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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21897740 - 07/04/15 05:32 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Coming from the guy who thinks it's not the job of the Supreme Court to decide on the constitutionality of laws, that doesn't mean much.




Ironically, judicial review is a power that SCOTUS gave to itself.  Congress allowed it, and it's been that way ever since. 


http://www.uscourts.gov/about-federal-courts/educational-resources/about-educational-outreach/activity-resources/about

Quote:

Judicial Review

The best-known power of the Supreme Court is judicial review, or the ability of the Court to declare a Legislative or Executive act in violation of the Constitution, is not found within the text of the Constitution itself. The Court established this doctrine in the case of Marbury v. Madison (1803).

In this case, the Court had to decide whether an Act of Congress or the Constitution was the supreme law of the land. The Judiciary Act of 1789 gave the Supreme Court original jurisdiction to issue writs of mandamus (legal orders compelling government officials to act in accordance with the law). A suit was brought under this Act, but the Supreme Court noted that the Constitution did not permit the Court to have original jurisdiction in this matter. Since Article VI of the Constitution establishes the Constitution as the Supreme Law of the Land, the Court held that an Act of Congress that is contrary to the Constitution could not stand. In subsequent cases, the Court also established its authority to strike down state laws found to be in violation of the Constitution.

Before the passage of the Fourteenth Amendment (1869), the provisions of the Bill of Rights were only applicable to the federal government. After the Amendment's passage, the Supreme Court began ruling that most of its provisions were applicable to the states as well. Therefore, the Court has the final say over when a right is protected by the Constitution or when a Constitutional right is violated.




--------------------


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InvisibleRan-D
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #21897776 - 07/04/15 05:37 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
I'm going to marry my cats soon and get tax deductions for them as dependents.




Nobody gives a shit about your cats. :crankey:


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: Ran-D]
    #21897815 - 07/04/15 05:44 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I do.  I love them.


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Offlinenicechrisman
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #21897823 - 07/04/15 05:46 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Then why don't you marry them?


--------------------
"Cosmic Love is absolutelely ruthless and highly indifferent:
it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."

John C. Lily

 


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InvisibleRan-D
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: nicechrisman]
    #21897836 - 07/04/15 05:48 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)



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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: Ran-D]
    #21897956 - 07/04/15 06:15 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

What are you doing with Lola you fuck?  Imma gonna find you and do that to you


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OfflinePatlal
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21898065 - 07/04/15 06:47 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
Well, if you take all the elected official, most of them are Republicans so it explains a lot




Are all Canadians so naive or is it just you?



Note that Americans, rightly, dislike Congress mo matter who's in charge.

Also note, the highest ratings were for Republican congresses.




2012 House seats:

Rep: 234
Dem: 201

2014 Senate seats:

Dem: 53
Rep: 45

Total:

Rep: 279
Dem: 250

Republicans wins, thefore I'm right, there are more republican elected officials in Washinton than there are Democrats

Learn your own damm country..


--------------------


Edited by Patlal (07/04/15 07:04 PM)


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OfflineMichAnon.ael
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #21898081 - 07/04/15 06:56 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

This is a Franklin quote from after the conventions.

“Well, Doctor, what have we got—a Republic or a Monarchy?”

  “A Republic, if you can keep it.” - Ben Franklin

on the side convo, an american telling others they don't know our country and to mind their biz is just funny


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: Patlal]
    #21898139 - 07/04/15 07:16 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
Well, if you take all the elected official, most of them are Republicans so it explains a lot




Are all Canadians so naive or is it just you?



Note that Americans, rightly, dislike Congress mo matter who's in charge.

Also note, the highest ratings were for Republican congresses.




2012 House seats:

Rep: 234
Dem: 201

2014 Senate seats:

Dem: 53
Rep: 45

Total:

Rep: 279
Dem: 250

Republicans wins, thefore I'm right, there are more republican elected officials in Washinton than there are Democrats

Learn your own damm country..






Quote:

so it explains a lot




I know my country. I also know what you said. You attributed the unpopularity of Congress to Republican politicians being the majority. I merely pointed out the stupidity of that statement and that Congress has been unpopular no matter which party is in power.

Perhaps fewer stupid statements from you regarding American politics are in order. Perhaps some day you'll have the wisdom to know that the main difference between parties here is not that one won't fuck you and the other will, but that the two parties simply fuck you in different ways.

Should that day arrive, you'll might actually have some interesting insights into American politics. Perhaps, but not likely.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


Edited by luvdemshrooms (07/04/15 07:22 PM)


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: ballsalsa]
    #21898154 - 07/04/15 07:21 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Marbury v. Madison




I'm aware of Marby v. Madison but thanks.

Whether they had the power 212 years ago or 213, it's the accepted system today and has been for 2 centuries.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21898163 - 07/04/15 07:23 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

It isn't even what most people think it is and it most certainly was not universally supported by the founders.


--------------------


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #21898177 - 07/04/15 07:27 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Whether they had the power 212 years ago or 213, it's the accepted system today and has been for 2 centuries.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Registered: 03/11/15
Posts: 20,860
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21898190 - 07/04/15 07:30 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Marbury v. Madison




I'm aware of Marby v. Madison but thanks.

Whether they had the power 212 years ago or 213, it's the accepted system today and has been for 2 centuries.




i thought this thread was about what the founders would think...

i'm just saying, jeffereson and madison might not like where SCOTUS ended up powerwise.:shrug:


--------------------


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Posts: 34,247
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: ballsalsa]
    #21898194 - 07/04/15 07:32 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
i thought this thread was about what the founders would think...




It's a rare event indeed when a thread stays completely on topic.


Quote:

i'm just saying, jeffereson and madison might not like where SCOTUS ended up powerwise.




And they might like it very much. We'll never know.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21898218 - 07/04/15 07:40 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

but we can make an educated guess that since they definitely didn't like the result of Marbury v Madison, its likely that they would not like the far sweeping powers granted by that decision. 

BTW, just because its been accepted for 2 centuries, doesn't mean congress couldn't challenge it now or in the future.

(personally, i think it makes sense, especially since amendments could be made to the constitution at any time if enough people disagree with SCOTUS)


--------------------


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OfflinePatlal
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21898236 - 07/04/15 07:46 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
Well, if you take all the elected official, most of them are Republicans so it explains a lot




Are all Canadians so naive or is it just you?



Note that Americans, rightly, dislike Congress mo matter who's in charge.

Also note, the highest ratings were for Republican congresses.




2012 House seats:

Rep: 234
Dem: 201

2014 Senate seats:

Dem: 53
Rep: 45

Total:

Rep: 279
Dem: 250

Republicans wins, thefore I'm right, there are more republican elected officials in Washinton than there are Democrats

Learn your own damm country..






Quote:

so it explains a lot




I know my country. I also know what you said. You attributed the unpopularity of Congress to Republican politicians being the majority. I merely pointed out the stupidity of that statement and that Congress has been unpopular no matter which party is in power.

Perhaps fewer stupid statements from you regarding American politics are in order. Perhaps some day you'll have the wisdom to know that the main difference between parties here is not that one won't fuck you and the other will, but that the two parties simply fuck you in different ways.

Should that day arrive, you'll might actually have some interesting insights into American politics. Perhaps, but not likely.




I admire your cynicism.

So basically, the government is your enemy and it'll fuck you over no matter what. With that mentality, your country will achieve nothing.

When you guys start seeing your government as an ally to your own success, maybe things will get better. The government is your goaltender, it keeps you in the game. You guys have to go out there and score the goals.


--------------------


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OfflineNcogneato
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: ballsalsa] * 1
    #21898237 - 07/04/15 07:47 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Well, regardless of everyone's personal opinion. I think most of us can agree to come together over the next couple of hours and do what Americans do best. BLOW SHIT UP!
Enjoy the firework festivities everyone!


--------------------
Psilocybin.........the poor man's Cancun.
                   


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: Patlal]
    #21898320 - 07/04/15 08:08 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
I admire your cynicism.




You should.


Quote:

So basically, the government is your enemy and it'll fuck you over no matter what. With that mentality, your country will achieve nothing.




Nope. With that mentality, the people keep a closer eye on their elected officials. A government needs to earn the trust of its people. Sadly, ours has not.


Quote:

When you guys start seeing your government as an ally to your own success, maybe things will get better. The government is your goaltender, it keeps you in the game. You guys have to go out there and score the goals.




Fortunately, enough of us recognize what shitbags the stupidity of many Americans has saddled us with. A limited government is the best government. The government commits the fouls, the referees (courts and people) keep them mostly in line.

R. Reagan said some dumb things, he said some wise ones. One of his wisest was: “In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem.”


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Registered: 03/11/15
Posts: 20,860
Loc: Foreign Lands
Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21898339 - 07/04/15 08:13 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

and one of his dumbest:  "If you've seen one redwood, you've seen them all."


--------------------


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: America's Fore Fathers: Would they approve? [Re: ballsalsa]
    #21898341 - 07/04/15 08:14 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
but we can make an educated guess that since they definitely didn't like the result of Marbury v Madison, its likely that they would not like the far sweeping powers granted by that decision.




There's not much point in guessing what people thought 200 years ago.


Quote:

BTW, just because its been accepted for 2 centuries, doesn't mean congress couldn't challenge it now or in the future.




Congress has the power. Congress is feckless.


Quote:

(personally, i think it makes sense, especially since amendments could be made to the constitution at any time if enough people disagree with SCOTUS)




I'm partial to the current system, though I don't always agree with the decisions.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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