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Invisibleonce in a lifetime
sun child
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: once in a lifetime]
    #24445025 - 06/29/17 03:51 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Hah, I didn't click your link 'til just now :smile:

Bill Robertie jumps out at me :smile:


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: once in a lifetime] * 1
    #24445044 - 06/29/17 03:59 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

My program revealed so many flaws in his books 'Advanced backgammon 1 & II' that he was forced to reissue them years later with major corrections.


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sun child
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #24445063 - 06/29/17 04:05 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Played a ton against GNU...  One of the best practices is to play a ton against a great computer...

My favorite game is poker; I also love Starcraft and chess..  My best result at chess was beating an international master, and drawing twice.

Just for the enjoyment of it..  Studied for about a decade with no purpose other than enjoyment, and because I love the game.

I would play the computer Fritz 6 against various other engines when I was 14 - blitz matches and longer ones...

All very much fun - fast games I would watch before going to sleep, the longer ones -- would set it for 5 hours or such -- and watch when I came home from school.

Backgammon I love as much as any other..


--------------------
Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland          Julia Delaney, Bothy Band                                        Rasta Girl, Sister Carol                    Genesis, Jorma K
I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing                                                                                                                    Do Your Thing, Moondog                     
large  . . music garden . .  very
all peace                    them hi
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OfflinePlantManBee
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: once in a lifetime]
    #24445088 - 06/29/17 04:13 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

not "finally here", been here and getting more noticeable daily. The passenger pigeon, Ivory Billed Woodpecker...san Marcos gambusia locally for me.  christ, the list would take weeks to compile if we wanted that heartbreak.


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Invisibleonce in a lifetime
sun child
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: PlantManBee]
    #24445099 - 06/29/17 04:18 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

; p

I saw a post a few years back. . . talking about if humanity drove 1 species to extinction. .  .

It's a lot more than just 1. . .

I would say, don't be depressed though - it only helps the Russians.


Kind of a half-joke there but -- happiness helps, it's a good thing -


Its important to spread the word and also fro all we can -


Every thing we do to lower our impact on the environment, is important. . .

The small things matter a lot, because they add up over time.


--------------------
Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland          Julia Delaney, Bothy Band                                        Rasta Girl, Sister Carol                    Genesis, Jorma K
I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing                                                                                                                    Do Your Thing, Moondog                     
large  . . music garden . .  very
all peace                    them hi
Starhouse - main
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Invisibledemiu5
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #24445212 - 06/29/17 05:03 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
My program revealed so many flaws in his books 'Advanced backgammon 1 & II' that he was forced to reissue them years later with major corrections.







if you're living in the past, you're already extinct


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channel your inner Larry David


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sun child
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: demiu5]
    #24445239 - 06/29/17 05:09 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Eep!  Orgone attained Nirvana!

hehe


--------------------
Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland          Julia Delaney, Bothy Band                                        Rasta Girl, Sister Carol                    Genesis, Jorma K
I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing                                                                                                                    Do Your Thing, Moondog                     
large  . . music garden . .  very
all peace                    them hi
Starhouse - main
Time Traveler's Guide


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Invisibleonce in a lifetime
sun child
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: once in a lifetime]
    #24445240 - 06/29/17 05:10 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Orgoneeeeee

Let's play backgammon but with checker pieces.


--------------------
Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland          Julia Delaney, Bothy Band                                        Rasta Girl, Sister Carol                    Genesis, Jorma K
I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing                                                                                                                    Do Your Thing, Moondog                     
large  . . music garden . .  very
all peace                    them hi
Starhouse - main
Time Traveler's Guide


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: once in a lifetime]
    #24445528 - 06/29/17 07:11 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Humans use almost all of the good land which accounts for about 45% of the Earth's surface. The rest is swamps, deserts and terrain that's too rough to grade easily. If someone can find water underground they'll grow crops in the desert. Swamps can be drained but at some point humans get collectively guilty about all the species they've mowing down with the trees and find it in their hearts or wallets that the expense of draining those dirty swamps doesn't make sense.

Rough guess would be that we should have killed off or enslaved 45% of large land animal species by now.

If we didn't use 40% of that land for farming and it was untouched by humans many of those extinct species would still be around. That same logic doesn't apply to global warming even assuming it's predictive accuracy is true. It has everything to do with humans using up all the good land and nothing to do with a minor increase in temperatures that would fall within normal variances absent the anthropomorphic. Even in most wilderness areas people are crawing around all over the place due to some leisurely reason.

Global warming is popular because it allows one to feel guilty about it without seeing the actual reason for the destruction that's happening. It seems to be a mixture of willful ignorance and repressed Cartesian Anxiety due to a sense of responsibility that can't be fixed with a carbon tax.

We need to quit using the land. There are certainly promising technologies that could move farming underground and into high rises but if successful it would also represent breaking the previous barrier of limited farming space.

It's interesting to note that the type of steam punk agricultural society that created all that farmland and children is also responsible in a way for the population growth leveling out in advanced nations. This line of logic is the only hope I can see for the Earth's biodiversity. I'm pessimistic about it but I can see how it would work. With unlimited energy there's nothing we couldn't do but we would have to use that energy responsibly.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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Offlinebeforethedawn
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: Rahz] * 3
    #24446203 - 06/30/17 01:41 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

What the human species is doing is bizarre, it's nothing else.

It's strange.

We don't need any of this. ANY of it. Mindless progress is a setback.


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Hostile humankind
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Offlinechibiabos
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: beforethedawn]
    #24446340 - 06/30/17 04:48 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)



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sun child
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: chibiabos]
    #24447691 - 06/30/17 05:13 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

That is a great one, chibiabos.


--------------------
Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland          Julia Delaney, Bothy Band                                        Rasta Girl, Sister Carol                    Genesis, Jorma K
I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing                                                                                                                    Do Your Thing, Moondog                     
large  . . music garden . .  very
all peace                    them hi
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Offlinechibiabos
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: once in a lifetime]
    #24448002 - 06/30/17 07:31 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

It's funny, because we ended a geological epoch and might obliterate our civilization through sheer apathy.


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Invisibledemiu5
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: chibiabos]
    #24448009 - 06/30/17 07:33 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

KT round 2

:snowman:


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: demiu5]
    #24465459 - 07/07/17 03:25 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/asiapacific/borneo-s-orangutans-in-alarming-decline-study-9014338

"The biggest threat to orangutans, one of only two great ape species found in Asia today, are habitat loss due to farming and climate change, and their killing for food or in conflict with humans.
Some 2,500 orangutans are killed in Borneo every year, the researchers said."

If there's anything to climate change, by the time it's hot enough to kill orangutans there won't be any left. Land currently marked for farming palm oil will reduce the current population by another 10%. Orangutan population is down 25% from 10 years ago.

Too many fucking people. I remember someone saying we could fit everyone on Earth in Texas. Maybe we should do that? Yea, like that will work. I think I mentioned 40% of the world surface is used for farming. When you account for buildings, roads and other infrastructure it's much worse. Here's a map that includes all human used areas. Looks like about 60% to me. Take out the deserts and we're down to about 25% wilderness. Take out the tundra and we're basically down to the Amazon.



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rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: Rahz]
    #24466178 - 07/07/17 08:08 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

over all (despite the low birth rate in some places) civilzed humans are incapable of controlling their birth rate.

In the hunter gatherer stage, nature at large put limits on the birth rate.

With civilization ( the 1st step usually being agriculture) humans arrogantly assume they can control nature and are separate from nature. But the human species is not self regulating as regards birth rate (although some species are), (even with birth control pills).

We  are more like some diseases, viruses, or cancer; all of which are apt metaphors for our effect on the ecosystems of the planet.

I think Edward O wilson has been concerned and writing about this for years.


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InvisibleDividedQuantumM
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: laughingdog]
    #24466444 - 07/07/17 10:24 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Mother Earth, I'm sure, wishes she could have capped us in the year 1 AD. At that time the world's population was approximately 231 million. Augustus Caesar was Emperor of Rome. Jesus Christ was born in a manger. China continued to be dominated by the Han Dynasty. The estimated population of New Zealand was zero. John the Baptist preached in the wilderness. God gave us Ovid.


Quote:

At this time North and South America were sparsely populated, as was Asia Pacific. The estimated population of New Zealand was zero. Southern Asia, Northern Africa, China and Southern Europe (parts of the same land mass) had relatively high populations. Colder Northern latitudes tended to have lower populations.

The territories that now encompass the Ganges, Tigris, Yangtze, Nile and Po rivers were the most populous.


www.worldmapper.org/




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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #24467305 - 07/08/17 09:53 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

DividedQuantum said:
Mother Earth, I'm sure, wishes ....




if she had wishes ... yes

I would certainly find the planet more attractive without most of what humans have done.

In some places people still live in harmony with nature, beyond the hunter gatherer stage. Some more rural, traditional Japanese villages, among others. Also possibly the amish to some degree.


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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: laughingdog]
    #24467439 - 07/08/17 10:43 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Very true. I guess another example would be the former Tibet. They were quite isolated, self-sufficient, non-expansionist and sustainable. Left to their own devices they'd still be that way.


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Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: the sixth mass extinction is officially here [Re: laughingdog]
    #24467511 - 07/08/17 11:20 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

laughingdog said:
over all (despite the low birth rate in some places) civilzed humans are incapable of controlling their birth rate.

In the hunter gatherer stage, nature at large put limits on the birth rate.

With civilization ( the 1st step usually being agriculture) humans arrogantly assume they can control nature and are separate from nature. But the human species is not self regulating as regards birth rate (although some species are), (even with birth control pills).

We  are more like some diseases, viruses, or cancer; all of which are apt metaphors for our effect on the ecosystems of the planet.

I think Edward O wilson has been concerned and writing about this for years.




Not with birth control alone perhaps, although I think monotheism might have something to do with that, but Western(ized) nations do regulate their birth rate. So much so that without immigration the population declines. Perhaps that is a natural response to being educated and having access to birth control.

One previous comment lamented that none of this is necessary. Nothing is necessary. I also con't care for the disease/virus analogy although there is some truth to it. I feel there's an emotional context to such ideas that can make it difficult to, at least, explore possible solutions. For instance, anthropomorphic CO2 may or may not be pushing the world to disaster but all that energy is part of the reason humans are able to achieve a level of civilization that provides a reasonable education and free/cheap access to birth control. People when educated do have a desire to regulate their numbers. That is not something a virus can achieve.

It could be regrettable that such a silver lining comes only after the world population has reached 7.5 billion and that the incursion of energy/technology has happened in poor countries without the subsequent stability and educational infrastructure necessary to support a self regulating environment, thus also being responsible for the continue population boom in some parts of the world. If the world was entirely Westernized (whether that's an appealing idea or not) the population would begin to decline and eventually the majority of the surface could be returned to a state of wilderness consensually.

If/when fusion becomes a reality it will be in part thanks to the abundance of energy from other sources. I regret that such small portions of the worlds wealth has been dedicated to funding such research. It should be a priority. Without fusion or some other new technology the majority of the worlds energy will continue to come from fossil fuels and fission.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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