|
MikeBearPig
Not liked.

Registered: 07/15/14
Posts: 2,319
|
Feminism, why?????? 2
#21859659 - 06/26/15 11:34 AM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
http://www.tickld.com/x/next-time-someone-says-women-arent-victims-of-harassment-show-them?utm_source=tickld&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=robothug&ts_pid=2&ts_pid=2
Came across this today, shared on FB by a family member who obviously agree's with this dribble. I found myself getting upset reading it.. Grinding my teeth at the first double standard and wanting to punch the wall by the 12th. The line that set me off, " All spaces outside are men spaces that women are passing through". Really? How much of a victim do you have to be to think this way.
Lemme explain something.. Cat calling is a cultural byproduct. You don't see tribe's lining up by the huts and tryin to holla at all the young tribe girls. It happens, only in places tainted by our culture. I will even go out on a limb and say, it isn't even that common and the men who do engage in it are usually some sort of bro or guy with that attitude, a desensitized little boy.
On the other hand.. I have been out with several female groups in the past and they actively engage in everything on this list + some. Who ever made the picture said that men talk about women when they walk by. I have no idea what kind of females you have hung around with, but even the more upper class girls that I hung out with were just the worst at every offence on this list, directed and geared towards men.
They even put the abortion waiting time on here.. It's mandatory for counseling, a pretty good and logical reason for somebody about to engage in something that is traumatizing. Why is there a complaint?
Before my wife had her bilateral mastectomy, she had to do to 2 classes to help ease her and teach her how to change her drains. Why is there no feminists screaming in the cancer lobby about this? It is the same thing, a body that belongs to a woman?
I fucking hate everything tainted with this point of view.. Feminism. It is not about rights anymore, it's about small injustices and people who were't raised with realistic standards of life.
Expecting to go through life with out facing problems, making hard choices, dealing with tough people,feeling emotions you don't want to feel or hearing something that is so true that it hurts you mad.. Well, your the fucking crazy one. These problems are out there, it is your job to be so strong that you can face them and smile when a guy tells you have a nice ass. The ability for one's words to affect you has nothing to do with the person talking to you. You are ill equipped to deal with life and you need to pick up a few skills to help you deal with strangers.
Think about it.. Letting somebody's words affect you is the same thing as them being able to control your mind by uttering a few words. How can you be susceptible to this? You are giving away your power in any situation and letting the person control you. Ain't nobody got time for that.
I don't know what kind of world you want to live in. In a perfect world, would not everybody that you came in contact with tell you that you have beautiful eyes or good legs? Or is a perfect world the opposite? Where nobody say's anything about anybody? While we walk, we gaze at nothing but our feet for fear of offending anybody.. Never make a conversation because it could possibly traumatize somebody?
Not the world I would want to live in.
|
Hayoxp
Enlil sucks cock


Registered: 06/05/15
Posts: 812
Last seen: 8 years, 6 months
|
|
Yes, Feminism is now Nazism
-------------------- Enlil is trash, needs to end himself.
|
Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
|
|
--------------------
|
Beanhead
IS IRONIC PARADOX


Registered: 10/11/08
Posts: 17,257
Loc: Geospatial inversion.
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
|
|
I read that yesterday and found that really on point.
I want to live in a world where I can approach a woman and just have smalltalk without there being sexual under-basis. Or them fearing that's the reason I talk to them.
These are the childsteps towards that.
Edited by Beanhead (06/26/15 11:58 AM)
|
moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
|
Re: Feminism, why?????? [Re: Shroomism] 1
#21859751 - 06/26/15 12:04 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
I'm not sure what the actual main point is here, but you guys are making a conscious effort to misrepresent feminism in a negative way, which I can't really understand outside of the argument, "belligerent SJWs are obnoxious" to which I say, so are you.
|
Mr.GuessWork
Stranger

Registered: 03/30/13
Posts: 4,563
|
|
Quote:
MikeBearPig said:
On the other hand.. I have been out with several female groups in the past and they actively engage in everything on this list + some. Who ever made the picture said that men talk about women when they walk by. I have no idea what kind of females you have hung around with, but even the more upper class girls that I hung out with were just the worst at every offence on this list, directed and geared towards men.
This is a pretty interesting point, and I've noticed that girls do this stuff too. When I see it happen, they tend be more serious about it though. With guys it's usually something they can laugh off, but with girls the conversation seems to feel more threatening somehow. I've seen it start those nasty girl fights between friends. Maybe some girls tend to have the same attitude when they see a guy engaging in that kind of behavior. It would explain some of the seemingly unmerited defensiveness.
|
Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
|
|
Quote:
moonrockmushy said: I'm not sure what the actual main point is here, but you guys are making a conscious effort to misrepresent feminism in a negative way, which I can't really understand outside of the argument, "belligerent SJWs are obnoxious" to which I say, so are you.

Do you have an actual point to make that is based in facts and reality, or are we relying on personalisms and non-sequitur? What good is feminism doing for modern society, that outweighs all the MULTITUDES of negatives and harm it causes?
The point is that feminism is cancer. Prove us wrong.
We don't have to make an effort to "misrepresent" feminism in a negative way.. it does that fine all on its own.
--------------------
|
moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
|
Re: Feminism, why?????? [Re: Shroomism] 2
#21859780 - 06/26/15 12:13 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Feminism is not cancer or Nazi-ism. Those are completely ridiculous comparisons and I don't even know where to start with them other than saying they are obviously coming from someone who has the idea that women are not inherently equal to men in terms of ability and the respect they deserve as human beings.
|
Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
|
|
Making assumptions are we? You would be dead wrong. Or should I have my woman come in here and explain it to you.
My beef with feminism has to do with I believe men and women should be treated relatively equally. Feminism, does not want equality.
--------------------
|
MikeBearPig
Not liked.

Registered: 07/15/14
Posts: 2,319
|
|
Quote:
Mr.GuessWork said:
Quote:
MikeBearPig said:
On the other hand.. I have been out with several female groups in the past and they actively engage in everything on this list + some. Who ever made the picture said that men talk about women when they walk by. I have no idea what kind of females you have hung around with, but even the more upper class girls that I hung out with were just the worst at every offence on this list, directed and geared towards men.
This is a pretty interesting point, and I've noticed that girls do this stuff too. When I see it happen, they tend be more serious about it though. With guys it's usually something they can laugh off, but with girls the conversation seems to feel more threatening somehow. I've seen it start those nasty girl fights between friends. Maybe some girls tend to have the same attitude when they see a guy engaging in that kind of behavior. It would explain some of the seemingly unmerited defensiveness.
I don't want to make it seem like one gender is more extreme than the other. We both participate in equal practices. Not all of us do it, it's just the small % of the people who do it that is worth talking about..
I have got kicked out of a restaurant because of a loud conversation about dildo's over dinner with a group of girls. I never experience this kinda shit with guys, I am also not denying that it does not happen.
|
MikeBearPig
Not liked.

Registered: 07/15/14
Posts: 2,319
|
Re: Feminism, why?????? [Re: Beanhead]
#21859813 - 06/26/15 12:23 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
moonrockmushy said: Feminism is not cancer or Nazi-ism. Those are completely ridiculous comparisons and I don't even know where to start with them other than saying they are obviously coming from someone who has the idea that women are not inherently equal to men in terms of ability and the respect they deserve as human beings.
What modern day Feminism and the SJW (social justice warriors) have transformed into now is not helpful for us to move on. It only highlights that we need to help more people deal with the harsh truth of what is reality as of now.
In the future as I explained.. No sense of randomness is boring.
Quote:
Beanhead said: I read that yesterday and found that really on point.
I want to live in a world where I can approach a woman and just have smalltalk without there being sexual under-basis. Or them fearing that's the reason I talk to them.
These are the childsteps towards that.
You can as of right now approach a woman and just have small talk with out sexual undertones. Just walk up to one and talk, it really does work. What does not work is denying that you have sexual desires and trying to fake talking to them. If they don't understand what it means to be human and think you are only after sex, and if you truly weren't, then move on and try again until you find one that might give you a chance.
Women know instantly if you wanna have sex with them, it's something beyond body language or spoken language. I truly believe if you approach with good intentions, they can pick up on it.
|
moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
|
Re: Feminism, why?????? [Re: Shroomism]
#21859817 - 06/26/15 12:23 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
You get kicked out of a restaurant for talking about dildos and feminism is to blame. ok.
|
Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
|
Re: Feminism, why?????? [Re: Shroomism]
#21859823 - 06/26/15 12:24 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:

I wonder what leading feminists have to say

--------------------
|
MikeBearPig
Not liked.

Registered: 07/15/14
Posts: 2,319
|
|
Quote:
moonrockmushy said: You get kicked out of a restaurant for talking about dildos and feminism is to blame. ok.
I was not actively talking.. I was merely stating that inappropriate conversations can be carried on by either gender.
You are obviously one of the brainwashed, how did you even spin that into that conclusion in your head?
|
Sophistic Radiance
Free sVs!


Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 43,135
Loc: Center of the Universe
|
Re: Feminism, why?????? [Re: Shroomism] 2
#21859838 - 06/26/15 12:29 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
I hate to bring up the fact that I'm trans, since everybody else does it for me, but I do feel that my having had significant experience living on both sides of the gender binary gives me some insight into this conversation.
Honestly, I think that well-intentioned but self-conscious men are misinterpreting the complaints feminists make about male-dominated spaces and casual harassment. For example, a lot of guys seem to be unclear on the difference between "catcalling" and "street harassment". Now, IMO, catcalling is completely different from street harassment. Catcalling is not really a problem at all. I actually used to catcall women when I was hormonally male, and when I heard women complaining about "street harassment" I was intensely concerned that I had been engaging in practices that could be considered harassment.
Well let me tell you that catcalling is NOT street harassment. Street harassment is bullying, aggressive, and intrusive. For example, the other day I was at the gas station, and a pair of young men started yelling at me. They said "Hey bitch, put on a fucking bra!" and when I ignored them, repeated this several times. Then as I was getting back into my car they switched it up, calling me a "long-ass bird", laughing and jeering at me.
See, now that, was street harassment. I'd never really witnessed that type of behavior when I was living and presenting myself as male, because people who engage in this type of behavior are cowards. They know that what they are doing is wrong but don't care that it is wrong as long as they don't have reason to expect any tangible consequences, such as from the strength and aggression of another male. They pick almost exclusively on young women who are alone. For some of us, it is a daily occurrence. It makes us feel legitimately unsafe in public and it has a macroscopic chilling effect on women's public participation. Again, when I was living and presenting as male, I'd never experienced this type of treatment at all. It seems to be a phenomenon that uniquely targets women while sparing men of even having to see it or think about it.
When feminists complain of street harassment, this is what they are talking about, but since most men don't witness it very often if at all, they assume women are being oversensitive about more innocent overtures such as whistling or benign one-off comments from a distance. But "harassment" has a clear cut definition and it refers to intrusive, unwanted, and repeated behaviors that have the effect of intimidating their target. We need you, as men who don't cotton to this kind of shit, to understand that we are not talking about you. The fact that you so resent your perceived association with this type of behavior shows that you know how wrong it is. We don't want you to feel bad about yourselves as guys, there's no doubt most guys are okay. We just want you to know that this stuff DOES HAPPEN and to pay close attention to your fellow males who might not be so scrupulous and to provide for consequences when they do or say fucked up shit.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
|
MikeBearPig
Not liked.

Registered: 07/15/14
Posts: 2,319
|
|
Quote:
BlindSophist said: I hate to bring up the fact that I'm trans, since everybody else does it for me, but I do feel that my having had significant experience living on both sides of the gender binary gives me some insight into this conversation.
Honestly, I think that well-intentioned but self-conscious men are misinterpreting the complaints feminists make about male-dominated spaces and casual harassment. For example, a lot of guys seem to be unclear on the difference between "catcalling" and "street harassment". Now, IMO, catcalling is completely different from street harassment. It's usually not a problem at all. I actually used to catcall women when I was hormonally male, and when I heard women complaining about "street harassment" I was intensely concerned that I had been engaging in practices that could be considered harassment.
Well let me tell you that catcalling is NOT street harassment. Street harassment is bullying, aggressive, and intrusive. For example, the other day I was at the gas station, wearing white skinny jeans and a green t-shirt with no bra, and a pair of young men started yelling at me. They said "Hey bitch, put on a fucking bra!" and when I ignored them, repeated this several times. Then as I was getting back into my car they switched it up, calling me a "long-ass bird", laughing and jeering at me.
See, now that, was street harassment. I'd never really witnessed that type of behavior when I was living and presenting myself as male, because people who engage in this type of behavior are cowards. They know that what they are doing is wrong but don't care that it is wrong as long as they don't have reason to expect any tangible consequences, such as from the strength and aggression of another male. They pick almost exclusively on young women who are alone. For some of us, it is a daily occurrence. It makes us feel legitimately unsafe in public and it has a macroscopic chilling effect on women's public participation. Again, when I was living and presenting as male, I'd never experienced this type of treatment at all. It seems to be a phenomenon that uniquely targets women while sparing men of even having to see it or think about it.
When feminists complain of street harassment, this is what they are talking about, but since most men don't witness it very often if at all, they assume women are being oversensitive about more innocent overtures such as whistling or benign one-off comments from a distance. But "harassment" has a clear cut definition and it refers to intrusive, unwanted, and repeated behaviors that have the effect of intimidating their target. We need you, as men who don't cotton to this kind of shit, to understand that we are not talking about you. The fact that you so resent your perceived association with this type of behavior shows that you know how wrong it is. We don't want you to feel bad about yourselves as guys, there's no doubt most guys are okay. We just want you to know that this stuff DOES HAPPEN and to pay close attention to your fellow males who might not be so scrupulous and to provide for consequences when they do or say fucked up shit.
Why can't every person explain their point of view this well? This is how you change peoples minds..
|
Mr.GuessWork
Stranger

Registered: 03/30/13
Posts: 4,563
|
|
Quote:
MikeBearPig said:
Quote:
Mr.GuessWork said:
Quote:
MikeBearPig said:
On the other hand.. I have been out with several female groups in the past and they actively engage in everything on this list + some. Who ever made the picture said that men talk about women when they walk by. I have no idea what kind of females you have hung around with, but even the more upper class girls that I hung out with were just the worst at every offence on this list, directed and geared towards men.
This is a pretty interesting point, and I've noticed that girls do this stuff too. When I see it happen, they tend be more serious about it though. With guys it's usually something they can laugh off, but with girls the conversation seems to feel more threatening somehow. I've seen it start those nasty girl fights between friends. Maybe some girls tend to have the same attitude when they see a guy engaging in that kind of behavior. It would explain some of the seemingly unmerited defensiveness.
I don't want to make it seem like one gender is more extreme than the other. We both participate in equal practices. Not all of us do it, it's just the small % of the people who do it that is worth talking about..
I have got kicked out of a restaurant because of a loud conversation about dildo's over dinner with a group of girls. I never experience this kinda shit with guys, I am also not denying that it does not happen.
It definitely happens in various ways on both sides, but I think there are some gender associated attitudes that affect those kind of topics. Sort of like how guys don't take sexual harassment seriously (they often sexually harass or tease each other as a joke), but girls are more likely to be offended by sexual harassment, even when it's meant as a joke. I think lots of sexual harassment claims are due to a clash of those two attitudes. I'd guess it's similar with stuff like cat calling.
|
Cujllickduo



Registered: 06/13/15
Posts: 19,552
Loc: England
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months
|
|
|
moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
|
Re: Feminism, why?????? [Re: Shroomism]
#21859866 - 06/26/15 12:37 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
The fact that you disagree with a feminist about what it means to be a woman or what tactics should or shouldn't be employed in the persuit of common feminist goals does not mean you are not a feminist.
This definition:
Quote:
the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.
which comes out of a dictionary (totally biased, right?), compared to what you guys are insinuating feminism is, to me it seems like you guys are exhibiting a selective bias as to how you portray feminism.
|
Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
|
|
I don't agree with harassment whether it comes from either gender, and if I ever saw anyone doing it I would try to put a stop to it. Just as I rail on feminists who harass, if I saw men harassing women unjustly I will tell them to stop that fucking shit, or if they cross the line I'd have no qualms with knocking someone the fuck out if they are physically assaulting someone or similar. Harassment is harassment.. and no one should have to suffer from it. Or assault for that matter. I can only go from my own experiences and what my woman tells me about. I've never participated in it personally. She says it's annoying if it happens all the time, but she just ignores and doesn't give them even the time of day. But it isn't just a sex issue... harassment can effect anyone. I feel most feminists make it out to be always Men vs females, and it's this HUGE social injustice that needs to stop. Men get harassed too. I agree it shouldn't happen. Now I'm not saying it's not an issue at all.. but I haven't really ever personally witnessed men harassing women to this extreme that is always talked about. Maybe I'm wrong.. but it doesn't seem to me to be this widespread, out of control issue, if we are talking about a few outliers. The most I've ever seen is catcalling.. which is benign and is basically human nature.. and women participate in it as well. If I see someone being harassed in the street, I would put a stop to that shit.
--------------------
|
|