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Offlineendogenous
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Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs?
    #21998262 - 07/26/15 02:08 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Barnyard pigs are clever creatures. They're known to work in pairs to maneuver the latches and gates of their pens. Once they figure out how to open the gates, they'll do so repeatedly, says Ken Kephart, a Penn State professor of animal science who has spent more than 20years working with pigs

The smartest swine even open up the rest of the pens to let the others out, he says. On the occasional early morning, a farmer will arrive at his barn to find many of the pigs loose. "They're very clever, without a doubt," says Kephart. "They can be trained to do many of the same tasks we ask other animals to do."

Some of these useful tasks are instinctual for pigs. For instance, they've long been used to lead people deep into the forests of France to sniff out buried treasure. Truffles, fungi growing beneath the roots of oak trees, can fetch hundreds of dollars, sometimes more than $1,000 per pound on the gourmet food market....

Other behaviors showcase pigs' ability to learn new behaviors. Using their snouts, pigs can even be taught to maneuver a modified joystick to move a cursor on a video monitor, as proven in research done at Penn State from 1996 to 1998 by Stanley Curtis, then professor of dairy and animal science and now an adjunct animal sciences professor at the University of Illinois.

For rewards of M&M's, Skittles or Reese's Pieces, the pigs moved the cursor over to a target, then used the cursor to distinguish among scribbles drawn by Curtis' grandchild. The pigs were shown one scribble, then a few seconds later shown the same scribble along with a second. They used the joystick and cursor to distinguish between the scribble they had seen before and the one they were seeing for the first time.
The pigs learned these tasks within 5 to 10 attempts, "very quickly," says Curtis. "As quickly as chimpanzees." ....

Curtis hopes to teach a crude language to pigs by teaching them words for images and building a vocabulary. The objective is simple: build a better hog house. "If we're going to build a better piggery so that animals' needs and wants are being supported, then we need to know more about what they need and want," he says. Designing hog houses this way would be both humane and practical, he argues.

http://www.specialtypettraining.com/graphics/articlepig.html


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OfflineThatKidWithTheFace
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: endogenous]
    #21998269 - 07/26/15 02:12 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Pigs are much smarter than dogs. My mother had 4 pigs living in her house, and while I hated those bastards because of how good my mother treated them (and they were dicks) they were extremely intelligent


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[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]


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OnlineCHeifM4sterDiezL
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace]
    #21998274 - 07/26/15 02:14 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

why did ur mom have pigs in her house?:what:


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Offlineteamkiller
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace] * 2
    #21998275 - 07/26/15 02:16 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)



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Offlinelowbrow
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: endogenous]
    #21998282 - 07/26/15 02:21 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

As far as I know, pigs are smarter than dogs.


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Offlineendogenous
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace]
    #21998311 - 07/26/15 02:44 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Pigs are much smarter than dogs. My mother had 4 pigs living in her house, and while I hated those bastards because of how good my mother treated them (and they were dicks) they were extremely intelligent



What did they do?


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Invisibledeucedbi9
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: endogenous]
    #21998363 - 07/26/15 03:31 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

And yet, we turn pigs into bacon while pampering pooches.

S'fucked up man. I aint gotta walk everywhere with my nose pointed at the ground so as to avoid stepping in pig shit. So, if pigs be so clever how come we don't got dog bacon?

I would happily buy dog bacon from my local butcher. I would be even happier if that dog was hanging up in his widow because it had been found guilty of shitting in the street, if the owner was strung up beside it I'd buy a strip of that cunt too.

Note:
no fuckin smiley's means I means it ya waggy tailed shit machine walking shitheads!


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: deucedbi9]
    #21998373 - 07/26/15 03:42 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Maybe logically but not emotionally. reason why we eat pigs and use dogs to our advantage. My dog is so fucking smart he can read every emotion and open doors. We have to lock them.


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: Gorlax]
    #21998406 - 07/26/15 04:29 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

K9 units have a higher success rate :cookiemonster:


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: Asante]
    #21998431 - 07/26/15 04:57 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

:cookiemonster:


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OfflineKremrBigSikter
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: Gorlax]
    #21998436 - 07/26/15 04:59 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Gorlax said:
Maybe logically but not emotionally. reason why we eat pigs and use dogs to our advantage. My dog is so fucking smart he can read every emotion and open doors. We have to lock them.



Dogs have been bred for a thousand generations to be companions to humans, of course they're going to be more in tune with human emotions. That doesn't say anything about whether dogs have more "emotional intelligence" than pigs.


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Offlineendogenous
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: KremrBigSikter]
    #22002640 - 07/27/15 01:54 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I'm not in favor of eating any fellow creature, but pigs seem to be the closest to humans, after monkeys, in intelligence. Eating a pig is getting close to cannibalism.

Is there anyone here who would eat a monkey? Why not?

And why do people think it's ok to eat cows, pigs, chickens,ducks, etc., but get horrified if someone eats a dog or cat?


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The Day of the Lord has come like a thief in the night. -- It is there but no one knows it.


Edited by endogenous (07/27/15 01:56 AM)


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OfflineShroomslip
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: endogenous]
    #22002683 - 07/27/15 02:14 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

This is just my take and observation, so don't take it like I'm stating it as imperial fact or anything..

Quote:


Barnyard pigs are clever creatures. They're known to work in pairs to maneuver the latches and gates of their pens. Once they figure out how to open the gates, they'll do so repeatedly, says Ken Kephart, a Penn State professor of animal science who has spent more than 20years working with pigs



I had a dog once who could climb a chain link fence. Not jump it, but literally climb it like a person would. I also currently own a dog capable of opening her own kennel with a latch on the outside that honestly shocks me. It's not repeated fumbling, she knows EXACTLY what to do. It is not a simple lift latch, it requires some pretty significant "combo" (lift it up, push it to the side). ALL of my dogs have been able to figure out a lift latch in a matter of days, and have had to keep them locked for this very reason. They also work together to accomplish a goal, although it's more pronounced in a wild pack type setting
Quote:

The smartest swine even open up the rest of the pens to let the others out, he says. On the occasional early morning, a farmer will arrive at his barn to find many of the pigs loose. "They're very clever, without a doubt," says Kephart. "They can be trained to do many of the same tasks we ask other animals to do."




You can find youtube videos of dogs freeing their other doggy friends from kennels using the same (relatively) complicated mechanism that my dog uses to escape her kennel
Quote:

Some of these useful tasks are instinctual for pigs. For instance, they've long been used to lead people deep into the forests of France to sniff out buried treasure. Truffles, fungi growing beneath the roots of oak trees, can fetch hundreds of dollars, sometimes more than $1,000 per pound on the gourmet food market....




Comparing dogs and pigs in tasks about smell, is unfair. Everyone knows dogs are good at tracking things by smell, but a pigs sense of smell and tracking is more advanced. This doesn't relate to intelligence, it's just simply a better refined ability they have been given over the dogs
Quote:

Other behaviors showcase pigs' ability to learn new behaviors. Using their snouts, pigs can even be taught to maneuver a modified joystick to move a cursor on a video monitor, as proven in research done at Penn State from 1996 to 1998 by Stanley Curtis, then professor of dairy and animal science and now an adjunct animal sciences professor at the University of Illinois.




Any animal can be trained to do anything with the correct system in place and a devotion to training them to do so. Next paragraph also ties into this. Until someone can prove dogs lack this capability (which would be pretty difficult) it's kind of a moot point


TL;DR, I don't believe pigs are smarter than dogs. And nothing in this article really supports that hypothesis to begin with. I think just in general we've let our own intelligence cloud our judgement on the abilities of "lesser" species to possess that kind of intelligence, or what intelligence actually is.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline


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Offlineendogenous
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #22002744 - 07/27/15 02:52 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

The article said:
Quote:

The pigs were shown one scribble, then a few seconds later shown the same scribble along with a second. They used the joystick and cursor to distinguish between the scribble they had seen before and the one they were seeing for the first time.
The pigs learned these tasks within 5 to 10 attempts, "very quickly," says Curtis. "As quickly as chimpanzees."



I don't think dogs would be able to distinguish between 2 different sets of scribbles.


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Offlinewangel
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: endogenous]
    #22002755 - 07/27/15 02:56 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

if that dog was hanging up in his widow because it had been found guilty of shitting in the street, if the owner was strung up beside it I'd buy a strip of that cunt too.


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OfflineEnjoywho
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: endogenous]
    #22002767 - 07/27/15 03:03 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

endogenous said:
I'm not in favor of eating any fellow creature, but pigs seem to be the closest to humans, after monkeys, in intelligence. Eating a pig is getting close to cannibalism.

Is there anyone here who would eat a monkey? Why not?

And why do people think it's ok to eat cows, pigs, chickens,ducks, etc., but get horrified if someone eats a dog or cat?




:rofl:

Fuck that shit I've got some bacon I've been meaning to cook might do it after work tomorrow.


--------------------
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OfflineShroomslip
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: endogenous]
    #22002795 - 07/27/15 03:30 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

You wouldn't believe you could train a pigeon to guide a bomb, but you can.

It's all in positive reinforcement. That entire paragraph is even preceded by the reward they received for a right answer.

Ever trained a dog to do a trick? Literally the same exact method. While holding treat until they make the "right decision" then they get the treat. All animals have a built in ability to recognize pattern. The more times you run the experiment (on the same animal) the quicker it will catch on what gets it the treat. Won't take long to get to the point where the animal knows EXACTLY what to do to get the reward and errors become almost non-existent while their understanding of the response time for picking the right option increases drastically.

The idea that a dog couldn't recognize pattern (speaking now of scribbles) is pretty ridiculous. Though it would depend on the patterns. But I kinda doubt we're talking scribbles of any complexity. They'd have to be almost entirely blind. People don't give animals a lot of credit or, because they don't talk like us. That doesn't mean they aren't capable of understanding symbols.

If I actually cared enough to invest time in it, I'd demonstrate on my own dog to show you that a god could recognize symbols. I honestly don't have the patience for it. Of the tricks I've tough so far, they've all been incredibly difficult circumstances taking a week or two for her to understand.

Experiment would start with someone like holding up a symbol and giving her a treat when she pawed it, then two pictures relatively similar but noticably different and waiting til she pawed one, and give a treat if it was right. Do this a few dozen times and she'd get it. If I drilled the idea in her head that pawing a certain picture resulted in a treat, eventually she would just do ti right off the bat.

Dogs are not blind, they are anything but. This would not be hard at all to do.

Also as a side fun fact, my dog understands language (and not one word commands) more than any other dog I've ever had. I take her out to go pee, I tell her "loki go to the bathroom" and she immediately squats and starts peeing. Does not work if I say bathroom, go or any other command word. Have had her for a couple of years now and it never fails (not even the only command she understands). My dog understands vocabulary as well.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline


Edited by Shroomslip (07/27/15 03:40 AM)


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InvisibleShroomopotamus
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: Shroomslip] * 1
    #22002805 - 07/27/15 03:36 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

are spaghetti's hamburgereyer than hotdogs?


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InvisibleShroomopotamus
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: Shroomopotamus] * 1
    #22002806 - 07/27/15 03:37 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

tune in next week to find out!

seascreast
out


--------------------
*
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This is a trap! A trap! You are all busted! Busted! You fools!
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Offlineendogenous
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #22002845 - 07/27/15 04:00 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Well, the people who wrote the article are dog trainers. They obviously think that pigs are able to learn advanced tasks faster than dogs and compared the speed of learning to that of chimpanzees.


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OfflineShroomslip
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: endogenous]
    #22002857 - 07/27/15 04:17 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

endogenous said:
Well, the people who wrote the article are dog trainers. They obviously think that pigs are able to learn advanced tasks faster than dogs and compared the speed of learning to that of chimpanzees.



Are they world renowned and the general go to authority? Shit I'm a mechanic, I'm self taught and have no credentials, that doesn't mean I'm some authoritative figure where everyone should just listen to what I say and accept as truth.

I dunno if they're right, but of all that's posted here, I've seen rebutted in all the dogs I've owned in my life. I'm not even a dog trainer and I've still seen all these arguments for why pigs are smarter blown out of the water.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline


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InvisibleKauaiOrca
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #22002872 - 07/27/15 04:33 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Given the way dogs are treated in our world vs the way pigs are treated, I'd say dogs are smarter.  Dogs are treated like family members and pigs are treated like pigs and are essentially food.  Dogs have figured out a way to get along with humans that is totally unique in the animal kingdom.

Having said that, the level of training that dogs are capable of is mind boggling.  Can pigs sniff out truffles and open doors?  Sure.  Watch a well trained bird dog on a hunt and ask yourself if a pig could be trained to that level?  My dog watches TV and whenever animals come on, she's all over it.


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"The universe is endless, limitless and infinite.  Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance.  We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end.  There is only memory.  Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends.  Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations.  Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death."

-- Ancient Taoist Master


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Offlineendogenous
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #22005271 - 07/27/15 04:04 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomslip said:
Quote:

endogenous said:
Well, the people who wrote the article are dog trainers. They obviously think that pigs are able to learn advanced tasks faster than dogs and compared the speed of learning to that of chimpanzees.



Are they world renowned and the general go to authority? Shit I'm a mechanic, I'm self taught and have no credentials, that doesn't mean I'm some authoritative figure where everyone should just listen to what I say and accept as truth.

I dunno if they're right, but of all that's posted here, I've seen rebutted in all the dogs I've owned in my life. I'm not even a dog trainer and I've still seen all these arguments for why pigs are smarter blown out of the water.




They are professional dog trainers.

Anne O'Neill, Owner
ABCDT Certified Dog Trainer and Behavior Consultant
Anne, the proud owner of a Jack Russell Terrier and a lovable Australian Cattle Dog, realized her love for animals at an early age. Growing up a rural part of Grapevine, Texas - Anne enjoyed all the animals in her neighborhood. She raised baby budgie parakeets, baby bunnies, puppies, kitties, frogs, snake and turtles.

Anne started studying animal behavior and training in 1999 when she adopted her first fun loving JRT "Biscuit". Then in 2002, Anne received a Certification as a Canine Obedience Instructor through the Animal Behavior and Training Associates (ABTA).

She continues to study animal behavior through professional continuing education programs and is a professional member of the Animal Behavior Associates, a member of the Association of Pet Dog Trainers, is qualified to perform CPR & First Aide on Animals, an approved American Kennel Club CGC Evaluator and supports several local rescues and shelters with behavioral evaluations, consultations and behavior assistance.

Anne is also working and studying behavior training for other animals such as potbellied pigs, cats and horses and continues to seek new opportunities to work with all kinds of animals. Her greatest joy is experiencing each Animal-Human bond and finding the best way for that family to communicate effectively, consistently and enjoy living with their pet.

Anne teaches through blended Positive Motivation, Force-Free Techniques utilizing Reward Based Methods. Most importantly she teaches each pet owner how to communicate with their dog on a level the dog will understand and consistently respond to.  Science is a big tool for Anne's approach to training and so education is a big part of your sessions with her. She has graduated thousands of dogs from very small to very large with wonderful success.


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OfflineKremrBigSikter
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: KauaiOrca]
    #22005320 - 07/27/15 04:12 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

KauaiOrca said:
Given the way dogs are treated in our world vs the way pigs are treated, I'd say dogs are smarter.  Dogs are treated like family members and pigs are treated like pigs and are essentially food.  Dogs have figured out a way to get along with humans that is totally unique in the animal kingdom.




Weed is smarter than corn. Got it.


--------------------
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OfflineEnjoywho
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Re: Are Pigs Smarter Than Dogs? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #22006394 - 07/27/15 07:13 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomslip said:
You wouldn't believe you could train a pigeon to guide a bomb, but you can.

It's all in positive reinforcement. That entire paragraph is even preceded by the reward they received for a right answer.

Ever trained a dog to do a trick? Literally the same exact method. While holding treat until they make the "right decision" then they get the treat. All animals have a built in ability to recognize pattern. The more times you run the experiment (on the same animal) the quicker it will catch on what gets it the treat. Won't take long to get to the point where the animal knows EXACTLY what to do to get the reward and errors become almost non-existent while their understanding of the response time for picking the right option increases drastically.

The idea that a dog couldn't recognize pattern (speaking now of scribbles) is pretty ridiculous. Though it would depend on the patterns. But I kinda doubt we're talking scribbles of any complexity. They'd have to be almost entirely blind. People don't give animals a lot of credit or, because they don't talk like us. That doesn't mean they aren't capable of understanding symbols.

If I actually cared enough to invest time in it, I'd demonstrate on my own dog to show you that a god could recognize symbols. I honestly don't have the patience for it. Of the tricks I've tough so far, they've all been incredibly difficult circumstances taking a week or two for her to understand.

Experiment would start with someone like holding up a symbol and giving her a treat when she pawed it, then two pictures relatively similar but noticably different and waiting til she pawed one, and give a treat if it was right. Do this a few dozen times and she'd get it. If I drilled the idea in her head that pawing a certain picture resulted in a treat, eventually she would just do ti right off the bat.

Dogs are not blind, they are anything but. This would not be hard at all to do.

Also as a side fun fact, my dog understands language (and not one word commands) more than any other dog I've ever had. I take her out to go pee, I tell her "loki go to the bathroom" and she immediately squats and starts peeing. Does not work if I say bathroom, go or any other command word. Have had her for a couple of years now and it never fails (not even the only command she understands). My dog understands vocabulary as well.




Ya when i have a treat my dog will immediately sit, speak, shake, lay down and roll over all in the span of a second. :lol: dont even have to say anything he knows the drill.


--------------------
"I don't give nothin' to nobody, I just pay the cost to do business." - Riley "Young Reezy"-Boondocks

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

"In the days of kings and queens I was a jester."

"And then the great lord created bears... too many bears... shoulda really dialed back on the bears." Squidbillies

"Can you start speaking words instead of your damn filthy lies!"- Louise "Bobs Burgers"


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