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Offlineryancvb
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[PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient
    #21876544 - 06/30/15 04:21 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

So on 6/16 I spawned 2 qts ( actually 3 quart jars + a little extra from an extra) of fully colonized rye spawn into ~6 qts of substrate consisting of 4 qts of dried manure/"organic humus" - note this is bovung/scotts brand and the information says that the product is not less than 51% dehydrated manure and not greater than 49% "organic humus" which is composed of peat, compost, forest products, manure, and/or other organic materials ( I picked out any twig or what appeared to be stone and crushed up the manure chunks to mix evenly throughout) there is also a nitrogen, available phosphate(P2O5), and soluble potash(K2O) content all of 1% and 2 and 1/3 qts of vermiculite sadly no gypsum as I was in an extreme rush as I was leaving for a vacation. The grains were coffee/water and gypsum soaked though prior to inoculation and colonization. The substrate was at field capacity and then pasteurized to a 160o Fahrenheit core temperature held for 1 hour and then cooled in air temp until temperatures were down and I could spawn. This was done in 3 19 qt. mini monotubs so I actually had 10 quart jars of spawn and 3 times the substrate.


Substrate cooled down and put into tubs

This left these at about a 1:3 spawn to substrate ratio - lower than I had wanted as I lost 2 jars due to suspected contamination due to stalled colonization, the one jar smelled sickly sweet and was immediately tossed and the second sadly was just a slow grower and had that wonderful smell of fresh mycelium but since I opened it I decided to toss it.- all of the jars smelled perfect when spawned and the tubs were left uncased and lids attached for GE. I was also as you have probably noticed a bad mushroom grower and didn't follow one specific tek and I also did not put the holes in my tub just to tape them back up - plan on doing that once I reach full colonization nor did I line the tubs( which is actually ending up being very useful) . Anyways these were placed in an open area, but out of the way of direct light.

Poof I am now on vacation for a week from that day 6/16- 6/23 at an extremely inconvenient time, and to make things worse the weather back home is rain and thunderstorms for the entire week with temperatures ranging from the high 70's to low 90's depending on time of day, windows in my place were closed and no air conditioner was on. Who knows how hot those poor mini-monotubs got. I'm worried the entire week how my tubs were doing.

6/23 at nighttime I get back from the vacation and immediately check the tubs -but of course did not open the lids the tubs are clear. They are at 7 days colonizing and not as far along as I would like all of the sides and bottom were completely uncolonized there were a few patches on the top but for the most part not nearly as colonized as I would have expected.

forgot to take pictures for this stage

I fear the mycelium may have died due to overheating. But decide to let them be and see if anything changes.

now 6/30 and 14 days colonizing there is visible growth on the sides, but the tops have not colonized much yet and there appears to be dead mycelium(grey) I decided to do a quick peek and remove the lid to do 2 things - take pictures so I can get your opinions and also cut a tiny sample of what appears to be healthy mycelium from one to verify I have live mycelium in the tubs. Sample bruised, so I assume thats a good indicator.












What do you think I should do? Do these seem viable? There was no bad smell, but no strong mycelium smell. Just the normal odor of the substrate. They appear to be growing just... very very slowly. Do you think they will ever reach full colonization? Am I just too impatient?

Lol did I essentially put all the strains in the tubs(MS syringe inoculated grains) to the true test of their strengths where only the ones which survived the extreme heat can proceed to colonize? :box:


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OfflineSksoul
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Re: [PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient [Re: ryancvb]
    #21876566 - 06/30/15 04:42 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

even at field capacity straight manure/compost isn't great to work with. Better to add a filler like coir, hay, or verm to fluff things up a bit. This is just a guess, but the mycelium may need time to work through the substrate if it is really dense.


--------------------
Like all great travellers, I have seen more than I remember, and remember more than I have seen.


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OfflinePussyFart
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Re: [PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient [Re: ryancvb]
    #21876577 - 06/30/15 04:50 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ryancvb said:
I also did not put the holes in my tub just to tape them back up - plan on doing that once I reach full colonization



You take the chance of damaging the fully colonized substrate when u wait......we drill them and tape them up because just untaping and stuffing them is easier when the tub is not filled with substrate material......it makes sense....

Quote:

ryancvb said:
What do you think I should do? Do these seem viable? There was no bad smell, but no strong mycelium smell. Just the normal odor of the substrate. They appear to be growing just... very very slowly. Do you think they will ever reach full colonization? Am I just too impatient?

Lol did I essentially put all the strains in the tubs(MS syringe inoculated grains) to the true test of their strengths where only the ones which survived the extreme heat can proceed to colonize? :box:



It's hard to say without better, more focused pics......try to get as good of pics as you can of the mycellium poking thru the top layer.....do not be afraid of opening the lid, a few minutes will not hurt a thing....


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Offlineryancvb
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Registered: 03/13/13
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Re: [PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient [Re: Sksoul]
    #21878069 - 06/30/15 01:11 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Sksoul said:
even at field capacity straight manure/compost isn't great to work with. Better to add a filler like coir, hay, or verm to fluff things up a bit. This is just a guess, but the mycelium may need time to work through the substrate if it is really dense.



Hey yeah I put verm in there, at about a 1:3 ratio of vermiculite to the manure mix :grin:


Edited by ryancvb (06/30/15 01:12 PM)


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Offlineryancvb
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Re: [PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient [Re: PussyFart]
    #21878152 - 06/30/15 01:31 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

PussyFart said:
Quote:

ryancvb said:
I also did not put the holes in my tub just to tape them back up - plan on doing that once I reach full colonization



You take the chance of damaging the fully colonized substrate when u wait......we drill them and tape them up because just untaping and stuffing them is easier when the tub is not filled with substrate material......it makes sense....

Quote:

ryancvb said:
What do you think I should do? Do these seem viable? There was no bad smell, but no strong mycelium smell. Just the normal odor of the substrate. They appear to be growing just... very very slowly. Do you think they will ever reach full colonization? Am I just too impatient?

Lol did I essentially put all the strains in the tubs(MS syringe inoculated grains) to the true test of their strengths where only the ones which survived the extreme heat can proceed to colonize? :box:



It's hard to say without better, more focused pics......try to get as good of pics as you can of the mycellium poking thru the top layer.....do not be afraid of opening the lid, a few minutes will not hurt a thing....




Thanks for the reply, I should have followed a single tek and standard monotub procedure - hopefully this will be a learning experience for me. I took a picture of the largest cluster poking thru.



hope that helps


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Offlinespacechildo
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Re: [PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient [Re: ryancvb]
    #21878285 - 06/30/15 02:03 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

your manure mix looks extremely wet and it gives the whole tub a bacterial looks IMO..
it could also simply be bad spawn..


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Offlineryancvb
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Re: [PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient [Re: spacechildo]
    #21878478 - 06/30/15 02:58 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

spacechildo said:
your manure mix looks extremely wet and it gives the whole tub a bacterial looks IMO..
it could also simply be bad spawn..



I think the flash on the camera made it look more wet than it actually is, I mixed it on the dryer side, but totally could be too wet. It definitely is a more compact sub though. There's a lot of condensation in the tubs. Spawn looked very healthy and fully colonized and I couldn't smell anything out of the norm or spot anything visually. But I'm sure its possible that I couldn't detect it.

I'd send a picture of one of the jars but it wasn't at 100% colonized when I took the picture  :facepalm3:

Hopefully they continue to colonize. Thanks so much for the input, I suppose only time will tell.


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Offlinespacechildo
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Re: [PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient [Re: ryancvb]
    #21878544 - 06/30/15 03:11 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

post the pic anyway if you still have it.

manure has never been compacted for me, it always looks like a great fluffy substrate I wanna colonize myself! :lol:


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Offlineryancvb
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Registered: 03/13/13
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Re: [PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient [Re: spacechildo]
    #21878848 - 06/30/15 04:13 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah I mean its not too compacted but definitely not fluffy, I think it probably overheated and who knows what went on during that. Hopefully the tubs aren't contaminated.

Here's one of the jars before it reached full colonization



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Offlineryancvb
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Re: [PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient [Re: ryancvb]
    #21896094 - 07/04/15 09:59 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Update- I did the unspeakable and am really fearing/accepting the worst at this point, at 17 days of colonizing one tub looks like it might be still going very slow, the second even slower, and the third looks like its not doing a thing at all.

Since things are already fucked probably I decided to do the unspeakable and with a sterilized glass rod I mixed up the second tub to redistribute the isolated patches of live mycelium into the largely uncolonized substrate and fluff it up to hopefully give it some air, and maybe some sort of chance.

Although I know that that was not something you should ever do, I felt that in this case it might be worth the information if it means losing a tub. Haha I'm most likely loosing all the tubs anyways. I learned a few things in the process -
  • the substrates are quite compact even with the vermiculite, in the future I need to add more "fluff" to my substrate mix
  • the substrates are not as wet as they look in some of my pictures, in-fact they are on the dryer side but not TOO dry
  • all of the grain in the uncolonized portions, i.e. most of the tub, had no mycelium. I take this as either heat death or contamination.
  • THE MANURE REEKED. Not of a familar sweet smell, not sour, or anything other than I could describe as shit


Definitely did not smell that strong when I spawned, is it normal to for manure to gain stench over time or is that a sign of contamination? This is my first time working with manure so not sure what it smells like when contaminated. There were no visual signs of any sort of growth other than mycelium, the tub once mixed/fluffed smelled of straight up shit.

Any hope?


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OfflineShroominMe
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Re: [PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient [Re: ryancvb]
    #21897457 - 07/04/15 04:40 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I think the nasty manure smell is due to anaerobic bacterial growth.


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Offlineryancvb
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Re: [PICS] Issue with manure monotubs possibly overheat related or am I impatient [Re: ShroominMe]
    #21897911 - 07/04/15 06:04 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah sadly I believe all 3 tubs are bacterial, are anaerobic bacteria contams airborne? If they are and pose a threat to my health and future grows I'll just scrap them now, but I do have hope for one of the tubs as it looks like its taking over the bacteria. I'm now making sure to wear a face mask whenever handling them, until I decide what to do.

The other two have just become experiments, as I've now taken the third and gave it the same mixing/fluffing treatment as the second with the addition of misting/spraying down the substrate with a 1:100 bleach to water mix as I fluffed. Pitiful attempt to kill off the bacteria to a point that the little mycelium there is can take over haha.

Might be best to just scrap them all though. :uhoh:


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