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Offlinejjgomes
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Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian
    #21942812 - 07/14/15 04:42 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

When I first started growing I was using golden teacher on birdseed and spawning that to pasteurized coir. My recent batch of bags has been cambodian on bird seed. I have used the same technique to pasteurize the coir (Damions tek.) I have had every single monotub (going on 4 now) get trich and I am getting tired of wasting time and money. Are cambodians not as tough as golden teacher or something?


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21942871 - 07/14/15 04:54 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

The trich is in your spawn.

Cambo and golden teachers are exactly the same. If you grow from spores you have 100s of strains working together in your grow. Some mushrooms if not most of them grown from spores are multiple strains themselves. Use agar to isolate an amazing strain from Amy variety of cubes.

Post pictures of your spawn jars next time.


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: bodhisatta]
    #21943718 - 07/14/15 08:02 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

It isn't in the spawn. I do all bags, they are all pressure cooked, 15psi, 90 minutes, they are all fluffy white.

I realize they are the same species, but I have had all of my golden teachers and all of my cambodians colonize at noticably different rates.


Edited by jjgomes (07/14/15 08:03 PM)


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Offlinespacechildo
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21943743 - 07/14/15 08:08 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

its obviously your spawn. trich dies at very low temps so it wouldn't survive the bucket.
just because we PC our grains doesnt mean we never have dirty spawn..


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: spacechildo]
    #21943779 - 07/14/15 08:17 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

True, but consistent results are part of proper method.



Here is the bag. These were both pressure cooked at the same time. As you can see the bag I have not inoculated is entirely clean. The bag I have is entirely fluffy and white. The bird seed is wild seed you are see a few black seeds showing where I have pushed the mycellium off the top while handling the bag.

For the past two months I have had four bags. Two months ago I spawed one bag and got trich. I spawned another bag and got trich. You are trying to tell me that from these remaining two bags, which have been colonized for two months at least, have trich? After two months if they had trich it would be over run. I have had a contaminated bag and that is not what I have here.


Edited by jjgomes (07/14/15 08:19 PM)


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Offlinespacechildo
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21943796 - 07/14/15 08:20 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

just because its white doesnt mean its right. trich is white..


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: spacechildo]
    #21943813 - 07/14/15 08:23 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Omg only until it matures, and it would show in the bag! I have had these bags for more than two months dude. That is plenty of time to mature.

Perhaps you are thinking that NO mushrooms are growing and its ALL trich? I am getting about one crappy flush of mushrooms that are riddled with trich.

I am wondering if my location could be contaminated. I am doing it in a closet. My first few tubs were fine, but perhaps once I got trich once the location got over-run with spores?


Edited by jjgomes (07/14/15 08:25 PM)


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Offlinespacechildo
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21943853 - 07/14/15 08:29 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

no dude, if the bags took 2 months to finish they are fucked.
trich often rides along from spawn to tub and doesnt show until you give it fresh air.

why are you debating every thing I'm telling you? Its like you refuse to consider it is your spawn
and just make up invalid reasons to why things failed..


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: spacechildo]
    #21943862 - 07/14/15 08:32 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

what are you using to inoculate your bags? are all your problem bags from the same syringe? looks like your WBS prep is solid from the pics just trying to narrow it down but when tubs trich out before they even flush IMO it has to be the spawn


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: spacechildo]
    #21943868 - 07/14/15 08:33 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Okay, You dont seem to be understanding.

These bags have been COLONIZED for more than a month. I just keep them in a cool dark place so they dont start fruiting in the bag. I do this ALL the time with oysters with 100% success. I have done with with cubensis with success as well. They took maybe 2 weeks to colonize.

The reason I am debating it is because you are not offering me information that lines up with my already successful practices. These are not the only mushrooms I am growing, they are the only ones that are failing.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: tetherface]
    #21943876 - 07/14/15 08:35 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

its probably your syringe


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Offlinespacechildo
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21943883 - 07/14/15 08:37 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

well just post a proper pic of the bag and I can show you the contam.

you dont seem to understand this hobby. just because your spawn has been clean on some other occasion doesnt mean you'll grow clean spawn every time.


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: tetherface]
    #21943884 - 07/14/15 08:37 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

tetherface said:
what are you using to inoculate your bags? are all your problem bags from the same syringe? looks like your WBS prep is solid from the pics just trying to narrow it down but when tubs trich out before they even flush IMO it has to be the spawn




I had considered it to be the spawn but the spawn shows no evidence of it until I spawn.
If you have fully colonized bags, wouldn't you expect any contamination to show up if they have been sitting for a month?

The problem bags are not from a single syringe. Two different vendors.

It is not like I am entirely ruling out the idea, but the facts are that there are so many indicators (successes) on my side that say the bag is not the problem. I am only recently having this string of infections.


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: spacechildo]
    #21943890 - 07/14/15 08:38 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

spacechildo said:
well just post a proper pic of the bag and I can show you the contam.

you dont seem to understand this hobby. just because your spawn has been clean on some other occasion doesnt mean you'll grow clean spawn every time.




I will be building a new tub and putting it in a new location to try to rule that out. When I do, I can take a proper photograph. Taking a picture through a crumbly bag is near impossible


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21943903 - 07/14/15 08:39 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

you cant take a picture of a grain bag you already spawned to bulk. little late for that now if you havent done it already..


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: spacechildo]
    #21943926 - 07/14/15 08:44 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

spacechildo said:
you cant take a picture of a grain bag you already spawned to bulk. little late for that now if you havent done it already..




Oh my good lord. Are you being intentionally belligerent? I will take a picture of the cake once I remove it from the bag?

Here are a couple photos where the bag is not a crinkly mess:



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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: tetherface]
    #21943944 - 07/14/15 08:49 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

put a few drops of each syringe on agar and see what grows but i highly doubt you got 2 bad syringes from 2 diff vendors but i've gotten 3 bad rigs in one order before so it can happen either way trich usually doesnt sporulate until you introduce fruiting conditions do you know what trich looks like before it goes green?(not trying to be a dick) just wanna help


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21943969 - 07/14/15 08:56 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Being a noob--with more experience than a lot of noobs however--I have no right to jump in here, but sometimes "out of the mouths of babes".... Anyway, something like this happened to me about 5 years ago--I have not done any mushroom work from that period til now--I was doing bird seed just as I had with previous successful projects but now everything would comtaminate. In my case it evident in the spawn jars themselves. At the time I could not get a clue to what was going on. It was only later, after I had quit growing that it occured to me this: I had bought a new pressure cooker, a much bigger one than I had been using and beside that there was no other variable that had changed among all my projects, successful and not. When I changed pressure cookers, I did not also change heat sources, and this, I now believe, was my downfall. The heat source was a small two burner hot plate. It was plenty hot enough to get my little 8 quart cooker generating contam-kilkler temperatures, but when I was using a cooker that was 3 times larger, that little burner was not up to the joh anymore. I recall being a bit puzzled by the fact that the steam coming out of the big new cooker was not as aggressive at had been the little pc's output.  So, to make a short story of it, I wasn't killing the bad guys as a direct result of upgrading my techology-Oh the irony of it! 
Anyway, just throwing this out there to maybe get some lateral thinking going.


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Most of my beliefs I acquired from my father and from John Wayne, and anything that wasn't ultra tough and ultra cool was to me ultra embarrassing. In fact, I lived in a state of near continuous embarrassment, never measuring up to the ridiculous standards I had accepted without question, applied to a framework of expectations neither I nor anyone else could meet.--J C Amberchele

almost nothing important that ever happens to you happens because you engineer it. Destiny has no beeper; destiny always leans trenchcoated out of an alley with some sort of 'psst' that you usually can't even hear because you're in such a rush to or from something important you've tried to engineer. ”
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21944008 - 07/14/15 09:09 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

jjgomes said:
Quote:

spacechildo said:
you cant take a picture of a grain bag you already spawned to bulk. little late for that now if you havent done it already..




Oh my good lord. Are you being intentionally belligerent? I will take a picture of the cake once I remove it from the bag?

Here are a couple photos where the bag is not a crinkly mess:






you said your tub turned into trich and I blamed that particular spawn.
this is also looking at least bacterial but not that bad, some parts I'm not sure of but could be mold.

just trying to help dude, its your grow you do whatever you want
so if you dont wanna accept its your grains I'll just move on and help someone who's willing to listen :shrug:


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: spacechildo]
    #21944040 - 07/14/15 09:23 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

spacechildo said:
just trying to help dude, its your grow you do whatever you want
so if you dont wanna accept its your grains I'll just move on and help someone who's willing to listen :shrug:




It is not that I am not listening, I am. I am trying to follow a methodical procedure to entirely rule out every other option other than my grain bags. I can easily relocate and I can easily build another tub. It takes much more time to start a bag from scratch.


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Offlinerazerath
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21944047 - 07/14/15 09:25 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

LC?


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: tetherface]
    #21944057 - 07/14/15 09:28 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

tetherface said:
put a few drops of each syringe on agar and see what grows but i highly doubt you got 2 bad syringes from 2 diff vendors but i've gotten 3 bad rigs in one order before so it can happen either way trich usually doesnt sporulate until you introduce fruiting conditions do you know what trich looks like before it goes green?(not trying to be a dick) just wanna help




This.

This is information that I didn't have before.

Are you entirely sure? I have seen grain jars contaminated with trich and they are either a dark grey, or they eventually turn green in the jar. Do you have more information on it?


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: razerath]
    #21944058 - 07/14/15 09:28 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

razerath said:
LC?



MS syringe


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21944077 - 07/14/15 09:32 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Id keep a LC as a fallback. I would make it first for less contams. My two cents...


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21944130 - 07/14/15 09:46 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

maybe try to properly pasteurize your next tub even though they say cvg lacks the beneficial bacteria and micro organisms maybe that will help idk also try to bump up your PC times to 120+ i've read some shit about sterilizing big bags for 3-4 hours on account of how long it takes to get them up to temp i use quarts so i can't say from experience


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21944380 - 07/14/15 10:42 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

jjgomes said:
It isn't in the spawn. I do all bags, they are all pressure cooked, 15psi, 90 minutes, they are all fluffy white.

I realize they are the same species, but I have had all of my golden teachers and all of my cambodians colonize at noticably different rates.



Oh ok sorry you know so continue on and teach me how to overcome trich


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: tetherface]
    #21944383 - 07/14/15 10:43 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

tetherface said:
maybe try to properly pasteurize your next tub even though they say cvg lacks the beneficial bacteria and micro organisms maybe that will help idk also try to bump up your PC times to 120+ i've read some shit about sterilizing big bags for 3-4 hours on account of how long it takes to get them up to temp i use quarts so i can't say from experience




This kind of happens by default. I always clean the tubs and spray them with bleach. After the time is up on the coir, I dump that into the tub where it cools down.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21944391 - 07/14/15 10:45 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)


Trich is a parasite of cubes in the right circumstances. A facultative parasite.

Keep being a belligerent noob or buy a scope and find out how fucked your 'clean' spawn is


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: bodhisatta]
    #21944402 - 07/14/15 10:47 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:

Oh ok sorry you know so continue on and teach me how to overcome trich




Nope, I know a little. Just enough to be dangerous. You may know more than me, but you certainly didn't take the time to find out what was going on in my situation.

What I do know is that shroomery members, without gathering adequate information INSTANTLY jump to conclusions and say "you did it wrong," "obviously you messed up," "start all over." Not only is that useless, it is detrimental to people who actually want to find out what went wrong, and where. You do that through methodical testing, not through arrogant and presumptuous comments.

If you want to have a conversation where everyone learns then I am willing to do that. As you can see if you read on, I did say I haven't ruled out that as a possible outcome.


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: bodhisatta]
    #21944405 - 07/14/15 10:48 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:

Trich is a parasite of cubes in the right circumstances. A facultative parasite.

Keep being a belligerent noob or buy a scope and find out how fucked your 'clean' spawn is




First quality post from you.

Thanks, I am going to research this. This is something I didn't know.
Where are these from?


Edited by jjgomes (07/14/15 10:49 PM)


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Offlinejjgomes
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: tetherface]
    #21944439 - 07/14/15 10:57 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

tetherface said:
maybe try to properly pasteurize your next tub even though they say cvg lacks the beneficial bacteria and micro organisms maybe that will help idk also try to bump up your PC times to 120+ i've read some shit about sterilizing big bags for 3-4 hours on account of how long it takes to get them up to temp i use quarts so i can't say from experience




This is pretty interesting. My earlier attempts did use smaller bags, maybe I do need to keep them in there for additional time.

thanks


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: tetherface]
    #21944541 - 07/14/15 11:09 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

If you dont wanna consider the spawn a possibility then I have a quick question, does your pc have a pressure indicator? jesuisravi had an interesting point, but I reckon he was using an "old teched" pc. Furthermore whats the chance of you chaning your pc, and then the chance of you not telling us on top? Microscopic I think, so prob not the pc.

Which leaves me to two more solutions. You said you stored the bags a month or two after full colonization, where? Cold they be accumulating trich spores on the outside, that you then "mist" into the air and tub when you case? Btw I was under the impression that its mostly the co2/o2 levels that decide if its gonna fruit?

If all fails and youre still determined to make it work. Then go back to square one and repeat the earlier successfull, superuncontaminated tek you used for the one you talked about that had no problems. Think about it for a couple of days, try to remember as much details of what exactly you did, then repeat it to the letter. See if you still have the problem then, if you cant repeat it then maybe something changed in your enviroment.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21944593 - 07/14/15 11:23 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Galba Cubensis said:
If you dont wanna consider the spawn a possibility then I have a quick question, does your pc have a pressure indicator? jesuisravi had an interesting point, but I reckon he was using an "old teched" pc. Furthermore whats the chance of you chaning your pc, and then the chance of you not telling us on top? Microscopic I think, so prob not the pc.

Which leaves me to two more solutions. You said you stored the bags a month or two after full colonization, where? Cold they be accumulating trich spores on the outside, that you then "mist" into the air and tub when you case? Btw I was under the impression that its mostly the co2/o2 levels that decide if its gonna fruit?

If all fails and youre still determined to make it work. Then go back to square one and repeat the earlier successfull, superuncontaminated tek you used for the one you talked about that had no problems. Think about it for a couple of days, try to remember as much details of what exactly you did, then repeat it to the letter. See if you still have the problem then, if you cant repeat it then maybe something changed in your enviroment.




Sigh... I am considering it as an option.

My pressure cooker is the Presto 01781. It has a pressure gauge on it and I am always at or slightly above 15psi. I only start timing once I am at 15psi.

I inoculated a few bags. They all colonized about 2 weeks after first sign of growth. I gave one bag to a friend and his got trich, however his house is a disaster zone so I pretty much expected that to happen. I did two of my own bags and they both got trich. At that point I was just cleaning my tubs with soap and water so I went to town and cleaned up everything with sanitizer. I went out of town for a month so I rolled the bags up and I put them in my closet to stay cool (70ish) and dark while I was gone. After I got back, I started another tub and just saw a patch of grey among the majority of white patch.

While I have cleaned the area, I am growing this in the same room as the old tubs.


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OfflineGalba Cubensis
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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21944669 - 07/14/15 11:45 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Well if electricity/gas isnt a problem try leaving those suckers on for, I dunno, lets say 6 hours ok?:crazy2: That should take any insecurities we might have out of the substrate. You shouldve store it even colder I think, even maybe in the fridge. Likewise with the casing; are you sterilizing it? Dont. Pasteurizing? Do. Nothing? You need to do something!

Heres another solution: Prep two monotubs without any spawn as far away from the room you usually do it in (do you use SAB btw? if not then you might just have been really lucky the first time...), just the casing as you would prep it for spawn. Close one after the casing preparement, take the clothes out of the closet you stored the bags in, unfold them carefully one by one and shake them over the other monotub before you close this one off too. Then wait and see what they get;)

What do you mean "same area as the old tubs"? They werent cleaned? Srsly just stay away from that f place for now....

EDIT: Im assuming youre pasteurizing the casing before putting it into the tubs.


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RETARDS!  I'LL IGNORE ALL OF YOUR ADVICE!  BUT TELL ME WHAT TO DO STILL!


Edited by Galba Cubensis (07/15/15 12:16 AM)


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21944762 - 07/15/15 12:14 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

For my two cents: I'd say your syringe or whatever inoculation method you are using (I decided not to read all of the flame war) is contaminated. Like, before you put it to spawn. Golden teachers and Cambodians should be virtually the same- especially from MS. Not every single spore in your syringe would be a slo colonizer. That's just too bad of luck, so it has to be that the source itself is contaminated, especially if you are doing both at the same time.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: TravelAgency]
    #21944894 - 07/15/15 12:54 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

TravelAgency said:
For my two cents: I'd say your syringe or whatever inoculation method you are using (I decided not to read all of the flame war) is contaminated. Like, before you put it to spawn. Golden teachers and Cambodians should be virtually the same- especially from MS. Not every single spore in your syringe would be a slo colonizer. That's just too bad of luck, so it has to be that the source itself is contaminated, especially if you are doing both at the same time.




What would be the odds of getting two contaminated Cambodian syringes from two different suppliers? I'm going to have to say that maybe with the larger bags its taking longer for the centers to get up to temp and they aren't pasturizing for as long as is needed. Thats the only thing I can think of. Trich just chilling in the center of the spawn that didnt get hot enough quite long enough to kill it. That shit waits to attack, trust me. I've had it pop out from the center of what I though was a full colonized clean monstor quart PF cake. When I broke the contaminated one up it was green in the center and spreading outward. My house is a mold fucking wreck and the still air box has made it damn near impossible for me to get a contam now though. I had gotten lazy and didnt pasteurize long enough as I had a date and a deadline to get everything done in a few hours. Bad idea.

I say find someone with a decent scope and look at the spore solution under it and see if it could be both syringes are contaminated. Maybe some trich spores got inside the needle at inoculation and are chilling up there. I'd thouroughly clean your still air box as well. Could be any of those things really. Good luck man, I hope you get that nasty green bitch under control, it's the green devil.


-MIM


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: MagicInMichigan]
    #21944958 - 07/15/15 01:20 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Yep and might I add I traced all of my conams to poor inoculation technique [which I have no fixed] so... Maybe?) but I really think you got a bad syringe or two. Bad luck, but not as bad of luck as getting 2 syringes full of super slow colonizers. I just don't see that as a probability.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: TravelAgency]
    #21945999 - 07/15/15 06:25 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Even though your attitude is shit, and you didn't sterilize your bags nearly long enough the failure was still you, not insufficient sterilization. Trich would be killed off under pasteurization temps. The spawn bags look perhaps a little bacterial too which never helped anything.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: bodhisatta]
    #21946002 - 07/15/15 06:27 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Or take one fully colonized bag never spawn it to coir just cut some slits for air after full colonization and watch the trich that you don't think is in your spawn turn green in a few days.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: bodhisatta]
    #21946222 - 07/15/15 08:02 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

:whathesaid:

After making the move to grow bags last year I had a solid success rate. When I ordered larger bags the problems from hell begun. The small bags I was doing approx 4qts of spawn and in the large ones I ran 10-15qts. Out of 10 large bags I had 1 partial success which cost me hours of time, WBS and electricity.

After narrowing it down and re-reading my notes I found that the increase in size of WBS per bag didn't allow the grain in the centre of the bag to fully sterilize. So I increased the times from 90 min to 120 and then to 180 and I am currently @ a fail rate of 5%. (I used a bad syringe)

To figure this out I took a bag that was infected with mean green which only appeared in the centre top portion of the bag after it was 85% visually colonized. I cut the bag and dissected it halfway through the centre. I found that the green began almost smack dab in the centre. (I did not kneed or shake this bag)

I hope this helps. I narrowed all possibilities and this seemed to be the only one that made sense. After making the changes I have not had any more major bag failures.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: rudeboi]
    #21946267 - 07/15/15 08:15 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I lost my first tubs to trich.

Now I put everything on agar first.  Listen to bodhisatta and spacechildo.  They've been patient and have been trying to help you.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21946398 - 07/15/15 08:49 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

some people get mad if you say their spawn was dirty. they'd much rather blame the bucket tek or their mail man. never made much sense to me :shrug:


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: spacechildo]
    #21946550 - 07/15/15 09:39 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Sterilize the substrate for 6 hours (that should be sufficient even to sterilize vince vaughn's eye bags;)). If it still shows up after that you can honestly say that there isnt a faintest possibility this is your contam vector. Wouldnt that be a nice feeling? To be comepletely sure beyond any imaginable doubt? I think even 3 might be enough, but hey theres a very mild flame burning here so lets be sure:smirk:


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Edited by Galba Cubensis (07/15/15 09:40 AM)


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21946565 - 07/15/15 09:45 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

yeah, try sterilizing manure for 6 hrs to make sure its clean before you spawn to it :rofl:

You should fuck off with the advice for now galba.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: jjgomes]
    #21946627 - 07/15/15 10:09 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

jjgomes said:
Quote:

tetherface said:
maybe try to properly pasteurize your next tub even though they say cvg lacks the beneficial bacteria and micro organisms maybe that will help idk also try to bump up your PC times to 120+ i've read some shit about sterilizing big bags for 3-4 hours on account of how long it takes to get them up to temp i use quarts so i can't say from experience




This kind of happens by default. I always clean the tubs and spray them with bleach. After the time is up on the coir, I dump that into the tub where it cools down.




im not quite sure what your trying to say here the bucket isn't proper pasteurization but like bodhi said trich spores die at around 140 so i doubt its the bucket pasteurization...i really think it was your pc times, you succeeded with smaller bags at 90 min 15psi then on your next batch with much bigger bags 90 min@15psi couldn't quite get it hot enough to sterilize. as a response to your earlier post trich imo is bright white spots with a kind of crystaline structure in between the bright white...


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: tetherface]
    #21946632 - 07/15/15 10:10 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

The only place I can find anyone mentioning manure is in your post. Maybe you should spend a little more time reading and a little less flaming?


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Edited by Galba Cubensis (07/15/15 10:11 AM)


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21946640 - 07/15/15 10:13 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I could be spending way more time helping if I didnt have to clean up your mess :shrug:

stop blaming the fucking bucket tek, there's a reason coir+verm can be used non-heat treated for casing layers.

stop fuckin guessing and making claims you dont know squat about.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21946646 - 07/15/15 10:15 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Again, maybe you should spend a little more time reading... I suggested the coir+verm (called it casing) was to be pasteurized. That was several post ago. Meanwhile weve started focusing on the substrate and pcing.

tl;dr you should read more


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21946674 - 07/15/15 10:26 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

well that was terrible advice. you should fuck off with that :lol:


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21946698 - 07/15/15 10:32 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

So thats the 3rd post not specifying what I said wrong nor what "mess" you have cleaned up... Seems to me its more about the fact that you dont like me and dont want to accept me into your imaginary hirarchy of "trusted knowledge". But Ill bite, could you please school me as to why it was terrible advice? All arguments Ive gathered so far are "theres a reason bla bla works", which ofc I can replicate into "theres a reason bla bla works, until it doesnt, then theres a reason it doesnt"...


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21946721 - 07/15/15 10:38 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

if your spawn is dirty wtf does it matter what you do to your sub. especially a sub that doesnt care.

if you really wanna learn more and not just troll make your own thread, listen to what people say (unlike your last thread) and checkout frankhorrigan sbj and tl's writeups.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21946798 - 07/15/15 10:59 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Ofc I wanna learn, that thread was a mapping thread, you can learn alot about someone/a forum just by looking at how they treat morons;) And so I did, f.ex I learned that you barely have the energy to keep a civilized tone. Dunno if this is maybe cause you spend too much time here, and I really dont care, seeing as its your problem and everyone that listens to your advice based on not reading through the thread.

My first post specifically stated that Im taking into account that he doesnt want to consider his spawn the vector. Well those were the options then... Maybe the verm+coir has a close to zero contamination risk, but that doesnt mean that OP couldnt have contaminated it himself somehow, personally my money were on his clothes being full of spores and cathing a ride along on the outside of the bags cause thats what I experienced 2 weeks ago in the experiments room. The two monotubs wouldve shown wether this is the case, again, keep in mind he didnt want to consider the spawn at first for many many posts....

EDIT: Seems I also need to brush up the reading skills as I also have been able to imagine stuff during this thread, somehow I was under the impression that he was using agar, since somone mentioned it, seems I pulled a spacechildo no?


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Edited by Galba Cubensis (07/15/15 11:03 AM)


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21946807 - 07/15/15 11:00 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

:facepalm:


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: spacechildo]
    #21946830 - 07/15/15 11:08 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Spores don't germinate on coir.  You can pasteurize it, sterilize it, or even just hydrate it and spawn.

OP take your spores to agar.  Your syringe or LC or whatever you're using is dirty.  If it's happening with two syringes they're both dirty.  This is why your spawn is dirty.  It's not because you're not PCing correctly.  It's because you're injecting it with dirty syringes.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21946861 - 07/15/15 11:21 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Becuase there arent any nutrients for it to use in the mix right? What if op is handling the casing with bare hands? You think any nutrients/contams might find their way into the stuff hes handling? Or lets say the coir he bought is tainted already from the store? Did you ask him where hes from? I bet coir in france or spain has just the same  build up as yours, not to mention the exact same contam vectors and exact same cleaning procedure before it even arrives to the store. So many things to take into consideration, but better to just assume he has the exact same coir as you, since you are the center of the universe:D


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21946866 - 07/15/15 11:22 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

spacechildo said:
if your spawn is dirty wtf does it matter what you do to your sub. especially a sub that doesnt care.

if you really wanna learn more and not just troll make your own thread, listen to what people say (unlike your last thread) and checkout frankhorrigan sbj and tl's writeups.



Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
Spores don't germinate on coir.  You can pasteurize it, sterilize it, or even just hydrate it and spawn.

OP take your spores to agar.  Your syringe or LC or whatever you're using is dirty.  If it's happening with two syringes they're both dirty.  This is why your spawn is dirty.  It's not because you're not PCing correctly.  It's because you're injecting it with dirty syringes.



thats what i was thinking but 90 minutes isn't long enough for those big ass bags hes using it will kill the trich but not the bacteria and a bacterial infection causes weak myc which is then easilly taken over by trich after spawning or like we both said its a bad batch of syringes... OP most vendors will replace syringes for a nominal fee if there bad or not the vendor i use charges like 4$ and doesn't question it if i were you i'd go that route which i've done before


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21946905 - 07/15/15 11:34 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I don't work with bags so you might be right tetherface :laugh:

Quote:

Galba Cubensis said:
Becuase there arent any nutrients for it to use in the mix right? What if op is handling the casing with bare hands? You think any nutrients/contams might find their way into the stuff hes handling? Or lets say the coir he bought is tainted already from the store? Did you ask him where hes from? I bet coir in france or spain has just the same  build up as yours, not to mention the exact same contam vectors and exact same cleaning procedure before it even arrives to the store. So many things to take into consideration, but better to just assume he has the exact same coir as you, since you are the center of the universe:D




I am the center of the universe, thanks for noticing.


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: tetherface]
    #21946913 - 07/15/15 11:35 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

tetherface said:
thats what i was thinking but 90 minutes isn't long enough for those big ass bags hes using it will kill the trich but not the bacteria




I found close to nothing on lentils as a substrate, so started experimenting with that. Found out it takes forever to sterilize them, had to repc two small jars yesterday for 2 hours, after the initial one wasnt enough, Small jars! Might be because they werent hydrated good enough. The time it takes for something to sterilize in the pc compared to greater mass/volume seems exponential rather than proportional IME, might be somthing to take into consideration.

paperbackwriter, not you you... :laugh: you keep them paperbacks written!:laugh:


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Edited by Galba Cubensis (07/15/15 11:42 AM)


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21947347 - 07/15/15 01:16 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

you can spawn to straw with your bare hands given your spawn is clean. So... If you get trich not from your spawn it is likely to be a small isolated spot. If it's in your spawn you come here and say your tub turned green


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21956219 - 07/17/15 01:38 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Galba Cubensis said:
Quote:

tetherface said:
thats what i was thinking but 90 minutes isn't long enough for those big ass bags hes using it will kill the trich but not the bacteria




I found close to nothing on lentils as a substrate, so started experimenting with that. Found out it takes forever to sterilize them, had to repc two small jars yesterday for 2 hours, after the initial one wasnt enough, Small jars! Might be because they werent hydrated good enough. The time it takes for something to sterilize in the pc compared to greater mass/volume seems exponential rather than proportional IME, might be somthing to take into consideration.

paperbackwriter, not you you... :laugh: you keep them paperbacks written!:laugh:




so how did you know to re sterilize them?? did you leave them uninnoculated for several days? and are you trying to say that mass/volume doesn't matter when trying to come up with an acceptable PC time for sterilization? IME the bigger it is the longer it will take to sterilize but maybe i misunderstood your post


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: tetherface]
    #21958568 - 07/17/15 10:53 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I ment that the time it takes for it to reach the desired temperature isnt proportional to its mass. Simply said, a little more mass equals alot more time cooking for it to hit uniform temp.

Well I didnt as much "know" as "feel", it just looked awful, wet spots everywhere (keep in mind I didnt even use a pc...), and when smell started leaking out I guess I maybe "knew" more or less:

Thats the best angle, the other side was nightmarish. Shiitake mycelium, not cubes.

Also, though I think its practical meaning is rather miniscule, dont forget that substrates/substances have different mass to volume ratio too, those lentils at least are heavy as f, probably also pratially cause of better overlay meaning less airpockets pr substrate volume. If you wanna be picky about it:crazy2:

EDIT: Keep in mind I dont know shit about lentils as substrate. I mean, fucking lentils man! Lentils! So as stated earlier, it might have been that they just werent hydrated good enough too, if Ive understood the physics correctly better hydrations would lead to better heat exchange and therefore faster finish, but Im out on a lim here :S


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Edited by Galba Cubensis (07/17/15 10:59 PM)


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Re: Continual Monotub problems - Cambodian [Re: Galba Cubensis]
    #21958771 - 07/17/15 11:50 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Are you reusing old tubs that got trich before? A quick bleaching is not adequate.

Also, Damiens bucket tek is not pasteurization.

I don't know if these questions have already been asked but if you're sure it's not your spawn then that eliminates a lot of vectors.

Did your last grows go until they contaminated?  Your environment could be full of trich spores now.

Once you see the mean green, it can be hard to get rid of.

Keep trying. Try agar.  If you think cambodian mycelium "strength" is a factor then the only way to test it is to grow from your GT spores to see if you get different results. (please tell me you at least made prints?)

Wipe your walls down with alcohol and steam your carpets and get a one-room air purifier with a HEPA rated filter to eliminate a few tertiary sources of contamination.


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