Home | Community | Message Board

High Mountain Compost
Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract, Kratom Powder For Sale   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale, Red Vein Kratom   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder, Kratom Powder for Sale, Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds, Bulk Cannabis Seeds, Feminized Cannabis Seeds, High THC Strains, USA West Coast Strains   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals, CBD Edibles, CBD Oils   North Spore Bulk Substrate, Cultivation Supplies, North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7  [ show all ]
This thread is very old and might contain outdated or inaccurate information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
""Silver" A Wolf's Story -the shamanic use of a.muscaria ?-." (a speculation)
    #2217907 - 01/04/04 06:05 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

It is my intention with this thread to tell you, probably in a number of "installments", what I have discovered about a.muscaria.This may hopefully serve as a journey of discovery for myself also.

Our journey begins with a wolf "Silver",his (or "her's"), is the spirit that lives within the breast of the initiate.Nowadays he may be your only guide!
The following information was taken from "Wild Battlefields:Wolf" BBC 2 December 24th 2003.
"Separation can lead to disaster.....Teamwork is the key to wolf survival..It's best to be one of the gang.Life on his own would be lonely and short." However  "The aggravation (of the pack's disputes over kills etc .ed) is sometimes best avoided altogether"...and..."The hassles of pack life often force young wolves to go it alone.But winter is not a good time to hit the road."..and..."Loneliness and hunger soon get the better of him".."the only way he can make contact is by sound.He varies the tone and pitch and his long muzzle helps trumpet the sound."..  the following is paraphrased ..."The different frequencies travel at more than 300m /second..faster in warm air.On a windless day it could travel 15km.The lower frequencies make it past most barriers"..."A wolf's hearing is very sensitive and they hunt just as well by night as they do in the day."
The programme did not deal with the possible fate of older wolves who are forced to live solitary existencies, as result of disputes or pack separation.I hope to be able to find out more at another juncture.
So the "five elements" of the wolf's strength are fang,endurance,sense of smell,howl and teamwork!
The loss of the wolf in Britain (and spiritually) has now lead to it's replacement by another top predator group ,the "middlewieght" cats -mainly puma and panther-.In America the reintroduction of the wolf is helping to redress the balance of nature by solving the coyote problem.It would be wonderful to think that the bear,boar,and wolf could one day be reintroduced somewhere in Britain*.But even if this proves difficult it's spirit should still be among us.
By the way guys the big cat issue is now becoming a serious problem,dream on if you think we'll be able to catch them all and deport them to the 'States and India,this "nation of animal lovers" is hardly going to look kindly on the notion of "shoot on site"!Maybe we could "tranq" them on site....?
(a short digression)...When a S.A gamepark "lost" a leopard in the suburbs of Jo'berg they panicked.."We can't possibly leave it there they (the inhabitants) will go nuts!"So they set out to catch their errant "lep"....When they had caught  eleven leopards none of which was "their" leopard they realised that they had been living with leopards for years without ever seeing any!My father told me, on my most recent visit that one had killed a farmer's lurcher when he'd gone hunting a sheep killer.There have been sitings of panthers on Southampton common!..( animal spirits have been the guides of the shaman since the dawn of consciousness).
End of "installment" 1 (don't worry shroomers we'll get to the fungi facts  patience,patience..) :eyemouth:

(I am informed that our local "Otter and Owl Sanctuary" is planning to introduce both bear and wolf (Sept 06 now you lot). They already have lynx, wild boar, wallabies (wallabies !), deer and various mustilida* (correct spelling?) -as well as owls, lots of owls from all over the world-.)

*Including of-course otters, "piles" of otters!


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 02:35 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2218645 - 01/04/04 04:59 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

The story of the red/orange topped "flame from the Earth" amanita muscaria IS the story of fire.We should consider ourselves as "modern Mowglis" rediscovering principles which far pre-date paleolithicum.It should also be a path of humility because it must surely be true that homo sapiens sapiens was not the only species of hominid to experience a.muscaria's effects, and neither is it's consumption limited to hominids and other primates.We must ask ourselves;"what evolutionary benefits does the fungi bestow on the various species which ingest it?"The a.muscaria is a gene map repository,but not just for that of our direct ancestors, it is trans-genic.When you remove an amanita you remove THE EXACT DNA CHAIN IN FUNCTION WHILST YOU REMOVE IT! That is the essence of sacredness*.Someone on another forum said something interesting (sorry I can't check it now but I will retrieve it) ,about the way that he felt that "relationship" was key to the understanding of the fungi's processes,THIS is where we are going with this thread.But believe me guys, and gals (I usually use "guys" to mean everyone),it can be dangerous if you don't know what you're doing.Hopefully this thread will help lay that evil down,for good. :lol:

*Contentious and possibly "wrong" in terms of nomenclature etc. but something of the sort is going on!


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/28/06 04:22 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinellamaboy
the weasel thatsnagged the bee

Registered: 11/08/03
Posts: 563
Loc: Portland PNW
Last seen: 12 years, 1 month
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2218659 - 01/04/04 05:07 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

*yawn*


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2218660 - 01/04/04 05:07 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

By the way please don't infer from the above that I consider "us" to be homo sapiens sapiens ( whatever that may mean), this is a matter currently far from resolution.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. *DELETED* [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2218665 - 01/04/04 05:09 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Post deleted by Silverwolf


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2218695 - 01/04/04 05:23 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

The exact comment from "Mushmonkey" (very appropriate) is; "Could it be that the trip from an amanita is more affected by your own expectations and mindset than other psychedelics?"...he also mentions the Berserkers (lovely boy)


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. *DELETED* [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2221199 - 01/05/04 07:37 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Post deleted by Silverwolf

Reason for deletion: Now irrelevant



--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2223365 - 01/06/04 04:08 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

"Mycorrhizal Spin Doctor?"
Before I go on a feel that I must give you some idea of the process by which Britain came to be populated by the "middle-weight" big cats.
In the late 70's the U.K government changed the law on the private ownership of "dangerous animals".They neglected however to change the legislation concerning where domestic kept "pets" could be released.Which at the time, before "The Dangerous Wild Animals Act" came into force, these "possessions" still were.Consequently those irresponsible enough to "own" such magnificent creatures in the first place proved themselves even more irresponsible by releasing them on places like Dartmoor,Exmoor or anywhere else they could find!Climate change due to global warming has also seen their numbers swell.
O.K?
Today's installment concerns foraging for and the act of picking the a.muscaria.

The really essential,and different, thing one needs to understand about "the big "A"s" is their mycorrhizal nature.Generally in Britain a.musc is found mycorrhizal with three different tree species; birch,pine and oak (years ago I picked some in August whch appeared to be beech symbiotes,however I now have no way of verifying this "one off" observation, I was only 18 and my family no longer has any connection with the area).
Each of these different trees has a "vibration" and "resonance" of it's own.I am an associate member of the British Vibrational and Flower Essence Association and have been studying the application of sonics,in various forms, more or less all my life.Through the study of the thirteen month year astrological system of the ancients I have also come to a deeper appreciation of the "wisdom of the trees". The thirteen month 28 day lunar year (or "Silver Wheel") is known (in my current "shorthand" at least) as the "Beth-Luis-Nion" system (however "New Year" is Samhain -"Halloween"-not the Winter Solstice -"Alban Arthan"-) these are; "Beth"=birch, "Luis"=rowan and "Nion"=ash. Two of the three trees already mentioned as a.musc symbiotes are part of this calendar.
So we are tuning in to the vibration of each individual tree vibration and the deeper vibration and resonance of the earth.
The D.N.A double helix,of which the rune "ing" is a cross section (scripts such as "ogham" a precurssor to "the runes" are now known to be far older -and more expressive/complex ?- than was once supposed), connects us to our pasts, and our "imminence", these are the spiralic correolis life forces which arise from the earth through the fungi and out into the cosmos.
The vital characteristics which we can access through the fungi may be indicated by the trees with which they are symbiotic,these are;
1.Birch=Sex (connected by Ralph Blum "the rune man", as "Berkana", with sexual energy)
2.Pine=Social Revellry (pine ales were brought to Scotland by the Vikings, and as one of Edward Bach's original flower remedies the potentised essence of it's blooms is known as "the conscience salver"))
3.Oak=Wisdom ("The Tree of the Summer Solstice", the potentised essence of which was said by Edward Bach to impart stamina and endurance to those whose usual forebearance was challenged).
However Just as not all flowers are suitable for use as potentised remedies (the Birch is not*) not all trees appear as lunar months on the ancient wheel, for the Beech may also be an amanita host.
The active amanitas receive their fuel from the plant sugars they are "gifted" by the tree with which their hyphae are mycorrhizal.The possible variances in the attributes these may impart make up some of the reasons why I have been interested in the controlled propogation of these fungi.


* N.B In Edward Bach's system.












































Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 02:46 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleEffedS
 User Gallery

Registered: 05/15/02
Posts: 7,370
Loc: Daylight Slavings
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2223739 - 01/06/04 06:33 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Thanks for this, a very interesting read. I also love muscaria, and always love to learn more. 

Don't let llamaboy upset you, he obviously doesn't understand the true passion for the entheogens just yet. :wink:


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Effed]
    #2224143 - 01/06/04 09:43 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Hi Effed, since you are a lover of Amanita muscaria are you aware of entheomedia.com, They produce an o all colored journal, theree issues so far on the amanita and Soma complex. I have a lengthy paper coming out in Issue four providing a bibliography of about 95% of all articles pertaining to these shrooms from the 1str century on.

Mark Hofmann is the editor of the Journal. It is the best on Amanita except for the large volume German language book by Wolfgang Bauer, Edzard Klapp and Rosenbaum, also heavilly illustrated with much color.

Currently the site is down for repairs and construction.

I will post here the covers for the three issues already out. They are devoted primarily to Amanita muscaria. I also have in my files several unpublished papers on Amanitas by young students written over the past twenty years including some unpublished nbotes for the Irsh Soma book.

But I will come back here in a half an hour and post those covers for you. This is a great journal and unforutnately only 100 copies of each issue were available and I do not know if back aissues are available or if more are printed.

My bibliogrpahy on the shroom comes out soon.

mj


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineMushmonkey
shiftlesslayabout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/26/03
Posts: 10,855
Last seen: 9 months, 26 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2224215 - 01/06/04 10:14 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Wow, I got a mention.. :laugh:

I'd absolutely drool over any papers about amanitas made available.  I've really an obsession with knowledge about these little things.. from one side of Eurasia to the other, they were a part of spiritual and religious beliefs and practices.. and possibly North America too, I haven't been able to find anything about the practices of native american tribes.. that seems to be a very strong indicator that there is something to them that we have lost, something that may be very important to understanding our roots as humans.


--------------------
i finally got around to making a sig
revel in its glory and quake in fear at its might
grar.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Effed]
    #2224236 - 01/06/04 10:20 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

WE must never forget the difinitive work by R. Gordon Wason: Soma: Divine Mushroom of Immortality.



Here are the first three issues of Entheos, mostly all devoted to Amanita muscaria and then four other popular books on the Amanita.
















And the Irish Soma theory





And one of my many surreal amanita art images.



mjshroomer.

and that is only a minor part of my Soma bibliography


Edited by mjshroomer (01/06/04 10:31 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #2224256 - 01/06/04 10:28 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Mushmonkey

Subject: Hi,

There are several papers in French and in English on the use of Amanita muscaria amongst some tribes of the Ojoibway of Northern Michigan and southern Ontario. They are the only no known Notrth americian Indians who used the Amanita muscaria. Some papers are by Navel and other sby Keewaydinoquay, a shamanic women of great power.

I met her back in 1977 at the 2nd International Conference on Hallucinogenic Mushrooms and the following year at the hallucinogens and Shamanisn in Native American Life Conference in San Francisco where her and R. Gordon Wasson announced their discovery of these indians who use the Amanita.

mj


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2226192 - 01/07/04 04:36 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I have just tried to use the search function to search the FAQ for the profiles of the psycho-active chemicals found in the active amanitas,unfortunately it doesn't appear to be functioning properly at the moment.If anyone could give the relevant link,which was my intention,or better still reproduce the chemical model here (esp.pictorially), I'm sure we would all be grateful.Remember however that most traditional shaman were/are, like myself, not biochemists!


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2226281 - 01/07/04 05:01 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

RE: "Essence of Sacredness"
I feel I should attempt to clarify something.
Whilst clearly both fungi and tree have their own separate species genomes it is the imprint of the previous vibrations (of both homonid and non-homonid interaction with the species) "trips", and even more so and more importantly those interactions performed with intent "Shamanism", that allow us access into our pasts, both genetic and "other-wise".
(The word "shaman" originally Siberian in origin could probably be rendered more clearly for the modern audience as "specialist")


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 02:51 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2226367 - 01/07/04 05:44 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

CHEMICAL ASPECTS:
The chemical properties listed below have been detected and/or isolated from the following species: Amanita muscaria, Amanita pantherina, Amanita regalis, Amanita corthurnata, Amanita gemmata, and Amanita strobiliformis.
(-)-r-4-Hydroxy-2-pyrrolidon-(2).
2(3H)-Oxazolone.
3-Bromoisoxazole.
3-deoxyibotenic acid.
3-Hydroxyisoxazoles.
[3C]Muscimol.
[3H]-Muscimol.
4-aminoalkyl-5-methyl-3-isoxazoles.
5-alkoxyisoxazoles.
5-aminomethyl-3-isothiazolol (Thiomuscimol).
[14]Muscimol.
Alkyl-1-azirine-3-carboxylates.
D,L-ibotenic acid.
D,L-muscarine.
D,L-threo-a-amino-3)x0-5-isoxazolidineacetic acid.
D,L-tricholomic acid.
Agarin: (See Pantherine below).
Amavadin.
GABA.
Ibotenic acid.
Isoxozole.
Isoxazolin-5-ones.
L-Muscarine.
Muscarine.
Muscarazone.
Muscarone.
Muscazone.
Muscimole.
Pantherine - (Agarin).
Selenium.
Stizolobic and Stizolobinic acid.
Theomuscimol.
Vanadium.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
The above list was excerpted from Teonan?catl: A Bibibliography of Entheogenic Fungi by John W. Allen and Jochen Gartz, PH.D.

If you want the references to each individual person and the hundreds of papers on this subject then you would have to purchase the Cd-Rom.

mj


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinethe man
still tappin caps
Other User Gallery

Registered: 08/13/99
Posts: 5,697
Loc: C A N A D A
Last seen: 1 day, 15 hours
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2227196 - 01/07/04 07:07 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

all thsi amanta talk i think i will share a cool find.

i was in costa rica reading a tourist magazine to find a nice place to eat for a treat. anyway i see muscara. i was liek what? i turn back and it was a article abotu how this guy met a finnish girl and she told him that amanta m's arent deadly but fun. and thats why santa claus wore those colors and was so happy and used the finnish reindeer ect ect.

anywayjust thought it was weird to read that ina tourist magazine in central america.

peace


--------------------
And Moses Said "Let my mushrooms grow!"


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: the man]
    #2227501 - 01/08/04 05:54 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Thanks MJ
"The Fountain of Youth" stuff is lots of news to me. ESPECIALLY given my special interest in the Seminole indians from whom Ponce de Lyon, the French explorer, first heard the term in relation to an ESPECIALLY sacred spring.My own personal spiritual study has included speculation about whether the Seminole ,(along with p.tapenades?), were utilising "the sacred mushroom" (see above), a.muscaria or var. formosa!
P.S Love that book "Soma etc."


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 11:12 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2227554 - 01/08/04 06:55 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

The Following extracts are from an article published in "Yoga International" Nov 2003 itself an extract from "The Katha Upanishad" by Linda Johnsen.

"There is an eternal tree called the Ashvatta, which has it's roots above and it's branches below" says the "Katha Upanishad", a yogic text which unveils the secrets of death.The yoga masters, the shamans of Siberia,the Persian priests, the ancient Celts, and even the Vikings knew this tree well. growing up in Norway I heard about this amazing tree, which my grandparents called "Yggdrasil", That grew down from the sky."...."Go out at night and look up at Scorpio, near where the ecliptic (the path of the sun and the planets) crosses the Milky Way.There you'll find a small constellation in the tail of the celestial scorpion (or cobra ?.ed) which the yogis call Mula, "the root."This is the root in heaven out of which the world tree grows.It happens also to mark the galactic centre,a rather surprising coincidence if you believe in coincidences!
If you follow the spray of stars backward through the zodiac you'll see the Ashvatta's trunk growing through Scorpio, it's limbs branching out in Libra (the Indian constellation Vishakka here means "forked branches"), and fruit growing on it's branches in Leo and Virgo (the Indian constellation here called Phalguni means "fruit of the tree").The ancient sages placed a woman here called Kanya (our Virgo).With one hand (our constellation Corvus is called "Hasta","hand",in India) she's reaching out for the fruit.And there entwined in the tree next to her is a long snake we call the constellation "Hydra", which the ancient Indians called Ashlesha, the "KING OF THE SERPENTS" (caps mine .ed)"..."The North Celestial Pole is the "second tree" (parenthesis mine .ed), standing at a right angle to the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil which encircles the ecliptic.The silver (wolf's blood!! .ed) fruit of this Northern tree is the source of soma, the famous yogic nectar of immortality."..."Legends about the World Tree from India to Scandinavia agree there's an eagle near the top of the tree that the snake is trying to reach.The eagle is the ajna chakra,the centre of consciousness behind the midpoint of the eyebrows.When the snake passes the eagle and reaches the very top of the tree of our psychic nervous system,enlightenment can occur."..."By the way, there really IS an Ashvattta tree.botanists call it "ficus religiosa" (some may call it "The Thorn apple" .ed read on); in India today it's called the Bodhi tree. Sitting under it , Buddha became enlightened.It's a type of banyan which first grows up from the ground, but then sends more roots downward from it's branches.When these aerial shoots reach the earth they re-root themselves and form a new tree.In this way one Ashvatta can become an entire forest of Ashvatta trees.If then you ask yourself, "Which is the original tree?" you'll realise that, in a sense, EVERY TREE (caps mine .ed) in the forest actually is the first tree.Though it looks like there are many trees, there is really just one.The ancient yogis chose the Ashvatta to symbolise their world because it perfectly represents that, although everything in the universe appears to be separate, in reality all things share the same eternal source." :sun:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2227651 - 01/08/04 09:15 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

No seminoles ever ate spsilocybian mushrooms or Amanita muscaria, and no psilocybine mushrooms were known of in Florida until before the Spanish brought cattle and then remained unknown in the south and southeast until the early 1960s.

P. tampanensis (this is the correct spelling} was only found toice in 30 years. It is extremely rare, so it is doubtful that they ate it. AS is the shrooms from manure.
Copelandia spp/. and P. cubensis. and a few others known of n Florida.

AS for Mexico, they Mexico jas the largest number of psychoactive shroopms in the world and they had most of them before the arrival of the Spanish who brought cattle intot he new world from Africa and India and a few hundred years later form Asia.

And Mr. G's story of shroom spores coming to florida in pineapple sli[s is rediculous since Pineapples (used by Spanish, Portuguese and English to combat scurvy) came from Brazil and Paraguay.

mj


Edited by mjshroomer (01/08/04 09:18 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2234444 - 01/11/04 08:54 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Ah, I wondered about the spelling, p.tampanensis -makes sense-, as I've only ever seen it once on a spore site (they are available apparently).On what evidence do you base your assertion that the Seminole made use of neither species MJ ?Does a.muscaria, or a variant, grow in Florida?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Lonewolf (01/11/04 08:57 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2234458 - 01/11/04 09:14 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Pollock, Peele, Lincoff, LaBarre, Borhegynad even Schultes have all studied medicinal plants of the seminoles. They have never used Copeladnida or P. cubensis shrooms in their cultures. And again, their were none in Florida until after the arrival of the Spanish who brought the first cattle here from Africa and Asia.

And yes, Amanita muscaria var. formosa has been re[ported in the literature from Florida.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2234486 - 01/11/04 09:49 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

"The Viper of Kernunnos"
Tuning into the vibration of the tree from which the fungi receives it's fuel should give initial auric protection from the dangers inherent when accessing the world of the amanita ally.
A quote from Melody's book "Love is in the Earth" on the preparation of crystal and "gem" remedies may be instructive here.."In order to prepare the energies for the assimilation into an elixir,conscious programming is recommended to facilitate enhanced transfer of the special energies desired.
Without conscious programming, all of the energies are transmitted,  and no specific direction for these energies is delineated (bold mine .ed); this method is conducive to activation of "spring tonics" and for general use."
(N.B "Wolf note" I have edited this post because whilst the quote from Melody would appear to be in some ways apposite a shift of perspective ( or dimension ?) is probably required to appreciate it's value. To equate the vibrations accessed by flower and gem remedies directly with those "beyond the veil" of the amanita's aura is probably erroneous, in so far as it is misleading. For whilst there are similarities the way that these two "healing perspectives" - all shamanism is healing - differ is not fully understood as yet , at least not by this student!)
Notions of experiencing the individual relationships of amanita troops mycorrhizal to specific tree species would seem to apply most "regularly" to the growing and picking of cultivated, "farmed", specimins as part of a complete shamanic experience.
This, ofcourse, is not to say that the world of the amanita ally cannot accessed by a general use of the fungi found on your foray. I have been studying amanitas over a twenty year period, on and off, they are to the mycologist as say The Great White Shark is to the marine biologist awesome, powerful and perhaps a little unforgiving for the ill prepared (understatement mine .ed).Once you've read this I hope you will be better prepared than I was! So before we go on to the actual preparation of foraged fungi lets look at how "we" should be prepared physically.
Nowadays before I avail myself of some dried amanita I can gauge my state of preparedness easily because once my intent has reached my endocrine sytem I can feel my kidney strength, this may however be because I have (as a result of serious surgery and unsupervised fungi use) suffered kidney damage in the past and have become sensitised to their state of health, suffice to say though that good kidney, liver and heart function are essential before you access the power of the fungi.Certain disorders in these organs may be amenable to treatment via amanita ingestion  however unless their application is to be performed by an experienced shaman, or unless you have considerable experience yourself, I wouldn't recommend it! The shaman will treat an illness by accessing the spirit realm, it has it's own rules, it is these we learn when we begin to access the power of "The Sacred Mushroom". :thumbup:


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 11:19 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2234498 - 01/11/04 10:02 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I see tampanensis , apart from it's rarity, is an import in any case!However the var.formosa is it a rare visitor or firmly indigenous to the region in large enough numbers to force us to speculate why the seminole did not avail themselves of it? Also MJ how different from that of a.muscaria are the chemical profiles for the psychoactive consituents of var.formosa?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2234625 - 01/11/04 12:19 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

The same chemicals I posted in this forum for Amanita can be found in most variations of the amanitas of the orange and red cap types.

The name variation is used because the caps colors are slightly different than the crimson red caps.

The pantherina contains the largerst amouncts of muscimol and ibotenic acid.

Ott once extracted three grams of ibotenic acid from over 120 pounds of Amanita muscaria and Amanita pantherina. Took one year for the extraction of those three grams which were sold to research labs for approx $5,000 dollars a gram each. Not worth the time says Ott to me in a Pers. Comm. in 1986. That makes ibotenic acid one of the most expensive drugs at five thousand a gram and that was over 15-years ago.

Mjshroomer

And p. tampanensis, originally collected by Pollock, Guzm?n and friends, in the early 1970s from Tampanensis, Florida, has not been found in Florida since.

However, recently a collection of two or three shrooms was reported in the literature in 1996 by Guzman who identified it from Mississippi.

Additionally, P. mamilata was only found once in Florida in the early 1920s or 1930s by Murril. IT has not been found again in the US but a small collection was found and reported from Jamaica in 1996 by Guzm?n.

mj


Edited by mjshroomer (01/11/04 12:23 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineMushmonkey
shiftlesslayabout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/26/03
Posts: 10,855
Last seen: 9 months, 26 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2235188 - 01/11/04 07:30 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

So here's an amanita related question. Has anyone bought any from a website, any info on that? Just curious. I'd rather find them myself, but I've been so unsuccessful.. so very unsuccessful.. and this fall I'll be back down in alabama, and I don't know of anywhere near where I'll be living that I could even try to look. Up here I've got a spot I think should be great, it's a large pine thicket on the top of a mountain.. but I won't be around after july/august. So, is it even worth it to cheat and buy them, or do you just wind up cheating yourself?

Also on the Florida note, might it be possible that mushrooms that are no longer found there might have been at one point, and that changes in the environment of the state have driven them out? Or perhaps even competition from non-native species, possibly those introduced by the Spanish even?


--------------------
i finally got around to making a sig
revel in its glory and quake in fear at its might
grar.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #2236171 - 01/12/04 03:30 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

No there have always been Amanitas in Florida after the Spanish arrived. Maybe even there before.

Mycology assumes that they were introduced tot he USA but I believe they are a northern species and that is because they are found int he northern hemisphere all around the world including China and Russia. Although some are introduced species of course.

mj


Edited by mjshroomer (01/12/04 03:32 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2236559 - 01/12/04 08:50 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

As some of you may know I have this CRAZY idea of introducing spores (or possibly mycelium) to suitable "partner" tree species, especially in areas which have previously suffered from poor harvest.
.."He carries with him his accumulated store of supernal wisdom -contained in his satchel, which is sometimes embroidered with an eye, signifying spiritual knowledge." From Chapter 7, "The Hanged One", of James Vogh's , aka John Sladek's, book "The Thirteenth Zodiac. The Sign of Arachne."


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (05/30/04 08:18 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2236573 - 01/12/04 09:15 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)


(note:MJ's info on the strength of the a.pantherina does suggest that the literature I read some 10 years ago, which suggested that the pantherina was especially highly prized by Siberian (?) shaman may have indeed been correct (sorry no reference).Also as a practitioner of natural medicine the notion of isolating "active compounds"  in order to ingest a "truer or purer" substance is always very worrying.The necessary "permissions" are seldom gained, look what they've done to marijuana!!)

(Does anyone have a list of the complete range of species with which the various active amanita species are mycorrhizal?)
Clearly the manifestation of various fungi as partners with specific tree species will occur "as needed" for the student of shamanism, or shaman.
The real clue to the nature of the fungi's vibration, as opposed to that of the tree species own flower , can probably be best determined by ascertaining whether or not there are any significant differences between the sugars provided to the fungi by the different tree species.This ofcourse, again, may become especially important should we intend, and indeed attempt, to propogate the fungi; however the issue of the tree's sugars is "gross" compared to the "subtle" one of it's aura.      :laugh:


Edited by Lonewolf (01/16/04 09:29 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2236625 - 01/12/04 10:25 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

(note:MJ's info on the strength of the a.pantherina does suggest that the literature I read some 10 years ago, which suggested that the pantherina was especially highly prized by Siberian (?) shaman may have indeed been correct (sorry no reference).




Unless this was in a work of fiction where you read or heard that about the Amanita, it is not in the published literature, at least the scientific and/or mycological literature at all. I now since I wrote the bibliography of entheogenic fungi which lists the almost 300 references to the Amanita muscaria (SOMA) complex. And the Soma references will soon appear int he fourth iswue of the journal Entheos, whose site, unfortunatley is currently down for reconstruction.

mj

This also includes every reference in the Russian literature to the discovery and historical documentation of the very shamans in that region of the world who use the Amanita muscaira.



No one has ever been able to grow any Amanita species away from their natural habitat. And again,. no siberian or others who use amanita muscaria ever used Amanita pantherina.

And their main sybiosis and mychorhizial connections are Birch and Pine, and a few minopr trees.

mj

And I am referring top expert cultivators who for years have tried.

In Oregon there is a deserted naval Hopspital where up to a few hundred pounds of A. muscaria and var. formosa grow each fall.

mj

Here is a photo of some Amanita muscaria taken by the Hawkseye when he visited Seattle a few years back,.





And here is an image by me of a Psilocybe cyanescens growing right in front of an Amanita muscaria in a large park in Seattle, Washington.



And some Amanita muscaria drying along with some P. cyanescens.



mjshroomer


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineMushmonkey
shiftlesslayabout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/26/03
Posts: 10,855
Last seen: 9 months, 26 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2236688 - 01/12/04 11:06 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Would there be any way for say.. me.. to get a copy of Entheos? Or is it uber-limited printing with no copy online?

All I'm running on is the few things I've read about them and the experiences of a few of my friends. None of which have been bad, of the 5 people I know that have eaten them.. so I'm really stumped as to how they've gained a reputation as a horrifying experience. In fact all 5 people I know have said it was an amazing trip, different than anything else but very enjoyable..


--------------------
i finally got around to making a sig
revel in its glory and quake in fear at its might
grar.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #2236943 - 01/12/04 01:33 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

http://www.entheomedia.com is currently down for the moment.

I would wait till they are back on line. There may still be some back issues available.

If you know how to contact Jon Hanna of the entheogenic review, he may be able to give you an email for Mark Hofmann, editor of Entheos.

As for yor five friends eating them, there are hundreds of reported bad trips in the literrature and also at many hospitals and if you were to contact the Poison Control Center in Atlanta, GA., I am sure you could find a lot more bad experiences form them. ITf theyr were all that great there would be hundreds of good trip reports about them along with the psilocybe mushroom trip reoprts.

mj


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
"Dimensional Issues" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2237479 - 01/12/04 05:52 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

It was no work of fiction MJ. The work was the first place that I learned of the storage of the amanitas in the permafrost, also ,as we shall see later, the work mentioned the bio-chemical preference of sun-drying for the "conversion of some of the poisons" (a paraphrase).My own best experiences -I notice you are drying the caps whilst in contact with a surface, I use another method, as you will discover-, have been in the light of the illumination provided by this particular piece of literature (some things may be hidden for a reason!). The preferability of the "sun-dry" method I have yet to verify (also see further posts on the preparation of the fungi).
Those are very beautiful specimins by the way, and what a large troop! We have ,as I've said on other threads, had something like that here in Southampton. As for "away from their natural habitat" (sorry to paraphrase you), if you mean without a partner tree I'm not surprised it didn't work (my "wandering merchant " idea).No I have no intention of removing them from their natural habitat but rather creating one in the form of a productive arboretum.I have difficulty in believing that THIS cannnot be done. :devil:


Edited by Lonewolf (01/12/04 06:00 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "Dimensional Issues" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2237524 - 01/12/04 06:24 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

"The Song Remains the Same"
Some of you may know, or may have seen, that the Led Zeppelin live film/"fantasy" "The Song Remains the Same" contains a filmic narrative which includes the consumption of a raw a.muscaria, symbiote with either a Beech or Oak -check and let me know-, by frontman Robert Plant. Following in the illustrious rock gods footsteps I did this , the "trip" was something like what I supposed mescaline would be like, and still do. However I continued to consume them raw for another year or two (on and off obviously), once experiencing a very unusual "trip" whilst "wearing" a fresh cap on my forehead (to the strains of "Agents of Fortune" by Blue Oyster Cult no less). Now you might say I was irresponsible, I certainly didn't know what I was doing, however there was little guidance for the sincere seeker at the time. this lack of "watching" has nearly killed me more than once! So I hope that we can all lay aside any personal (political,social, sexual, religious ,racial etc. etc.) differences whilst we look for "The Truth" out there! I'd hate what happened to me to happen to anyone else, to an extent we are all students here. :sun:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 03:06 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineMushmonkey
shiftlesslayabout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/26/03
Posts: 10,855
Last seen: 9 months, 26 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2238039 - 01/12/04 11:58 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I do know of the hundreds of bad experiences people have reported from amanitas, but honestly I think a lot of that might be attributed to their reputation. We hear of bad acid trips all the time, and usually find something to pin it on -- bad atmosphere, frame of mind, too much for an unprepared noobie. Bad mushroom trip, we find the same reasons. Bad amanita trip, and from what I've seen it's generally attributed to the amanita itself.. I think the reputation they've gained may cause their reputation to grow. Ie, someone eats one hoping for a good time, but the whole time they're preparing themselves for a fight through hell.
And indeed if they were used by the berserkers, that's so totally unlike an acid or psilocybe trip that I'm sure it would scare most people, especially someone that had no idea that their trip might take a turn into something that frentically powerful. One of my friends who has eaten them was a 110lb redheaded girl, and it certainly appeared to me that she was quite ready to leap up and start ripping arms off. Not that she would, but that she could at a moment's notice. The only reason I can figure that she had a fun time was that, well, she's quite a rageful lil ball of hate sometimes, hehe, and enjoys that side of herself really as much as any other. My uninformed interpretation at least. Feel free to berate my opinions. I'm just trying to make sense of things from what I see, hear, and read, and I'm just very distrustful of things that I'm told unless they completely fit with all the other pieces.. it's a process of finding enough pieces that you can afford to throw nearly all of them out, and still have enough left that fit together that you can see the whole picture clearly and without any messy opinions fogging your view.


--------------------
i finally got around to making a sig
revel in its glory and quake in fear at its might
grar.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlineneuro
Phytophiliac
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/11/99
Posts: 6,617
Loc: Rigel 7
Last seen: 5 years, 4 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #2238615 - 01/13/04 10:19 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

The amanita's compounds are classed as cholinergics. Cholinergics also house warfare chemicals like nerve gasses and such.

Cholinergic ingestion is risky when expecting good or bad experiences from them. Generally they're bad, I don't think attributions like acid are really the main factor with this particular situation.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: neuro]
    #2239932 - 01/13/04 07:35 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Believe it or not guys I was going to get to this subject (eventually -sigh- ed.), giggle, sorry where was I?...tum ti tum..Ah yes VIOLENCE! Remember the Berserker's didn't appear until man learned to forge swords like the Viking broadsword, I've been to a Viking/Saxon (oh there's nothing like "Dat Old Religion") battlefield and met a dragon here in Southern England, I'll get to -some- of that too! Least ways guys if the "warthog" pilots who shot up British ground troops in both "'Ornery Goddam" (Gulf) Conflicts -spits out butt end of imaginary "stovey" - had been on A's (amanitas) instead of speed "the guys" might still be alive. Of course that's nothing to all the depleted uranium that the U.S and U.K have spewed and defecated across the planet (speaks to "environmental impact" moderators please excuse)!
"I love the smell of napalm in the morning!"


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 06:05 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "Dimensional Issues" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2239977 - 01/13/04 07:54 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

"Something that goes unnamed is usually an object of deep worship or great fear" Giles "No Place Like Home" Season 5 "Buffy the Vampire Slayer".

We've spoken to the "how" and "why" (and perhaps too much to the "why" however bear with me communication with "the shining ones" -devas- is a sacred component of the shamanic experience) lets look at "when".
On my other major thread "British Indigenous" I spent a significant amount of time (laying the groundwork for some might say) on a discussion of the preferability of trees in their most fullsome leaf for the production of the most potent amanitas, although clearly this does not apply to the pine which is not deciduous. My suspicions were somewhat bourne out when I read in the Shroomery's FAQ that consistently the most potent a.muscaria specimins have been reported "early season",that is August/September. I would be very interested to discover whether this only applied to specimins foraged from deciduous tree partnerships (not half! ed.). I foraged several beautiful large orange caps last season, but the whole 100 dry grammes from the season were exclusively birch symbiotes. However I suspect that partnerships with the larger desciduous trees tend to occur "early season" (the birch has a faster metabolism does it not guys? It's much shorter lived and faster growing that the oak or the beech) - don't let MJ fool you I suspect oak partnerships are a little more common than you would infer from his posts -somewhere on the site there is a report from either a Northern North American or Canadian concerning oak foraged specimins this last season! So "Sugar production is dependent on both the presence of significant foliage and/or the tree's metabolic rate." Discuss: :cool:


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 06:09 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" *DELETED* [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2245667 - 01/16/04 09:09 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Post deleted by Silverwolf

Reason for deletion: Irrelevant



--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2248935 - 01/17/04 06:57 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

In that spirit ( see above ) I availed myself of just two (one half) cap segments - lovely pure amanitas - two nights ago and I am still feeling the effects now . This is - possibly ed. - the smoothest ride I've ever had on the big "A", no kidney dysfunction and a nice "clean feed", as they say in radio land. This cannot be other than because - despite our differences - this forum is giving me the opportunity to explore the sacred mushrooms potential. If some of you think I'm being a bit "Blue Ray" in trying to establish the true nature of the relationships between tree, planet, cosmos, fungi and ingesting organism I can assure you such is not my intent. There are mysteries here to explore which few other have been given the opportunity to reveal so please READ ON!


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (05/30/04 08:26 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2248990 - 01/17/04 07:13 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I'm gonna have to get all academic again soon, but it can wait. Now .. pet subject... Neanderthal community ( and "civilisation" ?) ...by the way apart from a few glasses of "Organic Cert." vodka two nights ago I'm celebrating tonight with some Pinus Alba "triple style" ale 7.5 % alcohol by volume WONDERFUL....quotes "Introduced by the Vikings spruce and pine ales (shooobeeedooo shhooobeeedon't) were very popular in Northern Scotland until the end of the 19th Century" HE He!.... when they kicked everybody out, they're now popular in Canada!!... Neanderthals ..they buried their dead, made weapons, dwellings, produced art etc.etc. TOOK Amanitas!! (??) chanted sacred chants and, goddammit, practiced religion. So my lord buddha, my lord Krishna if so what happened to their - incarnate - souls ?
It's a fair question guys even if you don't believe, after all I'm asking those that do!


Edited by Silverwolf (05/30/04 08:29 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineMushmonkey
shiftlesslayabout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/26/03
Posts: 10,855
Last seen: 9 months, 26 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2250564 - 01/18/04 03:45 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I think it would be entirely plausible that amanitas growing under different trees might be slightly different in their effects.. however it would be hard to 'prove', especially with such varied reports coming in from amanitas.. and from what I understand, each amanita itself is quite variable in what it contains.
But considering they ONLY grow in essentially a symbiotic relationship with certain trees, I don't think it would be unreasonable to think that a different species of tree would make more available to the amanita certain compounds that could lead to amanitas under a pine having different concentrations of psychoactive chemicals than an amanita from under a birch, or oak.. and looking at that list of compounds found in amanitas, that's lengthy.. I seriously doubt that each one has been researched for its specific effects.

There might not be a difference at all.. but to me at least, it sounds like it would be entirely possible.


--------------------
i finally got around to making a sig
revel in its glory and quake in fear at its might
grar.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2252258 - 01/19/04 10:16 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Again to bring up another point of far widespread misinformation is that the Vikings suspected use of amanita muscaria as a tool for their Beserkers attacks on other cultures, according to the late Dr. Richard Evans Schultes, in a personal communication to me in the late 1980s, stated that,
Quote:

"the Viking myth of using Amanita muscaria has been disproven. That was not the drink used by them to go into battle in a rage."




Sorry Lonewolf, your info is outdated ont hat one.

mj


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinethe man
still tappin caps
Other User Gallery

Registered: 08/13/99
Posts: 5,697
Loc: C A N A D A
Last seen: 1 day, 15 hours
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2253147 - 01/19/04 05:06 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

so it was used?

and if it wasnt amanita then what did they use?


--------------------
And Moses Said "Let my mushrooms grow!"


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblechinacat72
eyes of theworld
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/14/02
Posts: 3,626
Loc: Terrapin Station
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2253229 - 01/19/04 05:30 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I'm curious MJ ,have you ever had a "psychedelic" experiance on Amanita's?
Years ago I decided to explore these beautiful looking mushrooms. I tried many different batches from many different places. I ate them dried, raw and heated.
I experianced a intoxicated state, but not one I could call psychedelic(in comparison to LSD,psilocybin,mescaline,DMT,DOM,ext).
I found no value in the experiance and labeled them worthtless.
So my question to you is have you ever gotten off on them?Meaning a psychedelic experiance. All my experiments were 20 years ago and I havn't touched them since. Seems I have met or read about only a few credible people that say there psychedelic.


--------------------
Some rise
Some fall
Some climb
To get to Terrapin!!!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: chinacat72]
    #2254459 - 01/19/04 11:52 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I haave no desire to try them. Never did and never will.

I have always been satisfied with my favorate species, the "liberty cap" mushroom.

I have seen people on them have a strange time adn seen people get very sick and physically uncomfortable on them.

I personally do not recommend them.

mj


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinethe man
still tappin caps
Other User Gallery

Registered: 08/13/99
Posts: 5,697
Loc: C A N A D A
Last seen: 1 day, 15 hours
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2254518 - 01/20/04 12:05 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

i have taken small doses of var. farmosa. and find it can have a nice warming effect on winters days. i do not think they produce visions and arent very spritual at least to me at that dose. but mild narcotic/stimulation.


--------------------
And Moses Said "Let my mushrooms grow!"


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlineeve69
--=..Did Adam and ...?=--
Male User Gallery

Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 3,871
Loc: isle de la muerte Flag
Last seen: 4 years, 5 months
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: the man]
    #2255413 - 01/20/04 10:36 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

This is a weird thread. I have to applaud the various intelligences gathered here. Lonewolf has much spiritual knowledge. Thanks for writing. May you continue...to a conclusion...with some more experiencial info. Others, there's got to be at least three different threads here going on. I'm trying to understand but well, I don't have enough time.


--------------------
...or something







Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblechinacat72
eyes of theworld
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/14/02
Posts: 3,626
Loc: Terrapin Station
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2256976 - 01/20/04 07:43 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Thanks for replying MJ. :smile:
I would never see a reason to use them agian when nature has provided us with Psilocybes. They are beautiful mushrooms to look at ,but they provide nothing of value in their experiance. Lots of twitching and slobbering and drowsiness is about it.


--------------------
Some rise
Some fall
Some climb
To get to Terrapin!!!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: chinacat72]
    #2333768 - 02/14/04 10:31 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Oh well ask a somewhat snotty question and go on a long lupine lope.
  It sounds to me as if MJ wants to enter into a technical discussion on the uses of amanita muscaria as a physical stimulant. Bear with me guys I just got back! ( The bear's right here maybe we should ask him his name!). There's is still alot of work to do on this thread, much of which IS based on personal experience, before the commencement of this years season, there is however plenty of time for me to do it. Other responsibilities have kept me away for a while, and the way things are going long absences may well become the norm as the pack ranges wider. So it may be aswell to make friends with the bear that is with me! ( sorry couldn't resist that one!).
TEAMWORK: Look it is important to have plenty of strength in your internal organs before embarking on any initiatory experience with the amanitas BELIEVE ME, it is also vital to prepare them properly. I often use them in doses which cause little more than CNS arousal ( ref; Terence McKenna "evolution"), even so I have found it absolutely necessary to be in the best physical condition when I do so. Are they psychedelic? Absolutely, however again I stress that I do not recommend experimentation without preparation.
"In every generation there is a chosen one, she alone will stand against the vampyres, the demons and the forces of darkness, she is the slayer." Joss Whedon "Buffy the Vampire Slayer". Before we get into the " my sister, scary, she kills things with wood " debate an observation and, perhaps, a revelation "So you've never taken Amanitas MJ? You know that doesn't surprise me? Book learning, knowledge of chemistry and experience with other psychedelics is all very well but I can SEE now why your remarks sometimes seem a little "off beam" to me! No offence we can ALL be better than we are, and the sacred fungi TEACHES YOU!" I am not the finished article by any means you guys ( or even "Finnish" article -chortle- ) , partly because nobody PREPARED me or WARNED me about the neccesary awareness and acceptance of the PRESENCE OF DEATH involved in the amanita experience, or how to form the relationship which transforms this awareness and acceptance into growth and learning. Death walks the earth be aware! :sun:


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 03:12 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: Mushmonkey *DELETED* [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2338238 - 02/15/04 06:55 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Post deleted by Silverwolf

Reason for deletion: Confusing



--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 06:15 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: Mushmonkey [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2586042 - 04/21/04 08:20 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

"Who's been sleeping in my bed?"
Well now that was something of a trek (uh-huh. ed), but look I,ve  found  something! Go to www.greenmanessences.com and check out their "Green Man Shamanic Power Plants"... quote " This collection of flower essences represents some of the most sacred,most culturally and spiritually important plants in the world. All make it possible for us to modify the way we see reality. Some are benign, some are toxic- even deadly in the wrong hands (italics mine. ed)- but even the most poisonous are providing the modern world with important medicines.
Prepared as biologically inactive (uh-huh .ed) vibrational essences. the energy signature or "spirit" of the plant can be experienced first-hand- without the problems associated with ingestion of the actual plant material."
Well now Shroomerites what do you make of this? I have spoken to Sue Lilly (the proprietress), she is a fellow member of the British Flower and Vibrational Essence Association*, but I have not tried any of the essences ( which range alphabetically from "Ayahuasca" - for which she uses  Banisteriopsis caapi  not Psychotria Viridis! Which suggests that she may not have the correct "permissions"- to wild tobacco ).
I have also come across other examples of what might politely be called "dumbing down" whilst on my travels, but those do not directly concern us now.  :wexican:

(N.B She's not a "fellow member" anymore I've left!)


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 06:17 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: Mushmonkey [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2588287 - 04/21/04 09:40 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Hey,

What do you mean by this statement?

Quote:

"Ayahuasca" - for which she uses Banisteriopsis caapi not Psychotria Viridis!




Caapi, Ayauhuasca and/or Yage are made from a mixture of both Banisteriopsis Caapi (the vine) and the DMT and/or DMT and 5MEO-DMT form Psychotria viridis.

The vine is not very activce without the DMT which is the potente that makes you get high.

It takes both to make the mixture.

Without the leaves there is nothing there for you to experience.

mj


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: Mushmonkey [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2747503 - 05/30/04 07:45 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

There were more posts on this thread, but they seem to have disappeared  :shocked:
P.S Can we take a vote on whether or not we should have a great hairy berserker gremlin ?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2747522 - 05/30/04 08:00 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

This berserker thing concerns me MJ ( see "disapeared" post ), Mckenna identifies mescaline as an amphetamine - and dislikes it because it is one -, and we know that U.S forces have been using  those in combat. Aren't the substances found in the amanitas related substances, I have always suspected so ? :clown:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlineneuro
Phytophiliac
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/11/99
Posts: 6,617
Loc: Rigel 7
Last seen: 5 years, 4 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2747641 - 05/30/04 09:06 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

>>This berserker thing concerns me MJ ( see "disapeared" post ), Mckenna identifies mescaline as an amphetamine - and dislikes it because it is one -, and we know that U.S forces have been using those in combat. Aren't the substances found in the amanitas related substances, I have always suspected so ?

Mescaline is not related to Muscumol/Ibotenic acid. Completely unrelated actually. You may be thinking of Nerve gasses which are similar in action to the chemicals in amanitas, cholinergics, the US forces get Atropine pens ot counter act the nerve gas as Atropine is an anticholinergic. I don't know if the US Troops have used the nerve gas recently but they're ready if they're exposed to it.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: neuro]
    #2764134 - 06/04/04 06:25 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

neuro said:
Mescaline is not related to Muscumol/Ibotenic acid. Completely unrelated actually. You may be thinking of Nerve gasses which are similar in action to the chemicals in amanitas, cholinergics, the US forces get Atropine pens ot counter act the nerve gas as Atropine is an anticholinergic. I don't know if the US Troops have used the nerve gas recently but they're ready if they're exposed to it.




Thank you for your information on mescaline and muscimol/ibotenic acid, it has( also )been my supposition however that the cactus and the fungi are similar in that both may require that the "shaman" develop a relationship with their respective "allies" ( although I have never read any accounts of an amanita ally, this does not of-course mean that one does not exist ). Also my reference to amphetamine use regards the use of "speed" during combat by U.S pilots of such aircraft as the "Warthog" ( ground-attack jet ), and fighter aircraft etc, during this, and the previous, Iraqi conflicts.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 06:19 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: neuro]
    #2765457 - 06/05/04 05:31 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Mescaline is a phenylethylamine which in turn is an amphetamine.

And if atropine is given to someone on ibotenic acid, the atropine acts as a potente and increases the high of the ibotenic acid a thousand-fold.

Doctors use to administer atropine for Amanita poisonings before they found out it increased the high of the amanita chemicals in the human body.

And the Army did not really give their soldiers amphetmines to stay awauke. Like truck drivers, many individuals use speed to stay awake and work. In America and most western countries, everyone drinks coffee for the same effect of staying awake and then 10% of the worlds population chew betel nut leaves for the same effects and in Peru and Ecuador indigenous peoples chew coca leaves for stength and stamia to get them through their long days and in Africa and some of themiddle east many shew Khat for the same effects.

mj

The majority of amanita users find the experience unpleasant and most are unwilling to use the mushrooms again.

mj


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlineneuro
Phytophiliac
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/11/99
Posts: 6,617
Loc: Rigel 7
Last seen: 5 years, 4 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2765853 - 06/05/04 12:20 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

>>Doctors use to administer atropine for Amanita poisonings before they found out it increased the high of the amanita chemicals in the human body.

Are you positive about this, how old is your source on this?

edit:

Alkaloidaholic found this:
Quote:


But they also contain three other main constituents (Buck, 1961). Muscarin which is a parasympathomimetic substance is present. It acts directly on effector organs, smooth muscle, and glandular cells. Atropine prevents most of the effects.

Finally a pilztoxin is present because even after the muscarine present is prevented from acting by pretreatment with atropine, there remains a psychological effect. Narcoticlike intoxication, convulsions, and death have followed in spite of adequate treatment with atropine





but that same source says it contains bufotenin, so it's obviously old. Hopefully you get to see this before you're trip to overseas.


Edited by neuro (06/05/04 12:26 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: neuro]
    #2766005 - 06/05/04 01:42 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

I believe you can catch u0 on that in Journal of Psychedelic Drugs or Psychoactive drugs, name changes in article part three Mushrooms buy Andrew Weil and also Jonathan OTt's Psycho amanita paper in another issue of that hj journal.

Those are from the late 1970s and onwar.
I also know that there are mentions of this in other articles and probably in The Lioncoff and m Mitchell as wella s the Rumack and Salzman mushroom poisoning books. I personally do not have the time to dig up the refs.

Lincoff, Gary and D. H. Mitchell, M.D. 1977. Group 6: Psilocybin-psilocin (hallucinogenic poisoning). Toxic and Hallucinogenic Mushroom Poisoning:9-26, 100-135. 267pp. Van Nostrand Reinhold. New York.
A physicians handbook of mushroom toxins presents a brief history on the traditional use of entheogenic mushrooms in Mesoamerica. Their rediscovery by western society and descriptions of several well known and sought after North American varieties are presented. Dosages are included but caution should be given regarding proper dosage (See Allen, 1976, 1978, 1979, 1980; Haard & Haard, 1975; Ott, 1993) for relateddosage information.

Rumack, Barry and Emanuell Saltzman (Eds.). 1978. Mushroom Poisoning: Diagnosis and Treatment. 263pp. CRC Press. West Palm Beach.
One of two books dealing specifically with psilocybian mushroom poisoning and other toxic muhrooms. In this particular book, several papers regarding case histories and treatment for psilocybian intoxication are presented. The second book on mushroom poisoning is Lincoff and Mitchell's Toxic and Hallucinogenic Mushroom Poisoning.


mj


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlineneuro
Phytophiliac
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/11/99
Posts: 6,617
Loc: Rigel 7
Last seen: 5 years, 4 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2766010 - 06/05/04 01:44 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

What you've provided is more than enough, i was mainly interested in the dates themselves.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineAneglakya
mephiticconjurator

Registered: 03/17/02
Posts: 4,461
Last seen: 11 years, 6 months
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: neuro]
    #2766042 - 06/05/04 01:55 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

I'm going to check up in the Pharmacotheon and see what it says.. (i love jon ott.. he is my fucking hero.. i dream of meeting ,, or even just speaking to him one day)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2777026 - 06/09/04 05:56 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

mjshroomer said:
And the Army did not really give their soldiers amphetmines to stay awauke.




The British armed services, especially airforce, have consistently rejected the use of amphetamines . Their use by the bomber and fighter crews of the USAF was originally eschewed by the U.S until the retrirement of ( sorry guys I will need to check my facts on this, does anyone know who - definitely -  he  was ? ) a senior staff officer following the end of the first Gulf conflict. It's use was (re ?)-instated prior to the recent invasion of Iraq and was ( again ? ) identified by the British as the major cause of "friendly fire" by the USAF against it's ground forces. :guns:


Edited by Silverwolf (07/12/04 05:43 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineMushmonkey
shiftlesslayabout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/26/03
Posts: 10,855
Last seen: 9 months, 26 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2793796 - 06/15/04 03:10 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

just saw a post with a question to me from 4 months ago wow
what i had meant by there possibly being a difference in amanitas growing with different trees wasn't anything about vibrowhatsits, just about what they're around.
what things are around affect greatly how they taste, what nutrient concentrations they may have.. there may be a noticably different physical or mental reaction to amanitas grown under different trees due to certain substances found around and in the root networks of those trees.
honestly i don't know at all, i was just saying it would be a possibility that could be investigated.. i dont have the equipment to do so however.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #2803013 - 06/17/04 06:27 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Mushmonkey said:
what i had meant by there possibly being a difference in amanitas growing with different trees wasn't anything about vibrowhatsits




There's nothing wrong with vibrowhatsits ! As matter manifests on the gross physical plane so does it's vibrational precursor on the subtler etheric plane. The "higher" plants and animals vibrate at higher frequencies ( and on more than one wavelength ? ).
What I'm saying is that the metabolic and environmental differences to which we are refering will also be manifest on the various subtler ( etheric ) planes.

Also GUYS with reference to my previous post !.... :thumbup: I have searched various sources ( including the BBC story archive and www.mprofaca.cro.net ) and have now asked Greg Palast ( got to www.gregpalast.com ) , "Observer" journalist and author of "The Best Democracy Money Can Buy", for his help. I will report back to you should he be able to "fill in the gaps" on the "US Forces use of Amphetamines" story O.K ?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 06:25 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2872707 - 07/09/04 02:03 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

Over three weeks ago I set out to track down the story "Amphetamine use by U.S armed forces" firstly I  asked  Greg Palast (who has never reponded), then I searched the archives of The BBC (what story?), The Guradian-online (which seems never to have covered it)and The Times ("are you sure old boy?"), finally going back to use a search facility on Mario Profaca's site (www.mprofaca.cro.net) and looking,  where I had assured myself it could not be!, in the intelligence network files*. The location of the first useful page of which is as follows www.globalsecurity.org/org/news/2003/030103-speed01.htm .
"As outlined in a document published by the U.S Special Operations Command which oversees elite special operations troops, amphetamines are "part of a new trend that forsees "performance enhancements" designed to produce "iron bodies and iron willed personnel"".


*Coincidence?

(word to moderator "I hope that you will excuse what might appear this slight diversion from my main topic, however it speaks to the use of stimulants in warfare and I believe will help us identify precisely "where we are" with regard to our discussion about "the Berserkers"". Thank you.) :whistling:


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 03:17 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2882865 - 07/12/04 06:02 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

"Interestingly" this recent wet period here in the U.K this summer may produce some early amanitas around the Beeches and Oaks (I speculate), as we have discussed before these earlier fruits are said to be of higher potency (if you do pick some and don't know how to prepare them for goodness sake ask someone -maybe me if I'm around- O.K?).


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineMushmonkey
shiftlesslayabout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/26/03
Posts: 10,855
Last seen: 9 months, 26 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #2884575 - 07/13/04 02:10 AM (17 years, 4 months ago)

In reference to meth and the military..
german troops in WWII were given instructions on how to make garage meth. i don't have a source other than my memory, this tidbit of knowledge is something I came across what must be a decade ago or so, so obviously I can't recall where I heard it but I do trust it's true..

Also, Provigil, the anti-narcolepsy drug that's gaining favor, apparently, as a replacement for adderol and ritalin among college folk (much harder to find, but without the loss of coordination / focus / clarity .. it works via a different mechanism, and basically shuts off the part of your brain that makes you feel tired or groggy).

The first reference I ever heard to Provigil mentioned that the US Air Force had taken an interest in it, to provide to b2 bomber pilots. Since, I haven't heard the military mentioned, and that first reference was 4 years ago -- recently I believe nature.com had an article about Provigil, recently in the past few months, so obviously the first article I read was before it had passed FDA approval.

I've never come across it myself but am pretty interested in what its effects are, exactly.. the nature.com article, as well as the first I read, both mention that there are great worries about it becoming widely available. Our country hates sleep enough as it is without having a drug that would keep you up without the 'cracked out' feeling and look associated with other sorts of speed (well.. our world should i say, i guess).

We've had a rainy, cool summer here in Pennsylvania..
one of these weekends soon I'm going to start scouring my mountain-top pine thicket. And where it's not pine, it's oak. Still a bit warm -- highs in the low 80's -- but I'm going to try to keep on top of these things this year. I must find, and try, these things.. and when I do, since this thread apparently keeps coming back, I'll post my results here.

Don't warn me that it will be a bad trip, because frankly, I don't believe it. I have two sources. The internet, and people I know in real life. They disagree with the whole amanita experience. These are people I have tripped with on many different things many, many times.. all opinions I trust greatly.
Honestly I suggest others to do the same, but that in mind assuming I do find anything.. I certainly will post every detail I can remember.

should prove interesting..


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #2888891 - 07/14/04 10:38 AM (17 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Mushmonkey said:
  since this thread apparently keeps coming back




Youve seen my movies?!

(The drug mentioned on the page given is dexedrine.
Also  I won't discourage you from a first experience with a.muscaria just bear in mind all we've discussed here (and also read all of the "amanita at length" thread). Your post may prompt me to expound upon my method of drying and usual dosage. Good Luck!)

:thumbup:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 04:53 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" *DELETED* [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3075217 - 08/31/04 08:23 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Silverwolf

Reason for deletion: irrelevant



--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (08/31/04 08:29 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3138601 - 09/15/04 02:19 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

"Liar!" (ref: will talk about smoking  next post)
  Anyway; Captains Log ("hey that's my log") stardate; 15th Sepember 2004 lovely BIG troop of amanitas following thunderstorms and stuff. These are the earliest I've seen for quite a while, drying now.....(Birch symbiotes) :kiss:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3142718 - 09/16/04 09:51 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

How about a few pictures.. You can always scan them at Kinkos. I have.

I have already seen a few here in Settle.

But I have posted enough photos of them here already in my gallery of pictures.

mj


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #3153371 - 09/19/04 07:20 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Uh :....pictures...scan...camera (sorry what  does  this button do?). One day MJ, sorry guys.

:blush:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleGGreatOne234
Stranger
Registered: 12/24/99
Posts: 8,946
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3157633 - 09/20/04 10:13 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

I have eaten dried Amanita muscaria caps (from washington)
on several different occassions.

Each time i would eat 1/8 an ounce dried Fly Agaric,
With an Apple and water.

I have found the mushrooms to be both
Energizeing and Purifying.
-And dream about the mushrooms, literally.

With no negative effects at all.
Ive never eaten more than a dried 1/8th.

I love the Fly Agaric. mushrooms.

I have eaten them three days in a row once.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleGGreatOne234
Stranger
Registered: 12/24/99
Posts: 8,946
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #3157641 - 09/20/04 10:15 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

How does one go about getting their hands on this book?


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinesocratesmind
old hand

Registered: 02/22/02
Posts: 1,193
Loc: in your house :)
Last seen: 15 years, 4 months
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscari [Re: GGreatOne234]
    #3158107 - 09/20/04 11:49 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

not to sound like a smartass but amazon has 14 used and new.

was thinking of making this purchase sometime too :smile:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/det...ks&n=507846


--------------------
Prohibition will work great injury to the cause of temperance. It is a species of intemperance within itself, for it goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation, and makes a crime out of things that are not crimes. A Prohibition law strikes a blow at the very principles upon which our government was founded.
- Abraham Lincoln: Speech in the Illinois House of Representatives, Dec 18, 1840.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscari [Re: socratesmind]
    #3159591 - 09/21/04 02:04 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Well I checked out the prices. the Special edition of $250.00 dollars is not worth the price since he reports damge tot he cover and c box whioch holds the set.

So this caused me to look up my book Magic Mushrooms of the PNW. I found some book store from Minnesota selling it for $78.00 a copy and they reportedly have two copies for sale.  I sent them an email telling them that is wrong since the book is not out of print as reported from amazon.com

Here is the URL

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/det...g=UTF8&v=glance

What rip-off some of these people are.

The sellers are thirdcoastbooks.com in Minnesota.

have a shroomy day

mj

mj


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: GGreatOne234]
    #3198987 - 09/30/04 07:06 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

GGreatOne234 said:
I have eaten dried Amanita muscaria caps (from washington)
on several different occassions.

Each time i would eat 1/8 an ounce dried Fly Agaric,
With an Apple and water.

I have found the mushrooms to be both
Energizeing and Purifying.
-And dream about the mushrooms, literally.

With no negative effects at all.
Ive never eaten more than a dried 1/8th.

I love the Fly Agaric. mushrooms.

I have eaten them three days in a row once.




Sounds like what I call a good gentle therapeutic dose (watch those kidneys).


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3286245 - 10/27/04 09:01 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Some Shroomerites might remember my "British Indigenous" thread on the Mushroom Hunting forum in which I mentioned a certain suburban site displaying little evidence of the proximity of a suitable host. Well as U.K residents will know the weather has  been a hooligan recently, and tonight I found a magnificent well proportioned/apportioned  undamaged troop at the same site, really beautiful at night in the rain. Wish I could send you a picky. Stay safe!  :smile:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (11/04/04 06:47 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3334003 - 11/08/04 07:55 PM (17 years, 28 days ago)

You know I found two "must be" pantherinas this year, largish brown slightly "goldy" caps, but found them heavy on the kidneys (certainly heavier than the muscaria I'd picked some weeks before) when smoked. I've kept them but don't know if I can afford to give them freezer room anymore. I may not be in good enough shape to appreciate them at the moment (you have to be in shape for both the amanitas), I'm more or less certain they're pantherinas and not discoloured muscarias, any comments? :cthulhu: :cthulhu:

(Ed's note: I'm not now sure I even identified these properly -there is another very similar looking species in the family. Furthermore I would not consider taking them myself or suggesting anyone else should take them until their active/non-active status had been properly established!) :discodance:

Note dated Mid October 06, these were probably Amanita Rubescens (see pics).













--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 03:28 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3339329 - 11/10/04 12:00 AM (17 years, 27 days ago)

I saw mention on another thread (sutra!) of the  possibility of smoking the amanitas. It is no "possibility" infact if Don Juan had been indigenous to an area where working with the amanitas was vernacular ( as vernacular as, say, it's astrology) he almost certainly would have smoked them (can anyone remember the book in which Carlos smokes the mushroom pipe for the first time? Its the same one in which he is first smeared with a Datura paste I believe). I also believe this may well be the safest way to introduce someone to the amanita experience. It is not necessary to ram huge cap loads down
oneself, the same of-course being true of the other fungi! I cut my dried caps (yeah I'm getting round to posting my drying methodology. Interestingly I found out that heat drying psilocybes reduces potency, however I doubt that this is true of our "solid citizens" the amanitas, any comments?) with a pair of medical scissors into thin strips and then cut the strips "across" again, very dry caps will then almost powder in your hand, I suppose you could try grinding them in a herb cutter too. Mix with a herbal smoking mixture and/or, possibly, "American Spirit" Tobacco. I've found that smoking them with liberty caps  HHooowwlll!  is fine but ingesting them together certainly is not! Watch out though its hot!
I guess the pantherina issue is simply thus "more out more in"..... :hippie:

N.B It may be best to reserve judgement on the smoking issue until I have some properly dried "early youngsters" to ignite.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 03:31 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineWysefool
I AM SKELETON JELLY
Male User Gallery
Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 6,641
Last seen: 29 days, 2 hours
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3339769 - 11/10/04 02:49 AM (17 years, 27 days ago)

Smoking Amanitas right now....

I have this overpowering sense of... Absolutely nothing!
So what am I doing wrong?


--------------------
]


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineDMTelepath
Nut

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 567
Loc: States of America
Last seen: 16 years, 9 months
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Wysefool]
    #3339787 - 11/10/04 02:56 AM (17 years, 26 days ago)

The Castaneda book you were referring to is The Teachings of Don Juan: A Yacqui Way of Knowledge. I was just discussing the other day about how he smokes some sort of mushroom in his book. Ima have to give this whole thread a read soon! Do you have some sort of text with everything you write in it that i could view? If not, i'll just mosey on through the thread.


--------------------
Me, Myself, and GOD


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinekadakuda
The Great"Green".......East
 User Gallery

Registered: 05/21/04
Posts: 7,048
Loc: Asia
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Wysefool]
    #3339907 - 11/10/04 03:48 AM (17 years, 26 days ago)

dunno, jsut smoke the caps. i get a mild slightly off weed type high. and my tongue burns. i get a head ache after and go on my way. sure you got muscarias?


--------------------
The seeds you won't sow are the plants you dont grow.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineWysefool
I AM SKELETON JELLY
Male User Gallery
Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 6,641
Last seen: 29 days, 2 hours
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: kadakuda]
    #3339916 - 11/10/04 03:54 AM (17 years, 26 days ago)

Ya I've gotten mild effects like yours, it's not really anything fun though - it's like I'm high but I'm not stoney, hallucinating, or any of that fun stuff. It just affects my train of thought in a very subtle way. And yes I'm positive they're muscarias.

I guess I was just expecting something more, I don't see this being worthwhile in any way unless it was an additive to marijuana or in another smoking blend.

Oh well I guess I'll never have my fun with amanitas, always get too nauseous and lose my stomach contents before I can get any real effects. At least I should be able to find someone in marketplace to take my remaining stock.


--------------------
]


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinekadakuda
The Great"Green".......East
 User Gallery

Registered: 05/21/04
Posts: 7,048
Loc: Asia
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Wysefool]
    #3339951 - 11/10/04 04:17 AM (17 years, 26 days ago)

ya its certainly not somthing to write home about. but felizhigh and aneg. both stated rather intense effects from smoking in todcasils amanita thread.


--------------------
The seeds you won't sow are the plants you dont grow.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: DMTelepath]
    #3345548 - 11/11/04 06:53 AM (17 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

DMTelepath said:
The Castaneda book you were referring to is The Teachings of Don Juan: A Yacqui Way of Knowledge. I was just discussing the other day about how he smokes some sort of mushroom in his book. Ima have to give this whole thread a read soon! Do you have some sort of text with everything you write in it that i could view? If not, i'll just mosey on through the thread.




Thanks for the reference its a long time since I read the tome, and yeah I'm afraid your gonnna just have to "mosey on through" as I'm not fluent in tech stuff.
Actually guys I don't much like smoking Amanitas on their own, mix them with some dried psilocybes and weed (or hash), they seem to compliment each other, but as I said  don't bother ingesting them together. :rastamon:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (11/11/04 06:56 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlineneuro
Phytophiliac
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/11/99
Posts: 6,617
Loc: Rigel 7
Last seen: 5 years, 4 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: DMTelepath]
    #3349652 - 11/12/04 01:55 AM (17 years, 25 days ago)

Teachings of Duan Juan is the biggest piece of crap and is not accepted by anthropologists in the least.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: neuro]
    #3351426 - 11/12/04 02:15 PM (17 years, 24 days ago)

Reportedly when asked by a journalist "Does Don Juan really exist" Castenada replied "Does it Matter?" :whack:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: neuro]
    #3367618 - 11/16/04 06:42 AM (17 years, 20 days ago)

I and most ethnologists an d anthropologist, as Neuro said above, also believe Castaneda lied in his teeth.

The alledged smoking mixture humilito does not exist. Don Juan was a Yaqui and no yagui used hallucinogenic mushrooms. They do not grow in NEw Mexico and Arizona where the yaqui Indians live and no yaqui iindian has even beenm known to use the sacred mushrooms. And no you cannot smoke the psilocine/psilocybine,. This is from Sasha Shulgin. Castaneda was also a man who never once collected a single plant or mushroom specimen for deposit at any herbarium for researchers, so that others could follw up on his research.

The mazatecs and other tribes of Oaxaca used the sacred mushrooms in central and eastern Mesico, hundreds of mile southeast of where Don Juan alledgedly lived and practived his so-called sorcery. He lived Not in Oaxaca but in New Mexico and/or Arizona where the Yaqui Indians lived.

Castaneda lied to all. His books are only works of fiction and are klisted as such in Books In Print which is the catalogue of all books published on the market. Many in the scinetific community believe Castaneda stole most of his shamanic words from those historic works of R. Gordon Wasson's Russia, Mushrooms and History.

Here is Castaneda's death notice. IT seems he also had two different birth certificates. Even his wife did not known of his death until several months after.

mj

XXXXXxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
This is for Silverwolf:

In a personal communication to me in 1988, Dr. Richard Evans Schultes of the Botanical Museum of Harvard University, and author of Hallucinogenic Plants and co-author with Albert Hofmann (discoverer of LSD and syntheziser of psilocine/psilocybine)as well as co-authors of Plants of the Gods and Botany and Chemistry of the Hallucinogens, said that "the beserker theory involving vikings use of Amanita muscaria has since been disproven."

XXXXXXXXxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
XXXXXXXXxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

The Seattle Times
Friday 19 June 1998

'Don Juan' Author Castaneda has Died
by


Los Angeles - Carlos Castaneda, the self-proclaimed ?sorcerer? and best-selling author, apparently died two months ago in the same way he lived: quietly, secretly, mysteriously.



His tales of drug-induced mental adventures with a Yaqui Indian named Don Juan once fascinated the world. And though his 10 books continue to sell in 17 languages, he died wiothout public notice on April 27 at his home in Westwood.



The cause was liver cancer; he was believed to have been 72.



As befitting his mystical image, he seemingly vanished into thin air.



?He didn?t like attention,? said lawyer Deborah Drooz, a friend of Castaneda?s and the executor of his estate. ?He always made sure people did not take his picture or record his voice. He didn?t like the spotlight. Knowing that, I didn?t take it upon myself to issue a press release.?



No funeral was weld; no public service of any kind took place. The author was cremated at once and his ashes were spirited away to Mexico, according to the Culver City mortuary that handled his remains.



He left behind a will, to be probated in Los Angeles next month, and a death certificate fraught with dubious information. The few people who may benefit from his rich copyrights were told of his death, Drooz said, but none chose to alert the media.



Even those who counted Castaneda a good friend were unaware of his death and wouldn?t comment when told, choosing to honor his disdain for publicity, no matter what realm of reality he now inhabits.



Details of his birth are in dispute.



Carlos Cesar Arana Castaneda immigrated to the United States in 1951. He was born Christmas Day 1925 in Sao Paulo, Brazil, or Cajamarca, Peru, depending on which version of his autobiographical accounts can be believed. He was an inveterate and unrepentant liar about the statistical details of his life, from his birthplace to his birth date, and even his given name is in some doubt.



?Much of the Castaneda mystique is based on the fact that even his closest friends aren?t sure who he is,? wrote his ex-wife, Margaret Runyan Castaneda, in a 1997 memoir that Castaneda tried to suppress.

Whoever he was, whatever his background, Castaneda galvanized the world 30 years ago. AS an anthropology graduate student at UCLA, he wrote his master?s thesis about a remarkable journey he made to the Arizona-Mexico desert. Hoping to study the effects of certain medicinal plants, Castaneda said he stopped in an Arizona border town and there, in a Greyhound bus depot, met an old Yaqui Indian from Sonora, Mexico, named Juan matus, a ?brujo? -a sorcerer or shaman - who used powerful hallucinogens to initiate the student into a world with origins dating back more than 2,000 years.



Under Don Juan?s strenuous tutelage, which lasted several years, Castaneda experimented with peyote, jimson weed and dried mushrooms, undergoing moments of supreme ecstacy and stark panic, all in an effort to achieve varying ?states of nonordinary reality.? Wandering through the desert, with Don Juan as his psychological and pharmacological guide, Castaneda said he saw giant insects, learned to fly, grew a beak, became a crow and ultimately reached a plateau of higher consciousness, a hard-won wisdom that made him a ?man of knowledge? like Don Juan.



The Thesis, published in 1968 by the University of California Press, became and international bestseller, striking just the right note at the peak of the psychedelic 1960s. A strange alchemy of anthropology, allegory, parapsychology, ethnography, Buddhism and perhaps fiction, ?The Teachings of Don Juan: A Yaqui Way of Knowledge? made Don Juan a household name.



After his stunning debut, Castaneda followed with a string of best sellers, including ?A Separate Reality? and Journey to Ixtlan.? Soon, readers were flocking to Mexico, hoping to become apprentices at Don Juan?s feet.


The old Indian could not be found, which set off widespread speculation that Castaneda was the author of an elaborate, if ingenious hoax.



Such concerns have all but discredited Castaneda in Academia.



?At the moment, (his books) have no response in anthropology,? said Clifford Geertz, an influential anthropologist. But Castaneda?s penchant for lying and the disputed existence of Don Juan never dampened the enthusiasm of his admirers.



?It isn?t necessary to believe to get swept up in Castaneda?s otherworldly narrative,? wrote Joshua Gilder in the Saturday Review. ?Like myth, it works a strange and beautiful magic beyond the realm of belief . . . Sometimes, admittedly, one gets the impression of a con artist simply glorifying in the game. Even so, it is a con touched by genius.?



To the end, Castaneda stubbornly insisted that the events he described in his books were not only real but meticulously documented.



Even his death certificate is not free of misinformation. His occupation is listed as teacher, his employer the Beverly Hills School District. But School district records don?t show Castaneda teaching there.



Also, although he as said to have no family, the death certificate lists a niece, Talia Bey, who is president of Cleargreen, a company that organizes Castaneda?s seminars on ?Tensegrity,? a modern version of ancient shamanic practices, part yoga, part ergonomic exercises. Bey was unavailable for comment.



Further, the death certificate lists Castaneda as ?Nev. Married,? although he was married from 1960 to 1973 to Margaret Runyan Castaneda, of Charleston, West Virginia, who said Castaneda once lied in court, swearing he was the father of her infant son by another man, then helped her raise the boy.?



The son, now 36 and living in Suburban Atlanta, also claims to have a birth certificate listing Castaneda as his father.



?I haven?t been notified? of Castaneda?s death, said Margaret Runyan Castaneda, 76. ?I had no idea.?



When he wasn?t writing about how to better experience this life, Castaneda was preoccupied by death. In 1995, he told a seminar:



?We are all going to face infinity, whether we like it or not. Why do we do it when we are weakest, when we are broken, at the moment of dying? Why not when we are strong? Why Not Now?


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleStonehenge
Alt Center
Male User Gallery
Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #3368353 - 11/16/04 12:38 PM (17 years, 20 days ago)

Carlos was a storyteller, not a researcher. He took myths and legends and wove a story around them. This has been done for many thousands of years. He did popularise certain aspects of native lore and practices. If many things he spoke of did not exist, well, it was a story after all. You could say the stories were fantasy based in part on some things that did exist. I think he may have gotten caught up in the hero worship that comes with being a best selling author. It was hard for him to break the news to his fans that they were stories, not truth and that he was a writer, not a guru.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Stonehenge]
    #3380886 - 11/18/04 08:05 PM (17 years, 18 days ago)

Why have all the amanitas gone mostly bold in an italic fashion?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (11/18/04 08:09 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: mjshroomer]
    #3380899 - 11/18/04 08:08 PM (17 years, 18 days ago)

You most certainly  can smoke psilocybes, I bonged some up only the other day.
Oh and I don't believe the "berserker" stuff MJ. I have had plenty of personal experience with the amanitas. MJ is browbeating you with "feux" academia guys. Don't let him. :badcomputer:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 05:03 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlineneuro
Phytophiliac
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/11/99
Posts: 6,617
Loc: Rigel 7
Last seen: 5 years, 4 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3381228 - 11/18/04 09:11 PM (17 years, 18 days ago)

>>You most certainly can smoke psilocybes, I bonged some up only the other day.

Well you most certainly can smoke anything. The question is if you'll get an effect. Smoking psilocybes? I'd say you'll get some effect, will it be anything close to ingestion? Certainly not.


>> Oh and I don't believe the "berserker" stuff MJ. I have had plenty of personal experience with the amanitas

Everyone always rejects academia when their personal experience differs.

>>(you have also said that there was no shamanic use of a.pantherina, which is obviously rubbish)

Because you say there's not? Some prominent researcher's who've devoted their lives to this have questioned it. I don't think you're qualified enough to call it rubbish or to try to defame John Allen and indirectly Richard Evans Schultes.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: neuro]
    #3396910 - 11/23/04 04:44 AM (17 years, 13 days ago)

When traditional shamanism is taught it relies on knowledge directly imparted by the teacher with a great emphasis placed on the personal experience of the pupil. My guruji (teacher/imparter of wisdom), a very well respected spiritual master, in his learned and insightful book "Sharing the Quest" specifically mentions Don Juan's notion of a "seperate reality", and I am sure that he too would maintain that it is of no consequence whether these were "real" events or not.
The other point is that with one's head constantly in books (like some whom claim to be "witches" or "magicians") one never develops the intuition necessary to become a practicing  anything , especially shaman ("If it's non-psychedelic I deplore it!" Terence Mckenna). There is also a danger that one's "dry academia" will leave one unable to appreciate both allegory  and  metaphor.
(Smoking shrooms works for me Bud!)  :wexican:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (11/23/04 04:48 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" *DELETED* [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3398171 - 11/23/04 02:10 PM (17 years, 13 days ago)

Post deleted by Silverwolf

Reason for deletion: Repetition



--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (11/25/04 10:23 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" *DELETED* [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3477874 - 12/10/04 07:49 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Post deleted by Silverwolf

Reason for deletion: Bump



--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3480684 - 12/11/04 06:15 AM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Also a word on the "duties of a shaman"; if your work does not include practical environmentalism you cannot consider yourself a shaman. It is, and has always been, one of the duties of the shaman to care for the environment of which he/she is a part. It worries me that some on this site seem unable to grasp the importance of this responsibility, and are grossly underinformed about the way that pollution of the environment effects our coutryside (and especially our "shrooms"). Do they not watch even a small percentage of the television documentaries about environmental issues, or do they think it somehow "uncool" that they should keep themselves informed via the alternative radical media such as "INK" (go to www.ink.uk.com) ?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 05:05 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3489924 - 12/13/04 08:14 AM (16 years, 11 months ago)

A recent documentary on "The History Channel" (I now have cable) concerned itself with the continuing impact of the Chernobyl ("Chernobyl" means "Wormwood", which grows abundantly in the area) accident on the local population. A major concern of the environmental scientists working in the area is the bio-accumulation of radioactive fallout from the accident in the local mycology. The local population traditionally rely on the edible mushrooms/fungi they gather. However these same fungi are now potentially deadly as they continue to absorb from the environment large amounts of radioactive fallout. The nature of fungi (high water content and mineral/trace element absorbtion) makes them peculiarly vulnerable to radioactive toxification. Why I ask, as is it seems to be by some on this site, is it assumed that this is a problem somehow peculiar to foreign shores (if it is aknowledged as a problem at all)? Granted the former USSR has a particularly bad record of radioactive and chemical environmental pollution, however America and Britain have just prosecuted a conflict by, in large measure, the use of radioactive waste for military munitions (not to mention the "West's"  own  nuclear power industry). It is evidential of an "ostrich mentality" that some here seem unable to grasp the serious implications of the use of nuclear power,  and  particularly depleted uranium usage, for the continuation of all life on this planet.  :alert:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (12/13/04 07:54 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFr0ggy
AmphibianExperimenter

Registered: 12/13/02
Posts: 85
Loc: Amazonian Lily Pad
Last seen: 16 years, 8 months
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3490093 - 12/13/04 09:33 AM (16 years, 11 months ago)

:yawn:


--------------------
Ribbit ?


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSterile
mushroom lover
 User Gallery

Registered: 03/16/01
Posts: 2,526
Loc: under the Amanita
Last seen: 7 months, 5 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Fr0ggy]
    #3491054 - 12/13/04 02:26 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

A year ago ,MJ shroomer and some other shroomerites had a similar talk about the king of fungi...(Amanitas)
MJ told us that R G Wasson reported that siberian shamans never heat-dried the holy shrooms.

My question is mostly practical in nature...if they didn't heat-dry them, how DID they dry them....

Sun drying or wind-blowing drying, doesnt really work from my practical experience, mainly because of the massive amount of water that must be evaporated from within the shroom in a short time (in order to prevent rotting)

Now don't expect me to believe that they had these large hand-fans or something, i need to know cos i find it pretty hard to dry them over the fire without burning them too much wich results in potency loss.

I stay for days alone in the forest to pick my annual needs of shrooms, and i need to know if there is a better way of drying them on the top of a hill, with no access to heat dryers, ovens, car-heaters, fireplace , tons of silica gel and generally any kind of civilized methods.Thanx!

I need an academic type of answer here MJ :wink:


--------------------
The Source Of The Force
Is The Power Of The Mind


"if you don't like what you're doing, you can always pick up your needle and move to another groove." - timothy leary"
Anno: "-I can do anything with those clouds!"
Annos Tek




Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Sterile]
    #3492888 - 12/13/04 07:25 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Nice question, Hmmm.... :idea: try freeze drying under the permafrost ?!
My method (no slavering there !);
1. Cover a smallish sheet of cardboard (mine are 38cm long 20cm wide) in "silver" foil.
2. Push pleating pins through the board at cap segement sized intervals -see 3.- (pleating pins are 7cm long plastic pins with a "pleating bobble" approx. half-way down their length, they are used for pleating net curtains and stuff).
3. Cut caps into 8ths or 16ths depending on the cap size (don't bother with immature specimens I've found them toxic) -also watch out and make sure they actually do have a visible host (you think I'm joking ?!)-.
4. Impale caps onto pins until they rest half way down them (hot air can circulate around them completely).
5. Place board infront of domestic fan heater at high heat for approx. 3.5-5 hours -or until fully "cracker-dry"-. You may wish to remove caps from pins and turn them over half way through.
6. A nice touch is to play a domestic broad-spectrum "Bio-light" (used to treat s.a.d) on them whilst drying.
7.Place in air-tight bags in freezer.
9. Consume at liesure!

"Blessed be the flesh of the Gods !"

P.S "I know nudding gringo !"

(Ed's note: I now used a raised metal drying screen it's far easier (honestly where is my head at sometimes?).


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 05:09 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSterile
mushroom lover
 User Gallery

Registered: 03/16/01
Posts: 2,526
Loc: under the Amanita
Last seen: 7 months, 5 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3496505 - 12/14/04 12:04 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Hmmm...i wonder if you read any other posts except yours in this thread....you seem so alienated!

take care dude!


--------------------
The Source Of The Force
Is The Power Of The Mind


"if you don't like what you're doing, you can always pick up your needle and move to another groove." - timothy leary"
Anno: "-I can do anything with those clouds!"
Annos Tek




Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Sterile]
    #3497942 - 12/14/04 05:16 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

I am writing this thread for the perusal of those interested to view my findings, when and as the spirit moves me. This insane accusation that I am talking to myself (although at times I sympathise with that opinion) is meaningless. There is much to say about the sacred rites associated with the "Divine Mushroom of Immortality" (I seem to recall that there have been a number of books written on the subject), and it saddens me that there seems to be so little interest. Is the subject too demanding or do some of you guys simply feel threatened ? Shrooms are not just "Meat for the Beast" guys, their use has always been associated with faith, environmentalism and sex (some will of-course assert that these are infact the same thing !). Lack of dialogue about this subject suggests to me real indifference to the state of our Planet. Terence McKenna is clear that these concerns are central to our psychedelic experiences and "community building", however it is stating the obvious to say that it is difficult to build a community on ones own !

:cthulhu:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (12/14/04 05:21 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSterile
mushroom lover
 User Gallery

Registered: 03/16/01
Posts: 2,526
Loc: under the Amanita
Last seen: 7 months, 5 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3499009 - 12/14/04 07:48 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

A few months ago i wrote this Amanita trip report...

"It was summer of 2001, and i was experiencing once again, divine moments of truth , while trance-dancing and eating Amanitas during a Psychedelic trance festival that was held on a Greek island called "Samothraki"

After consuming Amanitas for almost 4 days on a row, i decided the time had come for a stronger dose.

The thing is, that i had mixed the grinded shrooms into a jar with marmelade, and i had no control of the actual dose i was ingesting...
After eating almost all of the marmelade, i smoked some hash, and felt quite sleepy...

I went to some friends that where camping close to me, but found them sleeping in their tent.
Not having enough space to lie down inside the tent, i lied down, keeping only half of my body (head in) in the tent.

Right after liyng down, i closed my eyes and started to see clearly right away.................................................................

Crystal vivid pictured, i watched what the eyes of a person would, if he had been cannoned from the earth with an unspeakable speed.

First i saw the tents ceiling, and right after alot of leaves, from the trees above the tent, out of the leaves and into the air, higher and higher , i could now see alot of tents from up there, i could now see a part of the dancefloor.....

larger part of the dancefloor along with camping area.......all of the dancefloor full of happy people dancing, thru some clouds (could only see white for 1/100 of a sec)

....Could now see all of the festivals area, along with some part of the island, it felt that something is pulling me in a straight line right out of where i was liyng down towards......who knows where!!!!?!!!!!

....larger part of the island, the whole island, alot of see around, the picture now was starting to look like a map, i could see some part of the country as i have seen it only on map......i could now see small parts of neighbour countrys.....

could see a large part of Europe now, whole Europe, more of the earth, more and more, untill i had this Sattelite view (and didnt even have the time to shit my pants)

Up to now all this cannon-procedure seemed as if it had lasted a just a few seconds (just to give you an idea of the speed)

Surprised, i watched the earth become smaller and smaller, feeling like an astronaut.
I was curious in what else could happen after such a long trip.....(I could hear the sound of the mooving earth now.in the silent space.....)

Well.......the earth became so small that other planets of our Solar-System became visible, in the beginning just a few, but in a matter of seconds i could see all of them, in great detail,

still moving with THE speed.
All of our solar system was now getting smaller and smaller.......i could see so clear that everyday life seems blured....

Our solar system was not visible anymore, i could now see the shape of our Galaxy (i dont even remember all these planetary aspects in my everyday life)

It was like a fucken documentary about space!

The galaxy became smaller and smaller as i was still on my way..............
I felt what i think was the entry into another Galaxy, only because i could see it become smaller and smaller again....At that point, i remember thinking,....."What next? What's after the Galaxyz?" And suddenly i felt as if i was in the clouds again, bright white light was making me blind.......

Right after, i started to see better , and could see another world where everything existed on clouds..........

I saw some gardens, where i could hear female voices coming from....i approached one of the gardens, (very happy) and was exited with my new discovery.

Right after i thought that my girlfriend was a jail, and wanted to get rid of it (i left her behind to go to that festival)

I could now see my girl and me in a space-ship classic UFO with no ceiling (from behind)

I saw me showing her some strange thing that was turning around it self, changing shape constantly, and i thought that this is what i always was trying to explain to her....
My knowledge of the liquid nature of anything, and that our relationship was actually just a short period of time, since everything changed constantly.

After that i remember being very enthusiastic as i was for the first time (from what i could remember) to perceive the world thru fluorescent rectangulars, triangles and other geometrical shapes floating in total black space (background).
It seemed that...every shape, was a completely diferent optical angle of perception.
I could think thru the triangle perspective, and thru the lozengle and so on...

The strangest thing of all, is that during the whole trip, i had my <<normal>> everyday way of thinking with me.
I could think, critisize and see what all these strange things mean for my life!
I dreamed awaken!
Finally, i <<woke up>> only that i knew that waking up didnt mean the same thing to me anymore.

Happy as very few times in my life for the incredible experience i just had, i started dancing jumping as high as i could in the air......
unfortunatelly because of the Amanitas i had no sense of balance, and i landed with my nose (auts!) on another guys head......
The crash was so violent that along with a *crack* inside my nose , i saw the guy holding his head from pain.....

I broke my nose alright, and lied down waiting for the bleeding....there was no bleeding eventually but only a very strong pain, which was strange enought since i never feel any kind of pain on my body during Amanita intoxication. It is completely numb.

My nose became 3 times its normal size and i wasnt so happy as i was in the beggining.......i danced tho, and managed to have a good time.

Moths later, i had to deside on whether i would make a surgery to make me breath easier since i had a bad since birth diaphragm.
Well Amanitas made my descision alot easier, since i now had a freakier nose than before and couldnt breath so well.

The result was that i now after the surgery have a perfectly working nose, better than what i had when i first came to life.

I dont think i would have done this surgery if didnt hit that guys head tho. That made things worse enough to make me desire the better."


--------------------
The Source Of The Force
Is The Power Of The Mind


"if you don't like what you're doing, you can always pick up your needle and move to another groove." - timothy leary"
Anno: "-I can do anything with those clouds!"
Annos Tek




Edited by Sterile (12/14/04 07:51 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleBi0TeK
elephant man

Registered: 11/07/02
Posts: 3,002
Loc: Yorkshire Moors, Great Br...
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3503104 - 12/15/04 01:03 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Silverwolf said:
My method (no slavering there !);
1. Cover a smallish sheet of cardboard (mine are 38cm long 20cm wide) in "silver" foil.
2. Push pleating pins through the board at cap segement sized intervals -see 3.- (pleating pins are 7cm long plastic pins with a "pleating bobble" approx. half-way down their length, they are used for pleating net curtains and stuff).
3. Cut caps into 8ths or 16ths depending on the cap size (don't bother with immature specimens I've found them toxic) -also watch out and make sure they actually do have a visible host (you think I'm joking ?!)-.
4. Impale caps onto pins until they rest half way down them (hot air can circulate around them completely).
5. Place board infront of domestic fan heater at high heat for approx. 3.5-5 hours -or until fully "cracker-dry"-. You may wish to remove caps from pins and turn them over half way through.
6. A nice touch is to play a domestic broad-spectrum "Bio-light" (used to treat s.a.d) on them whilst drying.





I have over 30oz of dried Amanita muscaria var muscaria that I've picked this season and if I had dried the stuff using your method then every single square foot of my entire house would have been covered with pieces of amanita stuck on pins!

Your drying method sounds somewhat time consuming for small amounts and kind of impractical for bulk..


--------------------
PROMOTE BACTERIA. THEY'RE THE ONLY CULTURE SOME PEOPLE HAVE.


Edited by Bi0TeK (12/15/04 07:28 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Bi0TeK]
    #3505251 - 12/15/04 07:53 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

What's your method? I can't imagine needing to dry that much, 100 dried grammes a year is enough for me (although I do need more freezer space) . I think there may be a fine balance between heating them too quickly and risking that nasty black/brown rot you get if you take your eye off the ball !
Our friend's question is interesting though. I'm thinking that a barbecue heat open fire covered with conductive stones and left shielded from the elements overnight (after segementing the caps) might be efficacious. Maybe raised from the coals or stones suspended on strings and sheltered. The freeze drying method interests me (the N.Europeans believed that the universe was created by a marriage of ice and fire), they almost certainly stored their shrooms that way.
Must read that trip report. I was going to talk about dosage and frequency. Our friend must be physically strong. I do stress that "the big A" can be demanding, make sure that you are truly healthy before you take it that's shamanism (which leads on to another subject I was thinking of talking about, detox and comedown preps).


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 03:43 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Sterile]
    #3505318 - 12/15/04 08:02 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Yeah, I once had a "galactic" vision on a semalanceata trip, it's possible guys....


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Sterile]
    #3505358 - 12/15/04 08:07 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Oh wow ! That should do the trick ! He, he, he ! How much did you take Bud, approximately..?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 03:43 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3505415 - 12/15/04 08:16 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Silverwolf said: (which leads on to another subject I was thinking of talking about, detox and comedown preps).




I've been using fijian kava and smoking wild lettuce myself recently, but you must cleanse the kidneys too.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflinePsiloman
member
Male
Registered: 04/11/03
Posts: 1,116
Loc: Europe
Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3505493 - 12/15/04 08:31 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Hmmm Asking someone experienced here like silverwolf...

Has anyone combined tryptamine carying mushrooms such as psilocybes with amanitas? I realise that amanitas have 3 different stages of "intoxication" and maybe one could first eat the amanita muscaria and during the excitation phase of the Muscaria one could eat the psilocybes....

What do you think?

Anything special hidden there?


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleBi0TeK
elephant man

Registered: 11/07/02
Posts: 3,002
Loc: Yorkshire Moors, Great Br...
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3506294 - 12/15/04 10:51 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Silverwolf said:
What's your method? I can't imagine needing to dry that much, 100 dried grammes a year is enough for me (although I do need more freezer space)




I dry mine on wire mesh in numerous pans in my oven on the lowest setting with the oven door cracked open a notch as per erowid and numerous other sites. The prefered method is sun dried but that doesn't realy work too well in the UK  :wink:

Quote:

Silverwolf said:
(now what am I going to do with these two dried a.pantherina caps ? Do you find any of these Bio ?)




Yes, I've stumbled across quite a few this season. Wouldn't touch them with a barge pole though.


--------------------
PROMOTE BACTERIA. THEY'RE THE ONLY CULTURE SOME PEOPLE HAVE.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Bi0TeK]
    #3508919 - 12/16/04 03:53 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Bi0TeK said:
Quote:

Silverwolf said: The prefered method is sun dried but that doesn't realy work too well in the UK




I now have some "energy efficient broad-spectrum grow-lights (infra-red bias)" for my aloes, aswell as the bio-light (broad-spectrum for sad). This extra touch (and the use of a reflective surface and slower drying time by fan) may well produce a superior result -he said superiorly-...


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (12/16/04 04:13 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Psiloman]
    #3508962 - 12/16/04 04:02 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Psiloman said:
Hmmm Asking someone experienced here like silverwolf...




Oh, hah hah, he he giggle oh that's a good one..."
But seriously I might be able to help, I too believe that they are digestively incompatible (but fun to smoke together, there are I believe other examples of this kind of phenomena). However that said I got an enormous "seratonin" type high one sunny shroom hunt after picking and eating psilocybes on the tail end of an amanita trip (hard to balance though but the euphoria -although short lived- was amazing), so your hunch would seem to be right on the nose (hah! hah!) well done !


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (11/10/05 02:29 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Bi0TeK]
    #3509054 - 12/16/04 04:18 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Bi0TeK said:

Quote:

Silverwolf said:
(now what am I going to do with these two dried a.pantherina caps ? Do you find any of these Bio ?)




Yes, I've stumbled across quite a few this season. Wouldn't touch them with a barge pole though.




So how come this high muscimol and ibotenic acid (?) content shroom (which I have read was used by Siberian Shaman -"shaman, for those of you who don't know, is actually a Siberian word-), is claimed not to have been used ?

P,S I've read some Erowid, it looks like "Dorling Kindersely" to me !

N.b Amanita Pantherina is apparently a high Muscarine or Muscazone (?) content shroom with plently of Ibutenic acid not Muscimol (which it contains -when fresh- in smaller quantities than does a.muscaria).


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 04:06 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleBi0TeK
elephant man

Registered: 11/07/02
Posts: 3,002
Loc: Yorkshire Moors, Great Br...
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3510457 - 12/16/04 08:55 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Silverwolf said:So how come this high muscimol and ibotenic acid (?) content shroom (which I have read was used by Siberian Shaman -"shaman, for those of you who don't know, is actually a Siberian word-), is claimed not to have been used ?




Ask MJ that one.

Quote:

Silverwolf said:
You know I found two "must be" pantherinas this year, largish brown slightly "goldy" caps, but found them heavy on the kidneys (certainly heavier than the muscaria I'd picked some weeks before) when smoked. I've kept them but don't know if I can afford to give them freezer room anymore.




You seem quite intent on experimenting with A. pantherina but a word of warning. You yourself claim that you were poisoned by ingesting Inocybe geophylla that you had mistaken for Psilocybe semilanceata which doesn't even resemble libs in any way.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat...rue#Post2213080



Inocybe geophylla Psilocybe semilanceata

Your experience shows that you aren't even capable of corectly identifying your own countrys most common magic mushroom!

I wouldn't be at all surprised if these "largish brown slightly goldy caps" you have are in fact Amanita phalloides (death cap).


--------------------
PROMOTE BACTERIA. THEY'RE THE ONLY CULTURE SOME PEOPLE HAVE.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Bi0TeK]
    #3514492 - 12/17/04 06:42 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Bi0TeK said:
Quote:

Silverwolf said:So how come this high muscimol and ibotenic acid (?) content shroom (which I have read was used by Siberian Shaman -"shaman, for those of you who don't know, is actually a Siberian word-), is claimed not to have been used ?




Ask MJ that one.



You seem quite intent on experimenting with A. pantherina but a word of warning. You yourself claim that you were poisoned by ingesting Inocybe geophylla that you had mistaken for Psilocybe semilanceata which doesn't even resemble libs in any way.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat...rue#Post2213080



Inocybe geophylla Psilocybe semilanceata

Your experience shows that you aren't even capable of corectly identifying your own countrys most common magic mushroom!

I wouldn't be at all surprised if these "largish brown slightly goldy caps" you have are in fact Amanita phalloides (death cap).





No, I know Phalloides when I see it Bio. I did explain my Inocybe mistake at the time and cautioned others against making a similar mistake. However you force me to recount the sad tale again so here goes. I am not always fully "able" and until 2001 had been very unwell for many years (do not my friends mix serious trauma and surgery -even some years later- with amanita abuse, a subject touched on earlier in this thread and a major reason for it's existence), on the particular shroom hunt in question I was very physically and emotionally tired having had a difficult time with my family and the shroom hunting in Wales earlier in the season, and a near impossible time negotiating barricaded fields, the possible perils of vicious dogs and the effects of climate change in my local area. When I came across the "innocent" Inocybe the pronounced nipple and shape (on the specimen I picked at least) was similar to some of the local psilocybes (and maybe I was feeling a little slighted) so be warned guys, I consumed it and it made me ill for well over a month. Prior to my 8 years of really serious illness (no nothing mate especially shrooming) , following a suicide attempt et.al, I was pushing my luck even though prior to this I had picked semilanceata in; Wales, Sussex, Essex, Devon, Hampshire and S.Yorkshire (Bro) -libs really don't always look like that either-, a fair proportion of which I had found with little local knowledge and under my own steam. So forgive please a rusty blade and don't be so quick to dis someone (especially when their amanita method may be "superior" to yours -it was only a quip-). My nasty Inocybe experience was a good while ago now, and remember cautionary tales should be posted here, don't discourage others from doing so by your haughty attitude "pride goeth before a fall" you know.
I now smoke my amanitas before ingesting them to judge their toxicity and, once you're used to the experience, you should be able to do this too guys.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (12/19/04 06:40 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinerunnerup
student

Registered: 03/23/04
Posts: 708
Loc: USA
Last seen: 11 years, 14 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3514511 - 12/17/04 06:48 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Man this is a ethnobotanical forum not mycology


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: runnerup]
    #3514542 - 12/17/04 06:57 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

I didn't put it here, it was originally in "Mushroom Hunting" !


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinerunnerup
student

Registered: 03/23/04
Posts: 708
Loc: USA
Last seen: 11 years, 14 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3514569 - 12/17/04 07:08 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Should be in General Questions


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleBi0TeK
elephant man

Registered: 11/07/02
Posts: 3,002
Loc: Yorkshire Moors, Great Br...
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3514753 - 12/17/04 08:05 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

In your "Real poison!" thread you said:

Quote:

Silverwolf said:
It has taken me a complete lunation to recover from the poisoning I suffered as a result of eating  just one small Inocybe  Geophylla-mistaken for p.semilanceata.




What I want to know is how did you positively ID a single mushroom as being Inocybe geophylla when you had already consumed it mistaking it as Psilocybe semilanceata?

Please, do tell. :smirk:


--------------------
PROMOTE BACTERIA. THEY'RE THE ONLY CULTURE SOME PEOPLE HAVE.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Bi0TeK]
    #3521255 - 12/19/04 06:38 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Because when I got home (having realised I had poisoned myself) I then looked up similar shaped mushrooms in a field guide , and positively identified it as an "Inocybe".


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Astrology [Re: Sterile]
    #3521298 - 12/19/04 06:53 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Hey Sterile (what is ?)
Check out my post on p.2 containing extracts from "The Katha Upanishad", I think you may find it interesting.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleBi0TeK
elephant man

Registered: 11/07/02
Posts: 3,002
Loc: Yorkshire Moors, Great Br...
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #3521547 - 12/19/04 07:54 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Silverwolf said:
Because when I got home (having realised I had poisoned myself) I then looked up similar shaped mushrooms in a field guide , and positively identified it as an "Inocybe".




Yeah, I likely story.

Another thing that springs to mind. Inocybe geophylla grows in deciduous, mixed and coniferous woods/forests where as Psilocybe semilanceata grows in pasture land, lawns, fields or other grassy areas, especially where cattle and sheep graze.

So you were looking for libs in the woods?  :crazy:


--------------------
PROMOTE BACTERIA. THEY'RE THE ONLY CULTURE SOME PEOPLE HAVE.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Bi0TeK]
    #3527813 - 12/21/04 03:04 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

It wasn,t really woodland, it was at the top edge of a lib productive sloped field and in the same area -I mean within a few square metres- of where I had picked libs the previous year, and not in any significant shade. Can I go now ?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" *DELETED* [Re: Silverwolf]
    #4864769 - 10/28/05 09:12 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Post deleted by Silverwolf

Reason for deletion: Bump



--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #4917858 - 11/10/05 02:27 PM (16 years, 26 days ago)

Further to my drying method I may now add that a raised drying screen -which allows hot/warm air to circulate around the caps- made of wood and mesh, along with a fan heater, works just as well (I still maintain however that a reflective surface underneath and the use of a broad-spectrum light whilst "blow-drying" may "enhance" the experience !).

Editor's note: It seems that I may be risking a  :shitstorm: of abuse by raising the depleted uranium issue(also see my "Maitake" thread on the "Gourmet and Medicinal" forum). Therefore, further to the current contoversy on the use of "White Phosphorous" by U.S forces in Iraq, I feel that I should make clear that the term "crispy critters" may well refer to the victims of "White Phosphorous" munitions and not neccessarily those of depleted uranium (d.u). However the evidence for the long term effects of d.u munitions, on those who inspire them once particulated, must surely suggest (to any reasonable mind) that their use, to paraphrase the findings of the U.N special tribunals of 1996 & 1997 is .."contrary to the International Convention on Human Rights, against the Geneva Convention and should be considered a war crime." (ref: "bio-accumulation" of d.u in mushrooms growing downwind of artillary ranges etc.)

P.S If you find any inaccuracies or false information in any of my posts feel free to point them out. I come here for open debate and to further my own knowledge aswell (it seems a shame to me that some with knowledge here would rather browbeat others with it than further the understanding of us all).


Edited by Silverwolf (11/20/05 12:25 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: runnerup]
    #6105976 - 09/27/06 05:17 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

runnerup said:
Should be in General Questions




God knows where this thread should be now! anyway here's a nugget!

Small mention made here;"In the Swiss specimens, Ibotenic Acid was found in a percentages ranging from 0.08 to 0.1%. Greater concentrations were in the ripe mushrooms grown in the summer. These concentrations focused in the cap more than the stalk. Takemoto isolated it in small quantities also from Amanita pantherina and Amanita strobiliformis. This sample was from Japan [Eugster, 1968]. The compound easily transforms itself through decarboxylation into the most active Muscimol. Because of this, some authors have preferred to give the cumulative percentage of the two compounds together. Benedict and others [1966] found this to be 0.17-0.18% (both for the typus and for the varieties formosa and alba of American origin). In an American pantherina sample, this percentage was 0.46% [Benedict et al., 1966; Chilton and Ott, 19763. Muscazone, finally, is found in all the species in very small quantities. The data available to estimate how much these compounds contribute to the psychoactive syndromes and psychological effects inducted by the Amanita muscaria are focused in two main research studies. The first one was carried on by Waser [1967] with 20 mg. of Ibotenic Acid and 5, 10, and 15 mg. of Muscimol; the second from Theobald and others [1968] with 7.5-10 mg. of Muscimol and 75 mg. of Ibotenic Acid on ten (10) normal subjects. If we can consider the result of these studies, the following emphasis....."


from the Lycaeum

(Ed's note: This does not establish the psychoactivity or no of Amanita Pantherina, I still would not advise anyone not under the influence of a trained Shaman from a longstanding tradition to even consider taking them.)


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/27/06 05:21 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #6111705 - 09/28/06 04:13 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Mushmonkey said:
I do know of the hundreds of bad experiences people have reported from amanitas, but honestly I think a lot of that might be attributed to their reputation. We hear of bad acid trips all the time, and usually find something to pin it on -- bad atmosphere, frame of mind, too much for an unprepared noobie. Bad mushroom trip, we find the same reasons. Bad amanita trip, and from what I've seen it's generally attributed to the amanita itself.. I think the reputation they've gained may cause their reputation to grow. Ie, someone eats one hoping for a good time, but the whole time they're preparing themselves for a fight through hell.
And indeed if they were used by the berserkers, that's so totally unlike an acid or psilocybe trip that I'm sure it would scare most people, especially someone that had no idea that their trip might take a turn into something that frentically powerful. One of my friends who has eaten them was a 110lb redheaded girl, and it certainly appeared to me that she was quite ready to leap up and start ripping arms off. Not that she would, but that she could at a moment's notice. The only reason I can figure that she had a fun time was that, well, she's quite a rageful lil ball of hate sometimes, hehe, and enjoys that side of herself really as much as any other. My uninformed interpretation at least. Feel free to berate my opinions. I'm just trying to make sense of things from what I see, hear, and read, and I'm just very distrustful of things that I'm told unless they completely fit with all the other pieces.. it's a process of finding enough pieces that you can afford to throw nearly all of them out, and still have enough left that fit together that you can see the whole picture clearly and without any messy opinions fogging your view.




We never did discuss the emotionally, physically and psychically morphic nature of these shroom's effects. They seem to have been linked with both "shape-shifting" and warfare. My own experience with them leads me to deeply suspect the validity of the research M.J mentions which dismisses their use by the Berserkers of the Cults of Odin. Any comments?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (09/28/06 04:23 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleAmatoxin
Injected With A Poison

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/27/05
Posts: 1,934
Loc: Not So Great Britain
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #6111778 - 09/28/06 04:26 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)



--------------------




Sectioned Under The Mental Health Act Sat 20-10-07 to Thurs 01-11-07 for playing TECHNO music


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Amatoxin]
    #6111788 - 09/28/06 04:29 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Are these your friends (before and after pics would be good!)?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleAmatoxin
Injected With A Poison

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/27/05
Posts: 1,934
Loc: Not So Great Britain
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Silverwolf]
    #6111813 - 09/28/06 04:34 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Silverwolf said:
(before and after pics would be good!)?




















--------------------




Sectioned Under The Mental Health Act Sat 20-10-07 to Thurs 01-11-07 for playing TECHNO music


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: Amatoxin]
    #6131907 - 10/04/06 12:58 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Hahhahahahahahahahahahahaha....totally awesome


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Sterile]
    #6135941 - 10/05/06 01:12 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Sterile said:
A year ago ,MJ shroomer and some other shroomerites had a similar talk about the king of fungi...(Amanitas)
MJ told us that R G Wasson reported that siberian shamans never heat-dried the holy shrooms.

My question is mostly practical in nature...if they didn't heat-dry them, how DID they dry them....

Sun drying or wind-blowing drying, doesn't really work from my practical experience, mainly because of the massive amount of water that must be evaporated from within the shroom in a short time (in order to prevent rotting)

Now don't expect me to believe that they had these large hand-fans or something, i need to know cos i find it pretty hard to dry them over the fire without burning them too much which results in potency loss.

I stay for days alone in the forest to pick my annual needs of shrooms, and i need to know if there is a better way of drying them on the top of a hill, with no access to heat dryers, ovens, car-heaters, fireplace , tons of silica gel and generally any kind of civilized methods.Thanx!

I need an academic type of answer here MJ :wink:




I've been thinking about this and pondering on the ancient Norse creation myth which concerns itself with the marriage of ice and fire. Does freeze drying amanitas at -8c or below convert the ibutinol to muscimol (some-one with a good enough freezer -and amanita experience- should try it)? You see how do you dry amanitas in Siberia without preparing a drying chamber fire? maybe you just shove 'em deep enough into the permafrost! It may have taken longer than heat drying to decarboxylise however if you bury them one year whilst eating the previous years harvest what's the problem?
We really need someone to test this. Does anyone know of any research on freeze drying amanitas to convert ibotinol to muscimol, or know the conditions necessary to promote decarboxylation? It's quite feasible that utilising the permafrost was simply for storage (the mushrooms being dried in a specially constructed oven but if the shaman used ovens there should be a picture of one somewhere!).





--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 04:35 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Bi0TeK]
    #6153310 - 10/10/06 09:44 AM (15 years, 1 month ago)

"Something you should consider before even thinking of picking them:

"Now these guys are only mildly toxic, but keep in mind that the Amanita genus has the species that cause 95 percent of all deaths from mushroom poisoning, so you damn well better know what species you're picking. Amanita virosa (Destroying Angel), Amanita phalloides (Death Cap),...these are the deadliest mushrooms known and cause violent deaths. Apparently you only feel the poison of these bad guys TWO DAYS after you eat them, by which time stomach pumping is seldom any use. They look similar to the "good" Amanitas, so be careful."

"...The Kamchacals gather them usually during the hottest months of July and August; they maintain that those that dry themselves in the earth, on the stalk, and that are somewhat furry and velvety to the touch on the underside of the cap have a far stronger narcotic effect than those picked fresh and strung up to dry in the air...

...The smaller mushrooms, which are bright red and covered with many white warty protuberances, are said to be far stronger in narcotic power than the larger ones, which are pale red and have few white spots.

...The usual way to consume fly-agarics is to dry them and then to swallow them at one gulp, rolled up into a ball, without chewing them; chewing fly-agarics is considered harmful, since it is said to cause digestive disturbances." (Divine Mushroom of Immortality (Fly Agaric Kamachadal) - Canadian Whole Earth Almanac, Vol 3 (No 1) 1972 Frankfurt 1809 by Georg Heinrich von Langsdorf)

"Tatiana is the 72 year old 7th generation shaman, a member of the Evin tribe in the town of Palana. She escaped the Stalinist purge which virtually wiped out the Evin & Koryak shamans and their ancient traditional use of mukhomor (now only the very elderly use mukhomor, while the young have been seduced with vodka). Tatiana is described in Shaman magazine (Spring or Summer 1996).

TATIANA's TEACHINGS - from notes of my August, 1994 Kamchatka trip:

Preparation:

Pick lone A. muscaria mushrooms, not ones in a family. Smaller ones (with open caps/veils) are stronger. Dry in the shade, preferably with a breeze, cap side up. Dig with fingers, use no knives.

Journeying:

Ingest dried mushrooms in odd numbers (3, 5, or parts of 3 or 5 mushrooms). Drink water. If you take a lot, you'll be in a state of lethargy. Tell your family not to bother you for hours, a day, three days, a year. (Tatiana, because of her 7th generation shamanic status, is in a permanent state of journeying and doesn't use Mukhomor for this purpose. She says that she can control ingestors by communicating with the mushroom inside of them.)

Medicinal Uses:

Three small fresh pieces of mukhomor good for sore throat and cancer. For arthritis: Place several young A Muscaria into an airtight container. Put container into a cool dark place (like a basement) until liquid comes out of mushrooms. Take a mushroom in hand, squeeze out moisture and place the pulp on arthritis. Bandage overnight. Mushroom body can be replaced in liquid and will last a long time." - (Visit to Kamchatka (Tatiana's Teachings) the Siberian Muscaria & Telluride Muscaria by Carter/Jo Norris)

History of use

The historical information of traditional use of this mushroom is misty at best, there are a lot of theory’s but little recorded facts. There is evidence of its use among the ancient Greeks and the proto-Hindi. Wasson suggested that the centre of the Eulisian Mysteries of Greece and the Soma of India was the Amanita Muscaria mushroom. Claudius II and Pope Clement VII were both killed by enemies who poisoned them with deadly Amanitas.. There are old reports about ritual use by shamans in Siberia and recreational use by the people in a tribe.

The mushroom was used by the native tribes of North East Asia in Siberia. The fly-agaric was in constant demand and there was a well-established trade between Kamchatka where it did grow to the Taigonos Peninsula where it did not grow at all. The Koryaks paid for them with reindeer and Lewin (1931) reported one animal was sometimes exchanged for one mushroom. The Kamchadales and Koryaks consumed from 1 to 3 dried mushrooms. They believed the smaller mushrooms with a large quantity of small warts were more active than the pale red and less spotted ones. Among the Koryaks, their women chewed the dried agaric and rolled the masticated material into small sausages which were swallowed by the men. Lewin does not report whether the women got some of the psychological response. The Siberians discovered the active principle was excreted in the urine and could be passed through the body once more. As soon as the Koryak noted his experience was passing, he would drink his own urine which he had saved for this purpose.

When the rich Koryaks "make a feast, they pour water upon some of these mushrooms, and boil them. They then drink the liquor, which intoxicates them; the poorer sort, who cannot afford to lay in a store of these mushrooms, post themselves, on these occasions, round the huts of the rich, and watch for the opportunity of the guest coming down to make water; and then hold a wooden bowl to receive the urine, which they drink off greedily, as having still some virtue of the mushroom in it, and by this way they also get drunk" (Strahlberg 1736). He continues in telling that with other tribes, where the people don’t drink the urine, the reindeer feast on it. It appears that reindeer like the effects of the mushroom too. Imogen Seger states that the use of the mushroom in Europe was banned to the underground and falsly accused of being a deadly poison and the appearance of the mushroom in folk belief functions as evidence. James Arthur goes a step further in this theory and explains the symbols in various religions and folk beliefs as Amanita influenced and evidence for a wide use of the mushroom in religion."

This is an "Amanita Shop" file (affiliate of "IamShaman").
It seems some of what I have written seems away by the above. Any comments anyone?

Admittedly there is no mention made of;
1. Re-sporing.
2. Any preference for early fall specimins.
3. Advanced drying techniques.
It seems the Evin and Koryaks may have got around some of the problems by concentrating on only the very strongest shrooms. In which case I'll be on the lookout for small solitary specimins myself and (if it is true that the more juvenile caps are stronger) extending my apologies to those I advised to pick only "fully opened caps".


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/11/06 05:16 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #6154114 - 10/10/06 02:48 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

Dear M.J
If you are going to delete your images, please delete the entire post as well!


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #6154142 - 10/10/06 02:56 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

mjshroomer said:
The same chemicals I posted in this forum for Amanita can be found in most variations of the amanitas of the orange and red cap types.

The name variation is used because the caps colors are slightly different than the crimson red caps.

The pantherina contains the largerst amouncts of muscimol and ibotenic acid.

Ott once extracted three grams of ibotenic acid from over 120 pounds of Amanita muscaria and Amanita pantherina. Took one year for the extraction of those three grams which were sold to research labs for approx $5,000 dollars a gram each. Not worth the time says Ott to me in a Pers. Comm. in 1986. That makes ibotenic acid one of the most expensive drugs at five thousand a gram and that was over 15-years ago.

Mjshroomer

And p. tampanensis, originally collected by Pollock, Guzm?n and friends, in the early 1970s from Tampanensis, Florida, has not been found in Florida since.

However, recently a collection of two or three shrooms was reported in the literature in 1996 by Guzman who identified it from Mississippi.

Additionally, P. mamilata was only found once in Florida in the early 1920s or 1930s by Murril. IT has not been found again in the US but a small collection was found and reported from Jamaica in 1996 by Guzm?n.

mj




I thought Amanita Pantherina contained the largest amounts of Muscarine or Muscazone (?) and Ibotenic acid (Ibutinol).


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/10/06 04:04 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: ""Silver." A Wolf's Story."The shamanic use of a.muscaria. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #6154175 - 10/10/06 03:03 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

mjshroomer said:
Quote:

(note:MJ's info on the strength of the a.pantherina does suggest that the literature I read some 10 years ago, which suggested that the pantherina was especially highly prized by Siberian (?) shaman may have indeed been correct (sorry no reference).




Unless this was in a work of fiction where you read or heard that about the Amanita, it is not in the published literature, at least the scientific and/or mycological literature at all. I now since I wrote the bibliography of entheogenic fungi which lists the almost 300 references to the Amanita muscaria (SOMA) complex. And the Soma references will soon appear int he fourth iswue of the journal Entheos, whose site, unfortunatley is currently down for reconstruction.

mj

This also includes every reference in the Russian literature to the discovery and historical documentation of the very shamans in that region of the world who use the Amanita muscaira.



No one has ever been able to grow any Amanita species away from their natural habitat.

And their main sybiosis and mychorhizial connections are Birch and Pine, and a few minopr trees.

mj

And I am referring top expert cultivators who for years have tried.

In Oregon there is a deserted naval Hopspital where up to a few hundred pounds of A. muscaria and var. formosa grow each fall.

mj

Here is a photo of some Amanita muscaria taken by the Hawkseye when he visited Seattle a few years back,.






The Oak is not a "minor tree" (especially in these Isles!).


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Sterile]
    #6161745 - 10/12/06 01:23 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Sterile said:
Hmmm...i wonder if you read any other posts except yours in this thread....you seem so alienated!

take care dude!




Yeah I get so alienated I wander over fields taking pictures of mushrooms, strange.....













There were at least a hundred a.muscaria out there today (12th Oct 2006 Silverwolf).


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/13/06 01:01 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilverwolf
sandtrout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/06/03
Posts: 1,108
Loc: Darkover
Last seen: 11 years, 21 days
Re: "The Viper of Kernunnos" [Re: Silverwolf]
    #6163405 - 10/12/06 08:57 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Silverwolf said:
Quote:

Bi0TeK said:
Quote:

Silverwolf said: The prefered method is sun dried but that doesn't realy work too well in the UK




I now have some "energy efficient broad-spectrum grow-lights (infra-red bias)" for my aloes, aswell as the bio-light (broad-spectrum for sad). This extra touch (and the use of a reflective surface and slower drying time by fan) may well produce a superior result -he said superiorly-...




Tatiana's method is light "non-invasive" I amend my remarks, however she prefers breeze drying so considers air movement essential. May I draw everyone's attention to the fact that one solitary just post veil break a.muscaria is considered worth an entire reindeer makes you think huh?

As I remarked on a thread on the hunting forum I won't be experimenting with amanita muscaria again until I am clear what all this means, there are interesting issues raised by Tatiana's Evin traditions.I have now described this thread as "A Speculation" something which was not clear before. I have also said I should "hit the books" I should.


I have edited much extraneous or any seriously* misleading information out of this thread, as it stands it represents an exploration into the nature of amanita muscaria (Now at least there is a collection of real questions; "To know the answer first know the question you must...hhhmmmm.").

*By most authorities really none.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (10/13/06 01:05 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7  [ show all ]

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract, Kratom Powder For Sale   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale, Red Vein Kratom   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder, Kratom Powder for Sale, Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds, Bulk Cannabis Seeds, Feminized Cannabis Seeds, High THC Strains, USA West Coast Strains   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals, CBD Edibles, CBD Oils   North Spore Bulk Substrate, Cultivation Supplies, North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Extraction for ibotenic acid and muscimol from Amanita Muscaria? johnjohnandjamal 19,767 10 08/22/06 11:50 AM
by alkloid
* A. muscaria in Europe (specific to the Celts)? entheoindole 877 5 05/08/05 07:46 PM
by entheoindole
* Is "Amanita muscaria var. muscaria" safe? Atrus 1,959 6 07/02/05 03:02 PM
by johnjohnandjamal
* Amanita Muscaria ... Urine , Health , and yes people do this. Tranceharper 2,897 9 10/27/05 08:46 AM
by Theido
* Amanita muscaria only grow...
( 1 2 all )
theocean06 3,228 21 06/24/08 08:43 PM
by Gumby
* Amanita muscaria Mushroom lenny 1,768 14 02/07/06 11:06 AM
by thedudenj
* Wormwood, Muscaria Extract Psilopleix 1,692 11 11/17/04 08:11 PM
by kadakuda
* Amanita muscaria stems sydeq 5,351 8 09/06/20 07:39 AM
by Ras_Irie

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: karode13, naum, Mostly_Harmless
17,584 topic views. 0 members, 4 guests and 14 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Print Topic | ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2021 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.088 seconds spending 0.011 seconds on 16 queries.