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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21905767 - 07/06/15 03:39 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

No, not someone but the govt suing universities and businesses for alleged discrimination based on the fact they didn't fill their quotas. Quotas don't exist but if you miss them, comes a lawsuit and big expenses. They don't have quotas any more, they renamed them to something else, "targets" or some bullshit.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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Offlineqman
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Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21907079 - 07/06/15 08:40 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
No, not someone but the govt suing universities and businesses for alleged discrimination based on the fact they didn't fill their quotas. Quotas don't exist but if you miss them, comes a lawsuit and big expenses. They don't have quotas any more, they renamed them to something else, "targets" or some bullshit.




He missed the thread when I proved it a few hundred times and 1-2 still refused the evidence based on nothing more than spite. :lol:


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21908618 - 07/07/15 07:58 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
No, not someone but the govt suing universities and businesses for alleged discrimination based on the fact they didn't fill their quotas. Quotas don't exist but if you miss them, comes a lawsuit and big expenses. They don't have quotas any more, they renamed them to something else, "targets" or some bullshit.




Not for quotas.  One is a landlord not fixing his African-American tenants property.  Another is a school firing a transgender woman for wanting to transition.  The third was voter discrimination via voter ID laws.

Anyway if that's the best you got I'm done.  You're either crazy or a troll.  Either way there's no point argueing with you.


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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Offlineqman
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Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21908649 - 07/07/15 08:11 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

The message is very clear to companies, don't hire enough females or minorities and get sued for "discrimination", that's called quotas in disguise.


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: qman]
    #21908684 - 07/07/15 08:24 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
The message is very clear to companies, don't hire enough females or minorities and get sued for "discrimination", that's called quotas in disguise.




That's not what happened.  Read the articles Stonehenge posted. 

A male professor was hired.  He decided he wanted to transition to a woman.  The head of HR wanted to fire him because having a transperson's around was offensive to the HR person's 'religious beliefs'.  That's not a quota, that's flat out discrimination.

North Carolina scaled back early voting and imposed strict voter ID laws.  The justice department sued them.  Again nothing to do remotely with quotas.

I'll just quote the third case.

Quote:

The complaint, filed in the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of North Carolina, names Cochran and three related corporate entities – EKP LLC, WRC LLC and Emlan Properties LLC – that own or owned the various properties managed by Cochran.  The complaint alleges that Cochran delayed or refused to perform maintenance or repairs at properties rented by African-Americans and refused to credit them for repairs they paid for or made themselves; verbally harassed African-American tenants with racial slurs and epithets, having made statements indicating that he disfavored African-American tenants; and threatened, harassed and retaliated against African-American tenants who resisted his discriminatory housing practices.




Again no quotas.  No one was being sued for not renting to blacks but rather how they treated the blacks they did rent too.

I stand by my assertion.  Stonehenge is either trolling or flat out crazy.


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21908688 - 07/07/15 08:26 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

That is what happened


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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Offlineqman
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Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21908698 - 07/07/15 08:30 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
Quote:

qman said:
The message is very clear to companies, don't hire enough females or minorities and get sued for "discrimination", that's called quotas in disguise.




That's not what happened.  Read the articles Stonehenge posted. 

A male professor was hired.  He decided he wanted to transition to a woman.  The head of HR wanted to fire him because having a transperson's around was offensive to the HR person's 'religious beliefs'.  That's not a quota, that's flat out discrimination.

North Carolina scaled back early voting and imposed strict voter ID laws.  The justice department sued them.  Again nothing to do remotely with quotas.

I'll just quote the third case.

Quote:

The complaint, filed in the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of North Carolina, names Cochran and three related corporate entities – EKP LLC, WRC LLC and Emlan Properties LLC – that own or owned the various properties managed by Cochran.  The complaint alleges that Cochran delayed or refused to perform maintenance or repairs at properties rented by African-Americans and refused to credit them for repairs they paid for or made themselves; verbally harassed African-American tenants with racial slurs and epithets, having made statements indicating that he disfavored African-American tenants; and threatened, harassed and retaliated against African-American tenants who resisted his discriminatory housing practices.




Again no quotas.  No one was being sued for not renting to blacks but rather how they treated the blacks they did rent too.

I stand by my assertion.  Stonehenge is either trolling or flat out crazy.




I'm not talking out those cases, I'm talking about the EEOC in general.


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: qman]
    #21908741 - 07/07/15 08:48 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

The Supreme Court overturned quotas in Gratz v Bollinger.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gratz_v._Bollinger

I've worked in the private sector in a capacity that required me to interview and hire applicants.  The EEOC isn't about quotas and isn't enforced via them.  If it was Facebook would be getting sued right now.

http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jun/25/facebook-diversity-report-black-white-women-employees


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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Offlineqman
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Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21908758 - 07/07/15 08:53 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
The Supreme Court overturned quotas in Gratz v Bollinger.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gratz_v._Bollinger

I've worked in the private sector in a capacity that required me to interview and hire applicants.  The EEOC isn't about quotas and isn't enforced via them.  If it was Facebook would be getting sued right now.

http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jun/25/facebook-diversity-report-black-white-women-employees




Facebook will do what many other companies do, start of program to enhance "cultural diversity" in the workplace. It's coming, just a matter of time.


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: qman]
    #21908767 - 07/07/15 08:56 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

As they should.  It's not only a smart business decision it's good for society as a whole.

Read the article.


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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Offlineqman
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Posts: 34,927
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Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21908782 - 07/07/15 09:04 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
As they should.  It's not only a smart business decision it's good for society as a whole.

Read the article.




Why is being forced to hire unqualified employees "a smart business decision"?  It's not.

"it's good for society as a whole"

No it's not, the unqualified minority feels embarrassed about their incompetency and the moral of the other employees drops off a cliff.


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: qman]
    #21908830 - 07/07/15 09:22 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

You didn't read the article or you did and you're strawmanning.

Quote:

“There’s more work to do. We remain deeply committed to building a workplace that reflects a broad range of experience, thought, geography, age, background, gender, sexual orientation, language, culture and many other characteristics,” she said. It’s a big task, one that will take time to achieve, but our whole company continues to embrace this challenge.”

In May Zuckerberg said: “We have the same talent bar for everyone. But we want to find a disproportionate number of candidates who are women and minorities.”

He has also said that there is “just so much research that shows that diverse teams perform better at anything you’re trying to do”.

“It’s this problem because it’s not even clear where you would start attacking it. You need to start earlier in the funnel so that girls don’t self-select out of doing computer science education, but at the same time, one of the big reasons why today we have this issue is that there aren’t a lot of women in the field today.”




No one is talking about unqualified applicants.  In fact this is part of the reason affirmative action exists, so we have more diverse qualified applicants.

And yes, it is good for business and society.  Facebook for instance is a huge social media corporation.  Having most of your business perspective come from white cis males is a very narrow view from which to grow a business, especially one like Facebook.

The same reasoning applies to society as a whole.


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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Offlineqman
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Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21908856 - 07/07/15 09:31 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
You didn't read the article or you did and you're strawmanning.

Quote:

“There’s more work to do. We remain deeply committed to building a workplace that reflects a broad range of experience, thought, geography, age, background, gender, sexual orientation, language, culture and many other characteristics,” she said. It’s a big task, one that will take time to achieve, but our whole company continues to embrace this challenge.”

In May Zuckerberg said: “We have the same talent bar for everyone. But we want to find a disproportionate number of candidates who are women and minorities.”

He has also said that there is “just so much research that shows that diverse teams perform better at anything you’re trying to do”.

“It’s this problem because it’s not even clear where you would start attacking it. You need to start earlier in the funnel so that girls don’t self-select out of doing computer science education, but at the same time, one of the big reasons why today we have this issue is that there aren’t a lot of women in the field today.”




No one is talking about unqualified applicants.  In fact this is part of the reason affirmative action exists, so we have more diverse qualified applicants.

And yes, it is good for business and society.  Facebook for instance is a huge social media corporation.  Having most of your business perspective come from white cis males is a very narrow view from which to grow a business, especially one like Facebook.

The same reasoning applies to society as a whole.




So if the idea for hiring minorities is so good, why has Facebook avoided it so much?  They didn't become a $240 billion company because they mismanage.  :lol:


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: qman]
    #21908870 - 07/07/15 09:36 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

They're not avoiding it.  In fact they're embracing it.  There's just no one to hire.

Anyway there's no feds busting down Facebook's door and no one is suing them.  There's no quotas.  You guys can take off your tinfoil hats now.  Or go post in the conspiracy forum.  Doesn't matter to me.


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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Offlineqman
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Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21908898 - 07/07/15 09:42 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
They're not avoiding it.  In fact they're embracing it.  There's just no one to hire.

Anyway there's no feds busting down Facebook's door and no one is suing them.  There's no quotas.  You guys can take off your tinfoil hats now.  Or go post in the conspiracy forum.  Doesn't matter to me.




Yet, the company has to file a EEO report and is now addressing the lack of diversity.  If their demographics didn't matter, why the effort to make change within the company?

"There's no quotas"

Yes we know the official rules, but FB will still have them.


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InvisibleDieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: qman]
    #21908943 - 07/07/15 09:50 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
The message is very clear to companies, don't hire enough females or minorities and get sued for "discrimination", that's called quotas in disguise.




Before hiring we are clearly told to look for females and minorities.  Our HR, and company culture, is to interview a female or minority who has a shred of qualification.  For a white male to be interviewed he needs to be very qualified and experienced.  I'm not sure that this is for fear of discrimination lawsuits, I think its the culture of white guilt and black privilege.  They all just march along it as though its the way things have to be (and should be).

I've seen women and minorities have institutionalized advantages over me my whole life.  My observations and feelings don't count though.  :shrug:


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: qman]
    #21908952 - 07/07/15 09:52 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

All companies with 100+ employees or that make more than $50,000 a year have to file EOO reports.

http://www.eeoc.gov/employers/eeo1survey/faq.cfm

Mark explained the reason they want more diversity.  I'm sure not wanting to appear discriminatory is good too.  Here's another article from Facebook on the company's stance.

https://newsroom.fb.com/news/2015/06/driving-diversity-at-facebook/


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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Offlineqman
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Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #21908974 - 07/07/15 09:58 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
All companies with 100+ employees or that make more than $50,000 a year have to file EOO reports.

http://www.eeoc.gov/employers/eeo1survey/faq.cfm

Mark explained the reason they want more diversity.  I'm sure not wanting to appear discriminatory is good too.  Here's another article from Facebook on the company's stance.

https://newsroom.fb.com/news/2015/06/driving-diversity-at-facebook/




Facebook is dealing with the issue the best they can AFTER the fact, if you can't see that reality I don't what to tell you. 

Mark is a businessman, he knows all the right things to say in public, why would you ever think his words are sincere?  :rofl2:


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: qman]
    #21909004 - 07/07/15 10:07 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

You could supply a link supporting your quotas argument.

So far all we have is a large business not being sued even though they're mostly hiring white males.

Rather Mark says what he does because it's good PR or because he means what he says is really another discussion.  For the record I believe it's a bit of both.


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Does black privilege exist? [Re: DieCommie]
    #21909098 - 07/07/15 10:26 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

DieCommie said:
Quote:

qman said:
The message is very clear to companies, don't hire enough females or minorities and get sued for "discrimination", that's called quotas in disguise.




Before hiring we are clearly told to look for females and minorities.  Our HR, and company culture, is to interview a female or minority who has a shred of qualification.  For a white male to be interviewed he needs to be very qualified and experienced.  I'm not sure that this is for fear of discrimination lawsuits, I think its the culture of white guilt and black privilege.  They all just march along it as though its the way things have to be (and should be).

I've seen women and minorities have institutionalized advantages over me my whole life.  My observations and feelings don't count though.  :shrug:




Yes, but the left wing loonies can't see the forest for the trees. They call discrimination and quotas something else and tell you it doesn't exist.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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