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clock_of_omens
razzle them dazzle them


Registered: 04/10/14
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Re: I am playing with Google translate [Re: akira_akuma]
#22138499 - 08/25/15 02:08 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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I no longer have any idea what is happening.
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GoldenEye
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Registered: 05/24/13
Posts: 4,340
Loc: Amsterdam
Last seen: 6 months, 19 days
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What I find an even more intruiging question is what language does to conciousness? Imagine if the word Mahmilapinatapai was in your vocabulary... It means as much as:
Quote:
"a look shared by two people, each wishing that the other will offer something that they both desire but are unwilling to suggest or offer themselves."
(It's basically a poetic version of describing the situation in which you don't have the balls to say: "DTF?" )
Would growing up with a language system that labels such subtleties make you more concious of interhuman non-vocal interaction?
What about the Inuit dialect in Nunavik that has 53 words for snow? Each referring to snow of a different crystalline structure?
What about the language of the Piraha? It can be whisteled, hummed and spoken as it is purely tonal. But, most importantly, it has no quantification! Just imagine what that does to conciousness! It also doesn't have a past or future tense... So you end up living in the here and now and not arguing about possessions!
The grammar of hapiness is a great documentary about this language. Truly a must watch:
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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dude, Chthonic thanatotic Abulia, it's the Debil's disease.
otherwise known as:
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 "i am so over this!"
as in "i'm underground, i can't decide, i want to die".
if you couldn't decide, wouldn't that be some form of death, like a death of the mind?
i dunno. i'm undecided as of yet.
Edited by akira_akuma (08/25/15 02:36 AM)
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: I am playing with Google translate [Re: GoldenEye]
#22138550 - 08/25/15 02:35 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
GoldenEye said: What I find an even more intruiging question is what language does to conciousness? Imagine if the word Mahmilapinatapai was in your vocabulary... It means as much as:
Quote:
"a look shared by two people, each wishing that the other will offer something that they both desire but are unwilling to suggest or offer themselves."
(It's basically a poetic version of describing the situation in which you don't have the balls to say: "DTF?" )
Would growing up with a language system that labels such subtleties make you more concious of interhuman non-vocal interaction?
What about the Inuit dialect in Nunavik that has 53 words for snow? Each referring to snow of a different crystalline structure?
What about the language of the Piraha? It can be whisteled, hummed and spoken as it is purely tonal. But, most importantly, it has no quantification! Just imagine what that does to conciousness! It also doesn't have a past or future tense... So you end up living in the here and now and not arguing about possessions!
The grammar of hapiness is a great documentary about this language. Truly a must watch:
heard about the Pidaha/Piraha before, and seen the documentary, and yeah it's fascinating! thing about language is that it only means what it means due to it's common usage. it's completely malleable given the right amount of time.
and Mamihlapinatapai is a funky word. cool beans, yo; one of the most succinct words ever. DTF basically, ya.
and ya, i don't know where language stems from but i have my theories of "why it is", and that is because humans communicate not via language but via translation, from movement, sound, and then symbol.
firstly there was the movement...like sign language...then what was needed to be communicated better needed sounds, so we made sounds...perhaps with certain inflection Ugh, doesn't carry as much weight as UGH!!
then you have the basis of poetry; sounds then attribute meaning such as the meaning being communicated, which then had gotten eventually translated into symbols (mayhaps via cave paintings and such) and then scripts.
more translation is needed to complete tasks of communication and of coercion. that's why i think possibly early speakers (before the grammarian schools) used persuasive language and movement with a certain (eventual) developed usage and syntax in order to say get people to "do this" or "don't do that" or "hey, that's my daughter, what the fuck man!"
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GoldenEye
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Registered: 05/24/13
Posts: 4,340
Loc: Amsterdam
Last seen: 6 months, 19 days
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Re: I am playing with Google translate [Re: akira_akuma]
#22138569 - 08/25/15 02:48 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Yeah, the relation between music and language is an interesting one too. Both seem to be equally innate to us suggesting perhaps a common origin? They must not have been all that different but over time they have each found their own cultural niche. There are still a lot of tonal languages supporting that idea.
And language still is bodily for the most part. I think around 80% of our communication is non-verbal and hidden in intonation and body language.
Try going on a silent retreat and see how much you feel like you know the other participants after 5 days of not speaking! I felt like I knew them better than most of my lifelong friends. Just from watching their bidy language for five days straight...
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
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Re: I am playing with Google translate [Re: GoldenEye]
#22138575 - 08/25/15 02:51 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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their body language and maybe such cues as their behavioral habits, noted.
and that's awesome that you find the two mutually compatible and intrinsic (language and music), i think the same thing. it is personally a quandary for me, as i am constantly pulled between the two.
good to know someone's essentially got the same back as i.
but yes, i think music has the exact same origin as language, as in language is the capitulation of the extent of music's boundaries.
music is an expression of emotions, and for ideas to be tied to such, language was devised. that's purely my speculation, though i don't mean to make a speck out of the instance of neither. both are equally fascinating with or without eachother, but...it is a theory.
Edited by akira_akuma (08/25/15 02:57 AM)
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GoldenEye
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Registered: 05/24/13
Posts: 4,340
Loc: Amsterdam
Last seen: 6 months, 19 days
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Re: I am playing with Google translate [Re: akira_akuma]
#22138605 - 08/25/15 03:03 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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And a good one, as language is so symbolic. It feels very accurate too becasue music feels so primal.
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GoldenEye
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Registered: 05/24/13
Posts: 4,340
Loc: Amsterdam
Last seen: 6 months, 19 days
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Re: I am playing with Google translate [Re: GoldenEye]
#22138611 - 08/25/15 03:05 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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In Nigeria they have a proverb that translates to: "If you can walk you can dance and if you can talk you can sing." Love it.
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: I am playing with Google translate [Re: GoldenEye]
#22138622 - 08/25/15 03:11 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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ah
“chinofamba chitamba chinotaura chinoimba”
just be happy for the air that you breathe.
nice.
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GoldenEye said: And a good one, as language is so symbolic. It feels very accurate too becasue music feels so primal.
i completely concur. it is - i think - as it is movement & form, from one space to another, that communicates. it's the silences that move us, because we feel we need to; just like with music, just like with words.
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