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zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: Jokeshopbeard] 1
#22073519 - 08/10/15 08:16 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Jokeshopbeard said: She's very ill and she needs psychiatric help - that's what underlies all of her actions IMO. Several recent life events have caused her to recede further into her illness - it's like she's become a shell of the wonderful woman I married all those years ago.
She was diagnosed with BPD less than a year ago. Off the back of this event (due to her overwhelming guilt) she's gone into a 28 day addiction treatment program to stop the drinking, starting this morning. That's a start. It is possible that this event was a blessing in disguise - if it causes her to take hold of her illness and work to conquer it no matter what, then there's some hope.
I thank everyone who has participated in this thread from the bottom of my heart. I've decided to give her one more chance, and I'm going to spend the next 28 days doing as much reading on how to deal with BPD as I can. I have set some very strict boundaries from here on out and have told her unequivocally that I will leave her if she crosses these boundaries.
When it came down to it, and I asked my heart what is right, I realised I would not be living from a place of utmost compassion to leave someone I love when they are so much in need of help.
You are a good, tolerant, understanding man. I applaud what you are doing.
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: RobZombie68]
#22073547 - 08/10/15 08:21 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Good for you man, that's quite a track record. Certainly unheard of in my circle of close friends. Drugs normally seem to be the root cause of any lying that occurs, but the the hard stuff tends to have that effect on most people IME.
I hate lying and stealing too, and in fact all I ask of anyone who comes into my house (including myself) is honesty. I have a huge sign over the door stating so. Still, we're only human and slip ups are inevitable. As long as we learn from them, then it's always worth it in the end. You gotta fuck up to become a better human right?
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: zappaisgod]
#22073576 - 08/10/15 08:26 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
zappaisgod said: You are a good, tolerant, understanding man. I applaud what you are doing.
Thanks for saying man; it's certainly been a hell of a challenge and I have questioned myself endlessly over the past week. I want to believe that some good can come of any situation, and I hope that my actions will inspire that in any situation I come across.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: Jokeshopbeard] 1
#22073641 - 08/10/15 08:39 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Give her a chance but don't give her your life if it doesn't work. You are a person, too.
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: zappaisgod] 1
#22073688 - 08/10/15 08:48 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Yeah, that's the main underlying boundary. I'm gonna have to work hard to keep track of it though. Through working with a therapist it has come to my attention that I risk replaying my parental script with her; when I was a total shit as a teenager/young man, my mother never chastised me for the terrible things I did - she just continued to provide unconditional love, I think, because she just didn't know what else to do.
That's a cycle that I will have to break. As has been said earlier in the thread, I cannot be her carer or therapist, and I have told my wife that I will no have no involvement in the treatment of her illness - she's on her own with that.
I hope that she can see what she's got to lose here. If she can conquer her illness she has the potential to be a truly wonderful human being. But like you say, at the heart of all this I have to protect myself, and I believe I'm now prepared to do so.
Thanks again man.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


Registered: 05/28/14
Posts: 4,345
Loc: North
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
#22073691 - 08/10/15 08:48 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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'Accidental' Affair.....is this a fucking joke?
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MajickMuffin
Edible Cult


Registered: 05/28/14
Posts: 4,345
Loc: North
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: MajickMuffin]
#22073702 - 08/10/15 08:50 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Like these dudes said, drop that bitch
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: MajickMuffin]
#22073712 - 08/10/15 08:51 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
MajickMuffin said: 'Accidental' Affair.....is this a fucking joke?
Have a read man, there's plenty of literature out there, which is from where I defined the terminology:
http://www.marriageadvocates.com/2012/01/05/anatomy-of-an-affair-accidental-affairs/
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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Srirachi
Mold Hand



Registered: 10/18/05
Posts: 11,411
Loc: Fare Thee Well.
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: Jokeshopbeard] 1
#22074095 - 08/10/15 10:22 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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A lot of these people have never really been in love. They act like it's a commodity exchange.
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FungusOfTheBungus


Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 121
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
#22074146 - 08/10/15 10:32 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Good luck with your decision to work with your wife and BPD. It's a tough road. You will never have a "normal" relationship in some ways. Your wife doesn't understand how those work. She is always in a constant state of anxiety and fear. It's like permanent PTSD. You will have to learn not to let her dump her emotional "slime" on to you and make it your fault that she feels that way. And learn how to not take the explosive anger episodes personally. (Easier said than done)
There won't be any quick cure. It takes many years of therapy for the symptoms to become less severe. There is no pill to fix a personality disorder. The only thing you can do in the meantime is work on yourself and how you interact with her. It also gets easier with time when you understand why borderlines behave the way do.
And do set limits on "alone time" with other men. Certain types of men can practically smell women with low personal boundaries and they will take advantage whenever they can. Primarily men with traits of NPD and ASPD.
I speak from first-hand experience. My wife has BPD as well.
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Anonymous #2
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: FungusOfTheBungus]
#22074203 - 08/10/15 10:42 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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I'm a narcissist and I absolutely can find the most broken woman in the room. Dad, or the husband, or life in general breaks them, and for a couple of hours, I fill in the cracks and make them feel whole.
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: FungusOfTheBungus] 1
#22074250 - 08/10/15 10:51 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Srirachi said: A lot of these people have never really been in love. They act like it's a commodity exchange.
I have wondered about this based on some of the responses! Thanks for your input throughout Srirachi, it's been really positive and has helped a lot.
Quote:
FungusOfTheBungus said: Good luck with your decision to work with your wife and BPD. It's a tough road. You will never have a "normal" relationship in some ways. Your wife doesn't understand how those work. She is always in a constant state of anxiety and fear. It's like permanent PTSD. You will have to learn not to let her dump her emotional "slime" on to you and make it your fault that she feels that way. And learn how to not take the explosive anger episodes personally. (Easier said than done)
There won't be any quick cure. It takes many years of therapy for the symptoms to become less severe. There is no pill to fix a personality disorder. The only thing you can do in the meantime is work on yourself and how you interact with her. It also gets easier with time when you understand why borderlines behave the way do.
And do set limits on "alone time" with other men. Certain types of men can practically smell women with low personal boundaries and they will take advantage whenever they can. Primarily men with traits of NPD and ASPD.
I speak from first-hand experience. My wife has BPD as well.
Thanks Fungus, that's precisely the kind of advice I need right now. I'm only in the initial stages of researching the condition, but the PTSD type symptoms have been apparent for some time (high stress situations often cause psychosis in her, although this is generally pretty harmless, to myself at least) and I totally get the anxiety and fear she feels.
I also understand from my limited research that, as you say, I must work on myself and how I interact with her. My understanding thus far is that firm boundaries are required as someone with BPD often does not have their own, or weak ones at best. I see this in my wife.
And yep, alone time is gonna be a sticker, and she's already agreed to cut this 'friend' out of her life.
Would you mind sharing with me any resources and/or coping strategies that you have found to be of the most help with your wife? How long have you guys been together if you don't mind me asking? Have your wife's symptoms remained fairly stable or do they wax and wane?
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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FungusOfTheBungus


Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 121
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: Jokeshopbeard] 1
#22074434 - 08/10/15 11:44 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Jokeshopbeard said:
Quote:
Srirachi said: A lot of these people have never really been in love. They act like it's a commodity exchange.
I have wondered about this based on some of the responses! Thanks for your input throughout Srirachi, it's been really positive and has helped a lot.
Quote:
FungusOfTheBungus said: Good luck with your decision to work with your wife and BPD. It's a tough road. You will never have a "normal" relationship in some ways. Your wife doesn't understand how those work. She is always in a constant state of anxiety and fear. It's like permanent PTSD. You will have to learn not to let her dump her emotional "slime" on to you and make it your fault that she feels that way. And learn how to not take the explosive anger episodes personally. (Easier said than done)
There won't be any quick cure. It takes many years of therapy for the symptoms to become less severe. There is no pill to fix a personality disorder. The only thing you can do in the meantime is work on yourself and how you interact with her. It also gets easier with time when you understand why borderlines behave the way do.
And do set limits on "alone time" with other men. Certain types of men can practically smell women with low personal boundaries and they will take advantage whenever they can. Primarily men with traits of NPD and ASPD.
I speak from first-hand experience. My wife has BPD as well.
Thanks Fungus, that's precisely the kind of advice I need right now. I'm only in the initial stages of researching the condition, but the PTSD type symptoms have been apparent for some time (high stress situations often cause psychosis in her, although this is generally pretty harmless, to myself at least) and I totally get the anxiety and fear she feels.
I also understand from my limited research that, as you say, I must work on myself and how I interact with her. My understanding thus far is that firm boundaries are required as someone with BPD often does not have their own, or weak ones at best. I see this in my wife.
And yep, alone time is gonna be a sticker, and she's already agreed to cut this 'friend' out of her life.
Would you mind sharing with me any resources and/or coping strategies that you have found to be of the most help with your wife? How long have you guys been together if you don't mind me asking? Have your wife's symptoms remained fairly stable or do they wax and wane?
We've been together for more than 6 years. Married for almost 3 years. Her symptoms tend to get worse when she starts her period, encounters a challenging situation or her plans do not come together as originally intended. And they became much worse and more prominent after our son was born 4 years ago. Having a child is a major source of never-ending stress for my wife. We both decided to not have another child.
Read that site I linked to you. http://gettinbetter.com/articles.html Read all of the BPD articles. Then read them again. Read them until you firmly grasp what is going on in your relationship. You have to come to terms with it and decide if you want to stay with her or not. Do not share this site with your wife. It was not made for her. It was made for you.
It sounds like your therapist is working with you on exactly the things you need to work on. Stick with this person if you like him/her.
You have white-knight syndrome. I'm not trying to be too judgmental but I can pick it up from reading your posts. Learn to suppress this tendency. It's not your job to rescue other people.
You will get mad at your wife. Much more often than husbands do in "normal" relationships. Do not stifle this but also do not take it out on your wife. Assert you boundaries and try to remain calm. Try not to point out her BPD symptoms. I do that with my wife sometimes and it doesn't help. What I do is once we are apart from each other after an argument I basically cuss her out under my breath. I don't hold back either. I let it all out. It does no good to hold it in. You are entitled to your feelings. Once everything is calmed down I will approach her and make a peace offering of some kind. Kind of the same way I would with a young child.
These are just some of the things that have helped me deal with this craziness. Every relationship is different. You will have to figure out what works best for you.
[Edited for grammar.]
Edited by FungusOfTheBungus (08/10/15 11:50 PM)
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Oeric McKenna
LIFE CAPS


Registered: 06/15/12
Posts: 5,318
Loc: Babylon
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: Jokeshopbeard] 1
#22074440 - 08/10/15 11:47 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Despite what everyone said, always choose forgiveness either way. If you choose to stay with her, forgive. If you choose not to, forgive.
I'd stay.
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paperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
#22075269 - 08/11/15 08:15 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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I still suggest marriage counseling if you plan to stay together. It sounds like you, understandably, have a lot of hurt yourself to sort out and it would be a nice way for the two of you to come together on the things you're both struggling with.
-------------------- Why should we strive with cynic frown To knock their fairy castles down? ~ Eliza Cook It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley
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Patlal
You ask too many questions



Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,797
Loc: Ottawa
Last seen: 6 hours, 8 minutes
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: MajickMuffin]
#22076216 - 08/11/15 12:47 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
MajickMuffin said: 'Accidental' Affair.....is this a fucking joke?
Well, accident's do happen. Maybe she tripped and fell on a guy's dick? Who knows? Weirder things have happened.
To the OP: I would leave her. Then again, if she commits suicide because of it, you're gonna have to convince yourself that it was because she did it and not because of you.
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hex_enduction
satta massa gana



Registered: 01/26/14
Posts: 12,051
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: Patlal]
#22077695 - 08/11/15 06:15 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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This post really resonated with me because it reminded me so much of my parents relationship. My mom definitely had BPD and I feel like that fucked with their relationship severely and in a similar manner to OP and his wife's. My dad eventually left her, but she seemed to be starting to recover a decent amount in the past year or so before her death (not suicide or anything like that). So I can't say for sure that she could have changed and been able to have a normal relationship with anyone, but she was definitely an amazing person who was just severely hindered by her mental health issues.
Anyway, life story aside, I would have probably left your wife in that situation, providing her with an opportunity to recover and rediscover life on her own. I just couldn't stand being cheated on, god damn. I guess I commend what you're doing though, it definitely takes a lot of fortitude to deal with that kind of person.
Hope none of this comes off as offensive to any mental illness sufferers. They all have my sincerest empathy.
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Connoisseur said: oh ive cried on drugs sunshine said: Tragic. I told the cop not to do it but he didn't listen.
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: hex_enduction]
#22079316 - 08/11/15 11:31 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
FungusOfTheBungus said: We've been together for more than 6 years. Married for almost 3 years. Her symptoms tend to get worse when she starts her period, encounters a challenging situation or her plans do not come together as originally intended. And they became much worse and more prominent after our son was born 4 years ago. Having a child is a major source of never-ending stress for my wife. We both decided to not have another child.
Read that site I linked to you. http://gettinbetter.com/articles.html Read all of the BPD articles. Then read them again. Read them until you firmly grasp what is going on in your relationship. You have to come to terms with it and decide if you want to stay with her or not. Do not share this site with your wife. It was not made for her. It was made for you.
It sounds like your therapist is working with you on exactly the things you need to work on. Stick with this person if you like him/her.
You have white-knight syndrome. I'm not trying to be too judgmental but I can pick it up from reading your posts. Learn to suppress this tendency. It's not your job to rescue other people.
You will get mad at your wife. Much more often than husbands do in "normal" relationships. Do not stifle this but also do not take it out on your wife. Assert you boundaries and try to remain calm. Try not to point out her BPD symptoms. I do that with my wife sometimes and it doesn't help. What I do is once we are apart from each other after an argument I basically cuss her out under my breath. I don't hold back either. I let it all out. It does no good to hold it in. You are entitled to your feelings. Once everything is calmed down I will approach her and make a peace offering of some kind. Kind of the same way I would with a young child.
These are just some of the things that have helped me deal with this craziness. Every relationship is different. You will have to figure out what works best for you.
Thank you so much for this man, I can't tell you how much I appreciate it. I really started to delve into the articles contained within the link yesterday, however I had a meeting with my therapist soon after, who advised that I take a break from them for a while to do a little healing - she could see that I was heading into 'information overload' territory. It's definitely a bit overwhelming at the moment to consider just how much I may have to sacrifice and change in order to continue my relationship with my wife. I sure as fuck hope she stands by her commitment to do her own healing. Either way, once I get over the initial shock of all this, I've little doubt it will help me to become a better person. I hope you take some credit for the fact that you've been instrumental in that.
Your personal experiences and advice are priceless to me man, and I shall make a determined effort to incorporate these into my life.
EDIT - The white night thing? Yeah, that's definitely been a big thing that's come in therapy (which is amazing by the way - only 4 sessions in) - I'm glad you pointed it out. My track record in relationships aint good - of the three long term ones, one committed suicide, one is committed, and my wife is the third. I have some very hard questions to answer about where I go from here, and I don't expect the answers to be easy to deal with!
Quote:
paperbackwriter said: I still suggest marriage counseling if you plan to stay together. It sounds like you, understandably, have a lot of hurt yourself to sort out and it would be a nice way for the two of you to come together on the things you're both struggling with.
Yep, already got that one lined up - in fact, we had this lined up way before her transgressions!
Quote:
hex_enduction said: This post really resonated with me because it reminded me so much of my parents relationship. My mom definitely had BPD and I feel like that fucked with their relationship severely and in a similar manner to OP and his wife's. My dad eventually left her, but she seemed to be starting to recover a decent amount in the past year or so before her death (not suicide or anything like that). So I can't say for sure that she could have changed and been able to have a normal relationship with anyone, but she was definitely an amazing person who was just severely hindered by her mental health issues.
Anyway, life story aside, I would have probably left your wife in that situation, providing her with an opportunity to recover and rediscover life on her own. I just couldn't stand being cheated on, god damn. I guess I commend what you're doing though, it definitely takes a lot of fortitude to deal with that kind of person.
Hope none of this comes off as offensive to any mental illness sufferers. They all have my sincerest empathy.
Thanks for your input man. I reckon I've got a hard road ahead of me. But which one of us hasn't right? And I'm pretty sure challenge and adversity, taken well and with an open mind, can only improve oneself.
Edited by Jokeshopbeard (08/12/15 12:10 AM)
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: Jokeshopbeard] 1
#22090243 - 08/14/15 07:40 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Why do you consistently have relationships with lunatics? Because you choose them. You should examine your motivation in re getting into long term relationships with nutcases. There are actually nice, fun and sane women in the world. Some of them are even kinky if that's your thing. But they are functional and happy with themselves. As far as I can tell from your report you are 0 for 3. What is it in you that causes you to exclusively get together with extremely damaged women?
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: My wife just had an 'accidental' affair.. any advice appreciated [Re: zappaisgod]
#22090782 - 08/14/15 11:24 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
zappaisgod said: Why do you consistently have relationships with lunatics? Because you choose them. You should examine your motivation in re getting into long term relationships with nutcases. There are actually nice, fun and sane women in the world. Some of them are even kinky if that's your thing. But they are functional and happy with themselves. As far as I can tell from your report you are 0 for 3. What is it in you that causes you to exclusively get together with extremely damaged women?
Precisely - because I choose them. Quite why I choose these particular character types, over all the other women I've dated, I don't yet fully understand. It's something I need to analyse, explore and resolve within myself, and I've already raised it with my therapist and fully intend to get to the bottom of it. It's almost certainly linked to the way I was raised by my parents; AFAIK it's considered common knowledge in this day and age that your relationship choices are heavily influenced by your parental script.
I'm not sure why you see it necessary to point out that some women are 'even kinky if that's your thing' - my sex life in each of my long term relationships has been nothing short of amazing; quite unlike the sex I have experienced in any of my shorter term relationships. Perhaps that also influences why I chose these partners - I have a very high sex drive and wouldn't stay long term with someone who couldn't match my sexual desires. As with anything, there's likely to be a culmination of factors at work.
Perhaps you could now answer a question for me. Why is it that you parade around these boards, passing judgement (you're nuts) on others, whilst boasting (I'm one of the funniest posters on the site. I also have a well earned reputation for calling out bullshit) about your own over-inflated ego? What is it about you that makes you want to hide behind this persona of being a 'horrid asshole'? Does it not occur to you that people tend to visit this place because they want help, and that actually, the environment you provide through your words is not conducive at all to providing the kind of safe, non-judgemental setting that could best achieve that?
Does it make you happy to be a 'horrid asshole'? IME, the only people in life that act this way are deeply unhappy within themselves. I think it's pretty clear to anyone that happy people are inspired to help and be kind and compassionate to others, whilst unhappy people on the other hand, tend to act in much the way you do. Maybe I'm completely wrong and you're a wonderful, happy person in real life. Wanna call me out on it?
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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