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Invisiblepirate-blues
Female

Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 13,656
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: A Day InThe Life] * 1
    #22077153 - 08/11/15 04:19 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

My cat flatout insisted on being an inside/outside cat. She would hide and every time I'd open the door to let my dog out, she dart out. Usually she just chilled with my dog in a small urban backyard(it was more like a garden, and had grass and trees that liked to sit in and around). She started spending a little more time outside, and there's no way she'd let me catch her.

I distinctly remember throwing cat food at her when I took ambien to go to bed and she snuck out right as it was kicking in. In the end, I let her win. Then one day my neighbor found her dead, there were no visible marks of bodily harm, her tail was kind of puffed up and the neighbor said that sometimes cats do that when scared - but ultimately, I suspect the poor thing just died of a heart issue. She was a runt, and the vet said she had a heart murmur. I was so sad though, I definitely cried that day.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: pirate-blues] * 2
    #22077358 - 08/11/15 05:06 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

I have 3 now.  They never go outside because I live 100 feet from Route 1.  I have had outdoor cats.  One got squished and one lived to be 15.  I live in a 3 story house.  They get plenty of exercise following me up and down the stairs and plenty of attention. Occasionally they get a mouse.  None of them are fat because I feed them right.  Sometimes Frankie and Roy go for a stroll on the deck but they rarely express an interest in going down the steps and turn right around when I make a move.  They do not run from me ever except when they want to play chase.  They are happy and healthy and don't really care that they don't go out much.  Lola has no interest at all.


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Invisiblesquidhead
senior citizen stoner
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Registered: 12/23/03
Posts: 233
Loc: left right here Flag
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: pirate-blues]
    #22077404 - 08/11/15 05:17 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

You want to eradicate hunger from Asian countries?

Let them eat cat. So many problems would be gone if that was done...along with legalizing ALL drugs. I'm talking over-the-counter heroin/cocaine/MDMA/weed/PCP/meth/LSD/mescaline/peyote/mushrooms/crack/Jimson Weed/Belladonna/barbituates/amphetamines, etc, etc.

Anything that can be snorted, shot, ingested, melted on an eyeball (Windowpane), plugged up your ass, everything!! Of course, there are a couple rules = must be 25+ yrs of age, can't purchase if your skin is turning a shade of blue, must have a physician's note if babbling, etc.

Street gangs wouldn't have a source of income anymore. Cartels would be worthless, as now the federal government controls sales. Tax the ever-lovin' piss outta these recreational substances & give that $$$ to the poor street-peeps looking for shelter.


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Enjoy Life. It has an expiration date.

When I die, I want my last words to be...
"I left a million dollars under the..." :bigblunt:


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InvisibleTantrika
Miss Ann Thrope
Female


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/26/12
Posts: 17,138
Loc: Lashed to the pyre
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: squidhead]
    #22077682 - 08/11/15 06:13 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

squidhead said:
You want to eradicate hunger from Asian countries?

Let them eat cat. ...




United Nations proposed that the solution to food issues is to eat insects.

http://www.fao.org/forestry/edibleinsects/en/

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-22508439

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/07/24/world/edible-insect-food-business/



:evilpuke:


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OfflinePsilosopherr
A psilly goose
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Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 12,278
Last seen: 1 month, 10 days
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: Tantrika]
    #22077694 - 08/11/15 06:15 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

SweetLeafSamadhi said:
Quote:

squidhead said:
You want to eradicate hunger from Asian countries?

Let them eat cat. ...




United Nations proposed that the solution to food issues is to eat insects.

http://www.fao.org/forestry/edibleinsects/en/

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-22508439

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/07/24/world/edible-insect-food-business/



:evilpuke:



which totally makes sense. bugs are good eatin and can be quite tasty

but really the solution is to significantly (non-violently) reduce the population.


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OfflineGiftofdeprivation
Discerning Vagrant
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Registered: 07/20/13
Posts: 3,933
Last seen: 8 years, 28 days
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: Tantrika]
    #22077708 - 08/11/15 06:17 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Why are humans so resistant to change?

It's all the same nutritional shit: protein, carbs, and fat. Anything extra is just "fiber"


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InvisibleTantrika
Miss Ann Thrope
Female


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/26/12
Posts: 17,138
Loc: Lashed to the pyre
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #22077754 - 08/11/15 06:24 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

rbalzer said:
Quote:

SweetLeafSamadhi said:
Quote:

squidhead said:
You want to eradicate hunger from Asian countries?

Let them eat cat. ...




United Nations proposed that the solution to food issues is to eat insects.

http://www.fao.org/forestry/edibleinsects/en/

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-22508439

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/07/24/world/edible-insect-food-business/

....

:evilpuke:



which totally makes sense. bugs are good eatin and can be quite tasty

but really the solution is to significantly (non-violently) reduce the population.




Solid enough source of nutrition, but going to have to work on the presentation at least.
But then, do not even like salad so a bug salad is something I am doubly resistant to. :lol:

Think that population reduction would take a shift in views on many people's parts -- personally decided to opt for a vasectomy without parenting my own children, if ever my relationship with a woman gets to the point that we want to raise kids we can look at adopting.
The idea of cutting off part of a family lineage is not something many people are up for though, and a person here or there probably will not be sufficient. :shrug:


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InvisibleDieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: Giftofdeprivation]
    #22077862 - 08/11/15 06:44 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Its not as bad as putting a bird in a cage, but I do think its pretty shitty for a cat to be stuck indoors.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: DieCommie] * 2
    #22077883 - 08/11/15 06:48 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

I have a three story house with over 2,000 sq ft.  I got my cats from a shelter.  None of them are fat and they are happy as shit.  If I let them out they will be squished.  If I didn't adopt them three cats would have been put down. Tell me how I'm an asshole.


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InvisibleDieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #22077948 - 08/11/15 07:01 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

The gilded cage is still a cage, but its better than being squished.  It doesn't sound ideal, but real life rarely is.  I don't like keeping my dogs locked up in a fenced yard.


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OfflineGiftofdeprivation
Discerning Vagrant
Male User Gallery


Registered: 07/20/13
Posts: 3,933
Last seen: 8 years, 28 days
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: DieCommie]
    #22077984 - 08/11/15 07:08 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

As they get older, the chances of introducing them to the outdoors becomes more and more precarious for their survival.

If they were babies when you got them, would it be morally wrong to confine them to the indoors?

Should one seek a designated indoor cat if that's what they are seeking?


--------------------

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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: DieCommie] * 1
    #22078038 - 08/11/15 07:20 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

DieCommie said:
The gilded cage is still a cage, but its better than being squished.  It doesn't sound ideal, but real life rarely is.  I don't like keeping my dogs locked up in a fenced yard.



I understand the sentiment but the house is big enough, thay have each other and me and my wife and they don't know anything else so they don't miss it.  I can assure you my house is not a cage for them any more than it is for me..  I will repeat my point.  If I didn't adopt them 3 cats would have had to be put down.  There is only so much room at the shelter and only so many cats can get adopted.  The shelter is a far less gilded cage than my house.


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InvisibleTantrika
Miss Ann Thrope
Female


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/26/12
Posts: 17,138
Loc: Lashed to the pyre
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: zappaisgod] * 1
    #22078122 - 08/11/15 07:39 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

DieCommie said:
The gilded cage is still a cage, but its better than being squished.  It doesn't sound ideal, but real life rarely is.  I don't like keeping my dogs locked up in a fenced yard.



I understand the sentiment but the house is big enough, thay have each other and me and my wife and they don't know anything else so they don't miss it.  I can assure you my house is not a cage for them any more than it is for me..  I will repeat my point.  If I didn't adopt them 3 cats would have had to be put down.  There is only so much room at the shelter and only so many cats can get adopted.  The shelter is a far less gilded cage than my house.




Not sure if many people fully realize just how bad the shelter system can be.

Spent many years volunteering in various shelters.

The cats sit in a small cage roughly the size of a carrying kennel for nearly 22 hours per day in the most poorly funded of them.
They get an opportunity to run around with the other cats for about an hour twice per day while their cage/litterbox is cleaned and their food is refilled -- quality of food depends on quality of donations; dry food is standard but in good months canned food can be a few times per week.
Better-funded shelters have cases where it's 30+ cats all kept together with communal litter boxes and food dishes in a room the size of a decent living room.

The best possible situation I have seen for a shelter pet to end up in is a foster-care home system where they live in a temporary home and have potential adoption visits arranged through phone or website.

When new cats come in, the oldest/least adoptable cats are euthanized to make space.
So, everyone who does not spay or neuter their pets may end up killing off a bunch of shelter animals every time they cannot find home for a new batch of kittens.

Anyone who has the space and the means, even if it is an indoor-only space, really ought to consider adoption.  So many good potential pets are killed each year because kittens are more popular. :sad:


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: Tantrika]
    #22078207 - 08/11/15 07:56 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

I adopt kittens because I want to raise them from scratch.  If you don't adopt a kitten eventually they become a shelter cat.  New Rochelle isn't like what you describe.  The adults mingle all day.  They do a good job but they can only support so many cats.  They make you pay for neutering upfront when you adopt.  You get your money back when you prove you did it. 

That place you were at is fucked up.


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Onlinekoods
Ribbit
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Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,059
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
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Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #22078218 - 08/11/15 07:57 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Yes. But don't smear shit in its face and throw it out to the curb if it has an accident.


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NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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InvisibleTantrika
Miss Ann Thrope
Female


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/26/12
Posts: 17,138
Loc: Lashed to the pyre
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #22078402 - 08/11/15 08:27 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
I adopt kittens because I want to raise them from scratch.  If you don't adopt a kitten eventually they become a shelter cat.  New Rochelle isn't like what you describe.  The adults mingle all day.  They do a good job but they can only support so many cats.  They make you pay for neutering upfront when you adopt.  You get your money back when you prove you did it. 

That place you were at is fucked up.




It was more to do with funding at that particular place; a couple years after I moved they finally got funding together for a better facility which was a significant improvement. 
The original facility was tiny and packed -- the dogs got better spacing and a large outdoor run to play in, but much of the interior was basically cages built into the walls and stacked up wherever space was available.  Even then, many ended up shipped off to the vet in the end.  The dog and cat cages were all in one room, and we would have to let all the dogs outside (with special smaller runs built in to separate those that were prone to fighting) before we could get to work on the cats. 
Certainly not all are that bad, but in areas where fundraising doesn't work to huge benefit the facilities are not always top notch.

There are also no-kill shelters present in a number of areas, which are significant improvements all around; however, they can only house so many as you note.

All my adult cat adoptions have been with me until they died of age-related issues, except one who is still with me.  He's slowly going blind, but he's still full of love.
One kitten from a friend's litter, she lived well rather than being sent to the shelter.

Montréal was really where the actual population issue was the hardest though -- every year there is what is endearingly referred to as "National Moving Day" where many people's yearly rent contract runs out all on the same day.
Mass moving also means mass pet abandonment, when people go from an apartment that can house a pet to one where it isn't allowed.


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Offlineclock_of_omens
razzle them dazzle them
I'm a teapot

Registered: 04/10/14
Posts: 4,097
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: Giftofdeprivation]
    #22078567 - 08/11/15 08:57 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

It's morally worse to let them roam around outside. They'll kill indiscriminately, and they're an introduced species in ecosystems where they don't belong.


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InvisiblecApTaInCrAp
Delightfullyexcellent
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Registered: 03/19/04
Posts: 2,613
Re: Is it morally OK to own an indoor only cat? [Re: clock_of_omens]
    #22079481 - 08/12/15 12:14 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

If your gonna let your cat outside (which i feel you should) do us a favor and listen to Bob Barker...



My kitten was adopted, one of my g/f cats was adopted and the other was a barn cat.


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"...Terrific, im glad we've had this time to discuss..im outro, call me if you wanna blaze one up.."



Edited by cApTaInCrAp (08/12/15 12:15 AM)


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