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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Cj-B]
    #21847155 - 06/23/15 06:47 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

> Last time I got into an argument with you, you spent multiple pages copy pasting historical revisionist organizations linked to Storm Front and other white supremacist groups in an attempt to convince us that Eisenhower ran death camps post-WW2 that killed 15-20% of the German population.

You rejected multiple sources using the usual left wing tactic of trying to smear them by association since groups you disapprove of linked to it. This is typical moon bat tactics, deny the truth, proclaim a lie and smear the opposition. I have facts, you have your typing skills.

The camps are a matter of historical record even if the msm would very much like to disavow them. You eagerly accept the discredited figures for german concentration camps but seem unable to grasp that the allies did the same thing. Its also a matter of record that we had camps for anyone who was or looked oriental. People died in those camps and were imprisoned without charges, without a trial or right to defend themselves. This is the crap you are defending. But as usual, it will go right over your head.


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“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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Offlinekoods
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: r00tuuu123]
    #21847164 - 06/23/15 06:50 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I have never seen anyone fly the Jolly Roger. Probably because there aren't many pirate sympathizers around. I've seen a lot of confederate flags. Probably because there are still a lot of racists.


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NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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InvisibleSophistic Radiance
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: koods]
    #21847210 - 06/23/15 07:02 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Didn't somebody post like a quote a few pages ago by the guy who designed the Confederate flag in the first place, and he said "I hate black people and this flag is an awesome banner for everybody who hates black people"? I mean, accusing the flag's opponents of rendering "guilt by association" is a SERIOUS stretch when you're talking about the originator of the fucking design.


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Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.



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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #21847310 - 06/23/15 07:24 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

>Didn't somebody post like a quote a few pages ago...

No


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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Offlinekoods
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21847326 - 06/23/15 07:28 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
>Didn't somebody post like a quote a few pages ago...

No




Here ya go then.





http://mic.com/articles/121082/here-s-the-racist-meaning-of-the-confederate-flag-in-the-words-of-the-man-who-designed-it


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NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


Edited by koods (06/23/15 07:31 PM)


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InvisibleSophistic Radiance
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21847336 - 06/23/15 07:30 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Dilsnique said:
Haven't read thru the thread to see if anyone posted it already, but this seemed interesting.


In 1863, as the editor of the Savannah Morning News, William Thompson proposed a design that would ultimately become the Confederacy's second national flag, which would come to be known as the "Stainless Banner".
Referring to the flag's design as "The White Man's Flag", Thompson praised its design, as well as stating:
"As a people we are fighting to maintain the Heaven-ordained supremacy of the white man over the inferior or colored race; a white flag would thus be emblematical of our cause. ... As a national emblem, it is significant of our higher cause, the cause of a superior race, and a higher civilization contending against ignorance, infidelity, and barbarism. Another merit in the new flag is, that it bears no resemblance to the now infamous banner of the Yankee vandals."
—William T. Thompson (1863)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Tappan_Thompson




"The Stainless Banner"



Ah, there it is. You were saying?


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Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.



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InvisibleSophistic Radiance
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Sophistic Radiance] * 1
    #21847349 - 06/23/15 07:33 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Seriously, anybody who plays down the very real racism of this flag is either consciously fronting for white supremacy or in denial of the fact that they are fronting for white supremacy


--------------------
Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.



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Offlinekoods
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Sophistic Radiance] * 1
    #21847360 - 06/23/15 07:36 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Who are we arguing with? A nazi sympathizer.


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NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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InvisibleSophistic Radiance
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: koods] * 1
    #21847365 - 06/23/15 07:36 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Oh, right. Consciously, then.


--------------------
Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.



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Invisible1234go
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: koods]
    #21847451 - 06/23/15 07:53 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Well, I said ignorant rednecks.

I don't appreciate being misquoted :crankey:





aahhhh, i figured as much.


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Offliner00tuuu123
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Sophistic Radiance] * 2
    #21847473 - 06/23/15 07:57 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

BlindSophist said:
Seriously, anybody who plays down the very real racism of this flag is either consciously fronting for white supremacy or in denial of the fact that they are fronting for white supremacy



:lolwut: kind of  drugs are you on? :ilold:


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:kingcrankey: Please report me to a Mod for hurting your punk ass hippie feelings :flipthebird: And all time Champion thread killer.:thatsayes:


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: TheGreenArrow]
    #21847477 - 06/23/15 07:58 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

TheGreenArrow said:
He's the one who spouted that gem. 

Look, did this war have to do with slavery?  Yes.  Was it the ONLY reason people faught it?  Hell no.  The only dog I have in this fight is this is a part of our history like it or not.  As stated earlier perhaps we should fold the Confederate flag and put it away.  Perhaps we should've made SC take that flag down immediately after the Civil War. In fact its a very defining moment and in order to move on we have to at least know WHY we faught in order to not reapeat it.




Am not an American, so could be spotty or incorrect on this.
It is to my comprehension that the particular instance of the Confederate flag that has been the centerpiece of the varying debates was put there in 1961:

Quote:

Hollis remembers the day the Confederate flag was hoisted over the State House to commemorate the war. The centennial kicked off on April 11, 1961, with a re-creation of the firing on Fort Sumter. The flag went up for the opening celebrations.

"The flag is being flown this week at the request of Aiken Rep. John A. May," reported The State on April 12. May didn't introduce his resolution until the next legislative session. By the time the resolution passed on March 16, 1962, the flag had been flying for nearly a year. (This explains why the flag is often erroneously reported to have gone up in 1962).

"May told us he was going to introduce a resolution to fly the flag for a year from the capitol. I was against the flag going up," Hollis said, "but I kept quiet and went along. I didn't want to get into it with the UDC girls." The resolution that passed didn't include a time for the flag to come down and, therefore, "it just stayed up," Hollis said. "Nobody raised a question."

Hollis said he doesn't recall any racist or political overtones within the commission regarding the hoisting of the flag.

The day the Confederate flag went up over the State House, the opening ceremonies of the centennial in Charleston were marred by controversy. Newspapers reported the open and ugly feuding between South Carolina and the national Centennial Commission, calling it "the second battle of Fort Sumter."




Quote:

The day the flag went up, headlines in the local newspapers were full of unrest. Besides the centennial controversy, the news that week included:

- Sen. Marrion Gressette, the head of the State Segregation Committee, created in 1951 to recommend measures to maintain segregation, was supporting a resolution condemning former North Carolina Gov. Frank Graham, who had spoken at Winthrop College defending the civil rights movement and calling for integration.
   
- Thurmond was fighting in Congress to keep federal funding for segregated schools. Political sentiment against school integration was so strong that state politicians vowed to stop all funding to public schools rather than integrate.
   
- The Freedom Ride with integrated bus loads of civil rights workers was on the road, and there were reports of violence along the route.
   
- The major story of the week was Kennedy's executive order to end segregation in work places that do business with the government. The forced integration of South Carolina's mills outraged politicians and editorial writers.

Hoisting the Confederate flag over the State House didn't generate any controversy at the time. Perhaps those most offended by it were too busy fighting real-life battles to expend any energy on symbolic ones.

It has only been 38 years since the flag went up, but its defenders seem to have lost their short-term memory. Dr. Hollis calls them "historical revisionists."

He said there should be no denying that white supremacy was a vital aspect of this state's political will in 1861, just as it was in 1961. And there can be no separating the banners from this history.

When asked to comment on the current controversy over the flag, Hollis quoted George Santayana, who said, "Loyalty to our ancestors does not include loyalty to their mistakes."



Source.

Then in 2000 controversy surrounding it flying on the capitol building resulted in it being moved to the Confederate war memorial, while additional legislation was enacted to ensure that further movements against the flag would be stemmed in advance:
Quote:

Back in 2000, civil rights activists successfully lobbied to have a much larger Confederate flag removed from the Capitol dome. But there was a compromise. The South Carolina Heritage Act decreed that just about all other tributes to Confederate history would be virtually untouchable. The only way to change anything of that nature -- including the smaller flag that was erected on the State House lawn -- would be to gain the endorsement of two-thirds of lawmakers.



Source.


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Offliner00tuuu123
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: r00tuuu123]
    #21847535 - 06/23/15 08:08 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I was at this Big-n-Rich concert one time and Gretchen Wilson lynched CowBoy Troy and the crowd ran around in hoods waving Confederate flags. If that's not rascist then get Milton Hershey to dip his chocolate into George Washington Carvers peanut butter.


--------------------
:kingcrankey: Please report me to a Mod for hurting your punk ass hippie feelings :flipthebird: And all time Champion thread killer.:thatsayes:


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Offlinekoods
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: r00tuuu123]
    #21847540 - 06/23/15 08:09 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Wut


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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Invisible404
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: r00tuuu123]
    #21847599 - 06/23/15 08:20 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

r00tuuu123 said:
I was at this Big-n-Rich concert one time and Gretchen Wilson lynched CowBoy Troy and the crowd ran around in hoods waving Confederate flags. If that's not rascist then get Milton Hershey to dip his chocolate into George Washington Carvers peanut butter.





that sounds... naughty



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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: 404] * 1
    #21847645 - 06/23/15 08:30 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

None of that nonsense makes it racist. People are such sheep, they watch tv to learn what opinions they should have. In the old days people did their own research and did not simply repeat what someone else said.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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InvisibleSophistic Radiance
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21847691 - 06/23/15 08:37 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
None of that nonsense makes it racist. People are such sheep, they watch tv to learn what opinions they should have. In the old days people did their own research and did not simply repeat what someone else said.




No, in the old days people believed what they were told to believe.


--------------------
Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.



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Offlinekoods
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21847698 - 06/23/15 08:39 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Dude, you regurgitate talking points more than anyone on this website. Your posts read like a transcript of right wing AM radio.


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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OfflineCj-B
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: koods]
    #21847831 - 06/23/15 09:09 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
> Last time I got into an argument with you, you spent multiple pages copy pasting historical revisionist organizations linked to Storm Front and other white supremacist groups in an attempt to convince us that Eisenhower ran death camps post-WW2 that killed 15-20% of the German population.

You rejected multiple sources using the usual left wing tactic of trying to smear them by association since groups you disapprove of linked to it. This is typical moon bat tactics, deny the truth, proclaim a lie and smear the opposition. I have facts, you have your typing skills.

The camps are a matter of historical record even if the msm would very much like to disavow them. You eagerly accept the discredited figures for german concentration camps but seem unable to grasp that the allies did the same thing. Its also a matter of record that we had camps for anyone who was or looked oriental. People died in those camps and were imprisoned without charges, without a trial or right to defend themselves. This is the crap you are defending. But as usual, it will go right over your head.





Yet again, namecalling with no substance to back it up. If your sources are all linked to the same overarching organization that has a very strong ideological bias against non-whites and a vested interest in leveling the playing field with moral outrage, they can't be relied upon to provide objective historical analysis.

Quote:

koods said:
Dude, you regurgitate talking points more than anyone on this website. Your posts read like a transcript of right wing AM radio.




Pretty much this. I honestly wonder frequently whether you're actually just a Republibot churning out your political beliefs as gospel or just a very, very dedicated troll.


--------------------
"I have no way of knowing whether you, who eventually will read this record, like stories or not. If you do not, no doubt you have turned these pages without attention. I confess that I love them. Indeed, it often seems to me that of all the good things in the world, the only ones humanity can claim for itself are stories and music; the rest, mercy, beauty, sleep, clean water and hot food (as the Ascian would have said) are all the work of the Increate. Thus, stories are small things indeed in the scheme of the universe, but it is hard not to love best what is our own—hard for me, at least."


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: What do you think of the Confederate flag? [Re: Asante] * 1
    #21847844 - 06/23/15 09:12 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Asante said:
qman you are the biggest race pimp on the shroomery. You cant flush the fucking toilet without finding a quasi clever way of saying "niggers suck".





dont leave yourself out of this race... you've toned down a lot publicly but you
are just the same as the rest of us... pimpin' aint easy


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