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specialpeopleclub



Registered: 04/10/14
Posts: 5,584
Loc: Mitten
Last seen: 3 years, 7 months
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Shiithead]
#22207508 - 09/08/15 02:05 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Well, the Muslems want it now. It gets annoying when people compare before their parents were born. Do you remember the millions dead in the world wars? Noone really does now, noone cares, it is over so move the fuck on. Singapore, better? Yeah, I want to be lashed in public 0r executed over weed, fucking retarded
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Dr.Wongburger
Yes!!


Registered: 08/23/15
Posts: 1,308
Loc: Colorado, USA
Last seen: 6 years, 11 months
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Beanhead]
#22207511 - 09/08/15 02:05 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Fuck Sharia law. Over there, great good for them. Not in my country tho. Not in the USA. Never gonna happen buddy.
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Shiithead
Your Huckleberry



Registered: 04/05/13
Posts: 9,997
Loc: God's Flat Green Earth
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Beanhead]
#22207516 - 09/08/15 02:07 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Con:
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Ephesians 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. Psalm 12:6 The words of the Lord are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Hebrews 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear. Revelation 3:11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.
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Ellis Dee
Archangel



Registered: 06/29/01
Posts: 13,104
Loc: Fire in the sky
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Lophosaurus] 1
#22207523 - 09/08/15 02:07 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Lophosaurus said: No one would visit Chicago just like no is vacationing in Saudi Arabia. There isn't that much crime going on anyways. I drive and travel 8 hours a day and I never see any serious crimes being committed.
Not much crime in Chicago??? You might be safer in the downtown business district but Chicago is a trainwreck, totally infested with gangs and robbers.
Here's a story just from last weekend. Police: 6 killed, 35 wounded in Chicago weekend shootings http://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/7/71/898828/2-killed-9-wounded-chicago-weekend-shootings
-------------------- "If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
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Ezuma
Gontish Wizard



Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 8,423
Loc: Roke
Last seen: 10 months, 21 days
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Lol who was honestly suggesting Sharia law would be introduced to the US? That wouldn't and shouldn't ever happen. Sharia law is nothing but cons. Islam is almost nothing but cons. I've got no love for fundamentalist Christians or Jews either but at least they seem to represent a small minority. Fuck Sharia Law, and fuck their damn prophet. Imma draw cartoons of whoever the fuck I like
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koraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,672
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Ellis Dee] 4
#22207531 - 09/08/15 02:09 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ellis Dee said:
Quote:
koraks said: Of course sharia law isn't a good idea. But it's not only because of the crass punishments associated with it. But a decent debate on the issue isn't possible since most people are not capable of looking past those punishments and recognize what is inherently wrong with sharia as a system.
Other than being based on Islam what's wrong with it?
That's the first thing. A second is its reliance on incredibly unreliable methods for finding and evaluating evidence. A third is the fact that there's no consistent set of laws underlying it, but a vague set of ramblings that is open to any imaginable interpretation in the form of the quran and the hadith. A fourth is its lack of consistent procedures in its application, leading to gross inequality in outcomes. And the list goes on and on. It's a fundamentally flawed system.
The argument that it effectively eradicates crime is nonsensical, as sharia trials are as common as trials are in the west. Apparently, there's still criminal behavior. And according to our standards, the punishments that are part of sharia law are in themselves criminal acts.
The comparison with Singapore's judicial system is beyond me and only seems to rely on the fact that Singapore still has the death penalty for certain crimes. Singapore's judicial system is much more similar to Western systems than it is to sharia. In fact, it looks nothing like sharia.
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Ellis Dee
Archangel



Registered: 06/29/01
Posts: 13,104
Loc: Fire in the sky
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: koraks]
#22207562 - 09/08/15 02:16 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
koraks said:
Quote:
Ellis Dee said:
Quote:
koraks said: Of course sharia law isn't a good idea. But it's not only because of the crass punishments associated with it. But a decent debate on the issue isn't possible since most people are not capable of looking past those punishments and recognize what is inherently wrong with sharia as a system.
Other than being based on Islam what's wrong with it?
That's the first thing. A second is its reliance on incredibly unreliable methods for finding and evaluating evidence. A third is the fact that there's no consistent set of laws underlying it, but a vague set of ramblings that is open to any imaginable interpretation in the form of the quran and the hadith. A fourth is its lack of consistent procedures in its application, leading to gross inequality in outcomes. And the list goes on and on. It's a fundamentally flawed system.
The argument that it effectively eradicates crime is nonsensical, as sharia trials are as common as trials are in the west. Apparently, there's still criminal behavior. And according to our standards, the punishments that are part of sharia law are in themselves criminal acts.
The comparison with Singapore's judicial system is beyond me and only seems to rely on the fact that Singapore still has the death penalty for certain crimes. Singapore's judicial system is much more similar to Western systems than it is to sharia. In fact, it looks nothing like sharia.
All good points. Thanks for the informative contribution!
-------------------- "If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
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Lophosaurus
suruasohpol


Registered: 08/09/07
Posts: 8,744
Loc: CA
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Ellis Dee]
#22207613 - 09/08/15 02:28 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ellis Dee said:
Quote:
Lophosaurus said: No one would visit Chicago just like no is vacationing in Saudi Arabia. There isn't that much crime going on anyways. I drive and travel 8 hours a day and I never see any serious crimes being committed.
Not much crime in Chicago??? You might be safer in the downtown business district but Chicago is a trainwreck, totally infested with gangs and robbers.
Here's a story just from last weekend. Police: 6 killed, 35 wounded in Chicago weekend shootings http://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/7/71/898828/2-killed-9-wounded-chicago-weekend-shootings
Oh, Yeah. I was talking about the area I'm in, not Chicago. Most places in the US are pretty safe if you aren't gangbanging or up to shenanigans. Of course if you go to places like downtown Miami or Detroit you could easily end up in trouble. You think if you lash a gangbanger or cut their hand off then they will clean themselves up and be a good person?
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Dr.Wongburger
Yes!!


Registered: 08/23/15
Posts: 1,308
Loc: Colorado, USA
Last seen: 6 years, 11 months
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Ezuma]
#22207622 - 09/08/15 02:30 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ezuma said: Lol who was honestly suggesting Sharia law would be introduced to the US? That wouldn't and shouldn't ever happen. Sharia law is nothing but cons. Islam is almost nothing but cons. I've got no love for fundamentalist Christians or Jews either but at least they seem to represent a small minority. Fuck Sharia Law, and fuck their damn prophet. Imma draw cartoons of whoever the fuck I like
I guess I got caught up in all the hype from the past when I was hearing all about this. What does your "love" or lack of love for Christians or Jews matter? thanks for sharing tho. I don't see or hear of Jewish people or Christians forcing their laws upon the people in todays world, if I'm wrong do let me know (even tho this is besides the point and subject). Even tho the USA is prominently a Christian nation.
Sharia law being introduced to the USA :
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/29/sharia-law-usa-states-ban_n_3660813.html
http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/2015/01/05/shariah-in-american-courts-the-expanding-incursion-of-islamic-law-in-the-u-s-legal-system/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ban_on_sharia_law
"In the United States, there are no Islamic courts, but judges sometimes have to consider Islamic law in their decisions. For example, a judge may have to recognize the validity of an Islamic marriage contract from a Muslim country in order to grant a divorce in America.
Some Islamic scholars argue that true Islamic belief cannot be coerced by the state, and therefore belief in Shariah should only come from the individual and not be codified by the state."
"insinuation of Islam’s supremacist shariah legal code into the U.S. judiciary. Entitled Shariah in American Courts: The Expanding Incursion of Islamic Law in the U.S. Legal System"
"The Center first raised an alarm about the penetration of American jurisprudence by one of the most anti-constitutional of such foreign legal codes with its 2011 report, Shariah Law and American State Courts: An Assessment of State Appellate Court Cases. That study examined a sample of fifty cases and found that in twenty-seven of them, in twenty-three different states, the courts in question allowed the use of shariah, generally to the detriment of women and/or children whose rights under our Constitution were infringed."
"This monograph also suggests that the effort to invoke shariah in U.S. courts is expanding. Worse yet, the total number of such cases is surely far larger in light of the fact that the proceedings of the vast majority of them are not published."
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koraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,672
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Ellis Dee]
#22207628 - 09/08/15 02:31 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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 I hope this adds some depth to the notion that sharia is just about idiotic punishments. Sure, it has its good points, but all considered, it's a hopeless solution compared to Western judicial systems.
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Bitter Cactus
reformed bad boy



Registered: 01/26/12
Posts: 11,773
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Last seen: 8 years, 4 months
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I would never shop lift if I knew the result would be my hand getting cut off.
There is something admirable about a tough on crime outlook. Instill fear in the people and nobody will dare to steal or do anything against the law.
-------------------- Taking acid and thinking you are a better man is a lot different then actually becoming a better man.
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Ellis Dee
Archangel



Registered: 06/29/01
Posts: 13,104
Loc: Fire in the sky
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Lophosaurus]
#22207649 - 09/08/15 02:36 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Lophosaurus said: You think if you lash a gangbanger or cut their hand off then they will clean themselves up and be a good person?
I think the recidivism rate will be near zero, especially for robbery because the robbers will be missing their hands and feet. And when the young kids see the OGs missing their hands and feet over mugging a senior citizen or a burglary it will set an example. Kids could grow up pitying the criminal for his lack of hands instead of dreaming about growing up and being a gangbanger.
Maybe sharia is a bad idea, but I think there is a place for harsh punishments improving society. Singapore is pretty close to ideal in that regard.
-------------------- "If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
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Ellis Dee
Archangel



Registered: 06/29/01
Posts: 13,104
Loc: Fire in the sky
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: koraks]
#22207678 - 09/08/15 02:41 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
koraks said:
 I hope this adds some depth to the notion that sharia is just about idiotic punishments. Sure, it has its good points, but all considered, it's a hopeless solution compared to Western judicial systems.
Yes 
I guess I liked the "idiotic punishments" part and saw the only bad aspect being that it was based on a religion that I loath. It appears to be a thouroughly flawed system in many ways.
-------------------- "If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
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Dr.Wongburger
Yes!!


Registered: 08/23/15
Posts: 1,308
Loc: Colorado, USA
Last seen: 6 years, 11 months
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Yea well over here in the United States of America we don't practice cruel and unusual punishment.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cruel_and_unusual_punishment
We stick your ass in jail.
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Beanhead
IS IRONIC PARADOX


Registered: 10/11/08
Posts: 17,257
Loc: Geospatial inversion.
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
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Quote:
Bitter Cactus said: I would never shop lift if I knew the result would be my hand getting cut off.
There is something admirable about a tough on crime outlook. Instill fear in the people and nobody will dare to steal or do anything against the law. 
Just 3D print another
suckers
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Dr.Wongburger
Yes!!


Registered: 08/23/15
Posts: 1,308
Loc: Colorado, USA
Last seen: 6 years, 11 months
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Beanhead]
#22207696 - 09/08/15 02:45 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Beanhead said:
Just 3D print another
suckers
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Oggy
Stranger Danger


Registered: 12/05/14
Posts: 1,276
Loc: Planet Remulak
Last seen: 6 months, 29 days
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Beanhead]
#22207703 - 09/08/15 02:46 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Sounds like a world of blind left handed people to me.
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Ellis Dee
Archangel



Registered: 06/29/01
Posts: 13,104
Loc: Fire in the sky
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Oggy]
#22207735 - 09/08/15 02:50 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Oggy said: Sounds like a world of blind left handed people to me.
No, only the bad guys would end up that way.
-------------------- "If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
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larry.fisherman
shoulda died already



Registered: 11/03/12
Posts: 36,294
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Re: Sharia law. Pros and cons. [Re: Ellis Dee]
#22207832 - 09/08/15 03:08 PM (8 years, 4 months ago) |
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You are so jaded. Morality is fluid. Nothing can change that, not laws, man, or a god.
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Ezuma
Gontish Wizard



Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 8,423
Loc: Roke
Last seen: 10 months, 21 days
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Just threw in the bit about other religions to point out its not that I have a hard on for hating muslims, its just their religion is the most toxic of the major ones by far  I don't think religious beliefs should have any bearing on what people can or can't do in the law. Everyone should get the same treatment. If they wanna wear a fucking tablecloth over their face fine whatever, but they shouldn't be surprised when people are sketched out that their faces can't be seen
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