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coversall
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight]
#27454701 - 09/03/21 10:14 AM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Woah, pan myc on oats is crazy hard to see! Is it just the photos or was it hard to tell the jar was fully col?
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Hindsight
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: coversall]
#27454748 - 09/03/21 10:45 AM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
coversall said: Woah, pan myc on oats is crazy hard to see! Is it just the photos or was it hard to tell the jar was fully col?
Easier to tell in person, harder to tell in photos. But even in-person it is very faint. Could be the strain I'm working with? Not sure.
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coversall
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight]
#27454752 - 09/03/21 10:50 AM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Hindsight said:
Quote:
coversall said: Woah, pan myc on oats is crazy hard to see! Is it just the photos or was it hard to tell the jar was fully col?
Easier to tell in person, harder to tell in photos. But even in-person it is very faint. Could be the strain I'm working with? Not sure.
Could be! the myc has always been super obvious on my pan-cakes! You can see how thick it gets in my sig!
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TheDoobsker
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: coversall]
#27454819 - 09/03/21 12:23 PM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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My Wild Coast culture is looking similar on grain right now. Really light compared to all my cube and tamp cultures on the same grain. Not feeling great about this culture because we're at day 9 from inoc. and it probably has 2 more days to go before fully colonized
This is hard red winter wheat berries (not on purpose)

Some PE and MM for comparison. Pics of grain jars are always hard to judge
Edited by TheDoobsker (09/03/21 12:26 PM)
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Jakeoncid419
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight] 1
#27454862 - 09/03/21 12:59 PM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Hindsight said: Thanks ruawakeyet, that makes sense. And yeah I had already ordered digital timers and they are on the way. I have the dial timers for some outdoor lighting and they don't hold proper time well, nor would I be able to synch them to the second so that a fan kicks on right when a fogger kicks off, etc.
In JOC's tek, he is using a bathroom fan to vent the greenhouse and I'm wondering if he is venting it to outdoors? Because if that super-saturated air is vented into the growing room, I would think it would increase ambient RH too much? I will play around with it.
One of my trays looks a bit odd - does this look like mold to you guys? There is a bit of blue/green that you can see in here. I'm brand new to pans so don't really know how to recognize healthy pan mycelium and tell it apart from cobweb and other things yet. PS this substrate is aged horse manure + rehydrated straw pellets. I have some other trays using black kow and some other trays using shredded straw and aged horse manure.

Yes it vents out through the wall and I have a dryer vent on the outside to keep blow back from coming back in
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Jakeoncid419]
#27454868 - 09/03/21 01:05 PM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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To me that wild coast jar looks great, Melmak jar looks dirty.
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TheDoobsker
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: A.k.a]
#27454890 - 09/03/21 01:18 PM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Nice, okay. I'm still trying to train my eye to pick out good pan cultures. Definitely prepping some substrate today for that jar. I probably should have done it a day or two ago.
Yeah, those uncolonized pieces in the MM look a bit sketch to me but whatever  It's getting spawned in a couple days
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Hindsight
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Jakeoncid419]
#27454911 - 09/03/21 01:31 PM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Jakeoncid419 said:
Quote:
Hindsight said: Thanks ruawakeyet, that makes sense. And yeah I had already ordered digital timers and they are on the way. I have the dial timers for some outdoor lighting and they don't hold proper time well, nor would I be able to synch them to the second so that a fan kicks on right when a fogger kicks off, etc.
In JOC's tek, he is using a bathroom fan to vent the greenhouse and I'm wondering if he is venting it to outdoors? Because if that super-saturated air is vented into the growing room, I would think it would increase ambient RH too much? I will play around with it.
One of my trays looks a bit odd - does this look like mold to you guys? There is a bit of blue/green that you can see in here. I'm brand new to pans so don't really know how to recognize healthy pan mycelium and tell it apart from cobweb and other things yet. PS this substrate is aged horse manure + rehydrated straw pellets. I have some other trays using black kow and some other trays using shredded straw and aged horse manure.

Yes it vents out through the wall and I have a dryer vent on the outside to keep blow back from coming back in
Thank you! I've been playing around with cycling since you mentioned it and the only question I have left relates to the temperature drop that happens as a result of the foggers coming on. That moisture pulls heat out of the air. If my grow room is at 77F, when the fogger is done with a cycle the temp inside the greenhouse can get down to like 73. It gradually goes back up to 77 as the room air is drawn in and the moist air flushed out but I'm wondering if you run your room into the mid 80's in order to keep the air in the greenhouse above 76 or so?
Edited by Hindsight (09/03/21 01:45 PM)
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ruawakeyet


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight] 1
#27454965 - 09/03/21 02:06 PM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Do you have an aquarium heater in your fogger unit? I run mine around 82 degrees F, and that helps the incoming air temperature stay warm, and it also helps the fogger put out the most fog.
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Hindsight
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet]
#27454998 - 09/03/21 02:39 PM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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I do not but can definitely give that a shot. Thanks for the tip!
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rockyfungus
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight]
#27455199 - 09/03/21 05:49 PM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Tried to transfer my wild coast clone from cold storage to a plate. 4 months later and the colony is dead.
No contams, no myc, just 10 blank plates with some dead myc in the center. I think I'm going to be lazy and just swab these plates with some spores.
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Jakeoncid419
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight] 1
#27455624 - 09/04/21 07:52 AM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Hindsight said:
Quote:
Jakeoncid419 said:
Quote:
Hindsight said: Thanks ruawakeyet, that makes sense. And yeah I had already ordered digital timers and they are on the way. I have the dial timers for some outdoor lighting and they don't hold proper time well, nor would I be able to synch them to the second so that a fan kicks on right when a fogger kicks off, etc.
In JOC's tek, he is using a bathroom fan to vent the greenhouse and I'm wondering if he is venting it to outdoors? Because if that super-saturated air is vented into the growing room, I would think it would increase ambient RH too much? I will play around with it.
One of my trays looks a bit odd - does this look like mold to you guys? There is a bit of blue/green that you can see in here. I'm brand new to pans so don't really know how to recognize healthy pan mycelium and tell it apart from cobweb and other things yet. PS this substrate is aged horse manure + rehydrated straw pellets. I have some other trays using black kow and some other trays using shredded straw and aged horse manure.

Yes it vents out through the wall and I have a dryer vent on the outside to keep blow back from coming back in
Thank you! I've been playing around with cycling since you mentioned it and the only question I have left relates to the temperature drop that happens as a result of the foggers coming on. That moisture pulls heat out of the air. If my grow room is at 77F, when the fogger is done with a cycle the temp inside the greenhouse can get down to like 73. It gradually goes back up to 77 as the room air is drawn in and the moist air flushed out but I'm wondering if you run your room into the mid 80's in order to keep the air in the greenhouse above 76 or so?
Yeah I keep the temp between 78-80 and I have dehumidifiers running outside the tent so the air that is pulled in during the dry cycle is hot & dry
-------------------- Natural omt/detox online pant cult classes available last Saturday of every month go to buymeacoffee.com/jakeoncid to sign up (1 on 1 consultations also available JOC PAN TEK CORDYCEPS MILITARIS EXOTICS [
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Hindsight
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Jakeoncid419]
#27455666 - 09/04/21 08:32 AM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Thank you! Very helpful. I have your NecD on the way and am looking forward to growing it in this martha. I'm hoping at least one of my current pan cyan trays will survive in the meantime. I got good at cubes but feel like I'm learning to crawl again due how different pan growing is.
Another question to you or anyone is about moisture pooling on the floor. I assume that if you have your foggers set to provide enough fog cycles that you are actually ADDING moisture to your trays to prevent from having to manually water them, it also means that you can't get away from water building up on the floor?
I have my martha set on a plastic dog kennel tray, which prevents the moisture from getting onto my floor, but I'm wondering how much of an issue standing water is going to be. The less I have to manually drain/mop/maintain things, the better. I travel a bit so need it to go at least 5 days hands off. I've read people using hydroton or perlite in the bottom to prevent standing water but that seems like a pain to drain/maintain. Saw Asura has his in a shower which is brilliant because the water can just drain down the shower drain but I don't have a spare shower. The best idea I think I've had is to elevate the kennel tray and have a slight diagonal tilt to it so the water runs down to a corner, then drill a hole in that corner and attach a drain hose to it, sealed to the tray with silicone, that then drains down into a bucket or tote. Also thought of buying a shower pan (the kind you actually build a shower out of and has a floor that slopes into a center drain) and just setting that on top of an open tote and putting the martha in the pan, but the cheapest shower pans are ~$120.
But before I go to all the trouble of that elaborate setup, I figured I'd check and see what others like doing with regards to water drainage.
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Jakeoncid419
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight] 1
#27455674 - 09/04/21 08:39 AM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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I use a hot water heater tray they sell at Home Depot it’s like a big plastic square that the greenhouse sits in and it collects any additional water then use the dehumidifiers to refill my fogger tank every day that way my disks last longer as they are only getting fed distilled water and I only need to top off the tub about once a week with additional water. About every two weeks I deep clean my tent I use a wet vac to suck up the extra water out of my hot water tank plastic square.
-------------------- Natural omt/detox online pant cult classes available last Saturday of every month go to buymeacoffee.com/jakeoncid to sign up (1 on 1 consultations also available JOC PAN TEK CORDYCEPS MILITARIS EXOTICS [
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Hindsight
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Jakeoncid419]
#27455685 - 09/04/21 08:52 AM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Awesome thank you! From my current tests of my empty martha, I think I was running the fogger too much/long as the amount of water collecting in the bottom would require removal every probably 4 or 5 days. I'm going to take that to mean I'm probably putting too much moisture in there. I've been using an empty tray to adjust fogging cycles per your or Asura's tek (I forget which one I saw it in). I'll keep playing with it.
Off to the hardware store to get a bathroom vent fan and exterior flap hood so I can exhaust outside and not have my room humid AF.
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Jakeoncid419
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight] 1
#27455798 - 09/04/21 10:23 AM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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fogger kicks on for 3 min exhaust fan kicks on halfway through the foggers run time for 3 min. So after the fogger kicks off the exhaust fan runs for another minute and a half pulling dry air into the tent then it kicks off in the system rests for 10 minutes full of Traer this is one of the most of your evaporation takes place in the fogger kicks back on and the whole process repeats
-------------------- Natural omt/detox online pant cult classes available last Saturday of every month go to buymeacoffee.com/jakeoncid to sign up (1 on 1 consultations also available JOC PAN TEK CORDYCEPS MILITARIS EXOTICS [
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ruawakeyet


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hindsight]
#27455815 - 09/04/21 10:33 AM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Hindsight,
I get the need for your setup to be automated for up to 5 days, but I must warn, pans can move really fast. They can go from pins to mature fruits in 3 days.
Edit: If I was going to have to be away for that long, I would set up an old cell phone with an app like Alfred Security Camera to watch over them. At least I could check in from time to time and see what's happening. It would hurt me not knowing how they were doing! 
If the fogger fails or runs dry, the fruits can fry in less than 12 hours.
It sounds like you are super close to having them dialed in though. I have learned to error on the side of too wet, rather than too dry.
Edited by ruawakeyet (09/04/21 10:35 AM)
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GlitchInSpace
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: rockyfungus] 2
#27455878 - 09/04/21 11:27 AM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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getting lots of bvi clusters. sorry for the out of focus pic
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ruawakeyet


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet] 1
#27455959 - 09/04/21 12:47 PM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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I would like to share what I came up with as a way to grow pans. It's definitely a case of TLDR, unless you like details. Either I'm sorry, or you are welcome. 
After reading this entire thread plus other's write ups, I took a little bit from everybody, (a lot from some), and I think this would grow pans fairly well.
Instead of a jartha setup, I sought a design that could utilize a more affordable single-disk fogger. The prices jump up quickly, and I didn't want to have to buy a 5; 6; or especially a 12 disk fogger. I also didn't want to have shelves below another shelf, and risk dry spots in a tent.
I considered JCM's FC, but I can't handle the noise from a hydroponic air pump.
This is using a 4' x 8' grow tent, but the same could be accomplished using a 4' x 4' tent. I have room for a shelf on the opposite side, plus enough room for me to walk in. Considering how miserable the conditions are inside, I don't know how much time I would want to spend inside, but it maintains the conditions better than standing on the outside with a door wide open. I suppose I could just double my equipment and have twice the growing area!

I simply melted a hole in the middle of a kiddie pool, and used a hole saw in the middle of a round table. I placed my fogger unit underneath, and ran the outlet straight up as shown. A plastic 4" diffuser distributes the fog in 360 degrees, while the edges of the kiddie pool catch most of the fog. I hope the fog is visible in the pictures.
The pool, (around 45 inch diameter at the top), can fit 5 pyrex cake trays. I am looking for a slightly larger pool to replace it with, then it could fit 6 cake trays and not waste much area. The pool does take on too much water after 4 or 5 days, so I have been using a rag to mop up the excess. When I melted the hole in the pool, it was upside down. I wanted a raised lip so that pooling water wouldn't drain down the middle, and it works as long as the water doesn't get too deep.

For the fogger unit, I used a small cooler instead of a tote. The lid fits tight enough as it was, so I only had to cut holes in the lid to make it work. I have found that the water level needs to be kept high in order to make the single disk fogger efficient enough. I am running an aquarium heater at around 80 degrees F. It uses around 2 quarts of water every 24 hours, but the diffuser simply pulls out and you can refill it from there.

I did add a component to my fogger unit though. I purchased a true HEPA air purifier, (a 2J8), and siliconed a 6" to 4" duct reducer to the top. I also sealed all the reducer's seams using silicone adhesive. I modified a cardboard box to house it, along with a 14" x 14" furnace filter to act as a pre-filter. At the reducer, I installed a 4" booster fan, which runs off a fan speed controller. All the air supplied to the fogger unit is HEPA filtered, which I believe will do two things: It should help keep nasties out of the fogger unit, extending the maintenance intervals, and it also helps keep the incoming air cleaner since that is dispersed directly onto the growing area. (I read where JOC uses a hepa filter on his jarthas, and I believe that is part of the reason his prints are so clean.) I should have taken pictures during assembly, but I forgot. The fan speed controller was essential in being able to tune the fogger for the application. The faster the fan speed, the bigger the circle of fog becomes.
I rely on the fresh air requirement being supplied when the fogger runs, and it displaces the stale air out a vent on the tent near the bottom. That of course runs on a cycle timer, around 4 minutes on, 10 minutes off. The air intake sits on top of the tent, and is also positioned near an open window that allows outside air to mix with the room air. (I ordered a waterproof fan planning on using it for the fogger unit, but changed the design before actually building anything. I now use that waterproof fan to pull air from the window and blow it into the room.)
Running off a separate cycle timer, I have a small heater and a wicking humidifier. I let the fog settle for a minute or two before the heater and humidifier kick on. The heater kicks on for around a minute, then a temp controller turns it off, allowing the humidifier fan to continue running. The rise in temperature lowers the relative humidity, allowing the evaporation to occur, while the wicking humidifier ensures nothing gets too dry. (I have not tried without the wicking humidifier, it would probably work fine without.)
Here's what I have discovered with my cycle timers: The dial types suck IMO. They can't be dialed in perfectly. It has proven impossible to get them synced, even trying to run the same on and off durations, they are off by a couple of seconds. It's good enough to work for now, but I have to reset one of them every day. With this setup, unlike a jartha, there can not be any air movement during the fogger cycle, (other than the fog) or it just blows the fog away from where it needs to be. A jartha I think would be less critical, as the air is moving downward regardless. I plan on replacing the dial type with digital cycle timers to remedy this.
Once I do that, I plan on a 4 minutes on / 10 minutes off cycle for the fogger. I like to allow a minute for the fog to settle before the heater kicks on. Ideally, I would let the heater run for around 7 minutes on / 7 minutes off. This lets the air stop moving inside the tent before the fogger comes back on.
The only other thing I know I need to change is my table. I need a plastic table, as the pressed particle board table is quickly going bad in so much humidity. I've had this setup running for about 5 weeks to test it out, and it is already moldy underneath.
There's another cool feature about this design: the pool can be rotated like a giant lazy susan. No need to reach across to do some work!
It is important to note: all of my electronic controls are kept outside the tent. There is too much humidity inside for them to survive for long. My heater and wicking humidifier are both on a plastic shelf, to make sure they stay off the floor. I was having some condensation build up on the floor closest to the heater, so there was a major electrocution risk there. I imagine the high humidity will trash the heater quickly, but that's why I run cheap heaters on a Willhi temperature controller.
Obviously, there are some pros and cons to this design, like any. I don't think this is better than anybody else's design, just a different way to do things. I want to thank everyone again for all they have contributed, and for blazing the trail to pantown!
Edited by ruawakeyet (09/05/21 12:28 AM)
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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: ruawakeyet]
#27456126 - 09/04/21 03:10 PM (2 years, 4 months ago) |
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Holy shit that’s a contraption right there!!
You could put chicken wire or something across the whole pool and set trays of pans on top which would basically turn the tent into a giant jcm type tub.
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