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Offlinefutura
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Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted
    #10150798 - 04/12/09 06:16 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

I am using colonized rye grain and mixing to bulk substrate(High Mountain Compost)Eqs. at 1 to 2 spawn to sub ratio and Cambos and Z Strain at about 1 to 1 1/4 spawn to sub ratio(Going for a 2 1/2" to 3 " Depth) I am going "Uncased" with this...

I am going to use Monstermitch's "Monotub" Tek(2" Holes stuffed with Polyfill) with 17 gal.(22") Stack-n-Views lined with black plastic bags cut down to substrate level..

Thoughts...

Since I want high CO2 levels and high humidity while spawn is colonizing sub should I wait to cut all holes in tub till after sub is fully colonized???

That way I could accurately judge depth of sub and put lower holes exactly at sub level...Also It would insure high CO2 levels at sub layer during spawn/sub colinization and high humidity becuase the tub would not have any holes for FAE(Some fae would get in as lids are never "Air-Tight" even when closed...)

I wouldnt need the Crumpled Wax paper then to inititiate pining...

I would just let spawn  colonize sub and then I would cut holes and lightly fill with polyfill and therby decrease CO2 Levels,and humidity and increase FAE and also put under 12/12 light(Flourescent-6500 Kelvin) as well so it would induce Pinning at that point...I will also be using a fan pointing away from tubs to inctrease FAE and lower temp to fruiting range of 76 deg. F

By not cutting holes until sub is fully colonized wouldnt it greatly reduce chance of contams as well...

Does any or all of this make sense??

Please reply..I welcome any and all comments....


Edited by futura (04/15/09 05:20 AM)


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Offlinec1dh3d
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: futura]
    #10150844 - 04/12/09 06:50 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Waiting to cut holes til it is colonized question:

No. You may want high CO2 levels for spawn run, but not absolute CO2 levels, the monotubs design is meant to vent excess CO2 - there will always be CO2 in the air just above the substrate as it is the heavier gas. If you are really concerned about it, you could use tyvek to cover the holes to keep some of the gas exchange inside, but that defeats the purpose of the 'hands free' setup if your swapping it out for polyfil after colonization (and its just completely unneccesary). Monstermich's tek is the one I am using in the grow log in my sig, and as presented in the pictures it is colonizing great with polyfil'd holes.

Aside from the above mentioned, do you really want to remove your freshly colonized substrate from the tub to cut holes in it, or try drilling holes directly over the substrate and cover the top layer of it in plastic shavings?

In the grow log below, I used a 10 lbs bag of highmountaincompost, and 4 quart jars of spawn, and followed the measurements in which to cut the holes on Monstermichs tek exactly. As can be seen, the substrate depth with the spawn added in fills it up almost perfectly below the holes, though I am using an 18 gallon tub - Not sure if that deviates from Monstermich's materials.

As for the not cutting holes until the substrate is colonized cutting down on contaminations:

I am starting to wonder if you are kidding :tongue: Firstly, you would be drowning your spawn in CO2 levels despite the fact that the tub may not be 'air tight'. Then if the spawn managed to fully colonize the substrate in the CO2 gas chamber its sitting in, you'd be exposing it to what ever contaminants may be floating in the air or hunched over the tub shredding plastic all over it. Absolutely, ridiculously bad idea.

Hope I don't come off sounding like an asshole, just my two cents. Good luck with whatever method you use :thumbup:


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Offlineiskinbash
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: c1dh3d]
    #10150943 - 04/12/09 08:03 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Unfortunately, youll have to think your procedure over again because you would only be able to do that once to each container.

Something I have been doing, and I havent had a problem with yet is, once you mix your spawn with your sub, lay another trash bag on top, and use that as means to keep CO2 levels up. Once its fully colonized, just pull it off and induce fruiting conditions. Not sure if its the best method, but for me it has worked again and again.


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Offlinefutura
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: c1dh3d]
    #10150952 - 04/12/09 08:09 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

c1dh3d said:
Waiting to cut holes til it is colonized question:

No. You may want high CO2 levels for spawn run, but not absolute CO2 levels, the monotubs design is meant to vent excess CO2 - there will always be CO2 in the air just above the substrate as it is the heavier gas. If you are really concerned about it, you could use tyvek to cover the holes to keep some of the gas exchange inside, but that defeats the purpose of the 'hands free' setup if your swapping it out for polyfil after colonization (and its just completely unneccesary). Monstermich's tek is the one I am using in the grow log in my sig, and as presented in the pictures it is colonizing great with polyfil'd holes.

Aside from the above mentioned, do you really want to remove your freshly colonized substrate from the tub to cut holes in it, or try drilling holes directly over the substrate and cover the top layer of it in plastic shavings?

In the grow log below, I used a 10 lbs bag of highmountaincompost, and 4 quart jars of spawn, and followed the measurements in which to cut the holes on Monstermichs tek exactly. As can be seen, the substrate depth with the spawn added in fills it up almost perfectly below the holes, though I am using an 18 gallon tub - Not sure if that deviates from Monstermich's materials.

As for the not cutting holes until the substrate is colonized cutting down on contaminations:

I am starting to wonder if you are kidding :tongue: Firstly, you would be drowning your spawn in CO2 levels despite the fact that the tub may not be 'air tight'. Then if the spawn managed to fully colonize the substrate in the CO2 gas chamber its sitting in, you'd be exposing it to what ever contaminants may be floating in the air or hunched over the tub shredding plastic all over it. Absolutely, ridiculously bad idea.

Hope I don't come off sounding like an asshole, just my two cents. Good luck with whatever method you use :thumbup:




Thanks...and no your not coming off like an A Hole...you answered exactly what I needed answered...sometimes I "Overthink" especialy while Im waiting around for my spawn jars and bags to colonize.How does the song go..."Too Much Time On My Hands!!! LoL!!!

Thanks for taking the time to respond!!!!

futura


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Offlinefutura
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: iskinbash]
    #10150957 - 04/12/09 08:11 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

iskinbash said:
Unfortunately, youll have to think your procedure over again because you would only be able to do that once to each container.

Something I have been doing, and I havent had a problem with yet is, once you mix your spawn with your sub, lay another trash bag on top, and use that as means to keep CO2 levels up. Once its fully colonized, just pull it off and induce fruiting conditions. Not sure if its the best method, but for me it has worked again and again.




Thanks..I was considering the "Crumpled Wax Paper" Tek to do exactly that...

futura


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Offlinefutura
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: c1dh3d]
    #10150976 - 04/12/09 08:22 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Oh and thanks for the link to the growlog...pretty much what I planned on doing two tubs with a little under 1 to 1 spawn/sub ratio(4 Qts Z strain on Rye to ten Lbs(5 Qts HMC) and 4 Qts Cambos on Rye to 5 Qts(Ten Lbs HMC)also doing 1 tub with 2 1/2 qts EQs(on mix of BRF and 5 Grains plus Bloodmeal)(As this is all I have of the EQs) to 10 lbs(5 Qts HMC)...No casing layers on any and will dunk 4 to 6 hours between flushes for max yield...

one question though...did you tape upsides of bag to monotub or just cut to substrate level???

Look forward to your growlog updates...


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Offlinec1dh3d
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: futura]
    #10151019 - 04/12/09 08:38 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

I used Gorilla tape to tape the garbage bag to the sides, and as this is my first ever mono-tub, I learned a very valuable lesson here - leave yourself plenty of slack depth-wise or you will have your substrate hanging in the monotub like a hammock rather than flat against the bottom. I completely taped this thing up before I realized that I had made a hammock for my substrate in the monotub! :rolleyes: So be sure to check your slack with every edge of the bag you tape, definitely.

Two questions:

1. You going to be posting a grow log for your different tubs?

2. Care to trade a print from your Z-Strain for a print of OI assuming all goes according to plan on each end?


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Offlineiskinbash
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: c1dh3d]
    #10151136 - 04/12/09 09:38 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

If you just barely tape up the bag underneath with plenty of slack, put your spawn and bulk sub in, let it fully colonize, case it if desired, then cut the garbage bag to just barely above the top of the sub, then you wont need to tape it. And with it untaped while fruiting, the bag can cling to the sub as it shrinks, instead of being taped to the sides and exposing the side of the sub as it shrinks.

Heres a couple pics of my current tub. I used the method described above.




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InvisibleShr00mZ
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: iskinbash]
    #10151186 - 04/12/09 09:57 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Clean the sides of the tub, when they're still moist stick ur trash bag liner in. Always black never use white. While the sides of the tub r moist it will hold your trash bag up against the sides. Then dump in the goods. Cut the liner to sub level. If you dont it will just get in the way. But its not impossible to never cut the trash bag.


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OfflineBudwiseman
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: Shr00mZ]
    #10169573 - 04/15/09 05:52 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Good tips here


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Offlineveda_sticks
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: Budwiseman]
    #10169582 - 04/15/09 05:57 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

I thought i answered this exact same question last month about waiting to cut the holes.

No, make the holes before using it. When you put the polyfill, pack it in tight for colinisation. Then when its ready for fruiting, take it out and pack it looser. simples.

Lining with a black trash bag is a good suggestion. It will help prevent side pinning. The substrate will stick to the bag as it shrinks, also makes for easier cleaning.


--------------------

PF TEK - writeup by EvilMushroom666
Lets Grow Mushrooms - RogerRabbit & RoadKills website with sample videos plus the full PF TEK video series. Alot of great information - BUY THE DVD
Cakes can and will pin! - So you think cakes suck for pins. Your wrong
Franks Simple Coir/Verm Tek
Franks Proper Pasturisation Tek
Franks Spawning To Bulk - Monotub
Professor Pinheads RTV Injection Port Tek
Foo Mans No Soak WBS Prep Tek


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Offlinefutura
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: c1dh3d]
    #10173075 - 04/15/09 05:51 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

c1dh3d said:
I used Gorilla tape to tape the garbage bag to the sides, and as this is my first ever mono-tub, I learned a very valuable lesson here - leave yourself plenty of slack depth-wise or you will have your substrate hanging in the monotub like a hammock rather than flat against the bottom. I completely taped this thing up before I realized that I had made a hammock for my substrate in the monotub! :rolleyes: So be sure to check your slack with every edge of the bag you tape, definitely.

Two questions:

1. You going to be posting a grow log for your different tubs?

**UPDATED 4/11** First grow log - Reduced to 1 monotub - Phase 2.5




Was looking at your grow log again...did you case??? and if so what did you use???I am going Uncased as most Monotub teks I read said not to use a casing layer in a monotub as their should be enough moisture in the bulk substrate...Especialy with HMC(Acoording to them) their is enough for 2 or 3 flushes. I am however going to dunk for 4 to 5 hours between flushes to rehydrate...I plan on removing myc mat by lifting out whole bag...place it in clean sterile tote with no holes and pour springwater(Ice cold from fridge to cut down on possible bacteria growth.) I will then take out of tote and lay on top of perforated Laundry Hamper and shimmy out old bag and let drain for 1/2 hour,,,that lets me clean out and sterilize monotub..add new bag and new polyfill return myc mat and start fresh for my second and hopefully third flushes...

Look forward to updates on grow log..would especially like to see if those Orissas turn out as HUGE as they are supposed to be!!!


Edited by futura (04/15/09 05:54 PM)


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OfflineDegot846
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: futura]
    #10173280 - 04/15/09 06:29 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

hopefully it's not the end of the road if you didn't cut ya holes prior to the spawn run


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InvisibleRedBeerd
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: veda_sticks]
    #10175436 - 04/15/09 11:50 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

veda_sticks said:
Lining with a black trash bag is a good suggestion. It will help prevent side pinning. The substrate will stick to the bag as it shrinks, also makes for easier cleaning.




All reasons making the trash bag liner a must.  Also, something I've been doing lately.. On late flushes or when your sub starts to shrink enough to where you're worried about side pinning, place chunks of polyfil inbetween the tub and the trash bag to take up the extra room..

As far as holes, I think you'll definitely want to do them beforehand... You'll either make a mess or hurt the myc making them after the colonization run...

Also, if your lid is not air tight, it will likely create enough GE just through the rim... I tend to tape up my holes with packaging tape during colonization, then filling loosely with polyfil afterward.


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OfflineBugzy
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: RedBeerd]
    #10175726 - 04/16/09 01:01 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

... I tend to tape up my holes with packaging tape during colonization, then filling loosely with polyfil afterward.


Not opposing too this idea, but do have a suggestion if you feel inovative......

You could use a hole saw too cut your holes too an exact size, find some PVC tubing which is cheap as polyfill, too fit and buy PVC end caps for the tubing.

Cut the tubing about 1/2"-3/4" longer than the depth of the cap and glue or silicone the tubing in the holes of the tub.

Make sure too mark the tubing after you put the cap on so you know where the cap ends, remove the cap and silicone the tubing in place.

Drill several 1/4-1/8" holes in the cap too allow GE, but restrict FAE

once dry, you can stuff the tubes w/ proper amount of poly and then while your sub is colonizing you can put the caps on too allow GE and remove during fruiting for FAE.

Just an idea.


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OfflineBudwiseman
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: Bugzy]
    #10176214 - 04/16/09 05:30 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Great ideas here


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Offlineshroomie_glen
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: Budwiseman]
    #10176615 - 04/16/09 08:54 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

You make the tub as usual, putting polyfill in the holes when spawning the grains and initially mixing the sub. 

THEN put the monotubs in one huge black trash bag.  Peek in on it about once a week, and this will vent all that unnecessary co2  until fully colonized.

To fruit, just remove the trash bag.  ITs THAT easy.


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OfflineSamoney84
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: Shr00mZ]
    #21848126 - 06/23/15 10:16 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Answered my question. Might go this route.


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OfflineGreen Bastard
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: Samoney84]
    #21849575 - 06/24/15 09:37 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Samoney84 said:
Answered my question. Might go this route.




Kinda old thread, with some outdated ideas....


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OfflinePussyFart
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Re: Some thoughts on Monotub Holes...everyones opinion welcome and wanted [Re: Green Bastard]
    #21849638 - 06/24/15 09:56 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

No need for placing it in a trash bag...just tape up the holes for colonization, and untape and stuff with polyfill for fruiting.

No need to drill holes in any lids either.


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