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DividedQuantum
Outer Head


Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,819
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: DividedQuantum]
#22017564 - 07/29/15 10:06 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Let me put it this way:
glimpee, I don't think you know what psychosis is. It is not merely the dissolution of the boundary between oneself and reality. In fact, it's not that at all. It's pretty complex, but to boil it down, the connections your mind makes become utterly spurious. Which is to say, you start perceiving shit that isn't really there (on any meaningful level). Not good. This eventually consumes every waking moment of your day, and you probably won't sleep. A lot of other things happen, like manias, that I won't bore you with. Pretty soon, you're in a totally bonkers fantasy world that not even God could unravel, and then eventually you come out of it and it takes years to fully recover.
Think while you still can.
-------------------- Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici
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Kickle
Wanderer


Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 17,856
Last seen: 1 minute, 17 seconds
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: DividedQuantum]
#22017586 - 07/29/15 10:14 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Sounds like a sped up human life
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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DividedQuantum
Outer Head


Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,819
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: Kickle]
#22017595 - 07/29/15 10:16 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Sped up, sure thing, with a little depravity, outright error and blatant falsehood mixed in.
-------------------- Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder



Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: glimpee]
#22017823 - 07/29/15 11:16 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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...no one ever said insanity has to be bad or debilitating.
This statement is not crazy, it's just ignorant. Mental illness is SO painful and SO debilitating, that it all too often results in suicide. I don't know how many people I've known with diagnosable mental disorders who have killed themselves.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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glimpee
Awakening



Registered: 12/08/14
Posts: 734
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: DividedQuantum]
#22018003 - 07/30/15 12:31 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
DividedQuantum said: Let me put it this way:
glimpee, I don't think you know what psychosis is. It is not merely the dissolution of the boundary between oneself and reality. In fact, it's not that at all. It's pretty complex, but to boil it down, the connections your mind makes become utterly spurious. Which is to say, you start perceiving shit that isn't really there (on any meaningful level). Not good. This eventually consumes every waking moment of your day, and you probably won't sleep. A lot of other things happen, like manias, that I won't bore you with. Pretty soon, you're in a totally bonkers fantasy world that not even God could unravel, and then eventually you come out of it and it takes years to fully recover.
Think while you still can.
Psychosis was probably the wrong word if I let it slip. What i'm aiming for isn't known as an illness, because it's controlled. It's probably not even documented.
-------------------- Just because I am arrogant does not mean I forget my place. It is how I choose to talk. I am not a monk. I am my own path, and I am without influence. Talk to me about my core being before you question my mental stability or life-choices. Chances are, they're only shocking to you because they don't fit your idea of what is.
Check out my Art Journal for some stuff I do http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21647069
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glimpee
Awakening



Registered: 12/08/14
Posts: 734
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Quote:
MarkostheGnostic said: ...no one ever said insanity has to be bad or debilitating.
This statement is not crazy, it's just ignorant. Mental illness is SO painful and SO debilitating, that it all too often results in suicide. I don't know how many people I've known with diagnosable mental disorders who have killed themselves. 
I think youre being ignorant.
Mental illness CAN be painful and debilitating. It usually is.
That doesn't mean no one who is "insane" isn't happy. That doesn't mean some "insane" people actually think their illness is a blessing. I've talked to some of these people.
It doesn't mean I can't harness a form of insanity to propel creative and spiritual thought processes and experiences.
-------------------- Just because I am arrogant does not mean I forget my place. It is how I choose to talk. I am not a monk. I am my own path, and I am without influence. Talk to me about my core being before you question my mental stability or life-choices. Chances are, they're only shocking to you because they don't fit your idea of what is.
Check out my Art Journal for some stuff I do http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21647069
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PocketLady



Registered: 01/18/10
Posts: 1,773
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: glimpee]
#22018591 - 07/30/15 07:10 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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I think I understand what you are looking for glimpee, so here is my 2 cents.
1. In order to master the mind, one has to realise that all thoughts and phenomena are illusory and products of the mind itself.
2. The way to truly understand this is to disengage from sensory and mental experiences to such an extent that you are able to perceive beyond the mind. This is meditation.
Whether you want to visit the astral planes (or others) or whether you want an ego-death type experience (Samadhi) where you experience oneness, you have to be able to get yourself into an extremely relaxed trance state where you are able to put aside the mind completely. This can only be done safely through meditation (and maybe access to the astral by lucid dreaming too).
I know you are trying to forge your own path, and I respect that and understand the reasons why. But what you have got to understand is that spiritual traditions hold a lot of techniques for being able to conquer the mind and reach the states you desire. The idea of the spiritual path is not to take what each spiritual tradition says as gospel, but to use the techniques as a spring board to having your own direct experiences, to discover your own spirituality. But the techniques are vital, otherwise you will never get anywhere. It's like saying "I'm going to invent my own car, and it's going to be nothing like any other car on the road." In order to invent a car, you need to study what building a car actually involves and understanding the process, the materials and equipment you will need. Only once you have a thorough understanding of the process can you go off and invent your own. If you tried to just invent one with no knowledge behind you, it would be impossible and you would end up in a right mess.
-------------------- Love is from the infinite, and will remain until eternity. The seeker of love escapes the chains of birth and death. Tomorrow, when resurrection comes, The heart that is not in love will fail the test. ~ Rumi The day we start giving Love instead of seeking Love, we will have re-written our whole destiny. ~ Swami Chinmayanada Saraswatir
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Kickle
Wanderer


Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 17,856
Last seen: 1 minute, 17 seconds
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: DividedQuantum]
#22019239 - 07/30/15 10:33 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
DividedQuantum said: Sped up, sure thing, with a little depravity, outright error and blatant falsehood mixed in.
Maybe all of those things are simply more apparent or even just less socially acceptable forms which makes them stand out
Far as I can tell humans over the course of a life are chalk full of all those regardless of whether we label them with a particular form of psychosis or not.
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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DividedQuantum
Outer Head


Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,819
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: Kickle]
#22019298 - 07/30/15 10:51 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Perhaps, but in reality it's very different than the waking consciousness of the majority. It's a decidedly uncommon state of the mind.
-------------------- Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici
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once in a lifetime
sun child



Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 1,807
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here's a thought: think about brain chemistry.
serotonin helps boost immune system - obv.
yet too much would not be ideal.
so -
once again,
balance and symmetretry.
btw thank you for your posts. peace.
o as sri ramakrishna said - peace, peace, supreme peace
dogen said - you'll always be fine.
-------------------- Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland Julia Delaney, Bothy Band Rasta Girl, Sister Carol Genesis, Jorma K I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing Do Your Thing, Moondog large . . music garden . . veryall peace them hiStarhouse - main Time Traveler's Guide
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder



Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: glimpee]
#22019480 - 07/30/15 11:59 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Insanity is a legal term, not a clinical term. It refers to the inability to stand trial because one's sanity is compromised. You cannot "harness a form of insanity," since you can't "harness" a legal status. Moreover, one cannot "harness" mental illness or any other disease. Illness refers to a variety of conditions that are not amenable to control or one would simply get rid of it. An artist like Hieronymus Bosch (possibly schizophrenic), El Greco (acute visual astigmatism), or Vincent van Gogh (probable Bipolar Disorder), revealed aspects of their physical or psychological maladies in their work, but these men didn't "harness" anything, they were the victims of their illnesses, and van Gogh committed suicide as a result of his last loss of lucidity. Happiness is a condition that is contingent upon inner and outer circumstances. One can be ill and still experience an abiding Joy perhaps, but tend to differentiate joy from happiness, the former being a deeply abiding condition that continues to endure even in the midst of pain and tragedy. Happiness is all too easily replaced by horror when one is seriously ill, psychologically or physically.
Edited by MarkostheGnostic (07/30/15 02:00 PM)
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once in a lifetime
sun child



Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 1,807
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: Kickle]
#22019520 - 07/30/15 12:08 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Shantideva
'In the spiritual energy that relieves The anguish of beings in misery and Places depressed beings in eternal joy I lift up my heart and rejoice. In the ocean-like virtue of the Bodhimind That brings joy to all beings And in accomplishing the well-being of others, I lift up my heart and rejoice. To the Buddhas of the ten directions I join my hands in respect Let blaze the light of Dharmas truth For the beings lost in darkness To the Buddhas considering parinirvarna I join my hands in prayer Do not abandon the beings in sorrow But remain and teach for countless ages. May any spiritual energy thus generated By my devotion to the enlightened ones Be dedicated to dispelling the misery Of living beings without exception.
As long as diseases afflict living beings May I be the doctor, the medicine And also the nurse Who restores them to health. As long as diseases afflict living beings May I be the doctor, the medicine And also the nurse Who restores them to health. May I fall as rain to increase The harvests that must feed living beings And in ages of dire famine May I myself serve as food and drink. My body, every possession And all goodness, past, present and future Without remorse I dedicate To the well-being of the world. Suffering is transcended by total surrender And the mind attains to nirvana. As one day all must be given up, Why not dedicate it now to universal happiness? May no one who encounters me Ever have an insignificant contact. Regardless whether those whom I meet Respond towards me with anger or faith, May the mere fact of our meeting Contribute to the fulfilment of their wishes. May the slander, harm And all forms of abuse That anyone should direct towards me Act as a cause of their enlightenment. May I act as the mighty earth Or like the free and open skies To support and provide the space Whereby I and all others may grow. Until every being afflicted by pain Has reached nirvanas shores, May I serve only as a condition That encourages progress and joy. They who out of wisdom Have seized the supreme Bodhimind Praise, glorify and rejoice in it, That it may grow to fulfilment. File:Ideal cut dm.jpg 'Like a blind man fumbling in garbage Happens to find a rare and precious gem, Likewise I have discovered The jewel of the precious Bodhimind. Like a blind man fumbling in garbage Happens to find a rare and precious gem, Likewise I have discovered The jewel of the precious Bodhimind. Thus was found this supreme ambrosia to dispel The Lord of death, destroyer of life; An inexhaustible treasure able to cure The poverty of all sentient beings.
The Bodhimind is a great radiant sun To disperse the darkness of unknowing... The Bodhimind is a great radiant sun To disperse the darkness of unknowing, And it is the very essence of butters Gained from churning the milks of Dharma. For all guests on the roads of life Who would take the very substance of joy, Here is the actual seat of true happiness, A veritable feast to satiate the world. Thus today in the presence of all awakened Ones I invite every living being to this festival Giving both immediate and lasting joy. May the gods and all others rejoice. Perfection of Forbearance
His the knife, and mine the body the twofold cause of suffering. He has grasped the knife, I my body. At which is there anger? Those who injure me are really impelled by my actions. For this they will go to the realms of hell. Surely it is they who are harmed by me?'
-------------------- Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland Julia Delaney, Bothy Band Rasta Girl, Sister Carol Genesis, Jorma K I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing Do Your Thing, Moondog large . . music garden . . veryall peace them hiStarhouse - main Time Traveler's Guide
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: PocketLady]
#22019580 - 07/30/15 12:20 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
PocketLady said:It's like saying "I'm going to invent my own car, and it's going to be nothing like any other car on the road." In order to invent a car, you need to study what building a car actually involves and understanding the process, the materials and equipment you will need. Only once you have a thorough understanding of the process can you go off and invent your own. If you tried to just invent one with no knowledge behind you, it would be impossible and you would end up in a right mess.
Great analogy PocketLady, I think this captures the essence of what is going on here quite succinctly.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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once in a lifetime
sun child



Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 1,807
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
#22019620 - 07/30/15 12:32 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Yes, +1 dear friend.
Wished also to say, well done'
as well to Kickle.
"It's up to you, what you really wanna do, spend some time in Jaimaca." -Sublime
*well done said to PocketLady, and Kickle, that is.
-------------------- Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland Julia Delaney, Bothy Band Rasta Girl, Sister Carol Genesis, Jorma K I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing Do Your Thing, Moondog large . . music garden . . veryall peace them hiStarhouse - main Time Traveler's Guide
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Khancious
da Crow



Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 628
Loc: Behind Everything
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It is simple really,
There is an experience, and a feeling of will... Do what thou will.
(This post does not advocate anything)
-------------------- I am that, which is.
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glimpee
Awakening



Registered: 12/08/14
Posts: 734
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Quote:
MarkostheGnostic said: Insanity is a legal term, not a clinical term. It refers to the inability to stand trial because one's sanity is compromised. You cannot "harness a form of insanity," since you can't "harness" a legal status. Moreover, one cannot "harness" mental illness or any other disease. Illness refers to a variety of conditions that are not amenable to control or one would simply get rid of it. An artist like Hieronymus Bosch (possibly schizophrenic), El Greco (acute visual astigmatism), or Vincent van Gogh (probable Bipolar Disorder), revealed aspects of their physical or psychological maladies in their work, but these men didn't "harness" anything, they were the victims of their illnesses, and van Gogh committed suicide as a result of his last loss of lucidity. Happiness is a condition that is contingent upon inner and outer circumstances. One can be ill and still experience an abiding Joy perhaps, but tend to differentiate joy from happiness, the former being a deeply abiding condition that continues to endure even in the midst of pain and tragedy. Happiness is all too easily replaced by horror when one is seriously ill, psychologically or physically.
Mental illness and insanity as words do not do my goal justice. As I said - I am aiming for something that is undocumented. What would you call it?
-------------------- Just because I am arrogant does not mean I forget my place. It is how I choose to talk. I am not a monk. I am my own path, and I am without influence. Talk to me about my core being before you question my mental stability or life-choices. Chances are, they're only shocking to you because they don't fit your idea of what is.
Check out my Art Journal for some stuff I do http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21647069
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glimpee
Awakening



Registered: 12/08/14
Posts: 734
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: PocketLady]
#22020176 - 07/30/15 02:46 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
PocketLady said: I think I understand what you are looking for glimpee, so here is my 2 cents.
1. In order to master the mind, one has to realise that all thoughts and phenomena are illusory and products of the mind itself.
2. The way to truly understand this is to disengage from sensory and mental experiences to such an extent that you are able to perceive beyond the mind. This is meditation.
Whether you want to visit the astral planes (or others) or whether you want an ego-death type experience (Samadhi) where you experience oneness, you have to be able to get yourself into an extremely relaxed trance state where you are able to put aside the mind completely. This can only be done safely through meditation (and maybe access to the astral by lucid dreaming too).
I know you are trying to forge your own path, and I respect that and understand the reasons why. But what you have got to understand is that spiritual traditions hold a lot of techniques for being able to conquer the mind and reach the states you desire. The idea of the spiritual path is not to take what each spiritual tradition says as gospel, but to use the techniques as a spring board to having your own direct experiences, to discover your own spirituality. But the techniques are vital, otherwise you will never get anywhere. It's like saying "I'm going to invent my own car, and it's going to be nothing like any other car on the road." In order to invent a car, you need to study what building a car actually involves and understanding the process, the materials and equipment you will need. Only once you have a thorough understanding of the process can you go off and invent your own. If you tried to just invent one with no knowledge behind you, it would be impossible and you would end up in a right mess.
I agree with you in really big ways, and I understand those two points.
I've studied general spirituality in mutliple religions, although my problem is that most (not all) religions pass down information in metaphors, and it is often near impossible to find the intended meaning. Even harder if you ask other peoples opinions. That's why I don't want to follow a religion - they don't truely give an answer.
I wanna pose a question - who first found spirituality? Was it one man or did it take generations of people?
Does one need to extensively know the entire process of different religions to find a path on his own? Can one not feel and envison the path, their changes, and the desired results? Not to sound arrogant, but I understand how a lot of the mind operates. I know how humans learn, change, adapt. If I can adapt my mind to be constantly open, in a constant state of creative meditation - am I getting closer to my goal?
Or must I study to achieve this?
I've looked into some of the techniques. I'm also looking into finding spiritual people to talk to and help guide me in the right direction. I still was to be as free of influence as possible - because being free of influence is (my) first step to enlightenment. Or at least my first MASSIVE goal.
After freeing of influence, I have to balance my being. Become holistic. From there, train each emotion, feeling, and though to correspond with how I want to treat the world
1. Expect nothing 2. Be content with everything 3. Keep an open mind 4. Never be an obstacle unless life calls for it
Thanks for your insight. I will ponder this further
( I also think I might just be a little lazy and want to not study.... but my logic also backs this up. I need to ponder this too )
-------------------- Just because I am arrogant does not mean I forget my place. It is how I choose to talk. I am not a monk. I am my own path, and I am without influence. Talk to me about my core being before you question my mental stability or life-choices. Chances are, they're only shocking to you because they don't fit your idea of what is.
Check out my Art Journal for some stuff I do http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21647069
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PocketLady



Registered: 01/18/10
Posts: 1,773
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: glimpee]
#22020413 - 07/30/15 03:34 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Not to sound arrogant, but I understand how a lot of the mind operates. I know how humans learn, change, adapt. If I can adapt my mind to be constantly open, in a constant state of creative meditation - am I getting closer to my goal?
Or must I study to achieve this?
Here's something to think about. What if the key to being able to experience different mystical states and planes lies not in being able to trick the mind into hallucinating, but in being able to consciously control the frequency of one's brainwaves?
-------------------- Love is from the infinite, and will remain until eternity. The seeker of love escapes the chains of birth and death. Tomorrow, when resurrection comes, The heart that is not in love will fail the test. ~ Rumi The day we start giving Love instead of seeking Love, we will have re-written our whole destiny. ~ Swami Chinmayanada Saraswatir
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder



Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
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Re: Am i the only one TRYING to go crazy? [Re: glimpee]
#22020470 - 07/30/15 03:44 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
glimpee said:
Quote:
MarkostheGnostic said: Insanity is a legal term, not a clinical term. It refers to the inability to stand trial because one's sanity is compromised. You cannot "harness a form of insanity," since you can't "harness" a legal status. Moreover, one cannot "harness" mental illness or any other disease. Illness refers to a variety of conditions that are not amenable to control or one would simply get rid of it. An artist like Hieronymus Bosch (possibly schizophrenic), El Greco (acute visual astigmatism), or Vincent van Gogh (probable Bipolar Disorder), revealed aspects of their physical or psychological maladies in their work, but these men didn't "harness" anything, they were the victims of their illnesses, and van Gogh committed suicide as a result of his last loss of lucidity. Happiness is a condition that is contingent upon inner and outer circumstances. One can be ill and still experience an abiding Joy perhaps, but tend to differentiate joy from happiness, the former being a deeply abiding condition that continues to endure even in the midst of pain and tragedy. Happiness is all too easily replaced by horror when one is seriously ill, psychologically or physically.
Mental illness and insanity as words do not do my goal justice. As I said - I am aiming for something that is undocumented. What would you call it?
I have no idea what your goal is, but "undocumented" appears to me that you are aiming for something that would be unique to YOU. Unless you become the first human emissary for intelligent extraterrestrial life like Richard Dreyfus was on Close Encounters of the Third Kind, I really can't imagine an interior goal that hasn't been aspired to by countless human seekers throughout history. But whatever it is, I rest assured that the greater good for you is not about developing a diseased mind.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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muckamuck
Stranger
Registered: 07/20/15
Posts: 187
Last seen: 7 years, 11 months
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Hey glimpee, I feel like you might be taking reality and your health for granted, both of which are fragile things to be appreciated. Do what you want of course, losing either could be the best way to learn, just be careful. Try not to alienate people because if you succeed in going "crazy" and suddenly regret everything then friends may be your only help in returning, so don't start neglecting them in favour of fantasy. Just my two cents
--------------------
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