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Shamanaut17
Registered: 06/26/15
Posts: 30
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Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? *DELETED*
#22122541 - 08/21/15 01:39 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Post deleted by Shamanaut17Reason for deletion: Old
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taGyo
Strainiac/AMU



Registered: 10/16/14
Posts: 18,802
Loc: Journal Land
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: Shamanaut17]
#22122582 - 08/21/15 01:47 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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They seem to like my oats and CVG just fine. Protein is important.
-------------------- Gyo's Better Grows TNF Q&A AMU Q&A Dominus fortunae meae sum
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SteveRogers
gandy dancer


Registered: 10/24/06
Posts: 3,450
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: Shamanaut17]
#22122645 - 08/21/15 01:59 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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What is the aim of this question? They thrive naturally on manure. People here have grown very impressive yields on probably over 25 different substrates. Are you looking for the easiest substrate to work with or just trying to play scientist and concoct some "super" mix of additives and chemicals?
-------------------- "General, I am loyal to nothing......except The Dream"
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taGyo
Strainiac/AMU



Registered: 10/16/14
Posts: 18,802
Loc: Journal Land
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: SteveRogers]
#22122670 - 08/21/15 02:04 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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I think a super mix would be a waste of time 
They grow just fine on standard mixes.
-------------------- Gyo's Better Grows TNF Q&A AMU Q&A Dominus fortunae meae sum
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mrbart4444
The mycelium whisperer


Registered: 09/13/14
Posts: 2,266
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: Shamanaut17]
#22122684 - 08/21/15 02:08 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Shamanaut17 said: Hey I have a pretty fundamental question that I cant seem to find the answer too.. I see people asking questions of what nutrients Psilocybe Cubensis may provide for a human, but what exact nutrients (or organic compounds) do Psilocybe Cubensis crave for prolific growing? Hypothetical example: Psilocybe Cubensis crave nitrogen and antioxidants to procreate mass, because of this coffee may be added to the substrate for beneficial nutrients. (Ik this isnt exactly true just a response format example) thanks in advance, fire away:)
They like dog food to but they aren't dogs
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mustangbob3
Mad Myrmecologist



Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 1,685
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: taGyo]
#22122698 - 08/21/15 02:12 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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mixes can be a good thing but depends what you are growing for.
if your trying to get the most BE from grains adding bulk is always going to be cheapest way of doing so.
additives like gypsum ect can and do increase BE further too.
but then you need to way in if the cost of the additives is worth the extra BE gained.
and if you grow for money i guess any increase in speed would be of benefit as you could do more grows per year average.
its all about your goals.
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SteveRogers
gandy dancer


Registered: 10/24/06
Posts: 3,450
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: taGyo]
#22122709 - 08/21/15 02:14 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
taGyo said: I think a super mix would be a waste of time 
They grow just fine on standard mixes.
Ya. That's what I was getting at. People always want to over think the whole game and look at nutrient breakdowns and exotic additives like Kelp, Bee Pollen, epistane (MikeBearPig haha) ect. They never EVER see superior results and often times have expensive failures that were time consuming to undertake in the first place.
OP, get yourself 4 monotubs worth of spawn colonized. Do one 50/50 manure/straw. Do one 50/50 manure/straw and case it. Do one CVG. Do one CVG and case it. I bet if you use a clone you will have a tough time telling which tub is which by the end of it.
-------------------- "General, I am loyal to nothing......except The Dream"
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mrbart4444
The mycelium whisperer


Registered: 09/13/14
Posts: 2,266
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: SteveRogers]
#22122730 - 08/21/15 02:20 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
SteveRogers said:
Quote:
taGyo said: I think a super mix would be a waste of time 
They grow just fine on standard mixes.
Ya. That's what I was getting at. People always want to over think the whole game and look at nutrient breakdowns and exotic additives like Kelp, Bee Pollen, epistane (MikeBearPig haha) ect. They never EVER see superior results and often times have expensive failures that were time consuming to undertake in the first place.
OP, get yourself 4 monotubs worth of spawn colonized. Do one 50/50 manure/straw. Do one 50/50 manure/straw and case it. Do one CVG. Do one CVG and case it. I bet if you use a clone you will have a tough time telling which tub is which by the end of it.
On a serious note though cubes aren't picky at all and will consume almost anything and still fruit I've seen people grow on shoes , bibles and teddy bears with nice results . CVG and horse shit are cheapest options and can provide massive flushes .
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Shamanaut17
Registered: 06/26/15
Posts: 30
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? *DELETED* [Re: mrbart4444]
#22122990 - 08/21/15 03:10 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Post deleted by Shamanaut17Reason for deletion: Old
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SteveRogers
gandy dancer


Registered: 10/24/06
Posts: 3,450
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: Shamanaut17]
#22123003 - 08/21/15 03:14 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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You realize that the nutrient content of the substrate does not have a large effect on potency, right? Your time and resources would be better invested in genetic isolation and cloning techniques.
-------------------- "General, I am loyal to nothing......except The Dream"
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
Loc: Canada
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: SteveRogers]
#22123015 - 08/21/15 03:17 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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nutrients are actually very low. They much prefer lower nutrients with a high water content. They prefer subs with lower nitrogen and nutrients actually. They seem to love things high in cellulose.
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Appalachian Brony
Psilocyan Gosling

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 221
Loc: Dirty hills
Last seen: 4 years, 5 months
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: Shamanaut17]
#22123057 - 08/21/15 03:28 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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You can use pretty much any grain as spawn. If you wanna experiment you're safest bet is doing it on spawn. Go to a natural grocery store and you can get quinoa, purple barley, and all sorts of random grains, and as long as you sterilize them they'll work and maybe you'll see/feel a difference.
You can soak them in different stuff, the most common is adding coffee to the prep water. I imagine you could use other things though, fuckin tea, violet uses liquid fertilizer and lets it sit and "ferment" for a day. I've been thinking about taking a piss on my oats next time I prep just for the picture, you'd steal my thunder if you do that though.
You can also do a search for eatyualive's use of supercake mix that hippi3 invented for cakes, eat uses in his bulk sub. If your spawn isn't perfectly clean though that will contaminate easier because it's so nutritious.
I've used rgs, wbs, rye, and oats and I'm sticking with oats now cause they're cheap as balls and so damn easy to prep. For bulk sub CVG is the shit, and if I'm growing cubes I don't fuck with a casing at all. It's fun to fuck around and do different stuff, I did that when I started out with pan cincs and failed repeatedly, but I think it's more fun to succeed and harvest more mushies than you'll actually eat.
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Appalachian Brony
Psilocyan Gosling

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 221
Loc: Dirty hills
Last seen: 4 years, 5 months
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I forgot about the blood added to grain spawn experiment by blackout
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/4493850
You could go to red cross and when they're done taking blood just yell "I HAVE AIDS" grab the bag and dip the scene
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taGyo
Strainiac/AMU



Registered: 10/16/14
Posts: 18,802
Loc: Journal Land
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
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Quote:
Appalachian Brony said: I forgot about the blood added to grain spawn experiment by blackout
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/4493850
You could go to red cross and when they're done taking blood just yell "I HAVE AIDS" grab the bag and dip the scene
Sounds legit 
We can call it the jail tek.
-------------------- Gyo's Better Grows TNF Q&A AMU Q&A Dominus fortunae meae sum
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mrbart4444
The mycelium whisperer


Registered: 09/13/14
Posts: 2,266
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: Shamanaut17]
#22123194 - 08/21/15 03:55 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Shamanaut17 said: In no way am I into mycology for profit. I know that the 'standard' substrates work, I just want to know what Cubensis like (i.e. nitrogen, protein, sodium, etc.) so that I may find my own natural substrate that has a higher concentration of what they crave to hopefully produce more desirable fruits. I'm honestly just trying to experiment and come up with my own personal cultivation tek, just to have that personal 'custom' satisfaction. And who knows, there could be a substrate out there thats very common, just overlooked, and it could be an AMAZING source of nutrients that really shows in the formation of many pins turning into big healthy fruit bodies with amazing potentcy unseen by cubes before. I dont know I'm just always looking for something new. I know 'stick to what you know' and 'if it aint broke dont fix it' but I just like to be innovative and go outside the box for a personal feeling of accomplishment and leadership 
Yea that's cool an all but I'd think they do best in their natural substrate (enriched soils and manure ) maybe we do it a little favor since we add gypsum which has sulphur as well.
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Edited by mrbart4444 (08/21/15 04:41 PM)
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mustangbob3
Mad Myrmecologist



Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 1,685
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: mrbart4444]
#22125530 - 08/22/15 04:11 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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ime adding just gypsum leads to quite a difference in yeilds.
in fact nothing i have added made my yeilds go up like gypsum!!
is it the minerals or ph buffer helps pinset ... i have no idea but i will say gypsum works!
i prob added 20% to my yeild with just gypsum!!
a small addition of insect frass added about 8% average yeild.
and adding alfalfa pellets to my manure and sitting for 3-6month. added a whopping 16% average yeild.
thats a total of 44% increase in yeilds. over a year its a big amount of fruits! and in my opinion worth it!
also alfalfa seems to increase colonization times. and my tubs fruit faster.
the speed + 44% increase in fruits means lots more per year! as grains are the most expensive i try to make sure i get best BE for money.
infact i get the 44% increase + i have reduced my grains spawn to 1:3 ratio. so my BE was altered drastically.
so ime its worth it!
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SteveRogers
gandy dancer


Registered: 10/24/06
Posts: 3,450
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: mustangbob3]
#22125588 - 08/22/15 05:33 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
mustangbob3 said: a small addition of insect frass added about 8% average yeild.
and adding alfalfa pellets to my manure and sitting for 3-6month. added a whopping 16% average yeild.
thats a total of 44% increase in yeilds. over a year its a big amount of fruits! and in my opinion worth it!
also alfalfa seems to increase colonization times. and my tubs fruit faster.
Firstly, are you referring to P. Cubensis here? Anyone that is calculating yields down to the percentage point while running year long grow cycles is in some deep fucking water.
Secondly, can you please elaborate on the alfa lfa pellet addition. Are you saying that you allow them to ferment for 3-6 months? How do you go about preparing the substrate as a whole, insect fras = worm castings??
-------------------- "General, I am loyal to nothing......except The Dream"
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SteveRogers
gandy dancer


Registered: 10/24/06
Posts: 3,450
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: mustangbob3]
#22125589 - 08/22/15 05:34 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
mustangbob3 said: a small addition of insect frass added about 8% average yeild.
and adding alfalfa pellets to my manure and sitting for 3-6month. added a whopping 16% average yeild.
thats a total of 44% increase in yeilds. over a year its a big amount of fruits! and in my opinion worth it!
also alfalfa seems to increase colonization times. and my tubs fruit faster.
Firstly, are you referring to P. Cubensis here? Anyone that is calculating yields down to the percentage point while running year long grow cycles is swimming in some deep fucking water.
Secondly, can you please elaborate on the alfa lfa pellet addition. Are you saying that you allow them to ferment for 3-6 months? How do you go about preparing the substrate as a whole, insect fras = worm castings??
-------------------- "General, I am loyal to nothing......except The Dream"
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mustangbob3
Mad Myrmecologist



Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 1,685
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: SteveRogers]
#22125608 - 08/22/15 05:52 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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yes cubes i have been keeping running averages for every grow for ten years! i have aspergers and can be obcessive lol i have files for everything.
with a running average its hard to gain higher BE as you need a lot of grows with improvement to touch the total average, but goes the same way with dropping it, it would take lots of failures to affect the total average by a large amount because of amount of individual sets involved .
i get free horse manure( the horse are also feed alfalfa pellets lol, organic too) i collect field manure but not very old just had the piss washed out. i add about 20% alfalfa horse feed pellets to the manure. leave in a pile not to deep or high or will compost too fast. you dont want it to literally rot. just age. leave for a while 3-6 months max needed. mix up. just use as normal manure.
i past in a boiler with manure mix in a mesh straining bag. when done i squeeze out as much water as possible. then while steaming hot transfer too a pre warmed home brew coolertub.
i then add pre sterilized insect frass(1% by volume) and mix. i then add boiling water and gypsum. this gives a temp of between 70 and 80c. i then mix up put on lid and leave to cool.
takes about 6 - 8 hours to cool. then use
EDIT but no i dont run lots of tubs and not all the time lol my goal by adding additives is to make the most dry product per amount of dry grains per grow.
just as a challenge for myself, like a game:) personal bests or targets.
and insect frass is insect poop and exoskeletons. full of proteins,amino acids, vits, minerals, fatty acids and chitin ect that grains and manure alone cannot offer and that any ground dwelling mushroom will get in nature naturally.
just a supplement, and superior to worm casts altogether imo. it also has nitrogen phos and potas but i dont really use for that reason tbh
dont think any additives really affect potency i must include, only fruit health and weight and speed improve noticeably.
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Edited by mustangbob3 (08/22/15 06:07 AM)
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SteveRogers
gandy dancer


Registered: 10/24/06
Posts: 3,450
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: mustangbob3]
#22125609 - 08/22/15 05:54 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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ARE YOU EVER NOT ON HERE! JESUS YOU AND MIKE MUST TAG TEAM METH PIPES.
.....good answer haha
I do not have access to fresh manure of the feed variety you discussed there. I will need to find a way to get a product that hasn't yet been leeched to try your alfal fa additive idea.
You are very meticulous and if your work with Mike on his improvement project is any indication of how meticulous you are, then I can't help but take your word for the increases in yield.
Thank you for providing me with a new project to start.
-------------------- "General, I am loyal to nothing......except The Dream"
Edited by SteveRogers (08/22/15 06:00 AM)
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mustangbob3
Mad Myrmecologist



Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 1,685
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Re: Psilocybe Cubensis' thriving nutrients? [Re: SteveRogers]
#22125630 - 08/22/15 06:16 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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the increase is a running average. still some grows are better than others 
and you prob could just use your normal manure and if you pour hot water on the alfala pellets and leave for a bit they will swell and break apart. and then mix with you manure and then past as you would normally.
might be a bit messy lol( never tried this way so )
i do it slowly but dont pile the pile too high or deep as you dont want full on composting. what your trying to acheive is basically finishing leaching the manure but with the alfalfa pellets in there too.
so the pellets swell and when you come to mix and break up the manure to use it 3 months later, it all gets mixed up with no mess.
just a lazy less messy way i do it.
EDIT i quick made a journal entry for you of a nutrient analysis of my alfalfa grown locally. if your interested. theres lots of goodies in alfalfa.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22125633
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Edited by mustangbob3 (08/22/15 06:29 AM)
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