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Coco coir in place of verm?
    #2194047 -

I have tried searching but that function is still down. :thumbdown:

Has anyone ever tried using coco coir in place of verm in the PF tek?

Wouldnt this work as well as the verm?

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: niteowl]
    #2194053 -

that's an interesting idea i haven't seen tried. it'd need a good sterilising, probably best with a pc.
coir has no nutritional value, and holds water well, so i bet it would work out, at least in part.
give it a try and get back to us - what's the worst that could happen?

:kiss:


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buh

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: shirley knott]
    #2194055 -

The worst is a simple waste of time.

I just got an 18 quart PC. The next time I get some spores I will try using some coir/BRF jars to see how it works.


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Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: niteowl]
    #2194056 -

Sounds like it may work. I haven't worked with coir yet but it looks rather dense - how airy is it? Maybe a touch of verm to lighten it up?
If you give it a go, I would like to see...


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"I suggest we ... learn to love our ... selves before it ... becomes illegal."

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Post deleted by Administrator [Re: niteowl]
    #2194057 -



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-Alien :cool:

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: daywalker]
    #2194062 -

Once you break coir up and add water it is very light and fluffy. When you first get it in brick form it is hard as hell real tuff to get busted up enuf to add h2o.


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Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: Alien]
    #2194101 -

I tried it twice , pressure cooked it, didn?t work, contaminated with bacteria.


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Grow Mushrooms from Spores - PF-Tek for Simple Minds

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: Anno]
    #2194107 -

Dammit, Anno!  :smile:

niteowl, maybe you could succeed where Anno failed? Now that would be worth a pat_on_the_back... check your pm


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"I suggest we ... learn to love our ... selves before it ... becomes illegal."

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: Anno]
    #2195174 -

How long did you PC the jars for?


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: niteowl]
    #2195252 -

1 hour.


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Grow Mushrooms from Spores - PF-Tek for Simple Minds

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: niteowl]
    #2195319 -

Ahoy there pirates!

When i had that question inside my empty brain in the past,
i did a simple test:
If you moist coco coir and let it stay in a plate for two weeks
it starts smelling differently than before. This simple test
shows that coco coir is NOT so dead as vermiculite.

Verm can attract no contaminants, ime, so nothing can beat it.
The reason is - i think - that verm is a rock, so no living
organism can use verm as a source for food. on the contrary,
coco coir is part of the fruit of a tree (wow, i am wicked)

lol

anyway

and last but not least, i have seen casings of mine, after
several crops, that show contamination in the coco coir
[i use for casing] and not in the mycelium itself.

:loveeyes: Merry Christmas :loveeyes:


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The living ghost of Kykeon

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: kykeon]
    #2195755 -

coco coir is nothing but fiber that shouldn't be the situation
i always thought the vermiculite was used to help it hold structure and a small ammount of water (maybe coir retains too much water)
but maybe i am mistaken
otherwise coir is aw esome for casing instead of verm

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: niteowl]
    #2195833 -

often the coco coir bricks contain also a small amount of fertilizer, this could be a source of contamination.

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: kykeon]
    #2196055 -

Isn't the purpose of pressure cooking to kill all the endospores that may be present? Unless there are some that can withstand the PC process, I am not sure if the coir is to blame for the contamination.


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"I suggest we ... learn to love our ... selves before it ... becomes illegal."

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: daywalker]
    #2197165 -

Quote:
Isn't the purpose of pressure cooking to kill all the endospores that may be present? Unless there are some that can withstand the PC process, I am not sure if the coir is to blame for the contamination.


well, if u pressure cook a stone and put it on top of a pf-like jar, no
contams will attract it. on the other side, if u pressure cook cheese and
let it on top of a pf jar, i bet my ass it will start to smell awful.

the key here is the original question: using coco coir instead of verm
on TOP of jars, where contaminants have access.


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The living ghost of Kykeon

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: kykeon]
    #2197280 -

I was talking about using coir in place of verm in the substrate. I had planned on putting dry verm on top of the coir/brf mix as a contam barrier.


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Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: kykeon]
    #2197538 -

As nitowl's reply clearly states ^^^, the original post was re: using coir instead of verm in the substrate. I can't think of a reason to use coir as the contam barrier.

My point is still valid. If the jar contams, then the contaminating organism was introduced AFTER the PCing was done. Unless some survived the process.


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"I suggest we ... learn to love our ... selves before it ... becomes illegal."

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: daywalker]
    #2197547 -

>Unless some survived the process.

This happens all the time.
Particularly bacterial endospores can be VERY hardy.


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Grow Mushrooms from Spores - PF-Tek for Simple Minds

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: Anno]
    #2197587 -

i just wonder how well it would hold together... hopefully the mycelium will keep it's shape when you try to take it out of the jar!!!..

good luck.


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-----------
Sniff, Sniff... What's that smell???... ohhhhh.!!
------------------


Pot Free for another : nevermind.. never made it..

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: Anno]
    #2197673 -

Thanks for that insight, Anno. I was unaware that they could be so robust. Would mixing some h2o2 in the substrate recipe help? Or even PCing twice at 1 hour each time kill them all or is eliminating 100% of the phuckers a pipe dream?


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"I suggest we ... learn to love our ... selves before it ... becomes illegal."

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: daywalker]
    #2198928 -

there is no point of adding hydrogen peroxide (h2o2) if u gonna boil it.
unless you use it after pcing. but then again, ime h2o2 can
hurt the spores.

so lets come to a conclusion. put verm on top of jars and everything will be
okeeeeee :smile:

:heart: :heart: :loveeyes: MEEEEERRY CHRISTMAS  :loveeyes:

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: kykeon]
    #2199277 -

I was thinking that adding h2o2 to the recipe would give that extra contam fighting factor before PCing, ya know.

I should say we will know how niteowl's experiment goes soon enough.

Hope Santa is good to all of you Shroomerites!  :stash: :spliff: :mushroom2: :nut:


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"I suggest we ... learn to love our ... selves before it ... becomes illegal."

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: daywalker]
    #2199304 -

I had thought of soaking the coir in h2o2 overnite, squeezing the h2o2 out and pasturizing in the oven. Then taking the "cleaned" coir and mixing the brf and h2o, Pc at 15-20 psi for 70-90min.


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Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: niteowl]
    #2199309 -

why not just stick with verm for jars? coir is an exceptional casing media,as anno has said,it just doesn't work in brf jars.
if you want to add something to your brf jars,do what i do and add equal parts brf and organic hulled millet.you'll like the results.


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Coaster is an idiot...
[quote]Coaster said:
but i thnk everything thats pure is white?
[/quote]



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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: Hanky]
    #2201220 -

I have thought long and hard on this subject.

Since Anno has tried twice and failed both times the problem may be rot and not a contam. Since coir is organic, the moisture and heat of PC'ing may cause the coir to start decomposing quicker.

Since verm is a mineral it cant decompose.

I will do an experiment with coir when I get spores. I will put up a grow log for future refrence to this question.


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Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: niteowl]
    #2201235 -

rot is a contam,rot wether it be dry rot damp rot etc is caused by verious moulds,fungus' and bacterias......maybe you should try thinking longer and harder about this subject.
sorry to burst your bubble.


--------------------
Coaster is an idiot...
[quote]Coaster said:
but i thnk everything thats pure is white?
[/quote]



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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: Hanky]
    #2205271 -

yeaaap. rot is a contam. just like aunt christin with her broken breast.
and yeap its xmas holidays and i am kinda high in the sky. :wink:

with this opportunity i would like to send my love to all of you guyz+girls!

:lol: :loveeyes: :nut: :smile2: :loveeyes: :lol: :tongue: :nut: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


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The living ghost of Kykeon

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: niteowl]
    #2227288 -

Grow Log

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat...;o=&fpart=1


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: niteowl]
    #2227491 -

I believe I might have an alternative to vermiculite that actually works. If it does (and so far it's showing promise), I will reveal all.


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Convert Metric and Imperial.

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: niteowl]
    #2227533 -

i use coco coir straight out of the bag with no problems, you can use verm but coir is far superior and helps protect mycelium, although straight out pasteurisation is fine i suppose

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: daywalker]
    #2227655 -

daywalker said:
I was thinking that adding h2o2 to the recipe would give that extra contam fighting factor before PCing, ya know.


H2O2 Breaks down at i believe 140 degrees(I believe thats right)but either way by the time you are done pressure cooking that H2O2 you used to fight contams will be no more than good old H2O.Thats why for example when you use it with Agar you wait untill the Agar has cooled some before adding.


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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: daywalker]
    #17018604 -

Once hydrated it is very fluffy.


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Mikey Doo

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: MikeyDoo]
    #17018653 -

:stopsign: this post is almost 9 years old chief

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Re: Coco coir in place of verm? [Re: MikeyDoo]
    #17018655 -

MikeyDoo said:
Once hydrated it is very fluffy.


You just bumped a 8+year old thread to say that? :lolz0rz:


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Cultivation
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