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Invisible404
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Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 14,539
Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21861022 - 06/26/15 05:45 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Quote:

404 said:

if the confederate flag represents oppression then we should probably tear down the flag we have currently as well as it was flown over the japanese internment camps







So why should the confederate flag be singled out for banishment?

To p silyman
>i'll be waiting for you to counter my point about the japanese internment camps

You may have a long wait. Facts are not what those people like to deal with.





i can't tell if you're talking to me or him with that question. i never said the flag should be singled out for banishment, nor am i a "left wing extremist", i'm a libertarian if anything.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: 404] * 1
    #21862152 - 06/26/15 11:37 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

the confederate flag represents pride in being on the losing side of a military and moral conflict(150 years ago).  Why any Southerner would take pride in that is beyond me.  it is a symbol of the darkest days of the south.  But, if they want to fly that old rag on private property, that should be their right.  As long as its not flying over gov't buildings, i have no bitch.


--------------------


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: koods] * 1
    #21862159 - 06/26/15 11:39 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Dr. P. Silocybin said:
The civil war was about slavery. Lincoln fought for the Union. The Confederates rebelled for slavery.




So Lincoln was wrong but you're right?

:lmafo:




Lincoln's motivations aren't important. He didn't start the war. The people who started the war were motivated by slavery.






the south left the union, they established their own nation, the union started the war with this new nation


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OfflineTheGreenArrow
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Prisoner#1] * 1
    #21862164 - 06/26/15 11:42 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Yay,big federal government and the giant ,"fuck you!" They have towards state's rights.


--------------------
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an
invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, conn a ship, write a
sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the
dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve an
equation, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a
computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.
Specialization is for insects.- Robert A. Heinlein
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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Dr. P. Silocybin]
    #21862170 - 06/26/15 11:44 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Dr. P. Silocybin said:
again........  http://www.amazon.com/Apostles-Disunion-Southern-Secession-Commissioners/dp/081392104X

Read the fucking book.

The rebellion was about slavery and the rebellion started before Lincoln was even inaugurated.

I have to go to work. I'll get back to correcting your revisionist history later.





isnt that the same guy that wrote about and constructed a park dedicated to the
'fact' that the north discovered dinosaurs and used them to win the war against
the south





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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #21862205 - 06/27/15 12:02 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I think of good old boys.  Good old southern boys, strapping young lads with sweat and grease dripping off their paunchy frames in the hot swamp.  Diverse southern boys of all shapes colors and sizes rolling playfully and lovingly in the hay together as one, with the only thing they have in common being their shared southern heritage. 

They have been known to take things to far, but I have known a diverse group of people to have pride in that symbol of loving brotherhood, and I have no problem with that as long as I feel the history behind it is honestly represented.  It never was a country, and it never will be if I have anything to say about it.

Lots of flags are symbols of war after all, and nobody likes war, but you can't always assume that a flag many people may freely choose to use can only be used for one reason.



See?  I bet you guys thought I didn't understand southern men.  We have some common ground.  We both find flags and brotherhood arousing.


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OfflineTheGreenArrow
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #21862217 - 06/27/15 12:09 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I agree with most of that post except the fact the Confedreracy WAs recognized US.


--------------------
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an
invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, conn a ship, write a
sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the
dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve an
equation, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a
computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.
Specialization is for insects.- Robert A. Heinlein
Saint RedBow of the Shroomey Loomey-Patron Saint of Sandbaggin Sumbitchs


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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: TheGreenArrow]
    #21862220 - 06/27/15 12:12 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I'm not sure of the technicality regarding it having been or not been a country, but anyone operating under the presumption that "the south will rise again" or anything like that is not included in my allowances for using that flag is what I'm trying to say.  I don't think many people actually think that, but I'm sure at least a couple still do.


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OfflineTheGreenArrow
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #21862236 - 06/27/15 12:18 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Lynard Skyner/Gimie back my bullets



--------------------
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an
invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, conn a ship, write a
sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the
dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve an
equation, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a
computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.
Specialization is for insects.- Robert A. Heinlein
Saint RedBow of the Shroomey Loomey-Patron Saint of Sandbaggin Sumbitchs


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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: TheGreenArrow]
    #21862263 - 06/27/15 12:31 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Heck yeah.  We've all come so far together. 



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OfflineLucisM
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #21862265 - 06/27/15 12:32 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)



--------------------
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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: TheGreenArrow] * 1
    #21862308 - 06/27/15 12:47 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

TheGreenArrow said:
Yay,big federal government and the giant ,"fuck you!" They have towards state's rights.




United States Constitution
article 1 section 9
Quote:

The Migration or Importation of such Persons as any of the States now existing shall think proper to admit, shall not be prohibited by the Congress prior to the Year one thousand eight hundred and eight, but a Tax or duty may be imposed on such Importation, not exceeding ten dollars for each Person.




ok, so congress wasn't allowed to fuck with the importation of slaves except by enacted a tax or duty not to exceed $10 per person...until 1808 which is precisely the year that importing slaves was prohibited by congress.  seems like slavery was getting phased out from day one, but maybe youre right, maybe states rights were being trampled...

article 1 section 8

Quote:

The Congress shall have power
To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes;
To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;
To make all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers vested by this Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof.




...and then again maybe not.


--------------------


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: D.M.T]
    #21862373 - 06/27/15 01:16 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

D.M.T said:
Quote:

Asante said:
What I think of the confederate flag?






Somehow I doubt that's how you really feel





I'm not saying that I love the confederate flag, Im saying that love is the antidote to what the confederate flag stands for.

Its a flag of hate. The pink heart is a symbol of love.


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


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OfflineDr. P. Silocybin
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #21862561 - 06/27/15 03:09 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

404 said:
i'll be waiting for you to counter my point about the japanese internment camps



Every nation, and therefore every flag has both good and bad history to it. Certainly the American flag represents imperial colonialism, slavery, manifest destiny, war, greed, and just about every other bad thing you can think of, but it also represents democracy, freedom, entrepreneurship, socioeconomic mobility and a bunch of other good things. I know this might not be a popular thing to say, but despite all of our ills I think America is a great nation.

What does the confederacy have to hang it's hat on besides slavery? Treason? Disregard for Democracy, and for the constitution? Anti-Industrialization might actually be a good one, but I have never heard anyone cite that as their reason for flying a confederate flag.

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

Dr. P. Silocybin said:
http://www.amazon.com/Apostles-Disunion-Southern-Secession-Commissioners/dp/081392104X




isnt that the same guy that wrote about and constructed a park dedicated to the
'fact' that the north discovered dinosaurs and used them to win the war against
the south




I think you must be mistaken. This book was written by Charles B. Dew. A quick google search of him didn't show anything related to dinosaurs, but if you have a link by all means post it. Having thoroughly read the book I have a high level of confidence in it's academic integrity. I'll summarize for the people who want to know about history, but don't have the time to read an actual history book. They do tend to be long.

In states like Virginia there was by no means a consensus for secession. The issue was hotly debated. The best way to understand how and why the confederate states seceded is to study those debates. Which politicians and which constituencies were in favor of secession? Which ones wanted to stay in the union? And how did they shape their arguments? Understand these political debates that raged across the south and you will understand the reason for the existence of the confederacy.

At the South Carolina Secession Convention Congressman Lawrence Keitt said, "Our people have come to this on the question of slavery. I am willing, in that address to rest it upon that question. I think it is the great central point from which we are now proceeding, and I am not willing to divert the public attention from it."

Henry M. Rector, the Governor of Missouri was arguing for secession at the Missouri convention, "The area of slavery must be extended correlative with its antagonism, or it will be put speedily in the 'course of ultimate extinction.'....The extension of slavery is the vital point of the whole controversy between the North and the South...Amendments to the federal constitution are urged by some as a panacea for all the ills that beset us. That instrument is amply sufficient as it now stands, for the protection of Southern rights, if it was only enforced. The South wants practical evidence of good faith from the North, not mere paper agreements and compromises. They believe slavery a sin, we do not, and there lies the trouble."

Article I, Section 9, Paragraph 4 of the Confederate Constitution, "No bill of attainder, ex post facto law, or law denying or impairing the right of property in negro slaves shall be passed."

Alexander Stephens, Vice President of the Confederacy, "Its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery . . . is his natural and normal condition."


The confederates made no attempt to hide the fact that they were seceding because they wanted to protect slavery. If they were brought back to life today they would gladly tell you about how they fought for their right to own slaves. The civil war was about slavery. If you fly the confederate flag, but don't support white supremacy any real confederate would consider you a traitor to their cause. When Dyllan Roof killed those people in that church he showed the world what a true confederate looks like. Anyone who would fly that flag yet denounce those murders is betraying the legacy they claim to be so proud of.


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OfflineDr. P. Silocybin
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Dr. P. Silocybin]
    #21862573 - 06/27/15 03:17 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Even if you totally ignore slavery that flag still represents treason to the United States. It represents a total disregard for democracy. Flying a confederate flag next to an American flag is the height of stupidity. A true confederate would burn the American flag.

Slavery, Treason, Anti-democracy. That is what the confederacy was founded upon.


Edited by Dr. P. Silocybin (06/27/15 03:24 AM)


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Offlinerxb
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Dr. P. Silocybin]
    #21862721 - 06/27/15 05:28 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Dr. P. Silocybin said:
Even if you totally ignore slavery that flag still represents treason to the United States. It represents a total disregard for democracy. Flying a confederate flag next to an American flag is the height of stupidity. A true confederate would burn the American flag.

Slavery, Treason, Anti-democracy. That is what the confederacy was founded upon.




bullshit, the south was a democracy.

the north was abusing the south before the war and those states left because they wanted fairness and democracy.


--------------------
->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <-

. i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications)

[quote]Enlil said:
I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]


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Invisiblevinsue
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: rxb]
    #21862726 - 06/27/15 05:30 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

...and slaves.
:mrt: . . . :peace:


--------------------

"All mushrooms are edible; but some only once." Croatian proverb. BTW ...
  Have You Rated Ythans Mom Yet ?? ... :taser:  ... HERE'S HOW ... (be nice) .  :mod: ... :peace:


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OfflineAchillita
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: rxb]
    #21862737 - 06/27/15 05:36 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

:popcorn:


--------------------


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Offlinerxb
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: vinsue] * 1
    #21862739 - 06/27/15 05:38 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

vinsue said:
...and slaves.
:mrt: . . . :peace:




again... not really factual.

the north had slaves after the southern slaves were free.

your perspective of the slave issue is skewed.


--------------------
->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <-

. i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications)

[quote]Enlil said:
I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]


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Offlinerxb
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: rxb]
    #21862744 - 06/27/15 05:42 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)



--------------------
->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <-

. i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications)

[quote]Enlil said:
I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]


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