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EntheoGod
Entheo



Registered: 03/06/15
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Last seen: 7 months, 28 days
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Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom.
#22126723 - 08/22/15 12:47 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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I was just bored thinking about ways to keep my cakes from colonizing random pieces of perlite that happen to get on the foil so I just placed 2 of my cakes in the lids used for the jars. I placed a little bit of moisturized vermiculite in around the cake filling the gap between the cake and the side of the lid.
I have been looking up others results in doing this but have yet to find any really useful information on the pros and cons of this method. I know I definitely don't like using the foil because its too much of a mess and verm gets piled up on it and then the cakes take longer trying to colonize that and eventually make their way to the perlite. Yes I could clean it off eveery time I mist but thats just too much of a risk for contaminating my cakes and I dont want to chance that. Im sure you can all appreciate my desire to be sterile. So to sum this up and get straight to the point....

I know someone has done this by now because I have seen it mentioned on here several times, those of you who have done this can you please share with me. Were the results better? more visually appealing? anything? Did you notice any problems with this method or anything of that nature as well?
Edited by EntheoGod (08/22/15 12:48 PM)
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EntheoGod
Entheo



Registered: 03/06/15
Posts: 648
Last seen: 7 months, 28 days
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: EntheoGod]
#22143137 - 08/25/15 08:52 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Still no responses?
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NDStepp84
Stellar nuclear waste


Registered: 04/23/15
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: EntheoGod]
#22143462 - 08/25/15 10:08 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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I'm sure it looks nice and neat, but I don't think it makes much of a difference other than that. I try to keep my cakes out of the perlite, but I don't worry too much if it grabs onto a random piece of perlite or two. The myc of freshly birthed cakes is strong and contam resistant. There is nothing sterile about a fruiting chamber, after you birth them they encounter thousands spores in the open air, you could probably wipe your ass with one and it would be fine.
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"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. -Robert A. Heinlein
Links and teks ND's grow log and discussion Plant thread
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: EntheoGod]
#22143499 - 08/25/15 10:16 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
EntheoGod said: Yes I could clean it off eveery time I mist but thats just too much of a risk for contaminating my cakes and I dont want to chance that. Im sure you can all appreciate my desire to be sterile.
You do realize that fruiting is not a sterile process, it is done in open air, and your fully colonized, contam resistant cakes are already covered with millions of mold spores right?
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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Grim767
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: PussyFart]
#22143531 - 08/25/15 10:22 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
PussyFart said:
Quote:
EntheoGod said: Yes I could clean it off eveery time I mist but thats just too much of a risk for contaminating my cakes and I dont want to chance that. Im sure you can all appreciate my desire to be sterile.
You do realize that fruiting is not a sterile process, it is done in open air, and your fully colonized, contam resistant cakes are already covered with millions of mold spores right?
What he said
-------------------- Trade List I won't bow to something that I've never seen, Can't believe in something that doesn't believe in me, I'm not blood of your blood, I'm no son of your god, I have no faith in your faith, Still I find salvation.
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EntheoGod
Entheo



Registered: 03/06/15
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: Grim767]
#22143705 - 08/25/15 10:54 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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I actually did not know they were so resistant to contamination while in the chamber. I have had a few develop trich before and I was sure that it was because of something that happened after the birthing. I am sure you're just saying they are a little more resistant because if they were completely resistant, infections couldn't happen after birthing.
I would still like to know if this is a better or worse method than the foil. I have read in a few places that your cakes grabbing onto perlite is bad because it can overhydrate the cake and also the mycelium growing onto the perlite could take more energy and nutrients away from the pins that could be developing or the fruits that are already coming to fruition. Theres no way the perlite being colonized by the cake after its in the chamber can be good for it, it has to be detrimental to the growth of the mushrooms and the mycelium. At least for the purpose of getting mushrooms to come from it for harvest.
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NDStepp84
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: EntheoGod]
#22143791 - 08/25/15 11:16 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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A hidden contaminate while colonizing and or lack of FAE would be of more concern for contam. A piece of perlite or two would be splitting hairs, as long as they are not picking up tons of the stuff. It would be impossible to find out with multi spore. You would need to grow the same isolate side by side. How much energy could possibly be waisted by picking up a crumb or two?
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"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. -Robert A. Heinlein
Links and teks ND's grow log and discussion Plant thread
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EntheoGod
Entheo



Registered: 03/06/15
Posts: 648
Last seen: 7 months, 28 days
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: NDStepp84]
#22143836 - 08/25/15 11:23 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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It takes no energy at all but when you have to pick the cakes up, possibly bruising them more than necessary, to clear each piece of foil of perlite and scatterings of vermiculite that has fallen off. Thats when I start to wonder, is there any better way to go about doing this.. and if there is a better way to do it can there be a better way to do it that can also benefit the cakes not just saving me time and energy. You seem to think I am unaware that I can easily clean the foil off.. I was looking for a different way to do it that would be better. If there is not a better way to go about doing this then thats all I need to know for now.
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



Registered: 04/08/12
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: EntheoGod]
#22143846 - 08/25/15 11:26 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
EntheoGod said: I actually did not know they were so resistant to contamination while in the chamber. I have had a few develop trich before and I was sure that it was because of something that happened after the birthing. I am sure you're just saying they are a little more resistant because if they were completely resistant, infections couldn't happen after birthing.
They don't ...... if the cake is perfectly healthy....the mycellium has already colonized all of the substarate, which makes it really hard for anything else to colonize it.....
Quote:
EntheoGod said: I would still like to know if this is a better or worse method than the foil. I have read in a few places that your cakes grabbing onto perlite is bad because it can overhydrate the cake and also the mycelium growing onto the perlite could take more energy and nutrients away from the pins that could be developing or the fruits that are already coming to fruition. Theres no way the perlite being colonized by the cake after its in the chamber can be good for it, it has to be detrimental to the growth of the mushrooms and the mycelium. At least for the purpose of getting mushrooms to come from it for harvest.
Well, if your mycellium wants to colonize the foil/perlite rather than fruit, it sounds more like an improper fruiting condition or consolidation related issue, more than coaster type related....
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
Edited by PussyFart (08/25/15 11:27 PM)
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EntheoGod
Entheo



Registered: 03/06/15
Posts: 648
Last seen: 7 months, 28 days
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: PussyFart]
#22143882 - 08/25/15 11:31 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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I am fairly sure the fruiting conditions are fine. The temp stays around 75F in the chamber, and I have the chamber built to specs. with around 5 inches of moist perlite in the bottom of the chamber. I mist and fan them around 4 or 5 times a day. I believe the myc is colonizing whatever falls onto the foil because its merely trying to grow even farther. I am unaware of any ways to prevent the myc from colonizing anything it can thats in its vicinity.
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: EntheoGod]
#22143896 - 08/25/15 11:35 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
EntheoGod said: I believe the myc is colonizing whatever falls onto the foil because its merely trying to grow even farther. I am unaware of any ways to prevent the myc from colonizing anything it can thats in its vicinity.
Let them consolidate longer before birthing.....this should prevent further colonization....
Once it has colonized all the available substrate, it needs time to digest the highly nutritious substrate i has just consumed in preparation for fruiting.
This time period is called consolidation, and the cakes usually need a full week of it before fruiting.
Now if you are giving them plenty of consolidation time, we can investigate further....
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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EntheoGod
Entheo



Registered: 03/06/15
Posts: 648
Last seen: 7 months, 28 days
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: PussyFart]
#22143907 - 08/25/15 11:40 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Thank you for being so helpful. I do believe that I let them consolidate long enough because usually by the time I birth them theres a tiny bit of myc breaking through the verm barrier on top and theres a few pins on them. I make sure to wait at least a week after the entire cake appears white on the outside of the jar even the bottom. I have had consolidation issues in the past and became aware of that so I changed up the habit and developed a little more patience with them. Every time I incubate cakes now I allow them a full week before birthing after they are colonized entirely.
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NDStepp84
Stellar nuclear waste


Registered: 04/23/15
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: EntheoGod]
#22143930 - 08/25/15 11:45 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Hopefully by incubate you don't mean heating the jars some how...
--------------------
"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. -Robert A. Heinlein
Links and teks ND's grow log and discussion Plant thread
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EntheoGod
Entheo



Registered: 03/06/15
Posts: 648
Last seen: 7 months, 28 days
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: NDStepp84]
#22143941 - 08/25/15 11:48 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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No I never apply any heat whatsoever room temp works fine. I used the word incubate n place of "letting them colonize" for brevity.
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NDStepp84
Stellar nuclear waste


Registered: 04/23/15
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Re: Placing cakes on jar lids with vermiculite in the bottom. [Re: EntheoGod]
#22143945 - 08/25/15 11:49 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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--------------------
"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. -Robert A. Heinlein
Links and teks ND's grow log and discussion Plant thread
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