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Hindsight
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: MuteUSO]
#27512108 - 10/21/21 06:31 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Yeah that’s not what you want. If you can’t find it I would probably just use 100% vermiculite.
Try searching for “sphagnum” or “sphagnum moss”. Also for “jiffy mix” or “seed starting mix” though the latter may be several things depending on brand. Peat is most commonly used as a seed starting medium. Jiffy Pellets are made of peat moss. You could ask a local nursery to show you seed starting mix and see if it looks like peat. It shouldn’t have any fertilizers added to it.
Edited by Hindsight (10/21/21 06:37 AM)
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MuteUSO
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight]
#27512160 - 10/21/21 07:40 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Hindsight said: Yeah that’s not what you want. If you can’t find it I would probably just use 100% vermiculite.
Try searching for “sphagnum” or “sphagnum moss”. Also for “jiffy mix” or “seed starting mix” though the latter may be several things depending on brand. Peat is most commonly used as a seed starting medium. Jiffy Pellets are made of peat moss. You could ask a local nursery to show you seed starting mix and see if it looks like peat. It shouldn’t have any fertilizers added to it.
I found those Jiffy Pellets, although it says that they are made from "peat moss or coco" (whatever that is supposed to mean). Are these the Jiffy pellets you referred to?
https://www.growland.se/Jiffy-peat-pellet-100pcs?curr=SEK&gclid=CjwKCAjwn8SLBhAyEiwAHNTJbdPwBCajSWStJ6FNbTHhQHhWbu-oscyLlVRaooiQng3XAqRmCd4t7RoCBZEQAvD_BwE
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Hindsight
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: MuteUSO]
#27512185 - 10/21/21 08:13 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Yes those are exactly what I was referring to. I don’t know that I would buy those unless I was really in a bind…. My main point in mentioning them was to get you or a nursery employee closer to exactly what you’re looking for. You don’t want coco (which is coconut coir) because the mycelium can consume it and you want your casing layer to remain unconsumed. Technically you could use those pellets if they were peat moss but you’d have to hydrate a bunch of them (they expand to about 1.5” diameter x 2” tall), and I don’t like that there’s no guarantee on that particular brand that you’ll actually get peat moss and not coir.
Jiffy Natural & Organic Starter Mix 12 Quart https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00C7RXJQQ
There’s nothing like this eh?
Using coconut coir with verm wouldn’t be the end of the world but I’ve never tried it so can’t say how bad it would be vs just using straight verm. Maybe someone else who has tried it can chime in.
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ruawakeyet


Registered: 05/03/21
Posts: 1,862
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: MuteUSO] 1
#27512217 - 10/21/21 09:05 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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MuteUSO, Waaaay back on this thread, a member by the name of High Night Expanse used leaf litter for casing and it worked. Search "leaf litter casing", and look for results from this thread. IIRC, he collected the leaf litter himself, but I don't know much else about the details. Edit: Page 476 of this thread has more details on using leaf litter for casing.
Some people also use cactus mix, so maybe this is something you can find. I would pay attention to the ingredients still, but it can also work.
If all else fails, I could mail you some if you were willing to pay the postage. This would not be cost effective, and I'm not trying to sell or make money on you, but if you can't find any other way, it's an option.
Edited by ruawakeyet (10/21/21 09:19 AM)
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nosf3r4tu


Registered: 03/26/19
Posts: 775
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: MuteUSO]
#27512251 - 10/21/21 09:34 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
MuteUSO said:
Quote:
coversall said:
Quote:
MuteUSO said: Would this serve as casing material? https://gluckspilze.com/Casing-soil
Translated it says: "pH: 7 - 7.5 80 % black peat 20 % white peat Moisture uptake to about 60%
This casing soil is ready-to-use, if required just add some water. Made of quality peat mixed with lime. The casing soil is pasteurized, and therefore NON-STERILE."
Thanks for your input! :-)
Not sure what white peat is, and I'm not super up on the pH stuff, there are some teks that talk about the pH of casing.
But I don't see why you couldn't mix that casing with verm and case pans with it.
Have you thought about getting some peat moss and making your own casing?
It seems where I am at it is difficult to find peat moss (Sweden) or at least I have difficulties finding it. When I put "peat moss" in google translate I get "torvmossa" back. When I google that I see products like the following, which are not what I want, right? https://www.cyberzoo.se/sv/articles/2.56.18490/terra-exotica-torvmossa-1-kg-40-liter
Look for black peat. That's what they calling it in my country. I also had a hard time finding it.
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bagga
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: nosf3r4tu]
#27512292 - 10/21/21 10:18 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Re jiffy mix - do we pasteurize it for pans? I didn't for cubes.
Quick spawn check - these whiter spots- bad or no big deal?
This is Ms pan (wild) myc.

Edit: forgot pic
Edited by bagga (10/21/21 10:20 AM)
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ruawakeyet


Registered: 05/03/21
Posts: 1,862
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: bagga]
#27512325 - 10/21/21 10:54 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Yes on the pasteurization, at least I would.
The white spots should be fine, it seems pretty common with pan mycelium.
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Hindsight
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet]
#27512374 - 10/21/21 11:53 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Yeah I follow the same JOC pasteurization tech for the casing as I do for the substrate (it's one and the same - instapot on keep warm for 12 hours).
On another note, I've learned a lesson on ultrasonic humidifiers - If you build your own by dropping a fogger into a storage tote filled with water and add a fan to pressurize it so the fog comes out the hose, the amount of fog deployed into your tent is highly dependent upon the level of water in the tote. The lower the water level, the more air space and the more air space, the more of the fog goes back into the water instead of going up the hose into the tent, and this drastically changes your moisture levels in the tent causing it to become too try. It appears the best solution is to have the smallest reservoir you possibly can, which has your fogger and fan in it, and then have an automated refilling setup where you have a much, much larger reservoir filled with water that automatically maintains the level in your fogger reservoir - or if you have a water supply (like a faucet etc), you can use a float valve and constant water pressure to keep it full. Personally, I'm going to use a ~3-5 gallon tote or bucket now for my humidifier reservoir then use a siphon setup attached to a 17+ gallon tote that holds the water and maintains the level in the humidifier reservoir. I'll just have to top up the 17+ gallon tote every week or so. Sounds like a project for this weekend since I have no trays in fruiting stage now and just spawned three trays the other day and am letting them consolidate.
I also feel like adding a bathroom vent fan in a spare closet and storing my substrate and unconsolidated trays in there because man it stinks until consolidation.
Edited by Hindsight (10/21/21 12:06 PM)
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ruawakeyet


Registered: 05/03/21
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight] 1
#27512426 - 10/21/21 12:59 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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I second that about the water level. I have to add 2 quarts every 12 hours or so to keep it as full as possible. It really does make a huge difference, especially trying to use a single disc fogger.
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Hindsight
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet]
#27512439 - 10/21/21 01:11 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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I have a nice 3 disk fogger and even then it's night and day when there's 4" of water vs 8" of water. My substrate will literally dry out at 4" of water due to the amount of water vapor that doesn't make it up the hose to the tent.
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bagga
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight]
#27512511 - 10/21/21 02:28 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Thanks, it's going in the instant pot 
Huh.... I appreciate this post, I'd been scratching my head about mysterious moisture loss this week after it had been stable for a few weeks. I have cubes in there at the moment.
I added tote with a water heater in the bottom, and I noticed it had rapidly started losing water.
I'm using a fogger and a large tote, filled it up on the weekend.
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bagga
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: bagga]
#27512668 - 10/21/21 04:38 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Odor absorbers. Anyone tried? Do they work?
3 days since pasteurizing, omfg.. I can't unsmell it. No one mentions this in the tek!
-------------------- _______________________ For personal religious use only. Embrace infinity for a healthier mind.
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ruawakeyet


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: bagga]
#27512701 - 10/21/21 05:10 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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I doubt any odor absorber is strong enough to work against 3 day old bulk.
I have found that really well aged manure won't stink much at all. I was lucky enough to start with some hpoo that had aged in buckets for a few years, then spent a few months laying in the yard before being used. That bulk didn't have any bad smell at all, and I could tell a difference in how easily it broke apart as well. Unfortunately, I didn't have that much of it and used it all up.
I went back to the same place as before. I was picky about what I collected after running out of the good stuff, thinking it had aged enough outside already, but after cooking the first batch, it was obvious it needed some more time before it's ideal.
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smurfreak
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread *DELETED* [Re: ruawakeyet]
#27513359 - 10/22/21 08:52 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Post deleted by smurfreak
Reason for deletion: privacy issue
Edited by smurfreak (10/22/21 08:53 AM)
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Hindsight
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: smurfreak]
#27513382 - 10/22/21 09:11 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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The only time I ever had pan mycelium look quite like that was when I wrote down JOC's pan agar formula incorrectly and used 10x the amount of peptone I should have.
I will say that I have seen various types of mycelium growth on pans. I'm growing like 7 varieties right now and some of them look pretty different from one another. I haven't fruited enough of them to say whether any particular mycelium pattern is good or bad yet though, but I am taking photos of each plate prior to sending it to grain so I can keep track of it and know in the future what's ok to send and what isn't.
Some examples....
Stereotypical textbook healthy pan mycelium:

A bit odd looking pan mycelium:

This one looks similar to yours and was a result of too much peptone in the agar:

Another example of too much peptone:

Good looking mycelium on grain water agar on the left vs too much peptone agar on the right
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Adas
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight] 1
#27513409 - 10/22/21 09:43 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Hindsight, congrats to your 666th post!
I agree that the myc looks weird, it's either Pan myc that's way overfed, or straight up mold.
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gt40
I will proof smthng



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight]
#27513467 - 10/22/21 10:55 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Hindsight said: On another note, I've learned a lesson on ultrasonic humidifiers - If you build your own by dropping a fogger into a storage tote filled with water and add a fan to pressurize it so the fog comes out the hose, the amount of fog deployed into your tent is highly dependent upon the level of water in the tote. The lower the water level, the more air space and the more air space, the more of the fog goes back into the water instead of going up the hose into the tent, and this drastically changes your moisture levels in the tent causing it to become too try. It appears the best solution is to have the smallest reservoir you possibly can, which has your fogger and fan in it, and then have an automated refilling setup where you have a much, much larger reservoir filled with water that automatically maintains the level in your fogger reservoir - or if you have a water supply (like a faucet etc), you can use a float valve and constant water pressure to keep it full. Personally, I'm going to use a ~3-5 gallon tote or bucket now for my humidifier reservoir then use a siphon setup attached to a 17+ gallon tote that holds the water and maintains the level in the humidifier reservoir. I'll just have to top up the 17+ gallon tote every week or so. Sounds like a project for this weekend since I have no trays in fruiting stage now and just spawned three trays the other day and am letting them consolidate.
I also feel like adding a bathroom vent fan in a spare closet and storing my substrate and unconsolidated trays in there because man it stinks until consolidation.
I think you use weak fan or place an output hose too close to water. Put the hose spout on the same lvl with the lid. You can check it even without hose, just look at flow from the lid hole. I use 60L reservoir with 71CFM fan. No visible difference regards to water levels. Fill the tank once a week while fogger hits every 10 minutes
Edited by gt40 (10/22/21 11:01 AM)
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Hindsight
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: gt40]
#27513495 - 10/22/21 11:35 AM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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Thanks gt40 - I'm not quite sure I'm following though.
I'm using a 26 liter reservoir and have my 4" hose output flange on the lid on one side of the reservoir and my 45 cfm fan on the other side of the lid. I have my fan dialed down a bit with a speed controller because I noticed when I turn the speed up to full, I actually notice less fog coming out the hose into the tent.
You can see it on the left here:

So what I notice seems to be opposite of what you are saying (I think). It seems like you are saying you don't want the output hose too close to the water level, yet what I am seeing is when the water level in the reservoir drops, which causes the hose output to be further away from the water, less fog comes out of the hose.
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ruawakeyet


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: gt40]
#27513720 - 10/22/21 02:12 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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gt40, I experience the exact same thing with my fogger setup. I'm using an inline booster fan, (not a high velocity fan), with a fan speed controller to dial it in. I can tell a difference both visually and in the amount of condensation that builds up in the fruiting area. As long as I keep it full, I have enough fog to make it work, but if the level drops much, things get too dry.
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gt40
I will proof smthng



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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet] 1
#27513868 - 10/22/21 04:12 PM (2 years, 3 months ago) |
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so yeah guys, I bet the fan is the your thing not mounting
I use 2 meters pvc with holes on different levels. When I run fan on a half speed I noticed that flow from the top holes are prominently weak. So I think if you use 70-100CFM full speed it will solve the issue. I use Noctua-NF-F12. Cheap model with IP67, relatively quiet. Also add a styrofoam to the sides of humidifier which holds it near the top. Works constant. I use 60L tank, if you use 120L it will requier ~ 1 refil per 2 weeks.
Did refils everyday previous month and it's an unnecessary pain )
Also, ruawakeyet, possibly you see condensation not because of amounth of water itself. As we all know condensation is a sign of temperature differences - cold air meets warm air and bump the drops appears. Probably additional water in a chamber hits the temparature more and you literally see it I began to see condensation since I put red bulb inside the chamber for heating. Temperature inside higher then outside - droplets on the walls. Glass trays can't hold same heat as air around them - droplets on the trays walls
Edited by gt40 (10/22/21 04:35 PM)
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