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InvisibleDOBAS
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Ayahuasca in America
    #22167250 - 08/30/15 11:43 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)



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OfflineThatKidWithTheFace
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: DOBAS]
    #22167266 - 08/30/15 11:49 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

:threadmonitor:


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[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]


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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace]
    #22167341 - 08/31/15 12:29 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I hope it's not a cult.


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OfflineThatKidWithTheFace
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: dixienormous] * 1
    #22167380 - 08/31/15 12:48 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Of course it's a cult.

That word isn't near as negative as the 90's wanted you to believe.


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[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]


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OfflineBitter Cactus
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace]
    #22167395 - 08/31/15 12:55 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Ayahuasca church.. :rolleyes:


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OfflineGiftofdeprivation
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: DOBAS] * 1
    #22167409 - 08/31/15 01:06 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

That is a distinct adam's apple

Every religion is a cult, until it gets enough followers and develops some clear fundamentals...

Just calling it like it is.


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Edited by Giftofdeprivation (08/31/15 01:06 AM)


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OfflineBig Worm
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Bitter Cactus]
    #22167417 - 08/31/15 01:10 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I didnt watch the video yet.

I'm close to people who are affiliated with native american tribes and shamans from south america who come here to do ayahuasca and peyote ceremonies and also organize sweat lodges and other ceremonies like Yuwipi and Vision Quests.

Sundance etc.

The Native Americans are legit and really treat the ceremonies as sacred.

Their are some white Americans that have been influenced by the culture and have organized groups that do the same ceremonies but have manipulated it as a source of greed and income. By charging people $250 for them to fast and go sit on top of a mountain for 24-48 hours.

Certain Native organizations like AIM are seeking these people out to strip them of their rights to perform the practice.



It is honestly a whole different world.

And it can get weird.


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OfflineGiftofdeprivation
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Big Worm]
    #22167433 - 08/31/15 01:26 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

It's a 3 minute video... :|

People will always pervert your religion. It's called evolution. Call it a new denomination and get over it.


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OfflineThatKidWithTheFace
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Giftofdeprivation]
    #22167443 - 08/31/15 01:36 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Giftofdeprivation said:
That is a distinct adam's apple

Every religion is a cult, until it gets enough followers and develops some clear fundamentals...

Just calling it like it is.




Of course it is!

I'm starting to think that none of y'all really knows what that word means.


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[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]


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OfflineGiftofdeprivation
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace]
    #22167455 - 08/31/15 01:46 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I'll wait until you look it up and catch up with the rest of the class.

Every known religion begins with humble origins. Or did you think Christianity (based on Paganism, Judaism, Buddhism, and many other influences) or whatever religion you follow, always was a major world religion?

It's just beliefs that others find strange. Enough people believe in it, well, it isn't so strange anymore, now is it?


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Edited by Giftofdeprivation (08/31/15 01:47 AM)


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OfflineThatKidWithTheFace
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Giftofdeprivation]
    #22167457 - 08/31/15 01:47 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Dude, you really aren't getting this :lol:


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[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]


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OfflineGiftofdeprivation
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace]
    #22167459 - 08/31/15 01:48 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Oh, elaborate, I'm listening. I don't know how much religion you've studied outside of whatever yours is, but if you step back and see religions as a whole, it'll blow your mind. We've discussed this topic at great length in college. Would you like to talk about the many theories of religion, as illustrated by any of the seven major theorists, because I'm quite privy in each.


Edited by Giftofdeprivation (08/31/15 01:53 AM)


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OfflineBitter Cactus
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace] * 1
    #22167465 - 08/31/15 01:51 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

The shamans that do those ayahuasca ceremonies are just as full of shit as Christians and Mormons and Scientologists and cult leaders.

It's cool they like to get fucked up on drugs and glorify their drug use and say they are communicating with the invisible guy in the sky, but common, you are just tripping, quit acting like it is some religious sacrament.

These are fucking drugs people. They produce cool visuals and interesting thoughts, but let's not put them on a pedestal and act like we are channeling God and ghosts and such.


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Invisibledeucedbi9
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Big Worm] * 1
    #22167467 - 08/31/15 01:53 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Big Worm said:

The Native Americans are legit and really treat the ceremonies as sacred.




Who gives a fuck if the Indians treat it as sacred. Catholics treat red wine as sacred they don't get to interfere with my use of it, fuck em. If I meditate should I have to know a single thing about Buddism. No.

If Ayahuasca is legal in America it should available to all, and if some 'whitey' wants to experience Ayahuasca in a safe environmment staffed with people who know what their doing, then who gives a shit what they charge. Like-wise, if peyote is legal to Indians, it should be available to all. No discrimination.

Ayahuasca and peyote, or synthed mescalin, seeing as how rare peyote cacti are, should also be available to all. These camps, for profit or not, are a good thing in my mind.

The fact that some people may use Ayahuasca without believing in any of the religious mumbo-jumbo, but, still get something that might be considered 'personal growth' from it's use, can only be a good thing.


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OfflineBig Worm
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Giftofdeprivation]
    #22167469 - 08/31/15 01:53 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Giftofdeprivation said:
It's a 3 minute video... :|

People will always pervert your religion. It's called evolution. Call it a new denomination and get over it.








After being massacred and having your identity, land and everything else stripped from you, I bet the last thing Native Americans want to see is people claiming to represent your way of life and spirituality turn out to be people who are using it to manipulate others and tainting the perceptions of your beliefs.



Especially if you have the means and rights to protect that from those people.


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OfflineThatKidWithTheFace
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Giftofdeprivation]
    #22167475 - 08/31/15 01:57 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Dude, I'm thinking that you're thinking that I'm saying something I'm not. I actually think we're making similar points :lol:

All I'm saying is that when people say things like "I hope it's not a cult", they're really not using the term correctly.

When people think "cult" they think Manson, the Satanic Panic, and all that jazz. But it's not that sinister.

The actual definition of a cult is "a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object". So, yes, an Ayahuasca church would be a cult, but so is Christianity an most other major religions.


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[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]


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OfflineBitter Cactus
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: deucedbi9]
    #22167479 - 08/31/15 01:59 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Yep, I am super into psychedelics when it is more for personal growth and for recreation and enjoyment of the actual experience.

People really take psychedelics WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too seriously.



Why can't a brotha just trip for fun these days instead of acting like their are communicating with DMT aliens and have the secrets to the universe and then say they have no engos and are enlightened?

What ever happened to tripping for the pretty colors, the crazy mind fuck, laughing with some buddies, but also to work on yourself and grow as a person. I just don't get where it changed from a positive experience almost like a rigid religious cult like mentality.


I just don't get it.


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OfflineGiftofdeprivation
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace]
    #22167487 - 08/31/15 02:05 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Quote:

Giftofdeprivation said:
That is a distinct adam's apple

Every religion is a cult, until it gets enough followers and develops some clear fundamentals...

Just calling it like it is.



ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Of course it is!



Oh, so this wasn't sarcasm?
Quote:

I'm starting to think that none of y'all really knows what that word means.



And this wasn't directed at me?

:facepalm: I'm an idiot. LOL!


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OfflineThatKidWithTheFace
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Giftofdeprivation] * 1
    #22167498 - 08/31/15 02:16 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Simple misunderstandin', man :highfive:


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[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]


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OfflineGiftofdeprivation
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Big Worm]
    #22167508 - 08/31/15 02:27 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

That makes total sense, good point and thank you for the perspective. I would be mad too. That said, you aren't going to be able to stop capital (the bigger, more accepted institution), from encroaching on that way of life (damn near all ways of life). It's gross, but it works.

Unfortunately, the world is a cruel place and Natives really have no choice but to adapt to the white man. The Native way of life has been rendered near impossible in America, now (not the religious aspect. Those usually stick around, even after a new denomination pops up) because we are bigger, and we're very disruptive to all walks of life. Blacks and Mexicans have gotten really good at living with us... Blacks by force, and Mexicans because they like our capital...

Would you like to talk about all the Pandas we've displaced/killed, or the locusts that swarm through and fuck us up from time to time? May the bigger force win. Don't get mad, get even.

Now, back to religion again, they will always grow and change, you aren't going to stand in the way of entropy, brother.


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Edited by Giftofdeprivation (08/31/15 02:44 AM)


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OfflineBig Worm
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Bitter Cactus]
    #22167536 - 08/31/15 02:50 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Bitter Cactus said:
The shamans that do those ayahuasca ceremonies are just as full of shit as Christians and Mormons and Scientologists and cult leaders.

It's cool they like to get fucked up on drugs and glorify their drug use and say they are communicating with the invisible guy in the sky, but common, you are just tripping, quit acting like it is some religious sacrament.

These are fucking drugs people. They produce cool visuals and interesting thoughts, but let's not put them on a pedestal and act like we are channeling God and ghosts and such.






You clearly haven't attended any type of ceremony.

There is much more too it then "tripping" and visuals.  Many people don't get visuals from certain cactuses.


There really is something going on underneath the fabric of what we experience with our senses.


I was oblivious to a lot of this not too long ago and if I didn't experience those things, I would be skeptical too.


And not all ceremonies are based around medicine (cactus .  Many are not.

In Yuwipi Ceremonies, spirits are visible and they interact with our environment and everyone is completely sober.  Its hard to deny that existence when you personally experience it.


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OfflineThatKidWithTheFace
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Big Worm]
    #22167540 - 08/31/15 02:55 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Everyone always acts like the two are exclusive.

I mean, c'mon, trippin's fun as fuck! :lol:


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[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]


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OfflineGiftofdeprivation
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Big Worm]
    #22167541 - 08/31/15 02:56 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

You're fighting an uphill battle, brother. You can tell there are a lot of educated Atheists here, right? Well, may the bigger force win.

I wish I could attach this pdf on erotic mysticism, discussing that exact phenomenon, but from German Mystical Writings. We could start talking about religious rapture and the countless paranormal experiences people are exposed to from ALL types of religions. Some Christian experiences sound like a socially induced seizure, it's bizarre. If you are looking for an Amen, you might want to visit DMT-Nexus.me

Schizophrenic people experience some pretty profound experiences without the aid of drugs too. The human mind is a powerful thing...


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Edited by Giftofdeprivation (08/31/15 03:01 AM)


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OfflineThatKidWithTheFace
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Giftofdeprivation] * 1
    #22167549 - 08/31/15 03:02 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Don't get me wrong, though. As I once read on here "I've banged a djembe or two in my day" :lol:


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[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]


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OfflineBig Worm
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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: deucedbi9] * 1
    #22167556 - 08/31/15 03:07 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

deucedbi9 said:
Quote:

Big Worm said:

The Native Americans are legit and really treat the ceremonies as sacred.




Who gives a fuck if the Indians treat it as sacred. Catholics treat red wine as sacred they don't get to interfere with my use of it, fuck em. If I meditate should I have to know a single thing about Buddism. No.

If Ayahuasca is legal in America it should available to all, and if some 'whitey' wants to experience Ayahuasca in a safe environmment staffed with people who know what their doing, then who gives a shit what they charge. Like-wise, if peyote is legal to Indians, it should be available to all. No discrimination.

Ayahuasca and peyote, or synthed mescalin, seeing as how rare peyote cacti are, should also be available to all. These camps, for profit or not, are a good thing in my mind.

The fact that some people may use Ayahuasca without believing in any of the religious mumbo-jumbo, but, still get something that might be considered 'personal growth' from it's use, can only be a good thing.






I'm not saying people can't use ayahuasca outside of an organized ceremony.

I eat psychedelics all the time lol.

I was just sharing insight from the things i have experienced just to add some perspective on how its used in certain areas in the US and the inner workings of certain aspects of the culture.


Their are just different experiences with different settings.  I'm pretty sure most psychedelic users can agree with that.

And most Native Americans who mainly use Cactus and other people who bring Ayahuasca from South America and other areas feel as if people shouldn't be charged money to be part of that type of experience.  They give it away for free.  It was just the fact they didn't like the way other organizations were profiting from it because they felt it turned the focus more towards profit and losing sight of what the origin of the ceremony is about.




These are just some things I've learned from being surrounded by this culture.  Not my beliefs.  Just my experiences of being exposed to this type of environment.


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Re: Ayahuasca in America [Re: Big Worm] * 2
    #22167565 - 08/31/15 03:11 AM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Bitter Cactus

People do eat psychedelics just for fun and to laugh. :shrug:


Some people use it in certain environments as a spiritual tool as they have for thousands of years.


Its not one or the other.


Both types of experiences can co exist.


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