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Offlinepopok
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Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw * 1
    #22191489 - 09/05/15 05:59 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I've been recently to visit a big industrial oyster producer in Greece, that started 12 years ago and I would like to share what I have seen there. They were very nice and open to share how their production system works, when others producers hidden behind industrial secret.

First, the straw is cut with a big wood chipper (Photo 1). Then it is moistened and mixed for 2-3 days to reach proper moisture. Then tons of straw is loaded in a stainless steel pasteurization tunnel (that cost 200 000euro), that take 1 week to heat, keep 65°c for two days, then cool down. Then spawn (180 000 euro per year from Sylvan) is introduced in the tunnel (Photo 2), mixed there by machines. Finally, straw and spawn are loaded by a conveyor belt into a machine that compress, bag them into 15-20kg bags (7kg dry weight)(Photo 3), and punch 12 holes of 1.5cm diameter (about every 20cm). They process this way tons of straw, they incubate in a special room on the same site (Photo 7). They sell 21day old bags to farmers at 5euro each (retailers resell them at 8-10euro). All this according to the manager, as I didn't visit this facility.
Photo 1, chipping straw
Photo 2, pasteurization tank
Photo 3, compressing, bagging and punching
Photo 4, an incubating bag

What I have seen is the fructification facility, geographically separated from the other sites. They have 9 10mx40m cylendrical greenhouses, each as a separate building. Each greenhouse has low semi transparent windows. Airtight walls and roof are made of thermoisolated corrugated plastic sheets, held by an internal skeleton of steel pipes. The ground was a smooth industrial concrete, almost slippery, and had 2 50cmx50cm drainage holes in the middle of the greenhouse.  Door was a truck size thick (probably thermoisolated too) metal sliding door. On each side of the door, two huge 1.2mx1.2m fans extract air out of the greenhouse, but only one was on. At the opposite side of the greenhouse, a large 4mx2m evaporative cooling panel allow air to seep in, I didn't ask if it was filtered. With this system, the growing space was only at 23.5°C when outdoor shade temperature was 30°C, I discovered since that  evaporative cooling consume less power than AC, and allow to premoist air. The air flow was strong, you could almost feel it as a light wind. I couldn't see the cooling pad from the outside, but they didn't seem to use other filtration than bug screen. Additional moisture was achieved to reach 80% in summer and 90% in winter, with low pressure mist nozzle in burst of 15 seconds.
Green houses
Front door and fan
Inside the greenhouse, rows of bags, cooling pad in the back

In the greenhouse space, the blocks are piled 3 by 3, in a π shape, on the ground, with 1m between piles. The piles form 6 rows along the length of the greenhouse, wich I found low as density. I was explained that each green house was emptied and the bags thrown away after 1-2 months or 2 - 3 flushs, and the space cleaned without chemicals, not even bleach. After that it was filled again in one or two weeks. This procedure is rotated over the 9 greenhouses. Surprisingly, for contaminants the situation goes from a bit of thrich on bag holes plus some flies for the cleanest greenhouse, to overgrown bags with mold on 1/3 of bags with flies and larvae for the dirtiest greenhouse, but summer is harsh on growers here. The day of the visit, each green house produced from 20 to 40 kg, by my eye estimatiom. Before harvest, they remove the diseased yellow or dryish mushrooms, they give or sell it to a sheep shephard or throw away. At another site they use a smaller greenhouse for packaging (does this foam and plastic package breathe ?), drying and storing fresh or dryied mushrooms. When packaging, they separate large mushrooms that are sold more expensively.
A bag pile
Harvest
Packaging
They said each bag weight 7kg dry, and have 50% to 60% moisture content, produce an average of 2kg in summer and 3.5kg in winter, that makes 28% - 42% biologic efficiency, consistent with my results on 3 flush using same spawn, slightly lower than declared for mycelia.be strains(http://www.mycelia.be/en/strain-collection/strain-list), but very low compared to stamets and others. They cultivate 4 strains in the summer and 4 others in winter to balance risks, including in the summer HK35 a winter strain. They mainly have Pleurotus ostreatus, although they have a greenhouse with citrinopileatus, sajor caju, and blocks baught from Netherlands of shitake.

I hope this report helps growers like the visit did to me


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Invisiblepablokabute
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: popok] * 1
    #22191492 - 09/05/15 06:01 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Thanks for sharing. :billymaythumbup:



:getstoned:


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InvisibleElkabong
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: popok] * 1
    #22191823 - 09/05/15 09:02 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)



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Offlineinvitro

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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: pablokabute] * 1
    #22192107 - 09/05/15 10:35 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

:awesome:


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: invitro] * 1
    #22192437 - 09/05/15 12:26 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

that's pretty crazy such an operation is running on pretty shitty yeilds.  and they're buying in blocks?  crazy...


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Invisiblesolarity
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: drake89] * 1
    #22192566 - 09/05/15 12:52 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Are the pictures screen grabs from a video, they don't look like shots you took?

Drake - blocks are not that unusual, if your set up is pasteurisation think of the capital investment required to produce shiitake. At a certain volume it makes financial sense.  All of the button mushroom industry is segmented like that.


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: solarity] * 1
    #22192831 - 09/05/15 01:54 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

solarity said:
Are the pictures screen grabs from a video, they don't look like shots you took?

Drake - blocks are not that unusual, if your set up is pasteurisation think of the capital investment required to produce shiitake. At a certain volume it makes financial sense.  All of the button mushroom industry is segmented like that.




back to my first point- this is what a real oyster mushroom farm looks like.



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Offlinepopok
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: drake89] * 1
    #22200592 - 09/07/15 04:18 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Thanks drake, it looks exactely the same, except more blocks per surface and different greenhouse materials. Do you know if they filter air intake ?

Sorry for my crappy photos. I forgot my camera when visiting, I thought that screenshots from TV were better than nothing.


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Visit our blog and our oyster farm on FB


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Offlinemoonlightmushrooms
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: drake89] * 1
    #22200962 - 09/07/15 08:28 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

drake89 said:

back to my first point- this is what a real oyster mushroom farm looks like.






Where is this?


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: popok] * 1
    #22201177 - 09/07/15 09:29 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

popok said:
Thanks drake, it looks exactely the same, except more blocks per surface and different greenhouse materials. Do you know if they filter air intake ?

Sorry for my crappy photos. I forgot my camera when visiting, I thought that screenshots from TV were better than nothing.



I think the compressed 15kg blocks are pretty standard in Europe.  But this Greek farm has very low BE compared to the one I posted. 

The photo I posted is taken from pleurotus.hu

If you're not getting 100% BE on the first flush, you're simply not doing it right.  Some farms I know get Better than that even.


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Offlinepopok
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: drake89] * 1
    #22202534 - 09/07/15 02:56 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

drake89 said:
If you're not getting 100% BE on the first flush, you're simply not doing it right.  Some farms I know get Better than that even.



How do you know that ? with wich strain ? you get 15kg oyster on such block on the first flush ?
I thought that in the beginning too, but I'am having some doubt. I find more and more pro sources claiming similar low BE. For instance, on mycelia.be : "200 to 250 g saleable mushrooms per kg fresh substrate"


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Visit our blog and our oyster farm on FB


Edited by popok (09/07/15 03:00 PM)


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Invisibleeatyualive
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: popok] * 1
    #22202899 - 09/07/15 04:13 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

cool.


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: popok] * 1
    #22202904 - 09/07/15 04:13 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

popok said:
Quote:

drake89 said:
If you're not getting 100% BE on the first flush, you're simply not doing it right.  Some farms I know get Better than that even.



How do you know that ? with wich strain ? you get 15kg oyster on such block on the first flush ?
I thought that in the beginning too, but I'am having some doubt. I find more and more pro sources claiming similar low BE. For instance, on mycelia.be : "200 to 250 g saleable mushrooms per kg fresh substrate"



i know a lot of farmers.  I'm not saying I get that kind of crazy BE.  But Lipa was telling me about his hybrid or isolate of wellington that's doing very well.  Most people I know that get great BE run amycel's 3015 on straw.  but it's about a million times easier to optimize your system to maximum efficiency than inoculating more substrate.  I do know that I am the best shiitake farmer in my region.  The other guy near me works twice the hours, with 6x as much square footage, and twice the employees, to produce a little less than me.  He could just grow better, IE sourcing high quality information and genetics.  To be fair he is an ex-military, and I'm a young biologist.


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Offlinepopok
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: drake89] * 1
    #22203092 - 09/07/15 04:55 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I should give the amycel 3015 a try. Drake, how long are you in commercial cultivation ? How did you optimize your system to maximum bio-efficiency ? is there a method, except sourcing high quality cultivation information and strain genetics ? what shitake strain do you use ? nice grows photo on your fb page

For the farm I visited, with their fully automatic block production by tons, I had the feeling that inoculating more substrate was much easier for them than anything else, especially if requiring more manpower.


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Visit our blog and our oyster farm on FB


Edited by popok (09/07/15 04:57 PM)


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Offlinemikesethnobotany
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: popok] * 1
    #22203255 - 09/07/15 05:22 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Nice FB page, Drake. Congrats on your succes. If medical school didn't pan out my plan B
was a mushroom farm in Missouri

I always thought that you should harvest shiitake before the margins have
unrolled for better shelf life? I guess if you're selling directly to local restaurants or
consumers that would not be an issue. Just curious why you wait


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: mikesethnobotany] * 1
    #22203532 - 09/07/15 06:07 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mikesethnobotany said:
Nice FB page, Drake. Congrats on your succes. If medical school didn't pan out my plan B
was a mushroom farm in Missouri

I always thought that you should harvest shiitake before the margins have
unrolled for better shelf life? I guess if you're selling directly to local restaurants or
consumers that would not be an issue. Just curious why you wait



thanks.  i'm really not that good, but good enough to be profitable selling wholesale.  My shiitakes blow the pennsylvanians out of the water.  I grow them as big as possible because I get paid by the pound.  They do not rot in the fridge, unlike oysters, they will just dry out after a month or so.


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: popok] * 1
    #22203556 - 09/07/15 06:12 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

popok said:
I should give the amycel 3015 a try. Drake, how long are you in commercial cultivation ? How did you optimize your system to maximum bio-efficiency ? is there a method, except sourcing high quality cultivation information and strain genetics ? what shitake strain do you use ? nice grows photo on your fb page

For the farm I visited, with their fully automatic block production by tons, I had the feeling that inoculating more substrate was much easier for them than anything else, especially if requiring more manpower.



i've been growing for a living for about 3 years.  i'm not claiming to be an expert among mushroom farmers, but probably around here :wink:.  I certainly don't have a method for maximum BE.  I don't even grow oysters any more, just shiitakes.  With them, I'm getting about 63% BE.  Which is just above what Aloha claims on their page.  And i'm only harvesting caps so actual BE is probably closer to 75-80%.

strain is 3782 which originate from mycelia.be

http://www.alohaculturebank.com/shiitake-fruiting-comparison.html


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Invisiblelipa

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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: drake89] * 1
    #22206577 - 09/08/15 10:35 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Those 15kg blocks at 100% should yield around 5 kg (11lbs) of mushrooms. When the operation is so big like that they most definitely are at the very least going to second flush which will definitely get them to 100 %BE by then. After second flush in my opinion the blocks should at least be moved to a secondary room or be recycled. Flies and viruses tend to kick in after that because of the spore load thus the need to gas the rooms..  We do 5 kg blocks and get around 75% on first flush average wise. By second flush we hit 125-180%. Then the blocks are off to the pigs to be mixed with molasses and eaten..


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Offlineinvitro

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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: lipa] * 1
    #22207569 - 09/08/15 02:17 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

What kind of gas is used to clean the rooms?

I didn't know that flies were attracted to spores, does that go for all mushrooms or just oysters?


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Invisiblelipa

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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: invitro] * 1
    #22207606 - 09/08/15 02:26 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Spores attract flies, flies bring in viruses and then the spores carry viruses around the room.  Chlorine gas just about most sanitizers will work with most foggers.


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Offlinepopok
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: lipa]
    #22210609 - 09/09/15 02:36 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

lipa said:
We do 5 kg blocks and get around 75% on first flush average wise. By second flush we hit 125-180%. Then the blocks are off to the pigs to be mixed with molasses and eaten..



which Strain do you use ? what substrate gives you this result ?


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Invisiblelipa

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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: popok]
    #22214550 - 09/09/15 09:51 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

We use rice or wheat straw and a strain from the wellington strain aloha has. Rice straw can give 100% on our size of blocks on first flush often but we don't like shredding it because it is difficult.


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Offlinepopok
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Re: Visit to a professional gray oyster mass producer on straw [Re: lipa]
    #22220974 - 09/11/15 09:23 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Thanks lipa, much appreciated. :thumbup:


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