Home | Community | Message Board


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale, Red Vein Kratom

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | Next >  [ show all ]
Offlinefatal222316
Alive
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/11
Posts: 332
Loc: FL Flag
Last seen: 2 months, 4 days
Enlightenment through meditation?
    #21827681 - 06/19/15 11:02 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Has anyone reached a state on enlightenment through meditation or other means?  Although enlightenment is a controversial subject in itself maybe I should rephrase it as a different modality that ends ones suffering, While I do meditate and have achieved different states of bliss none of them stick and or make a difference in the mainstream matters of life.


--------------------
"Who says upright Ape's should know the secrets of the Universe"--Terrance McKenna


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery


Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: fatal222316]
    #21831426 - 06/20/15 06:31 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

fatal222316 said:
Has anyone reached a state on enlightenment through meditation or other means?  Although enlightenment is a controversial subject in itself maybe I should rephrase it as a different modality that ends ones suffering, While I do meditate and have achieved different states of bliss none of them stick and or make a difference in the mainstream matters of life.




This is because Enlightenment, from a Buddhist perspective, is not a special 'state,' but is the Realization of what Alan Watts titled one of his books: This Is It. States are always transient conditions. I used to thnk the Hindu samadhis were just linguistically different than the Buddhist jhanas, but they are different experientially and are not valued equally. I have read that the startle response is greater in a Zen meditator than in a Yoga meditator, and at the time I thought the Yoga trance to be superior. But that was when I was truly in a mentality to escape from the mundanity of life. My attitude was more Hindu and Neoplatonic. But in Buddhism the very mundanity of life, Samsara - is not separate from Nirvana. We already ARE in Nirvana, in timelessness, simultaneously with being in time. I no longer hope for a condition such as the one portrayed by the guru Neem Karolie Baba in BE HERE NOW - Sat Chit Ananda - as being 'more' aware of the Eternal than of the temporal. In fact, the Sahaj Samadhi that Neem Karolie was said to have lived is called 'the natural state of samadhi,' without the immobility or rigidity that the Nirvikalpa Samadhi is accompanied by. I believe I had a brief experience of this state, replete with humming yellow-white light and bodily paralysis, and it was NOT during a psychedelic trip. It was the paralysis that caused me fear, bringing me out of the ecstatic state. I remember feeling a big smile stretching my facial muscles during that brief encounter, so I was still aware of my body, and thus my ego was still experiencing itself. But that was not a natural state, it was a peak experience that one either leaves the body for good from, or from which one comes back down again.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


Edited by MarkostheGnostic (06/23/15 01:08 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinefatal222316
Alive
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/11
Posts: 332
Loc: FL Flag
Last seen: 2 months, 4 days
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #21831574 - 06/20/15 07:59 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

The states I am accustomed to are really just a energetic flow running through my body filled with a type of compassion or love --that is if I start with my intention in meditation like this, at the end I several time have experienced kira's which previously I thought were bunk, which gives me reinforcement that this path is a valid one not just hocus pocus. I am currently trying to just go blank with no intention to experience the void everyone talks about with no success some times I just blank out for a time being.
  I am not as educated as well as you on buddhism, besides from what I here from people that claim to be enlightened such as  Tole or Adyashanti  I will look up some of the names you dropped though always trying to educate myself, Be here now seems to be the theme now and read many books on the subject with now avail trying to be the witness etc. I also started out with kundalini meditation with no success but it helped give me a platform to start meditating,  During the bliss state that I have encountered it also like a smile is forced upon my face and my head is tilted up  it is like a wave of compassion or love that is always there and is compromised of all consciousness--maybe --pays you a visit and it is very sad when I see it go I always try to hang on to it when really I think I should just surrender to it.


--------------------
"Who says upright Ape's should know the secrets of the Universe"--Terrance McKenna


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDeviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 4 months
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: fatal222316]
    #21832017 - 06/20/15 11:03 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Adyashanti is good. Another teacher I recommend is Matt Kahn. He teaches what he refers to as "heart wisdom" and that seems to resonate with me more than any other teaching.

Kahn's teachings center on getting in touch with your inner child as well as the love and wisdom of your own heart. When you are able to go deep into your own heart, you no longer need to worry  so much about things like enlightenment and meditation because your heart guides you.

He also talks about alignment, meaning having your whole being aligned with the truth. I feel like what happens with a lot of the so called direct path teachers is they teach us how to go directly to awareness because our body and mind are so out of alignment with awareness's  perspective, we cannot stay there and so it becomes a state we chase after, often while not bothering to align ourselves with the truth of our being.

Bentinho Massaro teaches something similar, his teaching is based on finding whatever way of being makes you feel most happy, excited and fulfilled and then being that way, rather than trying to get enlightened.

These sorts of teachings seem to resonate very well for me. To give you an example, a lot of Buddhist teachigns advise to simply let all thoughts, feelings and perceptions arise and dissipate without giving them much thought or attention. Matt Kahn says that while this can be a good practice for beginners, at the higher levels of spiritual attainment it is actually a bad practice because in a way you are disrespecting your own experience, which you are obviously having for a reason. He says a better practice is acknowledgement. So you have an experience, you simply acknowledge that experience fully. In this way, you are not trying to escape from or ignore your experiences but neither are you getting overly involved in them. I find this a lot better than the state of detachment Buddhist practices often lead to, which can be rather boring and almost life denying in a way.

To be honest, at this point in my journey I am  confused about what enlightenment actually is/feels like. I have had many glimpses of what I could call self realization and i have definitely realized that I am not the mind, not the body, etc. Yet I don't have the love-bliss, nor do I feel anywhere close to being fully liberated. I am confused over whether the state of self-realization is supposed to stick, and then the body and mind come into alignment with it, or whether I am supposed to bring the body mind into alignment with it and then it will stick. Teachers like Matt Kahn and Bentinho Massaro seem to favor the latter method.

Perhaps that appeals to me, because I am a practicing Christian and I find my practice of Christianity, far, far more powerful than any of the Buddhist/Hindu/kundalini stuff I have done. In Christianity, there is not much focus on enlightenment. Instead we focus on God/Jesus. There is just so much focus on God, God's love, God's beauty, God's majesty, etc.

I find that focusing intensely on God for extended periods, especially in a church with a bunch of other devout worshipers, fills me with spirit in a way nothing else does. When I am filled with spirit in this way things like "enlightenment" seem to lose their meaning. Instead I just perceive life, in all its wonder, glory and mystery. I don't feel like life needs to be any particular way as in enlightened vs non enlightened, but is only meant to be appreciated in whatever form it decides to take and it seems to me that loving God with all one's heart, mind and soul is the way to do this.

So basically I am very confused and don't know what I am talking about, but worshipping God seems to fix most things for me.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinefatal222316
Alive
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/11
Posts: 332
Loc: FL Flag
Last seen: 2 months, 4 days
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: Deviate]
    #21835676 - 06/21/15 07:16 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Sounds great I think your right about having a alignment with your own path is a better way to go about things, everybody is different just as our bodies and minds are different and maybe the great teachers are just trying to get us to find our own way through pointing a direct way to get us motivated in a way, I dont know.  Christianity is not really something I am into being someone who went to church when younger and not really digging it, but I defiantly feel a positive energy when in a church of people that actually have a lot of love and really do care--my wife makes me go sometime haha. 
    I think that is the problem of the seeker in general finding what works for your own mind body ideals  weather it be meditation christianity or kundalini.  I do not think anyone can stay in a state or modality of constant enlightenment forever everybody has there moments, but I do think we can get close to it and maybe hover over that state of mind or no mind-ego if you  find a path that brings you to the correct place for your own persons. I will look into the authors you mentioned always looking for more info  on the subject to see if it works for me ---check out buddha at the gas pump podcast very interesting talks from spiritual teachers.


--------------------
"Who says upright Ape's should know the secrets of the Universe"--Terrance McKenna


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePope
Stranger
Male

Registered: 09/27/09
Posts: 224
Loc: Oklahoma
Last seen: 8 years, 2 months
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: fatal222316]
    #21844318 - 06/23/15 12:35 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

i don't think enlightenment necessarily has to do anything with bliss, more has to do with what bliss happens in or is experienced by or whatnot. like is a way regardless of being happy or sad or anything else, a different backdrop to them or maybe a lack of one altogether. my biggest problem is i have no idea what enlightenment would actually be though, i cant confirm anyone is and if i could i still can't experience exactly how and what they experience to compare and know lol, know whats actually true. like people could go 'aha, there it is' and claim enlightenment but how would i ever know what's actually experienced there, it's confusing. most things do seem unknowable though


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery


Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: fatal222316]
    #21844416 - 06/23/15 01:24 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Your experiences are not to be doubted. The question is: How valuable are they to you? BTW, I continue to learn and I am not a Buddhist scholar. I have learned quite a bit from other Shroomerites who are far more dedicated to Buddhism than I am. I too began with a fascination for Kundalini Yoga, but have never had an experience that someone like Gopi Krishna described. Tantra is only one path and Self-Realzation is not dependent upon the play of non-ordinary energies. Don't take my word for it, my source, Sir Arthur Avalon AKA John Woodruff says as much in his works The Serpent Power and Shakti and Shakta. Sri Chinmoy also said pretty much the same thing. Ramana Maharshi has the deepest evaluation of these things. He does not focus on Astral (chakra-nadi) phenomena but goes right for Causal Body and Non-Dual Realization. I like to remind people here, like yourself, that if I seem to have a greater command of certain topics it's because I have stayed with a spiritual outlook since age 20 and I'm about to turn 62! So yes, I've experimented and experienced a bit more than younger folk, but I'm still a student. I also think that spelling, grammar and syntax matter and being impeccable there conveys intelligence (although I'm discovering from my wife's editing of my book that I can really mess up). :tongue:


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery


Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: Pope]
    #21844452 - 06/23/15 01:42 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Pope said:
i don't think enlightenment necessarily has to do anything with bliss, more has to do with what bliss happens in or is experienced by or whatnot. like is a way regardless of being happy or sad or anything else, a different backdrop to them or maybe a lack of one altogether. my biggest problem is i have no idea what enlightenment would actually be though, i cant confirm anyone is and if i could i still can't experience exactly how and what they experience to compare and know lol, know whats actually true. like people could go 'aha, there it is' and claim enlightenment but how would i ever know what's actually experienced there, it's confusing. most things do seem unknowable though




When you can practice compassion, and when you can SEE your own anger, intolerance, and prejudice and endeavor to reject those thoughts, then you are cutting at the roots of delusion with Manjushri's Sword of Discriminating Wisdom. When I see these imperfections in myself I feel stupid and inferior, BUT I am manifesting Enlightenment! Beware anyone who proclaims that [s]he is Enlightened, they are NOT just because of their inflated self-evaluation. I was invited to an acquaintance's home for the first time after many years, along with a good number of others, to sit with a woman who kept referring to herself as "a being such as myself." She was mentally ill in my estimation, and my poor friend was deluded into thinking that she was some exalted being. I've encountered wannabe gurus since the early 1970s and it's all a hustle. Enlightenment manifests in random acts of kindness, in seeing through other people's bullshit, in not allowing oneself to be seduced, coerced, or otherwise manipulated by feelings of guilt or shame or even pity. Pity is not equivalent to compassion despite the dictionary definitions making them synonymous. Equanimity and dispassion are not 'flattened affect.' A need for introverted contemplation is not neurosis, and a rejection of consumerism and materialism does not make you eccentric. These pathological evaluations are made by empty souls bloated with the artificial attractants of post-modern society who have never known the health and wholeness that resides in simplicity.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineyouknowyou
Stranger
Registered: 07/27/14
Posts: 247
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: MarkostheGnostic] * 1
    #21849855 - 06/24/15 10:41 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

enlightenment means the end of all suffering.

meditation is one of the most important method in order to develop the purification which will bring insight into the nature of reality and the 3 factor of existence: impermanence, dukkha, non self.

Experiences are useless if it doesnt bring insight.

True insights are permanent and cannot be forgotten.

so, when you meditate, the goal is to eventually bring clarity in the mind to penetrate and develop insight into reality.

in order to gain insight, you need calm. calm and insight basically comes together. without meditation, calm cannot be developed.

without a calm mind, there's of course no way to develop the factors of enlightenment.

meditation and mindulness is the way to enlightenment.
the buddha said many time that the only way to reach enlightenment is by developping mindfulness.

Mindfulness of body, thoughts, mood and feeling should be practiced constantly, not only when you meditate, but in every moment.


Edited by youknowyou (06/24/15 10:45 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery


Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: youknowyou]
    #21850693 - 06/24/15 02:19 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I recall that my first attempt at meditation was during the so-called Summer of Love in 1967, sitting on my bedroom floor across from a Day-glo poster of a lotus blossom with stars (the universe) in the center of the petals. I have meditated according to various schools since then, and just yesterday I signed up for an e-mail course from Ram Dass that is due to arrive July 6th. Last summer and since then I have been using the free Aro meditation course, which is a Vajrayana system. Be aware that Buddhism may have the most developed systems, but Buddhism has no monopoly on meditation. I have learned Transcendental Meditation, 3HO Kundalini Yoga techniques, Raja/Ashtanga Yoga methods, Kabbalistic techniques, Eastern Orthodox Christian Hesychastic techniques, and a variety of Buddhist practices in the ensuing decades since 1967. I'm still learning to employ mindfulness even as I type this period.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleonce in a lifetime
sun child
 User Gallery


Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 1,807
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #21851070 - 06/24/15 03:36 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Summers of love are awesome.

:earth:


--------------------
Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland          Julia Delaney, Bothy Band                                        Rasta Girl, Sister Carol                    Genesis, Jorma K
I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing                                                                                                                    Do Your Thing, Moondog                     
large  . . music garden . .  very
all peace                    them hi
Starhouse - main
Time Traveler's Guide


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleonce in a lifetime
sun child
 User Gallery


Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 1,807
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: once in a lifetime]
    #21851111 - 06/24/15 03:45 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

youknowyou,

you've expressed it very beautifully.  wonderful energy my friend.

:earth: :sunny:


--------------------
Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland          Julia Delaney, Bothy Band                                        Rasta Girl, Sister Carol                    Genesis, Jorma K
I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing                                                                                                                    Do Your Thing, Moondog                     
large  . . music garden . .  very
all peace                    them hi
Starhouse - main
Time Traveler's Guide


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelessismore
Registered: 02/10/13
Posts: 6,268
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: once in a lifetime]
    #21851178 - 06/24/15 03:59 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

When you want you stress your mind in meditation

Meditation is supposed to be effortless usually, but some people make it harder than it is

Some people pay lots of money and others spend their life learning to meditate

You know meditation has worked when you gain love by your actions, instead of regrets/worries


It permeates your actions, thoughts and way of living

Mindfulness is also a very good idea, then you can meditate at any place, just relax

You could say meditation teaches you the way out of 'ignorance', the self created thought prison we create

It teaches ways to live in cooperation with nature and all


Keep meditating, when you do it enough it will eventually be self sustaining and also prevent you from doing bad decisions in your life to a great degree

Meditate not to see god, but to be yourself


True enlightenment must be humility, to understand that you are what you see, therefore there cannot be any distinction between you and them, and your actions reflect this
Meditation clears all the chakras, one by one, or several at a time it seems, the top one is the one that connects you and lets you know you are connected , crown chakra

I just don't meditate on chakras unless I feel it is absolutely necessary, there is a lot of new age religions about this, some want to gain ultimate power with occult knowledge or such, witchcraft, kundalini etc.

Maybe Kundalini is right, but it shouldn't really be our focus

I just focus to relax, and if I relax enough my actions will be well decided


When relaxing I also know what makes my actions stupid: stress,pills,drugs , if I can avoid these I can usually stay myself in most situations

Know yourself - meditation brings self realization and ultimately enlightenment likely, but that may take more than one lifetime to reach that


Every moment is a blessing, and yet we fail to realize it when things don't go our way, even people who have meditated a whole life fail at times, noone gets there permanently it seems, I haven't seen one who was there permanently yet at least

There is also no need to strive to be perfect, but it is important to strive to be true to yourself

Some strive to be monks, fast each week, don't buy things, don't have sex - full life in celibacy


There are other ways, there is not just one way, we should follow our own path


** focusing on Kundalini awakening can be dangerous without a teacher, can make people criblings/insane, focusing on enlightenment can be equally dangerous because it strengthens the ego. Spirituality is not about receiving occult powers yourself but about giving it seems, you are your actions


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery


Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: once in a lifetime]
    #21851447 - 06/24/15 04:58 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

once in a lifetime said:
Summers of love are awesome.

:earth:




http://upnight.com/2015/06/21/if-i-gave-you-a-100000-would-you-stop-being-a-hippie/


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleonce in a lifetime
sun child
 User Gallery


Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 1,807
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #21851492 - 06/24/15 05:07 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)



--------------------
Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland          Julia Delaney, Bothy Band                                        Rasta Girl, Sister Carol                    Genesis, Jorma K
I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing                                                                                                                    Do Your Thing, Moondog                     
large  . . music garden . .  very
all peace                    them hi
Starhouse - main
Time Traveler's Guide


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineyouknowyou
Stranger
Registered: 07/27/14
Posts: 247
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #21851546 - 06/24/15 05:18 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

MarkostheGnostic said:
I recall that my first attempt at meditation was during the so-called Summer of Love in 1967, sitting on my bedroom floor across from a Day-glo poster of a lotus blossom with stars (the universe) in the center of the petals. I have meditated according to various schools since then, and just yesterday I signed up for an e-mail course from Ram Dass that is due to arrive July 6th. Last summer and since then I have been using the free Aro meditation course, which is a Vajrayana system. Be aware that Buddhism may have the most developed systems, but Buddhism has no monopoly on meditation. I have learned Transcendental Meditation, 3HO Kundalini Yoga techniques, Raja/Ashtanga Yoga methods, Kabbalistic techniques, Eastern Orthodox Christian Hesychastic techniques, and a variety of Buddhist practices in the ensuing decades since 1967. I'm still learning to employ mindfulness even as I type this period.



it seems that for buddhist, meditation is a mean. a mean to enlightenment. all they care about is how to reach the end of all suffering.

it seems also that some meditate to gain a bit more calm in their life, increase certain aspect of their lives. its allright to, but I dont see how they can meditate 1 hour every week and gain enough insight to truly change their mind.


mindfulness should be understood and developped constantly. then, and only then, will your meditation truly flourish.

if you go all day long without mindfulness, you will have to work the full hour of meditation just to try to reach some kind of mindfulness. if you are developping mindfulness in every moment, when you arrive to meditate, concentration is much easier to develop as your mind is already mindful, all you have to do is go even further into your mindfulness.

mindfulness. people do not understand the word and the method to be able to stay mindful in and out of meditation which is the biggest blockage.
in order to reach the jhanas, there's 5 factors. joy, rapture, one pointedness, sustain application and initial application.



people who say meditation is not for them is only because thye do not know what is meditation and the necessary prerequisite to be able to succesfully meditate.

I'll repeat this as I think its not talked about it often. the buddha said: mindfulness is the way to enlightenment:

heres a buddha quote that show how important he tought mindfulness is.

"This is the only way, O bhikkhus, for the purification of beings, for the overcoming of sorrow and lamentation, for the destruction of suffering and grief, for reaching the right path, for the attainment of Nibbana, namely, the Four Arousings of Mindfulness."


Edited by youknowyou (06/24/15 05:34 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleonce in a lifetime
sun child
 User Gallery


Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 1,807
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: youknowyou]
    #21851636 - 06/24/15 05:38 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

there are endless awakenings, and endless levels to existence.

dogen made the good point - there's no nirvana in samsara, but there's also no samsara in nirvana.

there's no one final answer, because it is new every moment;

yet it would be likely true to say, clear view is the way.


--------------------
Innocent, Oldfield & Hegerland          Julia Delaney, Bothy Band                                        Rasta Girl, Sister Carol                    Genesis, Jorma K
I Wish You Peace, Lawrence Laughing                                                                                                                    Do Your Thing, Moondog                     
large  . . music garden . .  very
all peace                    them hi
Starhouse - main
Time Traveler's Guide


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinefatal222316
Alive
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/11
Posts: 332
Loc: FL Flag
Last seen: 2 months, 4 days
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: youknowyou]
    #21851726 - 06/24/15 05:58 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I find compassion to be a very strong feeling that gives a very strong response during meditation, but lately I have been just been trying to let go of everything and follow the breath sometimes contemplating on the self or who am I really. I do try to be mindful or witness during my day, which I may be getting the two mixed up a bit there in terminology, but find it hard to keep this up and go back into normal ego routine. All in all I find meditation very relaxing and enjoyable, especially since letting go of clearing the chakras and all the kundalini type meditations. A beautiful book if anybody is interested in reading or listening to it on the art and practice of Tantric meditation is Sally Kempton Doorways to the Infinite  just finished it, lots of insight.


--------------------
"Who says upright Ape's should know the secrets of the Universe"--Terrance McKenna


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMahananda


Registered: 08/18/12
Posts: 117
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: fatal222316]
    #21852759 - 06/24/15 09:41 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

fatal222316 said:
Has anyone reached a state on enlightenment through meditation or other means?  Although enlightenment is a controversial subject in itself maybe I should rephrase it as a different modality that ends ones suffering, While I do meditate and have achieved different states of bliss none of them stick and or make a difference in the mainstream matters of life.




As Markos has suggested, altered states are not going to persist, and when ultimately you gain insight / wake up, you will wonder how you managed not to see the truth when it was right there in front of your own eyes, not something special but completely ordinary, ubiquitous, inescapable.

Having said that, meditation, inquiry, service and devotion (among other methods) can all, depending on the person, be effective catalysts for self realization.  (As an aside, Patanjali took the position that devotion was both necessary in connection with the eight fold path he laid out in the Sutras, and also sufficient in and of itself.)

The effect can be direct, as a result of the practice itself, or indirect, with the practice preparing the ground for a realization that takes an unexpected form.  The notion that "awakening is an accident but meditation makes us accident prone" gets at this.  To similar effect is the old aphorism about the student who asks a guru for the ultimate truth, and, unimpressed with the reply "you are that", goes to a second guru, who in turn says "till this ground for 10 years", after which the student asks the guru for the ultimate truth, is told "you are that" and experiences a stunning and complete awakening.

Note that your ego and its travails are very likely going to hang on after your awakening. Not everyone becomes a saint (and not a few saints were cranky people), and many (especially those who go on to teach) wind up with worse problems than ordinary people.  But it is true that the same disciplines (yamas and niyamas, the eightfold path, etc.) that foster the kind of peace of mind that is essential for meditation are a also palliative for certain types of suffering (though other types, often associated with spiritual pride, frequently arise, hydra like, as quickly as the original causes of suffering fall away).

Best of luck to you fatal, in life and in your seeking.


--------------------
Come, come, whoever you are.
Wanderer, worshiper, lover of living, it doesn't matter
Ours is not a caravan of despair.
Come even if you have broken your vow a thousand times,
Come, yet again, come, come


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineBeyondScience
 User Gallery

Registered: 03/26/15
Posts: 86
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
Re: Enlightenment through meditation? [Re: Mahananda]
    #21853276 - 06/24/15 11:59 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Enlightenment is understanding the doing of God- it is a creation beyond human-kind's grasp. This is a well-guarded thing, because of evil, which is why it is hard for people to achieve. There is more to it than what I have said, but that is the jest of it all.

I am there now.:smile:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale, Red Vein Kratom


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* DPT - did this guy snort himself a Kundalini experience? Asante 2,378 6 05/21/09 07:33 AM
by Spiralout112
* Strange energy/vibration during deep meditation?
( 1 2 all )
niteowl 6,547 28 07/05/14 07:15 PM
by Sozerius
* Enlightenment/insanity/egolessness fazdazzle 2,335 5 08/06/07 11:02 AM
by Rahz
* Kundalini tantra Question for the LADIES ONLY
( 1 2 all )
leviticus2013 7,537 28 04/08/07 09:03 PM
by leviticus2013
* Playing with energies during meditation..... niteowl 1,101 3 04/03/06 12:55 AM
by MystikMushroom
* The Darkness Before the Dawn (Kundalini Awakening) Adamist 12,592 15 04/26/11 09:00 PM
by playapez
* Kundalini Symptoms
( 1 2 all )
Poid 7,650 37 02/25/13 05:02 PM
by crkhd
* Enlightenment smacks of elitism or does it
( 1 2 all )
Anonymous 6,431 26 09/14/06 11:47 PM
by gettinjiggywithit

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Middleman, Shroomism, Rose, Kickle, yogabunny, DividedQuantum
1,344 topic views. 1 members, 3 guests and 2 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.034 seconds spending 0.01 seconds on 16 queries.