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OfflineKronk
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Registered: 12/29/14
Posts: 73
Loc: Washington
Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
Social politics. || A discussion
    #21870744 - 06/28/15 09:44 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I figure I would make this thread my proving ground. Somewhere to spend my time that is.

I love discussing politics. Specifically issues that pertain to matters of public opinion such as race and gender relations.

I want this thread to be a discussion of ideas regarding social evolution/advancement and related topics. There are no wrong answers. This is a place all of us to evolve our political opinions.

To clarify, this is not a thread for you to post generic peace and love crap. There is enough of that littering the forum. I want to see posts that bring up a specific issue along with your opinion on how that issue can be resolved. You don't have to have all of the answers, hopefully others will chime in with their own opinions, but do try and have some rhyme to your reason. It would be advisable to include any resources to support your opinions. Remember, if you can't back up those facts with proof than they aren't facts.



Please keep things respectful. If you find someones post to be offensive to your world view and you are incapable of having a civil argument using scientific method as your catalyst than simply do not respond to said post. If you have an issue with the terms logic and reason than it would be advisable that you not participate in this thread.








I'm too lazy to kick things off, so here is a template for your posts: (This is an example, feel free to do your thing. The example will probably be less coherent than I would like your posts to be.)
___________________________
Issue: Police profiling in America

Description: "Within law enforcement, rather than relying on the testimony of the driver or other documentation to determine the drivers race, ethnicity, or character, the officer makes a stereotypical  prejudgment which is used as a key factor to decide whether to engage in enforcement (e.g. stop and search or arrest)."

Impact: Police profiling largely, and unjustly targets black men in America. As a result of aggressive policing in ethnic communities have resulted in the unjust deaths of many black Americans at the hands of police.

Proposed solution: Policies issued on behalf of police departments to insure employee training and procedures to limit racial bias, otherwise known as General Order B-4 as developed by Berkeley police department with the aid of the NAACP. The adoption of such a system nationwide may reduce the subconscious profiling tendencies of certain individuals as well as provide measures to discourage such profiling by steepening penalties for the individual as well as their respective police department.

Resources: http://www.berkeleyside.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/Berkeley-General-Order-B-4.pdf http://bpr.berkeley.edu/2014/11/03/the-fair-and-impartial-policy/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racial_profiling
______________________

This was a rushed example and is not meant to be discussed here, nor does it reflect my opinions regarding the subject.


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Feel the power...
...Oh, I can feel it


Edited by Kronk (06/28/15 09:45 PM)


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OfflinePsilosopherr
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Registered: 02/15/12
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Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Kronk]
    #21870857 - 06/28/15 10:10 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

.

(typed something but then realized it was covered in the OP. oops)


Edited by Psilosopherr (06/28/15 10:11 PM)


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InvisibleShins
Fun guy
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Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 16,337
Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #21870922 - 06/28/15 10:18 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Police profile blacks because they commit more crimes, this is not a bad thing, its common sense.

Trying to stop it will make police less effective at fighting crime, that would not be a good thing.


proposed solution;  black people choose to commit less crimes and stop promoting it in our culture.


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http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/


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OfflineKronk
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Registered: 12/29/14
Posts: 73
Loc: Washington
Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Shins]
    #21870936 - 06/28/15 10:20 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

It was an example post to give you an idea of what the thread was about and how you should submit posts. I asked specifically for you not to discuss it. If someone else makes a post about it that is fine, but I wasn't trying to make a point.


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Feel the power...
...Oh, I can feel it


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InvisibleShins
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Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 16,337
Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Kronk]
    #21870947 - 06/28/15 10:22 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

We already have a whole forum for this...


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http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/


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InvisibleBoldAsLove
Pokemon Master


Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Shins]
    #21871791 - 06/29/15 02:15 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Police profile blacks because they commit more crimes, this is not a bad thing, its common sense.

Trying to stop it will make police less effective at fighting crime, that would not be a good thing.


proposed solution;  black people choose to commit less crimes and stop promoting it in our culture.




Not always true, and it can definitely go overboard. Like in the clearly racist Ferguson police force:

"A black motorist who is pulled over is twice as likely to be searched as a white motorist, even though searches of white drivers are more likely to turn up drugs or other contraband, the report found."


--------------------
DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor :alientransform: and Ferdinand :cigar:, the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,369
Loc: 'Merica Flag
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Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Shins]
    #21872357 - 06/29/15 08:22 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Police profile blacks because they commit more crimes, this is not a bad thing, its common sense.

Trying to stop it will make police less effective at fighting crime, that would not be a good thing.


proposed solution;  black people choose to commit less crimes and stop promoting it in our culture.




Black people get arrested more
because cops seek them out more
because black people commit more crimes
because black people get arrested more
because cops seek them out more
...


Impoverished black people are just as likely to commit crimes as impoverished white people. Cops seeking out blacks because they think they're likely to be criminals is a self fulfilling prophecy.


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InvisibleShins
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Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 16,337
Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #21873451 - 06/29/15 12:27 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Impoverished white peolle are not as likely to commit crimes, that's BS.  Asians even less so.  Asian privelidge!


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http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Shins]
    #21873995 - 06/29/15 03:06 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

It's not BS at all.


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
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Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Shins]
    #21874252 - 06/29/15 04:18 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Police profile blacks because they commit more crimes, this is not a bad thing, its common sense.

Trying to stop it will make police less effective at fighting crime, that would not be a good thing.


proposed solution;  black people choose to commit less crimes and stop promoting it in our culture.




Of course. But that makes too much sense for the average liberal to understand.


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“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21875858 - 06/29/15 10:00 PM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Pretty sure racism is against forum rules.

And claiming that blacks commit more crimes because of their skin color is racism.


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InvisibleShins
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Posts: 16,337
Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #21876218 - 06/30/15 12:26 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

I didn't say it was because of anything,  I merely observed a statistical fact.


--------------------
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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Registered: 11/11/09
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Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Shins]
    #21877012 - 06/30/15 08:35 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
I didn't say it was because of anything,  I merely observed a statistical fact.




Then merely discounted the real world reason for that fact.


Why do you think blacks commit more crimes if not for poverty?


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InvisibleShins
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Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #21877348 - 06/30/15 10:09 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Because Asians who live in povery commit drastically less crime, by a huge margin.    How do you explain that?  Poverty is not the deciding factor.


my opinion is that it is a combination of genetics and culture.  Mostly culture, although both are inter related.


--------------------
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Shins]
    #21877367 - 06/30/15 10:14 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

So you're saying it is in black people's genes to be criminals?


:lolsy:

Let me help you out of this whole you've just dug for yourself:

Culture isn't inherent.
Poverty isn't inherent.

Genetics are.


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InvisibleBoldAsLove
Pokemon Master


Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Shins]
    #21877370 - 06/30/15 10:14 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Because Asians who live in povery commit drastically less crime, by a huge margin.    How do you explain that?





Can you provide a source for that, please?


--------------------
DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor :alientransform: and Ferdinand :cigar:, the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.


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InvisibleShins
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Posts: 16,337
Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #21877420 - 06/30/15 10:26 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
So you're saying it is in black people's genes to be criminals?


:lolsy:

Let me help you out of this whole you've just dug for yourself:

Culture isn't inherent.
Poverty isn't inherent.

Genetics are.




yes I am saying that.

why is it so shocking to assert that different genes have different ezpressions?  Its basic biology.

rottweilers bite more than golden retrievers, are you trying to tell me that their breed has absolutely nothing to do with that?  Face up to reality and stop being a coward.  Life is not fair.


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http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/


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InvisibleShins
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Posts: 16,337
Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: BoldAsLove]
    #21877424 - 06/30/15 10:27 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

BoldAsLove said:
Quote:

Shins said:
Because Asians who live in povery commit drastically less crime, by a huge margin.    How do you explain that?





Can you provide a source for that, please?






Want me to change your diaper too?

www.google.com


--------------------
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,369
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Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Shins]
    #21877429 - 06/30/15 10:29 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
So you're saying it is in black people's genes to be criminals?


:lolsy:

Let me help you out of this whole you've just dug for yourself:

Culture isn't inherent.
Poverty isn't inherent.

Genetics are.




yes I am saying that.






Then you're a racist.


Now you're trying to compare dog breeds to human races?

Just stop.


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InvisibleBoldAsLove
Pokemon Master


Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
Re: Social politics. || A discussion [Re: Shins]
    #21877455 - 06/30/15 10:34 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Quote:

BoldAsLove said:
Quote:

Shins said:
Because Asians who live in povery commit drastically less crime, by a huge margin.    How do you explain that?





Can you provide a source for that, please?






Want me to change your diaper too?

www.google.com




You made a claim, the burden is on you to support it. Google is not a source but your welcome to use it to try and support your claim.


--------------------
DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor :alientransform: and Ferdinand :cigar:, the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.


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