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Anonymous

Acceptable Debate
    #2211656 - 12/31/03 01:38 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I have been wondering about this for a while now. Why is it that when you agree with someone it doesn't seem important to them or others that you offer reasons for agreeing with them.

On the other hand if you disagree you are required to state the reasons why you disagree.

Isn't it possible that you merely disagree and don't wish to be drawn into an argument where you realize there can be no 'winning' in the sense of getting someone to see you point, let alone agree with it?

Isn't also entirely possible that you may agree with someone for the wrong reasons?

Why do the members here think that is?


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: ]
    #2211670 - 12/31/03 01:47 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I agree.



:grin:

Seriously, though, it sounds like an ego thing that causes this. :thumbup:
Peace.


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:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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OfflineFrog
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Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: ]
    #2211675 - 12/31/03 01:51 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Mr_Mushrooms said:
I have been wondering about this for a while now. Why is it that when you agree with someone it doesn't seem important to them or others that you offer reasons for agreeing with them.



I never thought about that. When someone agrees with me, I assume that their reasoning is based on the same grounds. Wouldn't one want to know the basis for agreement? To see if we agree for the same reasons? Or for different reasons?

Quote:

On the other hand if you disagree you are required to state the reasons why you disagree.

Isn't it possible that you merely disagree and don't wish to be drawn into an argument where you realize there can be no 'winning' in the sense of getting someone to see you point, let alone agree with it?



Well, if you're going to take the time to disagree, you should take the time to state why, or *yawn*, why bother?


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The day will come when, after harnessing the ether, the winds, the tides, gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And, on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire.  -Teilard


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: ]
    #2211698 - 12/31/03 02:06 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Often when I agree with someone, I will elaborate on their idea to clearly state my position.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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Anonymous

Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: Frog]
    #2211710 - 12/31/03 02:11 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I agree with fireworks_god.

But I refuse to say why.  :lol:

Well, if you're going to take the time to disagree, you should take the time to state why, or *yawn*, why bother?

Well, for one reason, silence could imply agreement.  When speaking with people face to face a person might mumble, "I see what you mean."  That alone could be inferred as 'agreement' when it is not the case at all.

There are times when I feel like explaining my reasons for agreement/disagreement and times when I don't wish to discuss it any further.  I think this might frustrate people tied to their ego like a ball and chain who wish to argue trifles when life is much larger than a discussion on an Internet message board.

Happy New Year Frog. :smile:

MM


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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: ]
    #2211761 - 12/31/03 02:31 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

MM: I have been wondering about this for a while now. Why is it that when you agree with someone it doesn't seem important to them or others that you offer reasons for agreeing with them.

I run into this thought every so often, too.
However, being the asshole that I am... I occasionally call people out when I agree with them (if I suspect something's a little off). Most people get defensive and think I'm trying to trick them into changing their stance, as if I were lying to them about my stance in the first place just to gain their trust. Few seem to care about finding the common root, if it exists.

What really annoys me is when someone shares my point of view, but their reasons are completely bogus, ill-thought-out, blah blah blah. Blind, dogmatic adherence to anything (a more favorable opinion or not) is unacceptable in the Book of Sclorch.

Note: Book of Sclorch is an ammendable, non-dogmatic, unfinished, amorphous collection of Sclorch's thoughts.


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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Offlinedaba
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Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: ]
    #2212411 - 12/31/03 07:47 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I think when you agree with someone without stating a reason the person that you agreed with thinks that you share the similar thoughts as he/she does.

Not a very strong argument, but an argument nonetheless.


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Fold for The Shroomery!


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: Sclorch]
    #2212433 - 12/31/03 08:06 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

What really annoys me is when someone shares my point of view, but their reasons are completely bogus, ill-thought-out, blah blah blah. Blind, dogmatic adherence to anything (a more favorable opinion or not) is unacceptable in the Book of Sclorch.

Who cares how they got to the same place as you, if they took a different path? All of us travel different paths and think differently. We are all based on our experiences..had you led the same life and experiences as that person that annoys you, you might have done the same.


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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: silversoul7]
    #2213137 - 01/01/04 02:05 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

"Often when I agree with someone, I will elaborate on their idea to clearly state my position."

Right on - I normally do the same.. When I agree with somebody I usually attempt to express the idea from my own perspective, kind of to make sure we're both talking about the same kind of thing. I've seen people clarify their own statements if they realize people are agreeing for the wrong reasons..


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Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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OfflineSpecialEd
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Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: Shroomism]
    #2213653 - 01/01/04 07:30 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Who cares how they got to the same place as you, if they took a different path? All of us travel different paths and think differently. We are all based on our experiences..had you led the same life and experiences as that person that annoys you, you might have done the same.




In mathmatics, you can arrive at the correct solution whilst doing faulty work. You have the right answer, but you do not truly understand how to arrive at the right answer. And it really isn't all about answers...

It's about gettting there!


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-- :meff:
  /l_l\/
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Offlinelucid
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Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: ]
    #2213709 - 01/01/04 08:14 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

"life is much larger than a discussion on an Internet message board."

life is a discussion on an Internet message board :grin:
at least for me :smirk:


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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Onlinefalcon
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Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: ]
    #2214050 - 01/02/04 12:29 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

If agreement in a group leads to some kind of consensus as to what action should be taken then whats the point of explaining how you got there.

If your talking about philosloppy and this forum then what ever differences will become apparent at another time if people are working from a different set of premises or values. Patience young skywalker.


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Anonymous

Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: falcon]
    #2214145 - 01/02/04 01:32 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Ohhh that is wise!

Thank you! :heart:


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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Acceptable Debate [Re: falcon]
    #2214369 - 01/02/04 04:04 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

falcon said:
If agreement in a group leads to some kind of consensus as to what action should be taken then whats the point of explaining how you got there.



You're right, the history of thought is pointless, whether it was born 10 minutes ago or it's 1,000 years old. 
Method shmethod... the means ain't shit!
:rolleyes:

Quote:

falcon said:
If your talking about philosloppy and this forum then what ever differences will become apparent at another time if people are working from a different set of premises or values.  Patience young skywalker.



Not always. 
Sometimes people internalize their differences too much, everything builds up, and they release in the form of a metal pipe to their friend's head.  So maybe it's good to sort things out BEFORE it gets to that point, eh?


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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