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OfflinePatlal
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: qman]
    #21937130 - 07/13/15 12:30 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
Also I watched his entire Arizona speech and I swear to god, I think his leaning towards universal healthcare.

If there 's one guy that can convince the conservative that universal health care is the way to go, its trump




Who's going to convince the liberal Democrat that's bought and paid for by the health care lobbyists.




The word "universal healthcare" should convince all the liberal. It's their ultimate goal...




Please tell us all the Democrats that stood up and said the ACA was a capitalist health care program and "universal health care" was the best solution, I will save you the effort, it never happened.

They are all bought and paid for, the US health care system is going to remain for profit, Obama is a sellout liar about the ACA.




Obamacare was supposed to be universal healthcare but he had to water it down to please the Republican. It can't be done. It's one way or the other. He tried to breed a pigeon with an elephant and now that freak animal has to be put down.


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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Patlal]
    #21937139 - 07/13/15 12:34 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I think Bernie Sanders would be a bit more insistent.


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Offlineqman
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Patlal]
    #21937157 - 07/13/15 12:39 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Patlal said:
Also I watched his entire Arizona speech and I swear to god, I think his leaning towards universal healthcare.

If there 's one guy that can convince the conservative that universal health care is the way to go, its trump




Who's going to convince the liberal Democrat that's bought and paid for by the health care lobbyists.




The word "universal healthcare" should convince all the liberal. It's their ultimate goal...




Please tell us all the Democrats that stood up and said the ACA was a capitalist health care program and "universal health care" was the best solution, I will save you the effort, it never happened.

They are all bought and paid for, the US health care system is going to remain for profit, Obama is a sellout liar about the ACA.




Obamacare was supposed to be universal healthcare but he had to water it down to please the Republican. It can't be done. It's one way or the other. He tried to breed a pigeon with an elephant and now that freak animal has to be put down.




"Obamacare was supposed to be universal health care"

Please don't tell us you're this naive?  Why did the health care lobbyists spend billions and billions on DEMOCRATS to go broke with a universal non-profit health care plan???????  Obamacare was a capitalist health care plan from day one, don't buy into the political propoganda.

Let me ask you a question?  How many times did a D or R mention the word health care lobbyists during the 2 year debate on the ACA?  NEVER.

Both parties were bought and paid for by the SAME corporate interests.


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InvisibleShins
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: qman]
    #21937259 - 07/13/15 01:05 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Obamacare is not capitalist. Please.

it is fascism.


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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Shins]
    #21937271 - 07/13/15 01:08 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Obamacare is not capitalist. Please.

it is fascism.




It is state Capitalism.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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InvisibleShins
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #21937292 - 07/13/15 01:14 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

State capitalism doesn't exist, its called fascism; th merger of stae and corporation.

capitalism = its up to you to buy your own private insurance but there are no laws to force you to.


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OnlineThe Ecstatic
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Registered: 11/11/09
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Shins]
    #21937297 - 07/13/15 01:16 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
State capitalism doesn't exist, its called fascism; th merger of stae and corporation.




This. Its crony capitalism at best.


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InvisibleShins
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #21937302 - 07/13/15 01:17 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

Shins said:
State capitalism doesn't exist, its called fascism; th merger of stae and corporation.




This. Its crony capitalism at best.






Crony capitalism doesn't exist either, its fascism.

quit trying to slander Capitalism by tacking it on to the end of some made up term that refers to something which is not capitalism  at all.


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InvisibleShins
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Shins]
    #21937321 - 07/13/15 01:23 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Fascism should more appropriately be called Corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power

-Benito Mussolini



And fascism is the inevitable result of socialism.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Road_to_Serfdom

http://jim.com/hayek.htm

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-06-05/road-serfdom-cartoons


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Edited by Shins (07/13/15 01:31 PM)


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OfflinePatlal
You ask too many questions
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Shins]
    #21937381 - 07/13/15 01:41 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Let's just agree that Obamacare traded a problem for another.

I'll never thoroughly understand the US healthcare system given that I've never had to shop for insurance or pay the premiums and deal with everything that you guys have to deal with, but based on what I've read, the poor now have almost free health care while the medium class workers can't afford insurance anymore. Whether I'm right or wrong with the previous statement, one thing is for sure. Obamacare does not truly care for everybody and in the end it doesn't treat everyone equally.

Either go full private or universal. Or better yet, have a universal system with an independent private system for those who want to pay for faster treatment. It's what Germany, France,UK, Canada have been doing (canada a bit less but were getting there) and it works wonderfully


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21937390 - 07/13/15 01:44 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
But why should they get amnesty, welfare, social services, etc without paying any taxes and while they are illegal? We know obumble's motive, he wants them to vote dem.




A lot of illegals do pay taxes, more than the average person as filing for a refund using a dead person's SSN is a lot harder than finding work.  For similar reasons I've never met an illegal that collected any sort of welfare or social security.

I can't argue with Dems being pro-immigrant to pull in the Hispanic vote.  I like to think not wanting to break up families (i.e. compassion) plays some role but I'd be naive not to admit that there's a political motivation at play too.

Quote:

And the libs of course are against voter id. I wonder why?




I'm against them because I grew up poor.  There's been periods of my life were $20 was a burden.  I've also seen very little cheating in my life when it comes to voting and what I have seen has been in the form of ballot box tampering.  Especially the modern electronic ones.

In my home state I also saw a large budget cut to the DMV.  I'm not sure what it's like where I live now, a state that does have voter ID laws, but I do know that at one point in my life even getting to a DMV was a pain in the ass because the state had closed down so many of them.

I also know that there's people that have it harder than I ever did.  So there ya go.


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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OnlineThe Ecstatic
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Shins]
    #21937482 - 07/13/15 02:10 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

Shins said:
State capitalism doesn't exist, its called fascism; th merger of stae and corporation.




This. Its crony capitalism at best.






Crony capitalism doesn't exist either, its fascism.

quit trying to slander Capitalism by tacking it on to the end of some made up term that refers to something which is not capitalism  at all.




Well you don't get true capitalism (or true communism) as long as governments exist, so we just don't use those words anymore?

Come on. A vast majority of nations employ capitalism, and a vast majority of them are impoverished and debt ridden. What else needs to happen to allow criticism of capitalism?


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21937505 - 07/13/15 02:15 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

If someone does not drive they can get a state issued id card. Its not that hard, but the libs want illegals to vote early and often.

How many usa citizens don't have some form of id?


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“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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Offlineqman
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Shins]
    #21937523 - 07/13/15 02:21 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

Shins said:
State capitalism doesn't exist, its called fascism; th merger of stae and corporation.




This. Its crony capitalism at best.






Crony capitalism doesn't exist either, its fascism.

quit trying to slander Capitalism by tacking it on to the end of some made up term that refers to something which is not capitalism  at all.




If there are companies making real profits that shareholders can enjoy and those results come from legislation written by the corporate lobbyists, that is crony capitalism.

It's really no different than the bailouts of the banks, crony capitalism.


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InvisibleShins
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21937527 - 07/13/15 02:22 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Hardly any countties are even close to capitslist these dsys, in fact I can't even think of one.  Methinks you don't know the meaning of capitalism.


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OnlineThe Ecstatic
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: qman]
    #21937531 - 07/13/15 02:23 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Shins wants every negative effect of capitalism sequestered under a completely different word.

I'm sure he feels the same about socialism and communism.


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InvisibleShins
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Shins]
    #21937535 - 07/13/15 02:24 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Calling bailouts capitalism?  You guys must be hallucinating on drugs.


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OnlineThe Ecstatic
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: Shins]
    #21937544 - 07/13/15 02:26 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Hardly any countties are even close to capitslist these dsys, in fact I can't even think of one.  Methinks you don't know the meaning of capitalism.




Oh, sweet child, bless your heart.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_economic_freedom

Hint: the most economically free are the most capitalist.


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OnlineThe Ecstatic
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #21937546 - 07/13/15 02:28 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Regardless, virtually all nations have mixed economies so this is a stupid argument.


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InvisibleShins
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Re: So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day... [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #21937628 - 07/13/15 02:51 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

Shins said:
Hardly any countties are even close to capitslist these dsys, in fact I can't even think of one.  Methinks you don't know the meaning of capitalism.




Oh, sweet child, bless your heart.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_economic_freedom

Hint: the most economically free are the most capitalist.




it doesn't work like that.


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