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InvisibleSheekle
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Rebelutionsssss] * 1
    #22080712 - 08/12/15 10:20 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Rebelutionsssss said:
:strokebeard: I've wanted a discussion like this for so long. So some of the damage comes from the brain trying to counteract the missing serotonin by flooding the empty receptors with dopamine thus causing damage to them?



I do believe that's the case, and I believe that Alpha Lipoic Acid is a great supplement for reducing MDMA nuerotoxicity because it prevents that from happening and is one of the very few potent anti-oxidants that actually crosses the BBB (blood brain barrier)


--------------------
"Ur cat died because he hated u" - Koods
"I hope JSB kicks your ass one day." - Vandago
"you are the biggest 'internet guy' I have ever come across"- Jokeshopbeard
"The more I see you post the more I realize you're just this fuckin tie dye loser who trolls the Shroomery 24/7." - Herbologist
"Sheekle you cannot vile the dice of bullshit you have posted on this forum over the years, I like databases" - thelastoneleft
"or maybe i just come from a blood line of superior intelligence" - trees

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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Rebelutionsssss]
    #22080724 - 08/12/15 10:23 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

A few summarization points

1. Using MDMA once a week is way way too often and will definitely fuck up your body and brain to some extent as well as totally ruin MDMA for you

2. Meth is in every way a more dangerous, harmful, damaging, addictive and life destroying drug, with far less therapeutic benefit then MDMA.

3. MDMA does have profound, valuable therapeutic benefits for the treatment of PTSD and relationship counseling.

4. 5-HTP is a somewhat sketchy supplement. I am a huge supplement user and have researched and used dozens of them, but 5-htp I have always been wary of. Bitter Cactus is right, it is speculated to cause heart problems. It should be combined with B vitamin complex and used with care.

5. MDMA should be used as little as possible, like once a year or less ideally, but I would say it can make your life better if used properly, and has virtually no harm associated with it if used sparingly, carefully, if its clean and pure, if you hydrate and don't overheat, eat, sleep etc.

6. MDMA is a hard drug. Its not harmless like weed or kratom, but its not a life-ruiner for most people like meth and heroin are.

7. That said, for the unlucky few who cant limit their doses and use MDMA frequently, it will really fuck you up


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Everything I post is fiction.


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Invisibleabductee
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Registered: 05/07/15
Posts: 2,224
Loc: Canada
Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Sheekle]
    #22080726 - 08/12/15 10:24 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

When  I was a teenager I would pick up a half sheet or sheet and share with friends and people.lol. I had at least 50 trips.. not sure what was in the lsd, but never heard of anyone od'ing on it.. guess it depends how good it is.


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: abductee]
    #22080845 - 08/12/15 11:04 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

You cant OD and die from real LSD, but a lot of people are selling NBOMEs as LSD and those can easily kill you.


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Everything I post is fiction.


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Invisible404
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Registered: 08/20/10
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #22080889 - 08/12/15 11:15 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

to be fair, we don't know what the lethal dose for LSD (in humans) is considering no one's ever eaten multiple grams or ounces of the stuff. you will not die as a direct result of an overdose from anything you can afford or take recreationally though.

i have taken reported milligrams of 25c before. if it were as dangerous as all the scared folk are making it out to be, then i should have died or had a seizure. i didn't, and i've taken it a few times. i'm not convinced the reason is well understood why there are adverse reactions to it other than the fact that it's a psychedelic and phenethylamine, and those typically have a history of being dangerous.

You can OD from the 2c chems, you can OD from the DOx chems, bromo dragonfly seems like the worst out of all of them, and of course we have the nbomes which are related to the 2c's

you mentioned that you have researched 5htp and its "sketchy" but i didn't see you post anything on it either. do you have any science journals that back your claims?


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OfflineRebelutionsssss
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Registered: 07/23/14
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: 404]
    #22080917 - 08/12/15 11:22 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

yea man that bromo trip report was brutal


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:
To define is to confine.


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: 404]
    #22080989 - 08/12/15 11:39 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Don't get me wrong, I don't think 5-htp is particularly dangerous, but I have read it can potentially cause heart valve problems and a rare but serious muscle soreness condition. Bitter Cactus already posted that I believe.

I have also read its not very effective as much of the seratonin does not enter the brain.

However, I have taken 5-htp before and even have some now. i am not saying its super dangerous by any means, just that overall I don't consider it a particularly worthwhile supplement for most people at most times.

But the risks seem to be minor, the only major one being seratonin syndrome if combined with certain other drugs. Apparently its also bad for people with Downs syndrome.

The time I would consider taking 5-htp would be for a week or two following a dose of MDMA, assuming no contraindicated medications are being used.


--------------------


Everything I post is fiction.


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OfflineRebelutionsssss
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #22081002 - 08/12/15 11:43 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

well its just the chemical that your body needs to start producing its own serotonin. i have found extremely useful with my hangovers. hell even to brighten your mood or help you sleep. i usually take around 100mgs and fall asleep pretty damn well


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:
To define is to confine.


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Rebelutionsssss]
    #22081016 - 08/12/15 11:45 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah I think its ok, the only thing that scared me was the reports that it can cause "heart valve disease" whatever that is, but it seems like that risk is low and there is very little about it on the web.

I have some at the moment, I might take some, but I wonder if its good to take with kratom, and I also take turmeric every day which is an MAOI, so that makes me more wary to use it.


--------------------


Everything I post is fiction.


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Invisible404
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Registered: 08/20/10
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #22081028 - 08/12/15 11:47 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

5htp crosses the blood-brain barrier. serotonin doesn't

serotonin receptors do line your gi tract though.


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OfflineBitter Cactus
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #22081031 - 08/12/15 11:48 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Moonshoe said:
A few summarization points

1. Using MDMA once a week is way way too often and will definitely fuck up your body and brain to some extent as well as totally ruin MDMA for you

2. Meth is in every way a more dangerous, harmful, damaging, addictive and life destroying drug, with far less therapeutic benefit then MDMA.

3. MDMA does have profound, valuable therapeutic benefits for the treatment of PTSD and relationship counseling.

4. 5-HTP is a somewhat sketchy supplement. I am a huge supplement user and have researched and used dozens of them, but 5-htp I have always been wary of. Bitter Cactus is right, it is speculated to cause heart problems. It should be combined with B vitamin complex and used with care.

5. MDMA should be used as little as possible, like once a year or less ideally, but I would say it can make your life better if used properly, and has virtually no harm associated with it if used sparingly, carefully, if its clean and pure, if you hydrate and don't overheat, eat, sleep etc.

6. MDMA is a hard drug. Its not harmless like weed or kratom, but its not a life-ruiner for most people like meth and heroin are.

7. That said, for the unlucky few who cant limit their doses and use MDMA frequently, it will really fuck you up




I can cosign this.

- However, I will still say that if you were to take a 150mg capsule of meth in the same way one would take MDMA, the negative effects on your brain would be less severe and you would recover much much faster.

Unfortunately nobody actually does meth this way so yes I agree with you Moon.


- I think once you get older too even once a year is pushing it. I think getting shitfaced on booze is a safer alternative for your brain over MDMA.


- Also, if you suffer from depression do not mess with MDMA more then once or twice a year.

- After a roll, if you need the serotonin that bad just eat some turkey. I still think if you want to recover from a roll you should take kratom it will be a thousand times more effective then 5htp. When I took 5htp I swear to God I would get pain in my heart and my heart beat would be really fucked up. It makes you really nauseous too cause most of the serotonin just floats in your gut which is totally fucked up.


--------------------
Taking acid and thinking you are a better man is a lot different then actually becoming a better man.




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OfflineRebelutionsssss
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #22081036 - 08/12/15 11:49 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

its a nice supplement. the research that it actually does that is limited at best.


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:
To define is to confine.


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Bitter Cactus]
    #22081044 - 08/12/15 11:52 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Turkey, especially dark meat, is one of my favorite things in the world. People should eat it all the time instead of chicken, its so much better.

I have to disagree with you that getting shit faced on booze is safer though. Alcohol, especially at high doses, is INCREDIBLY harmful and INCREDIBLY dangerous. You can EASILY die from getting shit faced from alcohol, it happens every day. Alcohol indisputably causes brain damage, is carcinogenic, is highly physically addictive (you can die from the Withdrawal), has a dangerously low LD50, damages every tissue and organ in the body, causes liver failure, results in a massive amount of fatal car crashes, accidents and fights, and is involved in almost all crimes resulting in prison and a criminal record. Alcohol is one of the most dangerous and destructive drugs in the world, and does not have the potential therapeutic benefits MDMA does.

Many many times more people die form alcohol then MDMA, many many times more people become totally addicted to alcohol then MDMA, and many more people have more serious brain damage from Alcohol then MDMA.

Earlier I posted a scientific study (in the wikipedia page on Doctor Nutt) that ranks the harmfulness of the most common drugs. Alcohol is near the top of that list, MDMA is near the bottom.


--------------------


Everything I post is fiction.


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OfflineBitter Cactus
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Rebelutionsssss]
    #22081047 - 08/12/15 11:52 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Trust me man, there is a reason doctors do not prescribe 5htp for depression. With like 99 of the serotonin floating in your gut and getting into places it should not be, it is something you should not be using longer then a couple weeks. It is just a fucked up supplement in my opinion. IMO get the trytophan shit or just eat turkey if you want the serotonin cause trytophan is converted into 5htp and it all gets into your brain.


--------------------
Taking acid and thinking you are a better man is a lot different then actually becoming a better man.




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InvisibleSophistic Radiance
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Bitter Cactus] * 1
    #22081057 - 08/12/15 11:56 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Every time you say "trust me" it just makes me wish you would cite sources that much more


--------------------
Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.



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OfflineBitter Cactus
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #22081061 - 08/12/15 11:56 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Moonshoe said:
Turkey, especially dark meat, is one of my favorite things in the world. People should eat it all the time instead of chicken, its so much better.

I have to disagree with you that getting shit faced on booze is safer though. Alcohol, especially at high doses, is INCREDIBLY harmful and INCREDIBLY dangerous. You can EASILY die from getting shit faced from alcohol, it happens every day. Alcohol indisputably causes brain damage, is carcinogenic, is highly physically addictive (you can die from the Withdrawal), has a dangerously low LD50, damages every tissue and organ in the body, causes liver failure, results in a massive amount of fatal car crashes, accidents and fights, and is involved in almost all crimes resulting in prison and a criminal record. Alcohol is one of the most dangerous and destructive drugs in the world, and does not have the potential therapeutic benefits MDMA does.

Many many times more people die form alcohol then MDMA, many many times more people become totally addicted to alcohol then MDMA, and many more people have more serious brain damage from Alcohol then MDMA.

Earlier I posted a scientific study (in the wikipedia page on Doctor Nutt) that ranks the harmfulness of the most common drugs. Alcohol is near the top of that list, MDMA is near the bottom.




That list is full of shit.

IMO, you could get shitfaced twice a weekend for a year and taper off and get off relatively fine. If you did that with MDMA you would pretty much have no ability to hold your concentration for more then a second and your memory would be absolutely shot. A glass of red wine at supper time makes you live longer I hear. Try doing that with MDMA and honestly you would commit suicide after a year cause the depression would get so bad.

Alcohol is way safer for recreational and frequent use over MDMA. MDMA causes less social problems and less people abuse it on the regular but in terms of abuse MDMA is way less forgiving then basically any drug on the planet


--------------------
Taking acid and thinking you are a better man is a lot different then actually becoming a better man.




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InvisibleSophistic Radiance
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Bitter Cactus]
    #22081073 - 08/12/15 12:00 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

I know people who have abused MDMA harder than that who did not commit suicide, they were obviously affected by it but they eventually stopped and got better within a few months.


--------------------
Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.



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OfflineRebelutionsssss
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Rebelutionsssss]
    #22081087 - 08/12/15 12:03 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Rebelutionsssss said:
fast forward to 31:00





--------------------
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To define is to confine.


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Bitter Cactus]
    #22081111 - 08/12/15 12:11 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

The reason doctors don't prescribe 5-htp is because it is a natural supplement from gryphonia seeds. Pharmaceutical companies don't prescribe any natural supplements, not because they are dangerous or don't work, but because they cant patent them.

For example, S adenosyl Methionine (SAMe) is an amazing antidepressant, proven to be as effective as pharmaceutical SSRIs without any of the side effects and many serious additional health benefits such as healing the liver and easing joint pain.

They don't prescribe it because its natural, even though it is a better alternative.

SSRIs have many dangers, risks and side effects but they prescribe them anyways, because they make so much money from it.

If you think pharmaceutical companies care much about your health and well being, you are naieve. They care about profits, and will sell anything they can get away with as long as it makes money.


--------------------


Everything I post is fiction.


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Invisible404
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Re: How dangerous do you guys feel MDMA truly is? [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #22081112 - 08/12/15 12:12 PM (8 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

BlindSophist said:
Every time you say "trust me" it just makes me wish you would cite sources that much more




seriously.


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