|
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
|
Dondematias
Stranger

Registered: 08/24/15
Posts: 9
Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
|
Mycellium stops/stalls growth in incubator
#22136303 - 08/24/15 04:30 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Hi everyone,
The first time I cultivated mycelium on grain was last summer, I put the jars in a wooden cabinet and everything worked out perfectly, the myc grew and I went on to harvest mushrooms in no time. As it was summer, and the weather allowed for it, I did not have to use any means of heating the jars or having special incubator as it wasn't needed.
After that harvest winter came and with it the need of an incubator. I made the "tub in tub" incubator and heated it with an aquarium heater. The incubator worked fine (or so it seemed) I was able to control the temp to exactly what i needed it to be so there were no temp fluctuations to the jars.
And now comes my problem. The myc only develops as far as tiny white dots on the grain and stops growing right there.
To fix this I decided to inoculate my grain with live mycelium from a bfr cake I was able to grow and that grew onto the grain a little more but also stopped spreading after a few days.
My jars all have holes and filters on top for air exchange, just like on my first successful harvest.
After many failed attempts my hypothesis to the problem is as follows:
The wooden cabinet I used to incubate the first batch was not air tight, there was a seam where the door and the cabinet met along the bottom, side and top where co2 was allowed to constantly escape. I have read that co2 is heavier than air so I would assume that if I have something generating co2 inside a tall, closed container (big tub) the co2 would pool inside until enough of it was made so as to make it flow over the top edge of the container (same way water would overflow if enough was poured inside paper cup).
Once I put my jars inside this new incubator and they started producing co2 it was only a matter of time before the co2 rose over the level of the jars thus "drowning" them in co2 and not allowing any oxygen to enter the jars.
This wasn't a problem with the cabinet because it had top and bottom aeration holes/vents thus allowing co2 to escape from the bottom and oxygen to enter from the top and in this way not allowing co2 to start "pooling" and rising over the jars.
This time around i have cut down the top edge of the incubator to make sure co2 level doesn't rise over the jars and also instead of covering the tub with the original solid-plastic lid i will cover it with a blanket to allow further air exchange.
Please let me know your thoughts on this. Am I doing anything else wrong?
Thanks your your time!
here is a pic of the tiny white spots:
Edited by Dondematias (08/24/15 04:36 PM)
|
Stropharis



Registered: 04/02/07
Posts: 1,854
|
Re: Mycellium stops/stalls growth in incubator [Re: Dondematias]
#22136676 - 08/24/15 05:48 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
If you warm your home to where it is relatively comfortable (I'm assuming it already is) the reliance of p. cubensis will prevail and there is no need for a heating element or difficult to visualize cabinet.
|
Dondematias
Stranger

Registered: 08/24/15
Posts: 9
Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
|
Re: Mycellium stops/stalls growth in incubator [Re: Stropharis]
#22136706 - 08/24/15 05:53 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Hi, right now my home is at 60 degrees fahrenheit. Heating the whole house to make the mushies grow would be much more expensive for me therefore not a realistic option.
The adventage I think the cabinet has is simply that it has top and bottom breathing holes so it allows the heavier co2 to escape out the bottom holes while fresh air comes in from the top.
|
PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



Registered: 04/08/12
Posts: 22,502
Loc: Orbiting Earth
Last seen: 17 days, 21 hours
|
Re: Mycellium stops/stalls growth in incubator [Re: Dondematias]
#22136758 - 08/24/15 06:06 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Dondematias said: I have read that co2 is heavier than air so I would assume that if I have something generating co2 inside a tall, closed container (big tub) the co2 would pool inside until enough of it was made so as to make it flow over the top edge of the container (same way water would overflow if enough was poured inside paper cup).
Once I put my jars inside this new incubator and they started producing co2 it was only a matter of time before the co2 rose over the level of the jars thus "drowning" them in co2 and not allowing any oxygen to enter the jars.
This wasn't a problem with the cabinet because it had top and bottom aeration holes/vents thus allowing co2 to escape from the bottom and oxygen to enter from the top and in this way not allowing co2 to start "pooling" and rising over the jars.
This time around i have cut down the top edge of the incubator to make sure co2 level doesn't rise over the jars and also instead of covering the tub with the original solid-plastic lid i will cover it with a blanket to allow further air exchange.
Please let me know your thoughts on this. Am I doing anything else wrong?
Thanks your your time!
Totally false logic....co2 is heavier than air, but only by a minute fraction.....co2 stays mixed in with the air and doesnt settle.....this was not a sealed vessel....it rises to the top of the box riding the heat and/or humidity currents....
If it worked like you think we would all suffocate from the massive amount of co2 falling from the atmosphere....
--------------------
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
Edited by PussyFart (08/24/15 06:06 PM)
|
PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



Registered: 04/08/12
Posts: 22,502
Loc: Orbiting Earth
Last seen: 17 days, 21 hours
|
Re: Mycellium stops/stalls growth in incubator [Re: PussyFart]
#22136765 - 08/24/15 06:07 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Furthermore incubation should not be needed unless you live in a garage in alaska......
Jars/bags/tubs/trays should colonize @ room temperature getting ambient/indirect light.
Main pinning triggers are full colonization, FAE and Evaporation off of the substrate.
Light is a secondary pinning trigger. For tropical species temperature is not a pinning factor.
P. Cubensis are a tropical species. You could colonize at 70F and fruit at 80F with great results.
Light has been proven beneficial during all stages of mycellium growth. Mushrooms like mammals have a circadian rhythm.
You want ambient/indirect light(on a 12/12 schedule preferably) for colonization and consolidation.
You want direct/intense 6500K light on a 12/12 schedule for fruiting.
Optimal temps are mid 70s throughout the whole grow, but anywhere from 65F-80F is acceptable.
Incubation is outdated/uneeded unless temps in the range stated above cannot be kept.
The inside of the jar is always a few degrees warmer than the outside because the mycellium produces heat..mycellium tends to stall at temps above 83F , and contams thrive.
Fruiting at cooler temps tends to produce denser, meatier fruits, while fruiting at higher temps will often produce hollow, less dense stems.
Mycelium should be exposed to ambient room light from day of inoculation as has been known for many years. Light is not a pinning trigger until after full colonization and an increase in air is given, and even then it's a secondary pinning trigger. RR
--------------------
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
|
Dondematias
Stranger

Registered: 08/24/15
Posts: 9
Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
|
Re: Mycellium stops/stalls growth in incubator [Re: PussyFart]
#22137026 - 08/24/15 07:03 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Wow that's an amazing response thank you so much for your time. I totally get what you are saying about the co2 rising with the hot air, makes total sense. Although I would like to add that I was covering the incubator with the original solid plastic lid it came with so the co2 could not rise nor go anywhere, it was pretty much airtight. This time around I'm going to cover it with a blanket which should allow the co2 to rise with the hot air as you mentioned. Also I will bring the temp down to compensate for the heat the myc already produces.
My room temp is not quite inside the range you mention so I will still use the incubator. Thanks!
|
PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



Registered: 04/08/12
Posts: 22,502
Loc: Orbiting Earth
Last seen: 17 days, 21 hours
|
Re: Mycellium stops/stalls growth in incubator [Re: Dondematias]
#22137076 - 08/24/15 07:13 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Dondematias said: Although I would like to add that I was covering the incubator with the original solid plastic lid it came with so the co2 could not rise nor go anywhere, it was pretty much airtight.
Doesn't matter....there were heat currents creating a convection. The co2 levels were higher towards the top of the chamber....
--------------------
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
|
Dondematias
Stranger

Registered: 08/24/15
Posts: 9
Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
|
Re: Mycellium stops/stalls growth in incubator [Re: PussyFart]
#22137097 - 08/24/15 07:17 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Ok so for the sake of knowledge what is your take on why the myc didn't keep growing and what those white spots are?
|
PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



Registered: 04/08/12
Posts: 22,502
Loc: Orbiting Earth
Last seen: 17 days, 21 hours
|
Re: Mycellium stops/stalls growth in incubator [Re: Dondematias]
#22137111 - 08/24/15 07:19 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
They look contaminated to me......use new, clean inoculant....maybe get a print and try agar....
--------------------
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
|
Dondematias
Stranger

Registered: 08/24/15
Posts: 9
Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
|
Re: Mycellium stops/stalls growth in incubator [Re: PussyFart]
#22137168 - 08/24/15 07:30 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
I will look into that, seems legit, thanks
|
|