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whitebelt
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet] 3
#27978937 - 10/03/22 01:35 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Update: I found my first pins this morning! Surprisingly it was the tray that looked weakest to me (almost no myc poking through the casing layer, took longer than the others) that is full of pins and primordia right now! Feels like the first cube pins all over again . All of this happened after a slight temperature drop.
I was a long time lurker on this thread, so thanks everyone! I run Gordo Tek, so especially thanks to him!
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ruawakeyet


Registered: 05/03/21
Posts: 1,862
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: whitebelt]
#27978944 - 10/03/22 02:08 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Congrats on the first pan pins! Please keep us updated with pics before you harvest!
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Adas
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet] 1
#27979164 - 10/03/22 08:18 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Killing it again, Kirk and Baba!
My Bisporus outdoor clone which overcame moldy sub is pinning now in the FC. I've just cased it and placed it in the tub with holes and let it be. There are 2 pins so far, hopefully many more to come!
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kirkeng
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet] 1
#27979278 - 10/03/22 09:52 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
ruawakeyet said: Wow to those Bisporus and Nec D flushes! Way to go! kirkeng, I'm curious what you used for bulk. Do you mind sharing?
Bulk is just 50/50 manure/coir, peat/lime casing.
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ruawakeyet


Registered: 05/03/21
Posts: 1,862
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: kirkeng]
#27979360 - 10/03/22 10:36 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
kirkeng said:
Bulk is just 50/50 manure/coir, peat/lime casing.
Thank you! I'm definitely trying a manure / coir bulk next time. I see you aren't using any vermiculite, not even in the casing layer. It looks like it's working quite well, which is making me think some more...
I was planning on trying manure and verm (without straw for the first time). Hindsight had great success using manure and coir, which led me to consider a manure/coir/verm substrate. I have verm on hand, I'll have to buy some coir. If anyone would care to weigh in on the idea, I'm wondering:
1. Does coir outperform verm as far as water holding capacity while keeping the substrate aerobic? (Not as a stand alone substrate, but when combined with manure. I don't want anyone to get the wrong idea, I'm not trying to use coir without manure.)
2. Could anything be gained by using Manure / Coir / Verm, (I would have used a 50 / 25 / 25 ratio.) or should I save the vermiculite for making 50/50 casing mix? (vermiculite / peat moss)
2b. Is the casing layer improved by skipping the verm? It looks like that peat / lime casing layer is hard to beat!
3. Is it time to stop using vermiculite in mycology all together? I don't have that much leftover, and I could always add it to garden compost so it doesn't truly go to waste.
I know asking all of these questions means it's time for me to test and find out, but I'm hoping some of you already have the answers. It's going to take some time before I have clone cultures ready to even begin any side by side tests.
Thanks in advance!
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kirkeng
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet] 3
#27979485 - 10/03/22 12:37 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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I’ll only speak to my experience, I personally have a vendetta against verm, I dislike the texture and the sparkly bits that end up getting stuck to all the mushrooms, for whatever reason it really bothers me. I look at verm as a water reservoir and consider coir the same, I see no reason to mix them when one gets the job done. coir takes up less space in storage too so I appreciate that. With casing I avoid it cause it almost holds too much water in my opinion, less is more in my view. No disrespect to those who use verm but it ain’t allowed in my house. But I’ll never say never, maybe someday I’ll revisit the bag that’s been sitting in my garage for years. It’s worth it to try both and see what works for you though and make your own educated decision, after all your favorite food is probably different than mine.
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ruawakeyet


Registered: 05/03/21
Posts: 1,862
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: kirkeng]
#27979546 - 10/03/22 01:14 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Now that you say that, I dislike the flakes of verm that get stuck to the fruits / trays / jars / lids / etc., as well. It makes a mess, and the bags ALWAYS have holes in them from the store. Dry verm spills out of every hole just by looking at it sitting on the shelf.
Your notion that verm might hold too much water for the casing layer makes sense to me. We want evaporation from the casing layer, right? Peat moss is probably more porous than verm and probably evaporates more water.
I will hang on to my verm for now, but am going to make my first run without it and see how it goes.
Thank you so much for bouncing these ideas back and forth, I'm getting a much better idea of the direction I'm wanting to go now that I'm firing up another grow.
Since I never did get a successful grow of the Peace River Florida, I've decided to try them again this round. It's hard not going back to the PHV because it worked so well for me in the past, but I want to see a different look this time.
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Adas
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet] 1
#27979688 - 10/03/22 03:06 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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I have never used verm in my life and don't plan to. Hopefully the charcoal will be a good casing material (I bet it will be).
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kirkeng
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Adas]
#27979693 - 10/03/22 03:11 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Charcoal? Haven’t heard that before, what’s your reasoning? I admittedly don’t know jack about charcoal but I’m curious.
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Adas
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: kirkeng] 3
#27979713 - 10/03/22 03:32 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Charcoal is porous, should hold some water and should make a perfect inert casing material. No pasteurization or any prep. None of that shit, just pour it on top and done.
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Scotay
The Mad Mush Guy

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Tweeq] 1
#27979720 - 10/03/22 03:37 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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HQuote:
Tweeq said: The bags from my first go at Bisporus are still alive and well.

In mono with open bottom holes and a layer of water for humidity.
Hey there.... Looks nice. How deep is that substrate in your bag? Just wondering. Happy Monday!! 😎✌️
-------------------- Just chillin like a Villain and talking to like minded individuals!! Mush Love!! 😎✌️
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Scotay
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Scotay] 1
#27979756 - 10/03/22 03:59 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Man.... Y'all just smashing it here with the panhandlin up in here!! Impressive! Thanks to everyone who is taking the time to reply to me or just plain sharing knowledge to gleen! The charcoal sounds cool! I mean shit it'd be sterile already I think maybe. I just love learning new stuff. Trial or error. Happy Monday Panderers!!!😎✌️
-------------------- Just chillin like a Villain and talking to like minded individuals!! Mush Love!! 😎✌️
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smalltalk_canceled
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Adas]
#27979758 - 10/03/22 04:00 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Adas said: Charcoal is porous, should hold some water and should make a perfect inert casing material. No pasteurization or any prep. None of that shit, just pour it on top and done. 
Thanks for posting this, i asked about this in the quick questions and answers thread, i asked if charcoal contained nutrition in relation to what we're doing
what about sawdust? do you consider it inert to molds? would you pasteurise or sterilize or even consider it to case with wet sawdust?
ive seen molds form on lots of wood, im just looking for confidence/clarification
-------------------- Willpower is the one true virtue
  
Edited by smalltalk_canceled (10/03/22 04:02 PM)
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ruawakeyet


Registered: 05/03/21
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Scotay, I agree that charcoal should be "sterile", in the sense that it should lack nutrition and shouldn't be able to contaminate. In mycology, sterile is usually used in terms of all molds, spores, bacteria, and viruses being guaranteed to be killed or inactivated. Since charcoal could carry bacteria or mold spores in it, I wouldn't refer to it as sterile since that usually means something else here. That being said, it should be relatively clean considering the process it went through to become charcoal. 
smalltalk, I'm not positive about the nutrition question, but it should be pretty much nothing but carbon. There shouldn't be any proteins nor starches. I can say that sawdust can and will mold if kept in FC conditions. I suppose pasteurizing might help, but I'm not sure how much resistance the sawdust would have to molds longer term. (Long enough to get 2 or more flushes. I know many only go for the first flush.)
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Adas
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If sawdust is properly leeched, it's the same as coir that folks are used to. So essentially you could use that as a pseudo-casing.
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kirkeng
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Adas]
#27979840 - 10/03/22 05:30 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Adas said: Charcoal is porous, should hold some water and should make a perfect inert casing material. No pasteurization or any prep. None of that shit, just pour it on top and done. 
Word ima keep my eye on that, are you meaning activated charcoal? Or like regular old charcoal? Now I’m thinking if that’s a case starting some pits and make a bunch of charcoal, I dunno how they make the activated stuff but regular old charcoal shouldn’t be too hard..
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Baba Yaga
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: kirkeng] 2
#27979948 - 10/03/22 06:36 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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I bet that regular charcoal will work great. There are so many materials that could work as long as they are light and porous. I only use verm because I have it here for my planting but never have I used it in my bulk substrate. I really like to use it for grain prep/jars though and having said this, verm worked great as a sole casing material for me but the cleanup was a bitch. Stuck to my fingers, fruits and anything else.
Anyway, thumbs up for experimenting with stuff. Looking forward to hearing how this goes. Maybe I try casing with perlite next time. Will be hard to see what is going on though whit an all white color scheme 
I'm still thinking that coir can work as well, just as uncased can work just fine. Thinking that the how is more important than the what. This is a different discussion though but one of the leading questions which are driving me lately.
Edited by Baba Yaga (10/03/22 06:44 PM)
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Baba Yaga
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga] 6
#27980369 - 10/03/22 10:03 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Cased vs. Uncased 24 hrs later:

Both are performing well so far. There is a difference but marginal and running just one MS tub doesn't generate a result. Just look how many knots are on the uncased side, the whole surface is covered in them. I hope the uncased will perform equally in the end cause who want's to case if it is not necessary. Even if it does perform somewhat lesser than with a casing, not having to do it is worth something, right?! I like this very much. Will do more of these once I get a clone going.
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Scotay
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Baba Yaga]
#27980542 - 10/04/22 01:39 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Log in to view attachment
Test picture
-------------------- Just chillin like a Villain and talking to like minded individuals!! Mush Love!! 😎✌️
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Scotay
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Scotay] 1
#27980544 - 10/04/22 01:41 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Heyyyyy well sonofabitch I got a picture to upload!!! Ok. Happy Tuesday friends and neighbors!!! 😎✌️
-------------------- Just chillin like a Villain and talking to like minded individuals!! Mush Love!! 😎✌️
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