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Invisiblemillzy
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Registered: 05/12/10
Posts: 12,404
Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: SirShroomsAlott]
    #21836268 - 06/21/15 10:34 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

yeah, i really don't buy that about flying dixie being some deeply meaningful gesture to the south's history. here's an interesting civil war fact for you. the 1861 confederate constitution was a carbon copy of the u.s. constitution with one exception: it laid down explicit laws regarding slavery.

from article 1, regarding the importation of slaves.

Quote:

(2) Congress shall also have power to prohibit the introduction of slaves from any State not a member of, or Territory not belonging to, this Confederacy.




a line or so down, same section, regarding slave ownership.

Quote:

(4) No bill of attainder, ex post facto law, or law denying or impairing the right of property in negro slaves shall be passed.




source.

like i've said, it was the bizarro united states.


--------------------
I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger


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InvisibleSirShroomsAlott
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I'm a teapot


Registered: 05/15/14
Posts: 6,945
Loc: United States Flag
Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: millzy]
    #21836297 - 06/21/15 10:38 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Well we have the seperation of church and state, yet school districts want to teach creationism in science class, others want a plaque of the 10 commandments on state property. So many more that I don't feel like naming, the bible also condones slavery, even lays out a detailed instruction on how to own and treat them, but everyone skips over that part and probably pretends it's a metaphor for something else. But most people are Christian so that should be okay, but not a lot of people think like people down south, so that isn't okay.

This flag has been there forever, and was never a problem, until the actions of one person. It's a piece of cloth, nothing more, most state property its on, probably IS a representation of the history it has with that land. I highly doubt the states themselves have openly come out and say they are waving that flag as a way to endorse slavery.


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OfflineIhateyou
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: ohcrapitsnico]
    #21836301 - 06/21/15 10:38 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

If that's what you believe in put it up. It shouldn't be up in any government properties though. This is America not the Confederacy


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Invisiblemillzy
Male

Registered: 05/12/10
Posts: 12,404
Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Ihateyou]
    #21836418 - 06/21/15 10:51 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

i don't really care if people fly dixie. it's free speech. but the fact remains that it is, and always will be, a symbol of one of our most reviled institutions. you can say it means other things but that doesn't change that white supremacy/slavery are the two primary ideas associated with it.


--------------------
I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger


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OfflineEnjoywho
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Registered: 07/06/09
Posts: 20,880
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Ihateyou]
    #21836425 - 06/21/15 10:52 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I like it. All though the confederate flag that was actually used is different. But I like the new design that represents it now.

Beside all the shit that it ends up representing which I no doubt frown upon. I believe free speech is key. It's cool that it was the first thing they threw into the amendments.

If someone does walk around sporting it and is a racist douche bag especially as I have a lot of black friends just being a racist asshole he'll get his ass beat into the ground real quick. There's no excuse for just being an ignorant racist ass hole. I don't care what color you are if you can make me laugh i'll like ya instantly.


--------------------
"I don't give nothin' to nobody, I just pay the cost to do business." - Riley "Young Reezy"-Boondocks

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

"In the days of kings and queens I was a jester."

"And then the great lord created bears... too many bears... shoulda really dialed back on the bears." Squidbillies

"Can you start speaking words instead of your damn filthy lies!"- Louise "Bobs Burgers"


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: SirShroomsAlott]
    #21836450 - 06/21/15 10:59 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

>We don't convict people of thought crime in the US....at least not yet.

They do it now, ordinary crimes become enhanced hate crimes if the perps say anything un pc while committing it. So one regular punishment for the crime and a bigger punishment for thinking wrong thoughts. Plus people lose their jobs for not being pc, the thought police are out patrolling at all times.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755


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InvisibleSirShroomsAlott
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Posts: 6,945
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Stonehenge] * 2
    #21836461 - 06/21/15 11:01 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Guess I was wrong, we've already advanced to the stage of punishing people for thoughts.....well that's annoying.


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Offlinekoods
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Apollyphelion] * 1
    #21836924 - 06/21/15 01:02 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Apollyphelion said:
Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

Asante said:
Waving the confederate flag today means "we are racist losers and proud of it". The same as waving a nazi flag today. It used to be fairly innocent but now we know better, well except for some sore losers who persist in their stupidity.

In a historic context its a great symbol though.

Its a great symbol anyway: the states that wanted to cross out freedom.





doesnt the danish flag mean the same things since the bulk of the slave trade was
the dutch and that racism still shines through today




PWNED.




Really? What does the Danish flag have to do with the Dutch? Denmark and the Netherlands are two separate countries. :facepalm:


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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Offlinekoods
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: millzy]
    #21836934 - 06/21/15 01:04 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

millzy said:
i don't really care if people fly dixie. it's free speech. but the fact remains that it is, and always will be, a symbol of one of our most reviled institutions. you can say it means other things but that doesn't change that white supremacy/slavery are the two primary ideas associated with it.




It is also represents treason against the US.


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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InvisibleSoupSandwich
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: koods]
    #21836936 - 06/21/15 01:04 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

It's offensive.

It should stay flapping in the wind.

People need to harden the fuck up.



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Offlinekoods
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: SoupSandwich] * 1
    #21836959 - 06/21/15 01:09 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I don't know why southerners would be proud of the flag anyways. Doesn't it remind them of sucking ass in battle?


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #21836979 - 06/21/15 01:12 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

Asante said:
Waving the confederate flag today means "we are racist losers and proud of it". The same as waving a nazi flag today. It used to be fairly innocent but now we know better, well except for some sore losers who persist in their stupidity.

In a historic context its a great symbol though.

Its a great symbol anyway: the states that wanted to cross out freedom.





doesnt the danish flag mean the same things since the bulk of the slave trade was
the dutch and that racism still shines through today




Yeah, the obvious difference between the Danish flag wasn't used as a rallying cry for segregationists, and white supremacy terrorism for over a century.




as it was pointed out.. the dutch flag

but yea, it was infact used as such for about 200 years, what flag do you think
the KKK flew before the confederate naval jack? yes, the stars and stripes,
it's well known that the transatlantic slave trade was deeply rooted in racism
and that the dominant driving force in the transatlantic slave trade was the dutch


so yea... the dutch are the original racists and we need to eradicate their flag

Quote:

Next you're gonna tell us there's nothing wrong with Germans flying Nazi flags because the swastika is simply an ancient eastern symbol for the sun.




no, what I'm gonna tell you is I dont give a fuck what flag someone flies, it's
a fucking flag, a piece of cloth and the only ones that can give that piece of
cloth any power are the butthurt that allow it to have power over them


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: koods]
    #21836989 - 06/21/15 01:14 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:

Really? What does the Danish flag have to do with the Dutch? Denmark and the Netherlands are two separate countries. :facepalm:





both were in bed together with the bigotry and slavery. it's well documented but
the south is obviously the bad guy in all this


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InvisibletheRAPeutic
Hueman
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Registered: 07/22/13
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Patlal]
    #21837022 - 06/21/15 01:24 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

nah i dont like the flag

I was pretty cool with this kid from highschool who moved to Virginia sophomore year to live with his dad.. and he'd tell me how common it was for white kids to go out, drive around in high populace black areas with the flag swaying to "piss off the niggers".


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InvisibleDark_Star
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: theRAPeutic]
    #21837032 - 06/21/15 01:30 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I was on the train coming home from work a month or so back, and saw a lowriding pickup with the roof painted with the stars & bars parked in a lot in a bad section of a major NE city. I wonder what happened to that truck.... :lol:

Re: the Dutch, Europeans love to shit on the US, all while ignoring the atrocities that their countries have commited over years.


--------------------


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InvisibleAstral Pain
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Registered: 11/10/14
Posts: 2,923
Loc: Chicago
Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Dark_Star]
    #21837058 - 06/21/15 01:40 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Must have been Dukes Of Hazzard fans.



--------------------
"I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out"               
                -Bill Hicks-

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OfflineBeanhead
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Dark_Star] * 1
    #21837064 - 06/21/15 01:42 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Nah the Dutch were just smartasses capitalizing on anything and everything

u guys just jelly :awehigh:

I thought most prominent slavetraders were the Africans themselves O.o


Edited by Beanhead (06/21/15 01:43 PM)


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InvisibleSoupSandwich
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Beanhead]
    #21837078 - 06/21/15 01:46 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

White / Western Culture is one of the few slavery free zones in the world.
Yet, gets blamed for world wide slavery by most western history profs.


LINK


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OfflineBeanhead
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: SoupSandwich]
    #21837082 - 06/21/15 01:47 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Fuck you assholes blaming the dutchies

,,!,,

owait that's modern.


Edited by Beanhead (06/21/15 01:48 PM)


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #21837090 - 06/21/15 01:50 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

Asante said:
Waving the confederate flag today means "we are racist losers and proud of it". The same as waving a nazi flag today. It used to be fairly innocent but now we know better, well except for some sore losers who persist in their stupidity.

In a historic context its a great symbol though.

Its a great symbol anyway: the states that wanted to cross out freedom.





doesnt the danish flag mean the same things since the bulk of the slave trade was
the dutch and that racism still shines through today




Yeah, the obvious difference between the Danish flag wasn't used as a rallying cry for segregationists, and white supremacy terrorism for over a century.


Next you're gonna tell us there's nothing wrong with Germans flying Nazi flags because the swastika is simply an ancient eastern symbol for the sun.




The nazi flag itself is theft of an ancient symbol, which is trying to be reclaimed from the nazi legacy by various Buddhist or Hindu groups to this day.
The flag should not be flown, but there should also be an increase in cultural awareness of the symbol's importance to those who wish to use it once again divorced from the legacy of hate it was tied to.

Not sure there is fair parallel with the Confederate flag though.
The flag originated in the time of the civil war, which was a war over slavery.
Beyond the racist implications, it is also a banner of union between states who presumably still feel their other cultural influences to have been important to the formation of the modern United States.
Divorcing a sense of union through similar culture from the implications of the civil war is not so clean as the symbolism of the nazi flag though.

Not an American personally though, so my input on the topic of the flag itself is that even if they found a way to ban the flag it would only stoke fires of anger in the hearts of those who take pride in it; do not think it would do anything to really cull racism, aside from taking away a banner that some choose to rally under.
Likely they would make a new banner, and feel that it was further proof for a need to enact change.

Germany apparently still has supporters of the holocaust involved with at least one of their political parties:

They fly something other than the Nazi flag though.

As a Canadian looking in from the outside -- would not fly a Confederate flag if ever I moved to the southern states (where I have family).
Flew a Québec flag in Québec, which is often looked upon as a symbol of a very different sort of cultural struggle.  People would potentially hate me if it were up on the flagpole in the prairie provinces though.
:shrug:

Clearly not the same thing, but my closest frame of reference. :lol:


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