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mustangbob3
Mad Myrmecologist



Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 1,685
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: insanemike]
#22023412 - 07/31/15 08:22 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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lol im an idiot ,
i was perplexed as to why the tubs was the same humidity as the growroom 
i get you now lol just ignore what i said about working out how much heat the myc adds per hour then, as the temps was not for in the tub.
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CMOSS
Back Again


Registered: 07/07/15
Posts: 44
Last seen: 8 years, 4 months
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: insanemike]
#22023428 - 07/31/15 08:29 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Hey thanks for going through with this, I've seen alot of people set these kind of things up then never follow through on posting datapoint. Good Work! One of the more helpful parent posts that can help improve our understanding of growth parameters.
Even in the two years i've been gone, I've seen a swing in the 'recommended' procedure for general cube growers.
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mustangbob3
Mad Myrmecologist



Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 1,685
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: hamloaf]
#22023429 - 07/31/15 08:29 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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hows it going ham 
its the word british threw me off and wasnt sure 
as mike was courteous enough to convert F to C, i should at least make an effort to talk in terms that mean something to all
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: CMOSS]
#22023822 - 07/31/15 10:19 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
hamloaf said: Go Mikey, it's ya' birthday and we gonna' party like it's your birthday. 
Bob, we use BTU's over hear to measure thermal energy. Also, nice tidbit of information over how many BTU's an average human being runs. 
Nice avatar. I seen that pic on fakebook a few weeks ago. Did you catch any of the photo's and/or articles on pluto. There were some very interesting things we learned that we did not know previous to the fly-by.
Quote:
mustangbob3 said: hows it going ham 
its the word british threw me off and wasnt sure 
as mike was courteous enough to convert F to C, i should at least make an effort to talk in terms that mean something to all 
Actually, lol, I had to convert it the other way. The 2 insten hygrometers only read in celcius and so I changed the accurite to read the same.
Quote:
CMOSS said: Hey thanks for going through with this, I've seen alot of people set these kind of things up then never follow through on posting datapoint. Good Work! One of the more helpful parent posts that can help improve our understanding of growth parameters.
Even in the two years i've been gone, I've seen a swing in the 'recommended' procedure for general cube growers.
Thanks for dropping by. Glad to see new cultivators drop by and show there interest. This work is not being done just for me, it's essentially for all of us. So if you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask.
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Aero
Orea


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 2,253
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: insanemike]
#22023929 - 07/31/15 10:51 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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so walk me through again, i saw those numbers what happened at 5.30 am?
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: Aero] 1
#22023977 - 07/31/15 11:08 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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My temps drop and rh go up in the am because the outside temp drops in my region. Between 3am and 5am is when temp is at its lowest and between 3pm and 5pm temps are at there highest. My grow room temps never go above 75*F and never go below 65*F. Humidity is relative to temperature so usually when temps rise, humidity drops and when temps drop, humidity rises. My system is designed to function properly when grow room temps stay between 65*F-75*F and between 40%-60% rh.
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Aero
Orea


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 2,253
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: insanemike]
#22023989 - 07/31/15 11:15 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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cool thanks for clearing that up
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: Aero]
#22024068 - 07/31/15 11:54 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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No problem, Aero. That's what I'm here for. If you haven't already, check your pm's.
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Darkhome
•Shaman•N•Training•



Registered: 07/10/15
Posts: 517
Loc: United States
Last seen: 7 years, 1 month
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: insanemike]
#22024273 - 07/31/15 12:50 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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-------------------- “The shaman is not merely a sick man, or a madman; he is a sick man who has healed himself.” ~Terence McKenna~ "NOTHING"...I post or say is "TRUE"...Any pictures are taken from the Web and any conversation is just research for a fictional character. That being said; He is constantly seeking knowledge and evolving.
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: Darkhome]
#22025106 - 07/31/15 04:38 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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It's going to take a little while for all 3 of the hygrometers to level out. I will take another pic when they do and then I will take the tape off of the holes.
Edited by insanemike (07/31/15 04:38 PM)
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Aero
Orea


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 2,253
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: insanemike]
#22025320 - 07/31/15 05:31 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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looking good ! nice rhizo there
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taGyo
Strainiac/AMU



Registered: 10/16/14
Posts: 18,802
Loc: Journal Land
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: Aero]
#22026324 - 07/31/15 09:54 PM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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-------------------- Gyo's Better Grows TNF Q&A AMU Q&A Dominus fortunae meae sum
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mustangbob3
Mad Myrmecologist



Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 1,685
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: taGyo]
#22026970 - 08/01/15 03:11 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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love how much info your sharing
over the years, the amount of people who dont realise that more heat decreases the potential humidity of the air!
in past i have even heard people say raise the temps to increase evap for better pinset and also more humidity lol, and people have tried to argued this fact with me!
but it dont work like that, once the tub is at its max potential humidity adding more heat will decrease humidity and thus evap from sub and not increase it, as warmer air cannot hold as much water the evap from sub is halted and any that does will be equally met with condensation on the tub walls to keep equilibrium.
this thread is a great source of information and is setting things straight for lots of people!
nice one mike!
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: mustangbob3]
#22027045 - 08/01/15 05:14 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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It has been almost 12 hours of observation and neither tubs rh has moved down from 99%. This is making me a little uneasy. I was actually expecting the rh inside of the tubs to fluctuate as the temps fluctuated but nada. I placed the probes roughly at inlet hole height. Would placing the probes closer to substrate level make a difference? Did I miscalculate and thus the holes aren't large enough? Should the holes be closer to substrate level? These are some of the thoughts running through my head.
On the other hand, every hole on both tubs has a halo around it. My grow room temps have stayed within my set range. The substrate looks very healthy.
My substrate has some pooling water from condensation running down the walls. It was caused by when I moved them to set up the probes. It may be pointless to move them again to dab the water off the substrate because the condensation will probably run again when being moved back. The only thing I can think of that may make a difference is to dry the walls and then dab the substrate. Does this seem viable to any of you?
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mustangbob3
Mad Myrmecologist



Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 1,685
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: insanemike]
#22027103 - 08/01/15 05:52 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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i think what your seeing is the power of the engine that is the mycelial system.
it actually wants to put out more water into the tub but is limited by the amount the air holds.
so it quickly adds more as soon as available but then becomes restricted again when the air will hold no more.
its the myc system overpowering the power of temp difference so it plays no part.
i talked about this in pms the other week if you can remember. 'a system in a system...'
its just a testiment to the out put the myc is capable of but in our tubs is resricted by the air volume.
so the power of the myc just plows on and keeps it at the highest the air volume will allow 
EDIT i would dab up the pooling water on the sub, but im lazy and would let the walls just run down between the liner and tub wall away from sub
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: mustangbob3]
#22027130 - 08/01/15 06:19 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
mustangbob3 said: i think what your seeing is the power of the engine that is the mycelial system.
it actually wants to put out more water into the tub but is limited by the amount the air holds.
so it quickly adds more as soon as available but then becomes restricted again when the air will hold no more.
its the myc system overpowering the power of temp difference so it plays no part.
i talked about this in pms the other week if you can remember. 'a system in a system...'
its just a testiment to the out put the myc is capable of but in our tubs is resricted by the air volume.
so the power of the myc just plows on and keeps it at the highest the air volume will allow 
EDIT i would dab up the pooling water on the sub, but im lazy and would let the walls just run down between the liner and tub wall away from sub 
Thanks for easing my mind a little. Yes. I do remember quite well of you speaking of a system within a system. So your saying that the system is working properly, it's just that the mycelia is capable of putting out a lot more than what the system was designed for? Should the constant 99% rh be a concern at all?
I did not use any liners so I think I may go a head and dry the walls and dab the substrate then. Doing this will give me an opportunity to watch the power of the mycelium and to witness the recondensation of the walls. Could be an interesting observation.
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mustangbob3
Mad Myrmecologist



Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 1,685
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: insanemike]
#22027142 - 08/01/15 06:27 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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tbh i expected slight fluctuctions.
but remember you will still be getting evap so dont worry.
for every bit of humidity that is leaving the tub the myc will be giving back to maintain humidity in the tub.
so it is still losing/ evapourating at a constant rate even if it gives the illousion that it cant be
the amount of evap will equal the amount lost out the outlet holes 
compensation and balancing and all that 
only prob with being so high humidity all the time is the caps on the fruit will be more susceptible to bacterial blotch maybe?
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: mustangbob3]
#22027144 - 08/01/15 06:32 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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This was my pm to you bob but thought it really should be discussed exclusively in this thread, if you don't mind?
So is my next step to increase out flow? If the mycelium is always waiting on the system to release pressure and the inlet holes are simply there to control in flow than the next logical step would be to increase pressure release by allowing more exhaust. Does this sound right? Let me know if I ended up too far out in left field so that we can have a meeting back on the mound.
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mustangbob3
Mad Myrmecologist



Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 1,685
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: insanemike]
#22027191 - 08/01/15 07:09 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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ok mike
you will have to edit this post and put my rely i sent you back lol ive deleted my sent messages box lol
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Edited by mustangbob3 (08/01/15 07:24 AM)
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Re: Monotub Improvement Project preliminary test run #1 [Re: mustangbob3]
#22027256 - 08/01/15 07:56 AM (8 years, 5 months ago) |
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Mustangbob3 said
"bigger holes will help with the .. the.. lets call it back pressure lol
but tbh i dont know by how much the myc is limited in this way in say normal monotubs.
so your going to have to suck it and see really.
holding back some water in the sub may be benefit but limits evap somewhat.
and the reverse is obvious. i fear even bigger holes wont drastically change things in the way we think.
think about it the air as it warms to rise drops water out... so air leaving the tub will not be as humid as the air in the tub. lots of moisture are left behind.
its making my mind spin thinking of all the effects together to work out what is happening and it what proportions lol
but
it makes sense to me the most effective way of increasing evap would not be the outlet but inlet.
draw more cooler dry air in much more effecient than increasing the out as the loss from out is limited by warm air holding less water.
bring in more at the inlet, this cooler dry air will hold lots of water and will then allow more evap
i would try to achieve more inlet by changing the efficency of flow.
and i would do this by playing with the height difference between the in and out holes this way you alter the flow and also the size of head of warm air at the top space of the tub. you know all about bouancy driven ventilation and know how that will lend a hand in drawing in air at the inlet somewhat sort of like fine tuning lol lowering the top holes abit will make a larger head of warmer air at the top of the tub and vice versa raising the bottom holes will have some effect
as we cant really alter the engine input power as discussed before. but flow effeciency we can play with.
but you still need to keep it in the air exchanges per hour range required, this needs concideration too.
short of changing holes height difference or different tub dimensions ect you just got work with what you got and workout solutions as they are needed.
tbh i havent ever even used a hygrometer in a mono.. ever maybe they always keep the humidity.
i have literally just expected some fluctuations. surprising to me. maybe get others to check their tubs see if is maintains aswell? means little but will give comfort that your fruiting will go fine
in short see how it goes. we dont know how much moisture the tub is losing so no idea how much evap. you may have it perfect! you could/prob also be fine staying at 99% humidity all the way"
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