|
makaveli8x8
Stranger

Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 21,636
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
Re: Baby body parts for sale [Re: endogenous]
#21959240 - 07/18/15 04:23 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
endogenous said: The point is that the fetus doesn't know itself apart from the other organs in the mother's body.
If you take a person from Russia and bring them to the US - it usually will take a long time before they start feeling like they're separate from Russia.
you actually don't know that for a fact. All you know is that you don't have memories of knowing what it was like to be a fetus.
For all we know, 8+ weeks in, you have 1 neuron in just the right place that lets you experience what its like to be a fetus, but with zero memory retention, or memory for 1 second, whatever it may be.
Fact is, we don't know, which is why its a debate, the only ones pretending its fact, is the baby killers so they don't feel guilty for doing it, if they even feel guilt at all.
--------------------
  We were sent to hell for eternity Ø h® We play on earth to pass the time Over-population the root of all Evil-brings the Elites Closer to the gates.
Edited by makaveli8x8 (07/18/15 04:29 AM)
|
ChinChiller



Registered: 07/03/10
Posts: 3,270
|
Re: Baby body parts for sale [Re: makaveli8x8]
#21959253 - 07/18/15 04:31 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
I was reading about this in the WSJ this morning and medical research on fetuses has been common practice for a long time. Its any profits made of off the fetuses that could potentially cause some problems for PP, however isnt the money just making abortions more available.
Im all for it, abortions are good..in fact great for the planet (which cant sustain all these kids) as a whole and for women who dont want the kids (cant sustain kids).
Its a win win, also we get the added benefit of medical research ON TOP OF SAVING THE PLANET!
|
ChinChiller



Registered: 07/03/10
Posts: 3,270
|
Re: Baby body parts for sale [Re: ChinChiller]
#21959268 - 07/18/15 04:38 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
Planned Parenthood, saving the planet one packaged and sold fetus at a time!
|
Crystal G



Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 6 days
|
Re: Baby body parts for sale [Re: ChinChiller]
#21959366 - 07/18/15 05:46 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Errolscool said: Where is the order form? Instead of it going to medical research I would like to use it to spread on my toast also stocking stuffers!
Fetus grais, that would be interesting. Not enough fat though (I'm assuming). Perhaps it should be pickled and eaten like balut. I prefer sashimi style.
|
Amanita86
OTD Keymaster


Registered: 09/26/12
Posts: 89,464
Loc: hades
|
Re: Baby body parts for sale [Re: Crystal G] 1
#21959984 - 07/18/15 10:50 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
endogenous said:
Quote:
Amanita86 said: You shouldn't need a 'clear objective reason', you should be able too look and immediately tell..
As for your second argument with the parents, that's a flaw of our society.. Correct the flaw, don't kill the kid.. like I said selfish convenience. I'm guessing you don't hang around kids much..? I don't know, maybe you run a daycare, it really doesn't matter. There's no justification for killing a kid that young. You don't need a reason spelled out, you should inherently know.. or so it would seem to me.
It's not killing a child. It's removing an organ of the mother's body. Would you object to removing a kidney? or a gall bladder?
This is no different.
If a kidney dies after being removed from the body, it doesn't know it. Neither does the fetus. It doesn't know itself apart from the organs of its mother's body.
That right there ranks up with the dumbest shit I've ever heard in my life. That's just incredible you actually believe that, or you're a troll.
Quote:
Crystal G said:
Quote:
ballsalsa said: just for clarity, if a fetus is an organ, why does it have different DNA than all of the mother's other organs?
Because technically, a fetus is a parasite. It is a parasitic organism that is feeding off its host, and if the host wishes to extract this organism from their body, they have a perfectly legitimate reason for wanting to do so.
, that's like saying a tomato, or an ear of corn, or a flower is a parasite to it's own plant.
This is not a tick, it's a different category all together. By your logic every seed that has ever been produced is a parasite.. parasites dont give a fuck about the survival of the host organism. It's the propogation of a species...
No wonder you people can murder infants without losing sleep, even recommed it... you see babies as parasites
Well let me ask you this. In the mind of every aborted fetus that ever was and will be... what does that make you?
--------------------
Orange clock, pencil "They threw me off the hay truck about noon..."
*Mark 15:34  Gam zeh ya’avor...
|
Beanhead
IS IRONIC PARADOX


Registered: 10/11/08
Posts: 17,257
Loc: Geospatial inversion.
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
|
Re: Baby body parts for sale [Re: Astral Pain]
#21960041 - 07/18/15 11:05 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
Fuck yeah.
WHERE ARE THE BABYFARMS!?
Quote:
Astral Pain said: How far along? What the lady is describing in the video appears to be partial birth. She would give you $30 to $100 for specific parts from what I heard.
That's pretty sick.
I thought organs were way more lucrative
Edited by Beanhead (07/18/15 11:10 AM)
|
Mr.GuessWork
Stranger

Registered: 03/30/13
Posts: 4,563
|
Re: Baby body parts for sale [Re: Amanita86]
#21960091 - 07/18/15 11:17 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Amanita86 said:
...
Well let me ask you this. In the mind of every aborted fetus that ever was and will be... what does that make you?
You're personifying the fetus too much, man. It doesn't have a functional mind. It can respond to some stimuli, but it sure as hell isn't forming abstract ideas. It's still developing nervous tissue that let's it do stuff like breathe. It's WAY less functional than a new born baby, and they can't do a whole lot. How do you feel about taking brain dead people off of life support? An abortion is much closer to that, in terms of ending a thing with a personality, than it is to killing a kid.
|
Amanita86
OTD Keymaster


Registered: 09/26/12
Posts: 89,464
Loc: hades
|
|
A brain dead person doesn't have much life ahead of them, a fetus does..
You're robbing an entire life, as opposed to ending one that has reached it's end naturally.
--------------------
Orange clock, pencil "They threw me off the hay truck about noon..."
*Mark 15:34  Gam zeh ya’avor...
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
Re: Baby body parts for sale [Re: Beanhead]
#21960131 - 07/18/15 11:29 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Beanhead said: Fuck yeah.
WHERE ARE THE BABYFARMS!?
Quote:
Astral Pain said: How far along? What the lady is describing in the video appears to be partial birth. She would give you $30 to $100 for specific parts from what I heard.
That's pretty sick.
I thought organs were way more lucrative 
They are.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/07/17/why-planned-parenthood-wont-stop-donating-fetal-organs/
Quote:
One of those companies, Placerville, Calif.-based StemExpress, is mentioned in the anti-abortion video and calls itself in its marketing "the largest variety of raw materials available in the industry."
The company receives tissue directly from donors in addition to Planned Parenthood, a representative said, and extracts cells to purify them for researchers. The StemExpress catalog features a vial of two million "fresh" cells from a fetal liver for $1,932, and $1,840 for the same amount "cryopreserved," or frozen.
--------------------
|
Mr.GuessWork
Stranger

Registered: 03/30/13
Posts: 4,563
|
Re: Baby body parts for sale [Re: Amanita86]
#21960143 - 07/18/15 11:33 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Amanita86 said: A brain dead person doesn't have much life ahead of them, a fetus does..
You're robbing an entire life, as opposed to ending one that has reached it's end.
Why is the fetus entitled to a life in the first place? It really is closer to an organ than it is to a person while it's in the womb, especially up to the abortion dead line. Why do you feel a lady should be obligated to turn a sac of tissues into a person if she doesn't want to? You might as well argue that we're all obligated to have children just because we've got sperm or eggs. Is a sperm or egg a person? You should have a solid reason if you want to draw that line for other people and define what life is for them, because killing a chicken and frying an egg are two different things to most people.
|
Amanita86
OTD Keymaster


Registered: 09/26/12
Posts: 89,464
Loc: hades
|
|
Again your logic is flawed... eggs by themself dont make a baby, sperm by itself, doesnt make a baby.. so there is no need to feel like you have to mix the two..
That's like saying why dont we mix all gas and fire, just because they're there.
Any why dont you kill a fetus you ask? Because you don't kill babies.. period. Have some respect and atleast some form of responsibility for yourself.. there's people fucking dieing here.. enjoy your breakfast.
--------------------
Orange clock, pencil "They threw me off the hay truck about noon..."
*Mark 15:34  Gam zeh ya’avor...
|
Amanita86
OTD Keymaster


Registered: 09/26/12
Posts: 89,464
Loc: hades
|
|
And for the record, those eggs you're frying, are unfertilized..
--------------------
Orange clock, pencil "They threw me off the hay truck about noon..."
*Mark 15:34  Gam zeh ya’avor...
|
pirate-blues


Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 13,656
|
|
Quote:
Mr.GuessWork said:
Quote:
Amanita86 said: A brain dead person doesn't have much life ahead of them, a fetus does..
You're robbing an entire life, as opposed to ending one that has reached it's end.
Why is the fetus entitled to a life in the first place? It really is closer to an organ than it is to a person while it's in the womb, especially up to the abortion dead line. Why do you feel a lady should be obligated to turn a sac of tissues into a person if she doesn't want to? You might as well argue that we're all obligated to have children just because we've got sperm or eggs. Is a sperm or egg a person? You should have a solid reason if you want to draw that line for other people and define what life is for them, because killing a chicken and frying an egg are two different things to most people.
An interesting thing about women's bodies is that, miscarriage in early pregnancy if FAR more common than people realize - even the women themselves. Our own bodies self-abort more frequently than we know. Self-abortion(and abortion at will) is actually something that happens to several species of animals, other species can delay the pregnancy. It's something that is essential for their species - and you could argue that aborting a fetus that has very little chance of being born into a family that's ready, mature, or capable of raising a child in a safe home environment benefit our society. Some even argue that legalization of abortion has been a factor(one of many) in the decline of violent crime in the US.
I know armadillos can induce abortions, but here's an interesting article about self-termination among primates(particularly gelada monkeys)
http://io9.com/5886670/gelada-monkeys-offer-evidence-that-abortion-is-part-of-evolutionary-fitness
http://women.texaschildrens.org/Health-Topics/Pregnancy-Center/Early-Miscarriage/ ^ source for frequency of undetected miscarriages in early stages of pregnances, arguably another evolutionary mechanism.
Edited by pirate-blues (07/18/15 11:46 AM)
|
Amanita86
OTD Keymaster


Registered: 09/26/12
Posts: 89,464
Loc: hades
|
|
It's one thing if your body rejects it.. it's another thing when a doctor sucks that fucker out even though your body was "all systems go" and fully planned to deliver a healthy living baby.
--------------------
Orange clock, pencil "They threw me off the hay truck about noon..."
*Mark 15:34  Gam zeh ya’avor...
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
|
Why are you entitled to a life? Did you know that the human brain does not become fully mature until the mid twenties? That is why I support abortion into at least the 75th trimester.
Roe was based on a faulty application of the Constitution but I thought it was a brilliant piece of legislation. I also saw the looming problem in the reasoning. Much of the argument supporting the 26 week limit was predicated on fetal viability at the time. Well guess what. Technology has improved and it is now possible to save babies born at 20 weeks. What does that do to the law?
Unless it is for some some medical issue that surfaces late, and those are permitted up to the end, why doesn't the fucking moron just get it done right away? You have 3 months no questions asked. Just fucking do it if your gonna do it and no a fucking fetus is not an unfeeling cluster of cells or an organ at 20 weeks. That's fucking stupid. It reacts to stimuli and can feel pain.. Your liver does not feel pain because it doesn't have a brain. You feel pain. Your organs don't. They cause pain.
--------------------
|
Mr.GuessWork
Stranger

Registered: 03/30/13
Posts: 4,563
|
Re: Baby body parts for sale [Re: Amanita86]
#21960212 - 07/18/15 11:50 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Amanita86 said: Again your logic is flawed... eggs by themself dont make a baby, sperm by itself, doesnt make a baby.. so there is no need to feel like you have to mix the two..
That's like saying why dont we mix all gas and fire, just because they're there.
Any why dont you kill a fetus you ask? Because you don't kill babies.. period. Have some respect and atleast some form of responsibility for yourself.. there's people fucking dieing here.. enjoy your breakfast.
First, eggs that chickens lay will produce offspring if the chickens are allowed to run around with roosters like cage free chickens do. When you take an egg away from a chicken, you're taking away an embryo that would have grown into a chicken if the momma chicken felt like brooding. That analogy was solid. By eating breakfast, you are effectively performing a chicken abortion.
The fetus by itself doesn't make a baby either. It requires the continued cooperation of the mother for 9 months. Without that cooperation from the mother there is no baby, so no babies are killed in an abortion. fetus does not equal baby in any sense just because it might become a baby later. You're confusing the present with the future.
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
|
At what point does it become a baby and not just a lumpen fetus parasite? Blackmun hinged his decision on viability. Well the technology now can save a 20 week old fetus and turn it into a baby.
None of the eggs that you eat are fertilized. They cannot be fertilized by roosters after they are laid.
--------------------
|
pirate-blues


Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 13,656
|
Re: Baby body parts for sale [Re: zappaisgod]
#21960242 - 07/18/15 11:57 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
The question of when the human fetus develops the capacity for sentience is central to many contentious issues. The answer could and should influence attitudes toward IVF and embryo experimentation, abortion, and fetal and neonatal surgery. For the fetus to be described as sentient, the somatosensory pathways from the periphery to the primary somatosensory region of the cerebral cortex must be established and functional. Fetal behaviour is described and the development of the underlying anatomical substrate and the chemical and electrical pathways involved in the detection, transmission, and perception of somatosensory stimuli are reviewed.
It is concluded that the basic neuronal substrate required to transmit somatosensory information develops by mid-gestation (18 to 25 weeks), however, the functional capacity of the neural circuitry is limited by the immaturity of the system. Thus, 18 to 25 weeks is considered the earliest stage at which the lower boundary of sentience could be placed. At this stage of development, however, there is little evidence for the central processing of somatosensory information. Before 30 weeks gestational age, EEG activity is extremely limited and somatosensory evoked potentials are immature, lacking components which correlate with information processing within the cerebral cortex. Thus, 30 weeks is considered a more plausible stage of fetal development at which the lower boundary for sentience could be placed.
Keywords
Read More: http://informahealthcare.com/doi/abs/10.3109/14767059209161911p
|
Amanita86
OTD Keymaster


Registered: 09/26/12
Posts: 89,464
Loc: hades
|
|
You can take that science talk on out of here.. that fetus is a baby in the making... but for the fact the doctor blew that process, you have a baby human ... living..
Aka, the doctor killed a living human.
--------------------
Orange clock, pencil "They threw me off the hay truck about noon..."
*Mark 15:34  Gam zeh ya’avor...
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
|
I didn't say sentience. They react to stimuli and feel pain. They have tiny little brains
http://www.readcube.com/articles/10.1111%2Fj.1748-720X.2011.00592.x?r3_referer=wol&tracking_action=preview_click&show_checkout=1&purchase_referrer=onlinelibrary.wiley.com&purchase_site_license=LICENSE_DENIED_NO_CUSTOMER
Quote:
(1) At least by twenty weeks after fertilization there is substantial evidence that an unborn child has the physical structures necessary to experience pain; (2) There is substantial evi-dence that, by twenty weeks after fertilization, unborn children seek to evade certain stimuli in a manner in which in an infant or an adult would be interpreted as a response to pain; (3) Anesthesia is routinely administered to unborn children who have developed twenty weeks or more past fertilization who undergo prenatal surgery; (4) Even before twenty weeks after fer-tilization, unborn children have been observed to exhibit hormonal stress responses to painful stimuli. Such responses were reduced when pain medication was administered directly to such unborn children;
http://www.rhm-elsevier.com/article/S0968-8080(08)31370-6/abstract
Quote:
Neurobiological features that develop at 7, 18 and 26 weeks gestation suggest an experience of pain in utero.
Both of these papers are written from an abortion supporter's perspective but they have to acknowledge things
--------------------
|
|