taking notes brother! Thanks for posting this!!! 😎✌️Quote:
Baba Yaga said: I hope those fruits are going to mature since some of the caps are looking like they are damaged. Interesting though that the pins are only emerging from the areas with that dense overlay. I have one more uncased tub going at the moment and trying a different, more restricted hole setup with it. After that it's going back to casing for me as well. Will do more trials later.
I appreciate you and Myc H (sorry but your username fuckin cracks me up every time I see it!! Reminds me of the movie Porky's!!! Plus showing my age!!) Posting your experience with/without the casing!! Valuable knowledge folks!! 😎✌️
-------------------- Just chillin like a Villain and talking to like minded individuals!! Mush Love!! 😎✌️
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Scotay
The Mad Mush Guy

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: PanMax] 1
#27993891 - 10/11/22 03:12 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
PanMax said: Hey gang. Total FNG here. First post.
I have read the last 400 pages of this thread. I has taken me over a week to do it, and have found myself down several rabbit holes. Watching the evolution of Pan growing has been pretty incredible.
To the guys that have just DOMINATED this thing, THANK YOU. Baby Yaga, Hindsight, Joc Tek creator, Asura, Angam, Adas, and the many others with helpful links and input....Thank you all.
Things have changed quite a bit over a relatively short amount of time.
The one Tek that I found really different and interesting was Angam's Russian Tek. Oddly enough, I think only one other person duplicated that Tek, and just only just recently.
Between the Asura Tek, the Joc Tek, and the Russian Tek, I am curious as to the collective groups thoughts on "most replicatable" and reliable??
And finally, what would be considered the newest, most reliable sub recipe. 50/50 coir/hpoo, or is a compost now being used. Verm or no verm, and if so, what is the percentages best used.
Again, thank you everyone for the wealth of information and those that take the time to respond.
Dude.... Totally with you on this. There is sooo much information here!!! I was absolutely gobsmacked the first time I found this thread!! Insane really in the best of ways! Welcome to your new future hobby my friend!!! Happy Tuesday!! Nice to"meetcha" 😎✌️
-------------------- Just chillin like a Villain and talking to like minded individuals!! Mush Love!! 😎✌️
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Adas
Lonely Dreamer



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: YoshiTrainer]
#27993911 - 10/11/22 03:31 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
YoshiTrainer said: Thank you Asura! No I didn't weigh any of them, I should have. They were very meaty with solid stipes. They did dry down to about 5% of fresh mass. I was tempted to try some but am saving myself for the zaps.
Dried to 5%? Sounds more like Cambo tbh
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PanMax
FNG
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight] 1
#27993934 - 10/11/22 03:47 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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First, to all the people that have both reached out on the thread and sent welcome messages, THANK YOU, and nice to meet you all. Of course Hindsight answered my volume question with an awesome even higher volume recap of his most 'current' practice.
Honestly, it would be a really good idea for one someone (experienced and respected on the board) to start a (separate) thread for "Most current Pan Tek(s)"
This is an incredible thread, with SOOOO much information, and I have only read 1/3rd of it. It can be really hard separating information from posts with.....less information 
Quote:
Hindsight said:
On another note, I just finished my tent write-up for anyone interested in seeing how I made and run mine: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27993602
The above post by Hindsight is absolutely awesome with some CRITICAL information and details. My lowly contribution is nothing more than an amazon link to the timers Hindsight appears to be using (currently on an Amazon Prime deal) https://a.co/d/ipYNPAu
When I was first researching, I came across this video:
This video is almost right inline with what Hindsight has done. I wish I would have seen Hindsight's post first. I am embarrassed to say I pretty much used this video for my purchasing list. I still have pieces arriving. I have to tell you, save the money. Hindsight has replicated this (really well-done video) tent set up for a fraction of the cost.
Reminder: I am new here, so if posting links to stuff is not allowed, please just delete them. I receive nothing for them and am not associated with any of them.
-------------------- Forgive me, I’m just learning
Edited by PanMax (10/12/22 08:04 AM)
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ekabpils
Exploring Exotics



Registered: 10/20/21
Posts: 167
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: PanMax] 6
#27994754 - 10/12/22 06:57 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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NecD is coming:

Playing with NecD isolated cultures is interesting. Some culture is tall and thin. Another one is low and fat )
This time the same - three different cultures. Will show later when will do harvest.
Edited by ekabpils (10/12/22 07:02 AM)
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cambocyan

Registered: 06/24/20
Posts: 74
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ekabpils] 15
#27994992 - 10/12/22 10:27 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Copelandia Huasteca purple spore revert.
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SwabMarley
Twisted Metal Head



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: cambocyan] 1
#27994996 - 10/12/22 10:30 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
cambocyan said: Copelandia Huasteca purple spore revert.

Nice! Some little flying saucers there!
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V.L


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: cambocyan] 6
#27995023 - 10/12/22 10:49 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Hi Cambocyan! Did you got any RDU with those as I got last time I worked on them or only black spored ones?

Sadly never observed purple spored ones
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cambocyan

Registered: 06/24/20
Posts: 74
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: V.L] 7
#27995084 - 10/12/22 11:28 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Hello VL the print I worked on is purple and was originally from one of Jake's mutated huasteca isolates. In the picture he shared PHV was next to that tray droping a lighter almost pink spore color. I sure do miss his grows.

I did get purple spore fruits which were very thin and mediocre I never got them to drop purple spores but this picture is a culture I isolated myself from a dried purple Spore fruit I was pretty proud of myself because the odds were against me when reviving dried thin fruit overall what happened was it kept its mutated light pigmentated colored fruit body with black spores.
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PanMax
FNG
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: cambocyan] 1
#27995309 - 10/12/22 01:52 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Happy Hump-Day everyone!
Question:
1) Can you seal your grain spawn bags before sterilizing them (if they are in a filter patch bag)?
2) Could you seal your substrate bags before pasturizing them? I will be using a sous vide and I will probably test it open-bag first to see how long the center takes to come up to temp.
I am just trying to minimize the chance of contamination between prepping them and using them.
Thanks!
-------------------- Forgive me, I’m just learning
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