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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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OfflineFeemer
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Registered: 06/22/15
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Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
A Ramble on Reality, Existence, and Pardoxes
    #21843012 - 06/22/15 07:38 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Assumptions and founding principles

0. We may and probably will never understand this fully, be positive of it's truth, or know that we aren't crazy.

1. Time isn't what we think. There is only the ever present now. Expanding on the definition of time, I prefer to view it as a room. In the middle of the room (the present), energy manifests itself. The past is simply what was manifested before, and the future is what could manifest (on the left and right respectively).

What is reality? I would define reality as experience. Experience of anything, makes it real. I can see and experience the sight of a tree. But reality isn't limited to the material, you can experience an idea, belief, emotion that can never be touched or verified by anyone but yourself, but it is still real and exists. Existence is a curious thing in itself. Something can exist, even if you are not aware of it; it becomes apart of your reality when you become aware of (experience) it. Let's go off on a related tangent. When you really think about existence and the universe, you might ask the question: why does anything exist at all? Doesn't it seem more likely that absolutely nothing, and i mean NOTHING should exist? (And there's the paradox, absolute nonexistence would exist, but more on that later) But, as far as we know, we do exist, lots of shit exists and forms reality. But why, if we assume we do indeed exist, should reality and existence only be in the form it is, with our laws of physics and what not? Doesn't it seem that, if it's more likely that nothing should exist, yet our universe does exist, that EVERYTHING should exist rather than nothing? Why such a narrow form of existence and reality? It could be that that's just the way it is, and this is the only form that can exist as governed by those pesky laws of physics. However that's a rather unsatisfactory answer, and leads you back to asking why do the laws of physics exist? And to go off on yet another tangent, do the laws of physics act on thoughts, or for a more specific definition, conciousness? Yes, if we assume conciousness is created by the odd collection of elements that form our bodies, which are acted on by those laws of physics. But how, going back to the earlier point, can something exist if you can't experience it? So if conciousness is indeed created by those odd set of elements that are subject to laws of physics, that is a paradox, because those things would need to be experienced by conciousness to even exist in the first place. However, this only remains a paradox only if we keep that same definition of conciousness. What is conciousness? What is experience? I would posit that conciousness and experience is simply an exchange of energy (which can manifest itself in any form). When I experience a tree, it is light energy that conveys to me there is a tree. When I touch something, neurons and synapses fire and signal that energy, forming my thoughts. So if conciousness and experience is simply the exchange of energy, one could make the claim that an atom of hydrogen is concious because it experiences energy transfer. But what is hydrogen made out of? An electron, proton, and neutron. What are those made out of? Quarks and empty space (physicists have calculated that 90% of the mast of a proton is empty space, which is given weight by particles that pop in and out of space, time, and different dimensions). But what are those made out of?! You see the infinite paradox. It seems that in light of this paradox and in general logic, that EVERYTHING has to, absolutely has to be made out of the same thing, the same source material or substance. What is this source material? Is it energy? Energy is what I'm going to call it. Even particles and mass is just energy. When you destroy mass, such as in a fission/fusion reaction, energy is conserved. Energy just is. It cannot be created or destroyed.  Everywhere you look and everything you experience is not only made out of energy, but is experienced by the change/transfer of that energy. Your thoughts are energy. That tree, is energy. The air you breath is energy. So, if everything, and I do mean everything, is made out of the same source material (energy), then what is the difference between a tree and a thought? Your thoughts are just as real as the tree. The idea of elves and fairies and gods and ideologies are just as real as everything  around you. But can we test that it is real, can we observe it? One could argue that by simply having and experiencing the thought, it exists and is real. So to attempt to coalesce my thoughts, I would say EVERYTHING exists, or has the potential to, simply because everything is made out of the same thing, energy, which is constantly changing and manifesting itself in new, different, and increasingly complex ways. Now, dinosaurs don't exist in the conventional use of the word. They did exist at one time however. But, as I stated in our assumptions, time is arbitrary, and is simply the change in energy in an ever present now. And I'll back that up by saying, again in conventional terms of time, the past doesn't exist anymore and the future doesn't exist yet, there is only now that exists. It's has never not been now. So under our new ideas of time and existence, everything exists simultaneously, or given enough time,  everything will exist - but under our new understanding, that is the same thing as simultaneously existing. But elves and dinosaurs and fairies don't exist you say. And the laws of physics do. But as I said far far earlier, things don't exist in your reality until you become aware of (experience or perceive) them, but they still exist! And that's the punchline, if everything is made out of the same thing, then everything exists. But it is how you experience and perceive that source material (energy), that creates your reality. So I will ask, how many things exist that we just aren't aware of or cannot perceive? And perception will again form your view of reality. If a rabbit is preyed upon by a hawk, and two people observe it, they could form very different ideas and perceive the event very differently. And who's to say whom is correct? Is there an absolute truth and reality, that such and event can only be interpreted in one way that is ABSOLUTELY right? And following that, if there is an absolute truth and reality, would it be synonymous with the purpose of existence? But if everything is the same source material, energy, then is there a purpose? I posit that the purpose of existence and conciousness, which again is just energy, is that there is no purpose. I know, again with the parodoxes, but it's true. Is energy trying to do anything? Is there some final goal or form it is trying to achieve? And why didn't it just immediately manifest itself into that form, unless of course it was already in that form? So to try and articulate, we have already fulfilled the goal of existence/experience/conciousness because we exist and experience and are concious. So the "purpose" of it all, to me at least, is to simply experience and to be. But if there is no purpose, then why experience and exist? Well as I think I said in a rather convoluted way earlier, not existing and experiencing is, as it turns out, an experience, thus creating existence. Not existing and not experiencing is still a state of being. This is articulated well by the comments of a fellow psychonaut. we assume something is real because it has an outer edge, and thus can be experienced. But you can always take away the outer edge, until you have nothing, and I do mean NOTHING as in nothing exists. but when you have all of that absolute nothingness and non existence, the outer edge of that nothingness is nothingness. By giving it an outer edge to be experienced, thus it exists. Damn paradoxes.


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InvisibleDividedQuantumM
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Re: A Ramble on Reality, Existence, and Pardoxes [Re: Feemer]
    #21843093 - 06/22/15 07:54 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Please, please try to break that up into paragraphs next time -- walls of text are extremely hard on the eyes and difficult to read.


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InvisibleEternalCowabunga
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Registered: 04/04/05
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Re: A Ramble on Reality, Existence, and Pardoxes [Re: Feemer]
    #21843814 - 06/22/15 10:24 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Feemer said:
Assumptions and founding principles

0. We may and probably will never understand this fully, be positive of it's truth, or know that we aren't crazy.

1. Time isn't what we think. There is only the ever present now. Expanding on the definition of time, I prefer to view it as a room. In the middle of the room (the present), energy manifests itself. The past is simply what was manifested before, and the future is what could manifest (on the left and right respectively).

What is reality? I would define reality as experience. Experience of anything, makes it real. I can see and experience the sight of a tree. But reality isn't limited to the material, you can experience an idea, belief, emotion that can never be touched or verified by anyone but yourself, but it is still real and exists. Existence is a curious thing in itself. Something can exist, even if you are not aware of it; it becomes apart of your reality when you become aware of (experience) it. Let's go off on a related tangent. When you really think about existence and the universe, you might ask the question: why does anything exist at all? Doesn't it seem more likely that absolutely nothing, and i mean NOTHING should exist? (And there's the paradox, absolute nonexistence would exist, but more on that later) But, as far as we know, we do exist, lots of shit exists and forms reality. But why, if we assume we do indeed exist, should reality and existence only be in the form it is, with our laws of physics and what not? Doesn't it seem that, if it's more likely that nothing should exist, yet our universe does exist, that EVERYTHING should exist rather than nothing? Why such a narrow form of existence and reality? It could be that that's just the way it is, and this is the only form that can exist as governed by those pesky laws of physics. However that's a rather unsatisfactory answer, and leads you back to asking why do the laws of physics exist? And to go off on yet another tangent, do the laws of physics act on thoughts, or for a more specific definition, conciousness? Yes, if we assume conciousness is created by the odd collection of elements that form our bodies, which are acted on by those laws of physics. But how, going back to the earlier point, can something exist if you can't experience it? So if conciousness is indeed created by those odd set of elements that are subject to laws of physics, that is a paradox, because those things would need to be experienced by conciousness to even exist in the first place. However, this only remains a paradox only if we keep that same definition of conciousness. What is conciousness? What is experience? I would posit that conciousness and experience is simply an exchange of energy (which can manifest itself in any form). When I experience a tree, it is light energy that conveys to me there is a tree. When I touch something, neurons and synapses fire and signal that energy, forming my thoughts. So if conciousness and experience is simply the exchange of energy, one could make the claim that an atom of hydrogen is concious because it experiences energy transfer. But what is hydrogen made out of? An electron, proton, and neutron. What are those made out of? Quarks and empty space (physicists have calculated that 90% of the mast of a proton is empty space, which is given weight by particles that pop in and out of space, time, and different dimensions). But what are those made out of?! You see the infinite paradox. It seems that in light of this paradox and in general logic, that EVERYTHING has to, absolutely has to be made out of the same thing, the same source material or substance. What is this source material? Is it energy? Energy is what I'm going to call it. Even particles and mass is just energy. When you destroy mass, such as in a fission/fusion reaction, energy is conserved. Energy just is. It cannot be created or destroyed.  Everywhere you look and everything you experience is not only made out of energy, but is experienced by the change/transfer of that energy. Your thoughts are energy. That tree, is energy. The air you breath is energy. So, if everything, and I do mean everything, is made out of the same source material (energy), then what is the difference between a tree and a thought? Your thoughts are just as real as the tree. The idea of elves and fairies and gods and ideologies are just as real as everything  around you. But can we test that it is real, can we observe it? One could argue that by simply having and experiencing the thought, it exists and is real. So to attempt to coalesce my thoughts, I would say EVERYTHING exists, or has the potential to, simply because everything is made out of the same thing, energy, which is constantly changing and manifesting itself in new, different, and increasingly complex ways. Now, dinosaurs don't exist in the conventional use of the word. They did exist at one time however. But, as I stated in our assumptions, time is arbitrary, and is simply the change in energy in an ever present now. And I'll back that up by saying, again in conventional terms of time, the past doesn't exist anymore and the future doesn't exist yet, there is only now that exists. It's has never not been now. So under our new ideas of time and existence, everything exists simultaneously, or given enough time,  everything will exist - but under our new understanding, that is the same thing as simultaneously existing. But elves and dinosaurs and fairies don't exist you say. And the laws of physics do. But as I said far far earlier, things don't exist in your reality until you become aware of (experience or perceive) them, but they still exist! And that's the punchline, if everything is made out of the same thing, then everything exists. But it is how you experience and perceive that source material (energy), that creates your reality. So I will ask, how many things exist that we just aren't aware of or cannot perceive? And perception will again form your view of reality. If a rabbit is preyed upon by a hawk, and two people observe it, they could form very different ideas and perceive the event very differently. And who's to say whom is correct? Is there an absolute truth and reality, that such and event can only be interpreted in one way that is ABSOLUTELY right? And following that, if there is an absolute truth and reality, would it be synonymous with the purpose of existence? But if everything is the same source material, energy, then is there a purpose? I posit that the purpose of existence and conciousness, which again is just energy, is that there is no purpose. I know, again with the parodoxes, but it's true. Is energy trying to do anything? Is there some final goal or form it is trying to achieve? And why didn't it just immediately manifest itself into that form, unless of course it was already in that form? So to try and articulate, we have already fulfilled the goal of existence/experience/conciousness because we exist and experience and are concious. So the "purpose" of it all, to me at least, is to simply experience and to be. But if there is no purpose, then why experience and exist? Well as I think I said in a rather convoluted way earlier, not existing and experiencing is, as it turns out, an experience, thus creating existence. Not existing and not experiencing is still a state of being. This is articulated well by the comments of a fellow psychonaut. we assume something is real because it has an outer edge, and thus can be experienced. But you can always take away the outer edge, until you have nothing, and I do mean NOTHING as in nothing exists. but when you have all of that absolute nothingness and non existence, the outer edge of that nothingness is nothingness. By giving it an outer edge to be experienced, thus it exists. Damn paradoxes.




:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


--------------------


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Offlinesecondorder
Amanda Hug'n'kiss
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Registered: 04/05/15
Posts: 532
Loc: Queensland, Australia
Last seen: 9 months, 6 days
Re: A Ramble on Reality, Existence, and Pardoxes [Re: Feemer]
    #21849148 - 06/24/15 06:48 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Please, please try to break that up into paragraphs next time -- walls of text are extremely hard on the eyes and difficult to read.




This^


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


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