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StellasOpus
Stranger
Registered: 07/09/13
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Re: Purpose of psilocybin for the shroom? [Re: Molybdites]
#18536611 - 07/09/13 09:11 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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ive gone far in the abyss and havent come back yet
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Jii
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Registered: 01/17/08
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Re: Purpose of psilocybin for the shroom? [Re: Molybdites]
#18542141 - 07/11/13 12:34 AM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
I think this means that the psilocybin content has to do with the nutrients that the fungus is getting from the soil, and that is the fungus ingests a certain nutrient or food, it will make psilocybin as a byproduct.
Potency has very little to do with nutrients. Potency is mainly up to genetics
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Is psilocybin present in the mycelium of active mushrooms?
Yes.
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why does the amount of the chemical vary so much in the mushrooms?
There is huge variance also in size, appearance etc. Probably to survive in changing enviroment.
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Then why would cubensis produce psilocybin in a grower's jar
Because grower mimics it's natural habitat. Mushroom do not know the difference. I think.
-------------------- My shroom inspired photo gallery - One of god's own prototypes. Too weird to live, too rare to die - I highly recommend www.genesisgeneration.us and Freedomainradio. Jii
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Jef
Out-of-work Sex Slave
Registered: 12/02/08
Posts: 764
Loc: near Duncan, BC
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Re: Purpose of psilocybin for the shroom? [Re: psily]
#21388882 - 03/10/15 07:33 PM (9 years, 11 days ago) |
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Amanita muscaria produces it's amatoxins to attract flies. It doesn't kill the fly. Instead it gets high and falls off the cap and under, where it gets covered in spores and after a few hours of tripping revives and flies off. The fly spreads its spores everywhere it goes.
Deer who eat them prolly spread some spores on their hooves and muzzles.
Does anyone know for fact that psilocybin doesn't cause some species of fly to do the same thing. In the case of cubes, the fly may logically go directly to the next, fresh, warm cowpie.
Doesn't this make the most sense ?
Nobody would be likely to have watched for this, and finding flies on a cowpie is hardly amazing.
-------------------- I am my own lab rat. Tell me and I will forget. Show me and I will remember. Involve me and I will learn.
Edited by Jef (03/10/15 07:36 PM)
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DividedQuantum
Outer Head
Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,847
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Re: Purpose of psilocybin for the shroom? [Re: Jef]
#21388958 - 03/10/15 07:49 PM (9 years, 11 days ago) |
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I think it's probably more likely that the psilocybin is a defense mechanism, i.e. that animals who consume the mushrooms would rather not repeat the experience, and leave them alone in the future. As an evolutionary argument, this makes a lot more sense.
-------------------- Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici
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Jef
Out-of-work Sex Slave
Registered: 12/02/08
Posts: 764
Loc: near Duncan, BC
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Re: Purpose of psilocybin for the shroom? [Re: DividedQuantum]
#21390657 - 03/10/15 11:00 PM (9 years, 11 days ago) |
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Then why do deer regularly trample people peeing out amatoxins, and eat amanita muscaria ? Reindeer clearly love the trip they get out of amanitas.
Think about it. Before man was around a herd (Buffalo)would maybe move over an area only every three months or so.
These tiny mushrooms need a way to get spores from on old dried up turd, not so attractive to flies, to a fresh cowpie, often upwind wherever the herd has gone.
Where you have herd animals you have flies, and the animals brush the flies off with their tail, and then it hangs back down right in front of where they turd out of, inoculating the fresh pies.
It may be that the tail hits the flies, or that the tail just brushes their flank on which the flies have left spores.
Either way the turd has a good chance of getting spores this way as long as the mushrooms "invite" the flies with a free psilocybin trip, and prolly some nutrients.....just as the amanita does.
Have you had some bad trips that you still think it's a defense ?
-------------------- I am my own lab rat. Tell me and I will forget. Show me and I will remember. Involve me and I will learn.
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Hobozen
Registered: 11/03/11
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Loc:
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Re: Purpose of psilocybin for the shroom? [Re: DividedQuantum]
#21391262 - 03/11/15 03:50 AM (9 years, 10 days ago) |
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Quote:
DividedQuantum said: I think it's probably more likely that the psilocybin is a defense mechanism, i.e. that animals who consume the mushrooms would rather not repeat the experience, and leave them alone in the future. As an evolutionary argument, this makes a lot more sense.
I think that is a very incomplete and narrow argument. I'm not sure why exactly, but it seems so.
Edited by Hobozen (03/11/15 03:50 AM)
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Zanthius
Mean Alien
Registered: 02/05/09
Posts: 1,570
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Re: Purpose of psilocybin for the shroom? [Re: psily]
#21392901 - 03/11/15 01:34 PM (9 years, 10 days ago) |
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Psilocybin might be the "antenna" for the shared consciousness of sentient mushrooms, which is transduced to your 5HT2A receptors when you have ingested magic mushrooms. If our neural networks can be conscious, maybe certain mycelium networks also can be conscious of themselves.
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Zanthius
Mean Alien
Registered: 02/05/09
Posts: 1,570
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Re: Purpose of psilocybin for the shroom? [Re: DividedQuantum]
#21392951 - 03/11/15 01:49 PM (9 years, 10 days ago) |
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Quote:
DividedQuantum said: I think it's probably more likely that the psilocybin is a defense mechanism, i.e. that animals who consume the mushrooms would rather not repeat the experience, and leave them alone in the future. As an evolutionary argument, this makes a lot more sense.
Really? That might make somewhat sense for κ-opioid receptor agonists (like salvia) which are dysphoric. It doesn't make much sense for 5HT2A receptor agonists, because they don't necessarily induce any more dysphoria than euphoria. In fact, I think they tend to induce more euphoria than dysphoria.
Psilocybin is also very non toxic, and why on earth wouldn't mushrooms want animals to eat their fruiting bodies? Plants have developed nice tastes in their fruits in order to get animals to eat them. Animal consumption of spores/seeds helps dispersion. Magic mushrooms even like to grow in animal feces. How do you think the spores got there?
Edited by Zanthius (03/11/15 01:55 PM)
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ballsalsa
Universally Loathed and Reviled
Registered: 03/11/15
Posts: 21,874
Loc: Foreign Lands
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Re: Purpose of psilocybin for the shroom? [Re: psily] 1
#21393064 - 03/11/15 02:10 PM (9 years, 10 days ago) |
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i just don't see how a chemical that causes pleasant effects to those who ingest it could be a defense mechanism. Is opium a defense mechanism for poppies? do berries taste delicious as a defense mechanism? In my opinion the answer is no. If anything, these are examples of dispersal strategy. many sessile organisms provide incentive for motile organisms to graze their fruits, thereby transmitting offspring greater distance than the wind.
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MarkostheGnostic
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Loc: South Florida
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Re: Purpose of psilocybin for the shroom? [Re: psily]
#21395455 - 03/11/15 10:46 PM (9 years, 10 days ago) |
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psily said: Hello,
Im new to the board - many thanks for the invaluable info! I have a question and hope someone already knows it or can point me in the right direction. I was wondering what is the purpose of psilocybin for the shroom, i.e. is it to help it fight bacteria, molds, insects, nematodes - what?
Its not an entirely useless question, because, for example, plants secrete more of certain substances in response to certain chem or mechanical stimuli. Same could be for our shroom. I'd like to know.
If you know the answer, better yet have a link or 2 to some papers, thanks a lot in advance :-)
I can paraphrase the late Stephen Gaskin of The Farm, Summertown, TN http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Gaskin who once wrote that 'A man and a mushroom can get together and become much more together than either a man or a mushroom.' In this biosphere, there is a Taoist unity that the Cartesian mind of subject-object has lost the ability to grok. On a cosmic level, the very universe like a super-computer has found ways on this tiny blue marble to increase consciousness of itself through a symbiotic relationship of a fungus and a human being. We disseminate the spores of these fungi, and they in turn become part of us.
I am reminded of a saying from The Gospel of Thomas: "Blessed is the lion which a man eats so that the lion becomes a man. But cursed is the man whom a lion eats so that the man becomes a lion" - Logion 53. Better for the mushrooms to be consumed by man, bettering the man, who in turn cultivates and spreads the spores of the mushroom far and wide, than a man die and merely become substrate for the mushroom. In the former, the 'order of operations' as in math, allows the universe becomes more conscious of itself through the bemushroomed man - a human consciousness becomes capable in measure of providing eyes, ears, smell, taste, touch and thought for the universe to be able to perceive itself. This is my take on the symbiosis of man and mushroom, since clearly, psilocybin/psilocin is more a neurotransmitter than a deadly protective cyclopeptide toxin.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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0000000000000
Registered: 06/09/15
Posts: 47
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hmmmmm
also to note the chemical structure, in the pictures, amatoxins have an indole in the middle of their molecules/proteins. i don't know what biology says about what genes encode what and why an indole departs off into a peptide (turns out a toxic one) whereas in the other case it forms an alkaloid, a tryptamine.
Edited by 0000000000000 (07/03/15 07:56 PM)
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