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zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: BoldAsLove]
#21942967 - 07/14/15 05:10 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
BoldAsLove said: Unfortunately, no. I don't see why Iran has any reason to pursue a nuclear weapon given the state of their economy right now, nor why that would be considered such a ludicrous idea.
But they are. They are not rational actors.
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xFrockx


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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: zappaisgod]
#21943170 - 07/14/15 05:57 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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All human beings are cruelly, cruelly, rational. That religion shit is all a farce, theater at best. Behind the scenes in Iran and other seemingly ridiculous countries are people who want power and excess, who have found various ways of achieving that for themselves in their conditions.
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Stonehenge
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Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: BoldAsLove]
#21943242 - 07/14/15 06:11 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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>Israel is a far stronger ally to have in the region than Iran.
With allies like that we don't need enemies.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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Centerfinger
George Clooney is a Spy!



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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: Stonehenge]
#21946472 - 07/15/15 09:11 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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I have not come to a conclusion as to what the end game plan is for this agreement. As it sits right now, I'm leaning towards the billions in arms sales to neighboring countries, as the war machine must move forward and we need new customers to buy our bombs. The only other angle I can reasonably lean towards is that once the sanctions are lifted, Iran can push their oil to the world markets to drop the price in order to put another squeeze on Russia.
But what do I know, I live a life of common sense and to be honest I could care less if the region explodes and eats itself.
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Stonehenge
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Loc: S.E.
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: Centerfinger]
#21946502 - 07/15/15 09:19 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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The squeeze on Russia is probably part of the plan plus it saves us a bundle on oil.
Why should iran be under sanctions in the first place? They broke no international rules, its all because the parasite state wants them bombed. They will do dirty work anyway and try to undo the agreement.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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BoldAsLove
Pokemon Master


Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: Stonehenge]
#21946867 - 07/15/15 11:22 AM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Stonehenge said: The squeeze on Russia is probably part of the plan plus it saves us a bundle on oil.
Why should iran be under sanctions in the first place? They broke no international rules, its all because the parasite state wants them bombed. They will do dirty work anyway and try to undo the agreement.
Iran was under sanctions in the first place because there were strong suspiscions that they were pursuing a nuclear weapon, which would be a violation of the NPT.
-------------------- DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor and Ferdinand , the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.
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Stonehenge
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Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: BoldAsLove]
#21947096 - 07/15/15 12:21 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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>Iran was under sanctions in the first place because there were strong suspiscions that they were pursuing a nuclear weapon, which would be a violation of the NPT.
"strong suspicions"? To you moonbats that is like being found guilty by a court. In the real world, it means little but usa has to jump when the parasite country says to jump. Our politicians have all taken the bribes and sworn to support them instead of the country that elected them.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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Shins
Fun guy



Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 16,337
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: Stonehenge]
#21947435 - 07/15/15 01:40 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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Iran has always denied persuing nuclear weapons and always said its nuclear program is for electricity and medicine.
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qman
Stranger

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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: Shins] 1
#21947556 - 07/15/15 02:11 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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If Iran is such a dangerous "terrorist state", why does the rest of world (Europe, China, Russia, India, ect.) do business with them? The majority of the world doesn't seem to concerned.
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BoldAsLove
Pokemon Master


Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: Stonehenge]
#21947893 - 07/15/15 03:18 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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[quote][b][i]Stonehenge said:[/i][/b] >Iran was under sanctions in the first place because there were strong suspiscions that they were pursuing a nuclear weapon, which would be a violation of the NPT.
"strong suspicions"? To you moonbats that is like being found guilty by a court. In the real world, it means little but usa has to jump when the parasite country says to jump. Our politicians have all taken the bribes and sworn to support them instead of the country that elected them.[/quote]
Are you incapable of making a post without calling people names? You should be able to state your case without resorting to elementary school-style insults
Iran wasn't found guilty, but that doesn't matter. Countries are free to choose who they wish to do business with. Most of the world, not just the U.S., decided not to do business with them until they could convince the world the nuclear technology was for peaceful uses only. What's the problem with that?
-------------------- DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor and Ferdinand , the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.
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Stonehenge
Alt Center


Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: BoldAsLove]
#21947950 - 07/15/15 03:28 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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>Iran wasn't found guilty, but that doesn't matter.
It doesn't matter to the moonbats, no. Why then should they be sanctioned and threatened with war?
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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nooneman


Registered: 04/24/09
Posts: 14,561
Loc: Utah
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: xFrockx]
#21947974 - 07/15/15 03:31 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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Does anyone actually believe that iran is going to follow through with ANYTHING they agreed to? Anyone? I didn't think so.
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BoldAsLove
Pokemon Master


Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: Stonehenge]
#21947990 - 07/15/15 03:33 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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Once again with the name calling.
It matters because if I'm a country I can choose who I wish to do business with and who I don't, regardless of if they've been convicted of a crime or not. In my personal life I tend not to associate with shady, back-alley bomb makers, even if they've never been caught. It's the same situation here. Why does it bother you so much that most of the world is against Iran having a nuclear weapon and will take steps to prevent that?
-------------------- DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor and Ferdinand , the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.
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BoldAsLove
Pokemon Master


Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: nooneman]
#21947994 - 07/15/15 03:34 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
nooneman said: Does anyone actually believe that iran is going to follow through with ANYTHING they agreed to? Anyone? I didn't think so. 
I'm confident they will for at least a little while. They don't want to risk another round of sanctions.
-------------------- DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor and Ferdinand , the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.
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Stonehenge
Alt Center


Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: BoldAsLove]
#21948289 - 07/15/15 04:43 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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>Once again with the name calling
Once again false
>Why does it bother you so much that most of the world is against Iran having a nuclear weapon and will take steps to prevent that?
I'm in favor of fairness and justice. Having our war machine used for wrong things like that makes me mad. We pay taxes under threat of prison our money and it gets used like that. Sanctions too cost us money and loss of prestige.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: Stonehenge]
#21948672 - 07/15/15 06:00 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Stonehenge said: The squeeze on Russia is probably part of the plan plus it saves us a bundle on oil.
Why should iran be under sanctions in the first place? They broke no international rules, its all because the parasite state wants them bombed. They will do dirty work anyway and try to undo the agreement.
Saves who on oil? We don't give a fuck.
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Stonehenge
Alt Center


Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: zappaisgod]
#21948805 - 07/15/15 06:33 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
zappaisgod said:
Quote:
Stonehenge said: The squeeze on Russia is probably part of the plan plus it saves us a bundle on oil.
Why should iran be under sanctions in the first place? They broke no international rules, its all because the parasite state wants them bombed. They will do dirty work anyway and try to undo the agreement.
Saves who on oil? We don't give a fuck.
"Saves who on oil? We don't give a fuck."
Who is the we? Are you queen Elizabeth using the royal we? Most sane people care about the cost of oil because it impacts their lifestyle a lot. We know you hate Iranians and all brown people.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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starfire_xes
I Am 'They'



Registered: 10/24/09
Posts: 21,590
Loc: Dallas with all the assho...
Last seen: 7 months, 2 days
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: BoldAsLove]
#21949202 - 07/15/15 08:15 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
BoldAsLove said:
Quote:
nooneman said: Does anyone actually believe that iran is going to follow through with ANYTHING they agreed to? Anyone? I didn't think so. 
I'm confident they will for at least a little while. They don't want to risk another round of sanctions.

They got their deal. In the new 'treaty' or whatever it is called, if sanctions are called for again, Iran is 1) Allowed to appeal the sanctions or 2) Break the treaty at their discretion.
In other words, they can do as they please. You honestly think that this country, who has the stated goal of the elimination of Israel, who mocked the US and Obama while talks where ongoing, and who publicly stated that any agreement reached would not affect their own sovereign nuclear program, is going to stick to their word?
You people must be high. Next, do you trust Obama for ANYTHING related to foreign policy? Look at the fucking mess foreign policy is in. Arab Spring is a case in point.
I agree we shouldn't interfere in foreign sovereign matters. What do we do? Well we need a leader. And he is the kind of leader who makes it perfectly clear that if they jerk our chain, they pay.
Kind of like the big, dumb kid in school who bullies pick on all day. Then the day he has had enough, they pick on him one time to often and he puts one of them in the hospital.
The US needs a leader that 'walks softly and carry a big stick' Not sending troops in, not making deals, not getting americans killed for 'nation-building' and 'democracy'
Once we have a leader that 'puts a country in the hospital' for stepping on us, it won't happen again.
American foreign policy is fucking stupid. That's why people fuck with us.
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Stonehenge
Alt Center


Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: starfire_xes]
#21949218 - 07/15/15 08:19 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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Star, I agree with much of that, obumble's policies have varied from foolish to insane. But I have to disagree with one or two things.
>You honestly think that this country, who has the stated goal of the elimination of Israel...
That is not the country's stated goal. A few hotheads said some things. Compare that to some of the loony statements from the likes of mccaine, graham, and others. Do they make national policy? No.
>The US needs a leader that 'walks softly and carry a big stick' Not sending troops in, not making deals, not getting americans killed for 'nation-building' and 'democracy'
Exactly, we have no business in Iraq or any of those other countries we are meddling in. For that matter, we have no business messing with iran. Why go after them when n korea is run by a certifiable lunatic who already has nuke and missiles too? How can you justify letting them slide and bashing the hell out of iran?
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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starfire_xes
I Am 'They'



Registered: 10/24/09
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Re: Here's what the Iran Negotiations are really about, probably [Re: starfire_xes]
#21949344 - 07/15/15 08:58 PM (8 years, 6 months ago) |
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That was more or less my point. And some 'conservative' whose name I don't remember, said a couple of years ago that N Korea was a much greater threat to the US and we were focusing in the wrong direction.
But our credibility is shot. We negotiated from a point of weakness. Iran knows that Obama makes idle threats, like his 'red-line' in Syria. They have us pegged for being weak. A leader doesn't make a threat he can't enforce.
The world is more dangerous because of this 'deal' and because o O's lack o leadership.
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