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OfflinefirstTIMER420
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Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s
    #21955323 - 07/17/15 09:31 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Hey guys, I recently posted a couple threads on broad questions concerning these two, but now I need to get more specific.


Also, any advice on growing pans, I know you need somewhere between a 1:1 and 1:2 spawn to sub ratio, but im having problems figuring out my tray ratios.

I am doing 2 6qt trays for pans and 2 6qt trays for PE.  My question is I know the sub lvl needs to only be about 1.5in at the most, therefore, I cannot seem to figure out how much spawn+sub that is going to be.  My first measurements were 2qtspawn and 4qt sub for the PE( obviously wrong) What spawn:sub ratio would you use for each to achieve the desired Substrate lvl in the tub(for pans, then PE, respectively)


Now, since I do not have access to Hpoo( which obviously I will have to get before I even attempt to grow pans, but I digress) I was thinking about what I was going to use for casing.  ive had some people suggest using Peat Moss as a casing, but from what ive read it tends to contam easily.  I have come across some "Jiffy organic seed starting mix" which includes(you probably already know) Sphagnum peat moss, verm, and lime.  Sounds like a perfect casing mix, all it needs is the pasteurization.  Will this mix work well, and are there any adjustments needed to it besides the Pasteur.?
I need to know if anyone has used this for pans, if not, what have you used it for?


As far as horse manure, I can get the dehydrated pellets, but I really don't want too, I feel like its just not the same for the mushies as the real field aged stuff, and could potentially contam easier.  Opinions on it?

I only have 2 syringes of pan cyan, and since they are different than cubes, I need to know how much to use to innoc the grain jars(qt).  Im guessing the regular amount should be fine(1/4 - 1/2 CC)

As far as colonization times, what am I looking at?  and for transferring them to the tray, how long should the colonization of the tray take before I need to start fruiting(I know it can vary, just need a basic timeline)


Penis Envy:

I want to do 2 monotubs of Penis Envy, and am probably going to use rye berries for spawn, and verm/coir/gypsum for the substrate.  My question is, what percentage of the ingrediants go into the substrate mix?(60/30/10?)

Anyone know what can cause the mutations to occur, or is it just based on genetics?  Im thinking it obviously has something to do with fruiting conditions, maybe too much rH or something, what you think?

As far as sub lvl in the monotub, I know it needs to be somewhere around 2-3 inches, then the casing layer(or should it be that height with the casing layer?)

Ive read that PE can take a lot longer to colonize and fruit than other strains of cubes, if so, what time frame am I looking at?

Anything else I need to know when dealing with Penis Envy?


Spore Syringe:

If I only use a 1/4 or 1/2 of the spore syringe solution, How should I save the rest of it.  By that, I mean should I just flame the needle and cap it, or re attach the nipple and store it like usual?

This is important, as I do not forsee myself using the whole pan cyan syringe and would like to save it for another couple grows.


I know this is a wall of text, but I need some help here, and any advice given is greatly appreciated, My success or failure is up to me, but you can definitely help me to succeed, just like all of you have so far with my other grows.

THANK YOU SHROOMERITES :love: :smile: :growshrooms: :headbang:


:popcorn:


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Invisibleazur
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: firstTIMER420]
    #21955362 - 07/17/15 09:45 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

STOP!  Get agar and start growing your mycelium on it. Then proceed


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OfflinefirstTIMER420
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: azur]
    #21955377 - 07/17/15 09:48 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

For both im assuming right?

I was thinking about PCing my agar in my Erlenmeyer that I have but I don't have a cap, I have a stopper for it but not sure if I should drill a hole in it or not.

What else do you use for PCing agar?


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Invisibleazur
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: firstTIMER420]
    #21955387 - 07/17/15 09:52 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I use a maker's mark 46 bottle. I've tried all different types. But that bottle is the best so far. No overboil which is awesome. I put tin foil over the top, poked a few holes in it, then loosely put another piece of foil over that.
Fill your pc with water to the same level as your agar is (much more water than pcing grain) and bring the temp up slowly and when it's done down slowly. Don't let it get higher than 15psi.

Yes, both. Those syringes are not only probably not clean, but with agar will last you years possibly


--------------------


A cube is NOT a cube.

FALL IN LOVE WITH LC
FOTTSE!!!
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OfflinefirstTIMER420
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: azur]
    #21961201 - 07/18/15 04:09 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

cool, can you help with my other questions regarding spawn:sub ratios?


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OfflineSokamin
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: firstTIMER420]
    #21961341 - 07/18/15 04:46 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I've grown PE by injecting (with a syringe with sterilized water from my own PE print) rye berries and casing them with a little bit of vermiculite, nothing more. Just as simple as that. Hope this helps you out a little bit.


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~~ keep growing, keep printing, keep tripping ~~
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Offlinekn33b
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: firstTIMER420]
    #21961410 - 07/18/15 05:04 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Getting the revolving door of cultivation > regular harvests takes a lot of time/work/patience. I agree with Azur to get some agar going. Everything else is just minute details.


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Edited by kn33b (07/18/15 05:09 PM)


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Offlinekn33b
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: kn33b]
    #21961416 - 07/18/15 05:06 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

It's been my experience that hpoo is mushroom steroids. There's nothing like it. I get huge 1st and 2nd flushes, but not much after that. Dehydrated poo is better than none, my friend.


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OfflinefirstTIMER420
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: kn33b]
    #21961878 - 07/18/15 06:58 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

thanks.

and I hae all the shit for agar, just haven't started it yet.  I have 2 syringes with like 2cc left, and im going to use them to start my agar for my next project

might use it to start my Pans as well, I REALLY want to grow those.


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Offlinekn33b
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: firstTIMER420]
    #21962072 - 07/18/15 07:47 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Sounds like you've got your work cut out for you! I don't recommend reusing syringes more than once, but that's the beauty of agar-- a few xfers and you're contam free, cut back from millions of spore colonies battling each other for nutrients to a few colonies, and you skip the 1-2wk germination process. I honestly don't know anything about pans, I've only grown cubes. But I started out with cakes just to learn what this is all about. Keep us posted!


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OfflinefirstTIMER420
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: azur]
    #21962466 - 07/18/15 09:19 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

hey, do I need to wrap my petris in saran wrap?


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Invisibleazur
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: firstTIMER420]
    #21962472 - 07/18/15 09:21 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

You can. I just put mine in ziploc bags


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FALL IN LOVE WITH LC
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: azur]
    #21962661 - 07/18/15 10:27 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

azur said:
STOP!  Get agar and start growing your mycelium on it. Then proceed



:whathesaid:


Quote:

azur said:
Fill your pc with water to the same level as your agar is (much more water than pcing grain) and bring the temp up slowly and when it's done down slowly. Don't let it get higher than 15psi.



Why on earth do you use so much water? If you sterilize agar in an AA sterilizer do you also add such a large volume of water? I'm not sure that the water surrounding the bottle will reach the same temperature that the steam above it will, which is what we are using to actually do the sterilizing. Unless your PC is really clean and you're using distilled water for PCing the liquid water will not be able to be superheated above 212 like the pressurized steam can.

When I make agar in my AA921 I use a very small amount of water(about a half inch), much less than I used for a 2 hour bag cook. I also elevate the rack an inch to keep the agar bottle completely out of the water. I run 20psi, and I DO NOT bring it up slow. Maximum heat, until steam is blasting out of the vent like a motherfucker and 2-3psi have been reached without even applying the weight. Then I add the weight and the heat remains on max until I hit 20psi, pressure builds quickly at this point. Once the vent pops off twice, then I reduce heat to damn near off to maintain 20psi. Once the cycle is complete(I run for 35 mins) I shut off the heat and let pressure naturally drop ~5psi before moving the cooker in front of my running flowhood to continue cooling until it hits 0psi. Then I open it up and take out the bottle before the 921 starts to pull vacuum. I have NEVER had agar boil over at all and I've poured a couple thousand plates this way. I use a Jose Cuervo silver tequila bottle(clear glass) with a 1/4" hole in the lid with an SFD patch siliconed over it and cover it with foil, the threads got kinda messed up on the cap when I over tightened it a long time ago, so its kinda loose nowadays but works just fine.

I don't think agar boils over from the PC coming to pressure too fast, it certainly doesn't happen at 20psi. I think it happens by people popping off the weight to release pressure and not admitting to doing so when they realize what they did.


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Edited by Juiceh (07/18/15 10:52 PM)


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Offlinekn33b
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: Juiceh]
    #21962728 - 07/18/15 10:50 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

There's more than one way to skin a cat.

I always wrap my petris in Saran Wrap.


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Invisibleazur
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: Juiceh]
    #21962766 - 07/18/15 10:59 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Juice, i don't take the weight off until  i pour plates 2 hours later. I use a smaller pc for agar.

But....i think i still owe you something from a trade. Something i didn't have, but i don't remember what. Pm me what it was and your addy and I'll get it out this week


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FALL IN LOVE WITH LC
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InvisibleMad Season
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: kn33b]
    #21962796 - 07/18/15 11:06 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Truth is that the more space between water and the lid of the pc, means more room for pressurized steam. The shit we want. For every psi, the boiling temp of water goes up 2-3°C. However pressurized steam can rise in temperature a lot more, bonus #1

Water can't be compressed like gas can. Waters better at transferring pressure/force, such as hydraulics because you can't compress it like a gas. The more air you have in the chamber, the longer it'll take to dissipate, because it'll hold a lot more air in the bigger area provided, by using less water.

The longer it takes to dissipate, the less chance you get of boiling over. Because the more pressure you have for a longer time, the higher the temperature is for boiling, thus the agar won't boil. Bonus #2


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Edited by Mad Season (07/18/15 11:07 PM)


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InvisibleJuiceh
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: Mad Season]
    #21962874 - 07/18/15 11:27 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

azur said:
Juice, i don't take the weight off until  i pour plates 2 hours later. I use a smaller pc for agar.

But....i think i still owe you something from a trade. Something i didn't have, but i don't remember what. Pm me what it was and your addy and I'll get it out this week



Ah ok, so the excess water is to retain the heat and keep the agar liquid for when you go to pour? I'm still not quite sure you're gonna get as thorough of a sterilization as you could because the water surrounding the bottle won't reach the same temps. I guess it must be enough though cause we sure as hell know it works for you! :thumbup:

:pm: on the way.

Quote:

Mad Season said:
For every psi, the boiling temp of water goes up 2-3°C.



I keep forgetting this.

Quote:

Mad Season said:
Water can't be compressed like gas can. Waters better at transferring pressure/force, such as hydraulics because you can't compress it like a gas. The more air you have in the chamber, the longer it'll take to dissipate, because it'll hold a lot more air in the bigger area provided, by using less water.

The longer it takes to dissipate, the less chance you get of boiling over. Because the more pressure you have for a longer time, the higher the temperature is for boiling, thus the agar won't boil. Bonus #2



Ok, I just took a phatty dab.. but are you saying because I let all the air evacuate and blast out pure steam until I have a couple psi of pressure before applying the weight, that's why I don't get any boil over?


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InvisibleMad Season
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: Juiceh]
    #21962891 - 07/18/15 11:30 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Could be. In fact, that would make perfect sense. The faster it goes up to pressure, and the longer it stays at a high pressure, the less boiling you'd get.


--------------------
contam and car window art
How to shroomery like a pro! (Seriously, everyone read this!)
Improve your sterile techniques! (A comprehensive guide to agar)
Links upon links of literally EVERYTHING UP TO DATE

AMU Q&A
No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.


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InvisibleJuiceh
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Re: Pan Cyan and Penis envy ?'s [Re: Mad Season]
    #21962911 - 07/18/15 11:35 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

:havesomescience:


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How I make 15 lbs of casing in a 941. How I line 12 shoeboxes with 1 39gal bag. How I Deep Fry Cubes!
RogerRabbit said:You need a bigger pressure cooker for this hobby. RR


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