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D.M.T
Shroomery Contaminant


Registered: 10/31/09
Posts: 10,991
Loc: In your brain
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: moonrockmushy]
#21836719 - 06/21/15 12:18 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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moonrockmushy said: If you think that is just part of daily life people should learn to tolerate there is something seriously wrong with you.
What does condemning racism, sexism and other things you don't like do? Does it change anyone's minds? Does it prevent anything? Or does it just make you superior to them?
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D.M.T
Shroomery Contaminant


Registered: 10/31/09
Posts: 10,991
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Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: theRAPeutic]
#21836734 - 06/21/15 12:23 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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theRAPeutic said:
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D.M.T said:
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moonrockmushy said: Racism is not freedom of speech, it is an ideology that people believe in. I am anti-Christianity too, but you wouldn't say I'm against free speech for that would you?
Another idiotic attempt at justifying racism. Mr. Storm Roof must have just been exercising his free speech as an American. 
An ideology is a thought, and to me freedom of thought is more important than freedom of speech.
It was violence that killed these 9 people. Not racism.
The violence was clearly fueled by racism. maybe you havent seen the pictures of his white supremacist/kkk affiliations posing with the numbers 14/88, wearing the apartheid era flags, etc..
I've seen the photos for a second on the news. Not closely but they told me what they convey. Nothing more needs to be said about them - if I were in charge of the media I wouldn't give these people much more attention than telling the public what happened when it did. But to the public that doesn't sell.
A lot of extremists want fame or some sort of recognition, and to them any publicity is good publicity. It seems in addition to being a racist, this might have fueled this kid's actions.
There is definitely some sort of psychological imbalance. The majority of people, as hateful as they may be, know better than to do this shit.
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Dark_Star
train driver pervading a desktop


Registered: 08/20/04
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: D.M.T] 1
#21836753 - 06/21/15 12:29 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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The whole notion of hate crimes is dumb as fuck. Like murder is worse & deserving of a harsher punishment due to it being directed at certain group of people. And vice versa, like murder isn't as bad, and deserves a lesser punishment because it wasn't directed at certain group of people. Murder is murder. The harm it causes is the same regardless of the reasoning behind it, and it should be treated as such. Roof should never step foot out of prison again, and I'd say the same thing if it wasn't a race thing. He murdered a bunch of people. That's the issue.
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moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: drege]
#21836762 - 06/21/15 12:30 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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drege said:
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moonrockmushy said: If anything I wish racists would just come out and say what they really think
I already did. I do not advocate destruction of life, not black, white, hispanic or asain - neither plant nor animal. I do not consider myself racist, but living in oakland california I am not in a ciultural zone that is comfortable, I do not like rap music (references to street drugs, prostitution or advocation of murder - though I like the beats and lyrical flow), pants sagging (its a prison thing you know, it meant 'my ass is available for your pleasure') I wish to live amongst people like me, I appreaciate my my non white peoples cultural diffrences, but they are not my own, I abhor MY cultural heritage where percentages of my ancestors enslaved and oppressed persons of color, but I am better than them, I am evolved; but I am also aware. I choose to live in communities where I am comfortable, I do not hate non whites.
So you know the truth, that all people are essentially equal without regard to racial categories, but you think it is easier to just stick with the status quo.
Two roads diverge in the woods, and you prefer to take the one well travelled. I get it.
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moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: D.M.T]
#21836779 - 06/21/15 12:35 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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D.M.T said:
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moonrockmushy said: If you think that is just part of daily life people should learn to tolerate there is something seriously wrong with you.
What does condemning racism, sexism and other things you don't like do? Does it change anyone's minds? Does it prevent anything? Or does it just make you superior to them?
Here? I get off on truth and maybe get to influence a couple people with my words. In that respect I am the same as anyone else. In my real life being non-racist allows me a better understanding of what it means to be a human, and allows me to truly appreciate human diversity.
Why, what does racism do for you? Does it make you feel better about yourself, or can you point to actual ways it has helped people?
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theRAPeutic
Hueman


Registered: 07/22/13
Posts: 8,702
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: Dark_Star]
#21836797 - 06/21/15 12:38 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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D.M.T
Shroomery Contaminant


Registered: 10/31/09
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: moonrockmushy]
#21836804 - 06/21/15 12:40 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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moonrockmushy said: Why, what does racism do for you? Does it make you feel better about yourself, or can you point to actual ways it has helped people?
It doesn't affect me. I simply don't engage with racists or racism.
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drege
This space for lease

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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: D.M.T]
#21836808 - 06/21/15 12:40 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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Thats real cute, what is he like 17? He looks like he's got mental problems. Herman bell, Mumia Abu-Jamal and Marshall “Eddie” Conway - were affliiated with the black panthers, should we conclude that the black panther movement is a group of racial merderous ideology? Moreover, since they were all black men should we say that all black men are racist hateful murders? No, that would be racist on OUR part to say that now wouldn't it. Now do you see the idiocy of condemning groups and races for the actions of the individual?
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Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!


Registered: 01/22/03
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: moonrockmushy]
#21836820 - 06/21/15 12:43 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
moonrockmushy said: But being anti-racist doesn't mean I'm against free speech.
being an anti-racist just means you're a racist in denial
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21821894#21821894
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When a black person gets shot by police they probably deserved it, but when a white person goes into a black church in South Carolina and kills nine black people, lets give him the benefit of the doubt guys.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21821915#21821915
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If a black person walked into a predominantly white church and killed nine people you better believe race would come up, it would probably be more overt even.
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I am taking issue with racism not free speech. When did I advocate for censorship?
every time you've espoused the desire to eliminate racism
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Racism is useless, and people who rely on it to judge others are weak-minded. I stand by that. If anything I wish racists would just come out and say what they really think, rather than dancing around the issues like pussies because they are afraid of what people will think of them if they are totally honest about their beliefs.
didnt you say you dont like christianity?
Quote:
Racism consists of ideologies and practices that seek to justify, or cause, the unequal distribution of privileges, rights or goods among different racial groups. Modern variants are often based in social perceptions of biological differences between peoples. These can take the form of social actions, practices or beliefs, or political systems that consider different races to be ranked as inherently superior or inferior to each other, based on presumed shared inheritable traits, abilities, or qualities. It may also hold that members of different races should be treated differently.[1][2][3]
Among the questions about how to define racism are the question of whether to include forms of discrimination that are unintentional, such as making assumptions about preferences or abilities of others based on racial stereotypes, whether to include symbolic or institutionalized forms of discrimination such as the circulation of ethnic stereotypes through the media, and whether to include the sociopolitical dynamics of social stratification that sometimes have a racial component.
In sociology and psychology, some definitions include only consciously malignant forms of discrimination.[4][5] Some definitions of racism also include discriminatory behaviors and beliefs based on cultural, national, ethnic, caste, or religious stereotypes.[2][6] One view holds that racism is best understood as 'prejudice plus power' because without the support of political or economic power, prejudice would not be able to manifest as a pervasive cultural, institutional or social phenomenon.[7][8][9]
While race and ethnicity are considered to be separate phenomena in contemporary social science, the two terms have a long history of equivalence in popular usage and older social science literature. Racism and racial discrimination are often used to describe discrimination on an ethnic or cultural basis, independent of whether these differences are described as racial. According to the United Nations convention, there is no distinction between the terms racial discrimination and ethnic discrimination, superiority based on racial differentiation is scientifically false, morally condemnable, socially unjust and dangerous, and there is no justification for racial discrimination, in theory or in practice, anywhere.[10]
In history, racism was a driving force behind conquest and the Transatlantic slave trade,[11] and behind states based on racial segregation such as the United States in the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries and South Africa under apartheid.[12] Practices and ideologies of racism are universally condemned by the United Nations in the Declaration of Human Rights.[13] It has also been a major part of the political and ideological underpinning of genocides such as the Holocaust, but also in colonial contexts such as the rubber booms in South America and the Congo, and in the European conquest of the Americas and colonization of Africa, Asia and Australia.
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Prisoner#1
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: Dark_Star] 1
#21836833 - 06/21/15 12:45 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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Dark_Star said: Roof should never step foot out of prison again
he also shouldnt be made as a burden to the tax payers, give him his trial, put him to death
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D.M.T
Shroomery Contaminant


Registered: 10/31/09
Posts: 10,991
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: Prisoner#1]
#21836861 - 06/21/15 12:50 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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Prisoner#1 said:
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Dark_Star said: Roof should never step foot out of prison again
he also shouldnt be made as a burden to the tax payers, give him his trial, put him to death
I only advocate this if we use a rope or firing squad. With the cost of these lethal injection drugs and appeals capital punishment just isn't worth it.
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drege
This space for lease

Registered: 11/04/14
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: Prisoner#1]
#21836866 - 06/21/15 12:50 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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https://discord.gg/hqdy5ymn
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theRAPeutic
Hueman


Registered: 07/22/13
Posts: 8,702
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: Prisoner#1]
#21836868 - 06/21/15 12:51 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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I agree
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moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: Prisoner#1]
#21836886 - 06/21/15 12:54 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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Black is not a race. It is a vague skin characteristic that only makes sense by comparing two people. I call people black all the time, but if you asked me to define black I would say it is any person who has dark skin, which is not a racial category any more than brown eyes.
It is a useful identifying characteristic. The skin is the largest and most visible organ in the body, but all you can tell by looking at skin is the color.
Black does not mean big nose, big butt, big hips, like zappa was telling me earlier, and it doesn't mean you celebrate Kwanzaa and love watermelon. Those are racial stereotypes, not facts.
Quote:
theRAPeutic said: http://pastebin.com/Wv78DL8Z
Manifesto
Thank you.
Edited by moonrockmushy (06/21/15 12:55 PM)
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moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: moonrockmushy]
#21836950 - 06/21/15 01:07 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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I was not raised in a racist home or environment. Living in the South, almost every White person has a small amount of racial awareness, simply beause of the numbers of negroes in this part of the country. But it is a superficial awareness. Growing up, in school, the White and black kids would make racial jokes toward each other, but all they were were jokes. Me and White friends would sometimes would watch things that would make us think that “blacks were the real racists” and other elementary thoughts like this, but there was no real understanding behind it.
Honestly that could so easily be a post at the shroomery. The fact that you guys don't see how inappropriate trying to nitpick the ways race might be somewhat valid is in this thread really goes to show how out of touch some of you are. I really don't want to talk about that anymore. I feel I've said everything I have to say on the topic and now I'm just repeating myself to people saying the same thing over and over with slightly different wording.
This crime was motivated by racial hatred. If some of you want to claim not to be racist while maintaining that white people are a discrete group withing homo sapiens, fine, I think it is clear where I stand on that.
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Dark_Star
train driver pervading a desktop


Registered: 08/20/04
Posts: 31,859
Loc: Uranus
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: Prisoner#1]
#21836999 - 06/21/15 01:17 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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You'll get no argument from me there. Though he'll be a burden regardless, what with all the appeals. Best case scenario is another inmate handles the situation for us.
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moonrockmushy
High on Spite



Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: drege]
#21837024 - 06/21/15 01:27 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
drege said: Thats real cute, what is he like 17? He looks like he's got mental problems. Herman bell, Mumia Abu-Jamal and Marshall “Eddie” Conway - were affliiated with the black panthers, should we conclude that the black panther movement is a group of racial merderous ideology? Moreover, since they were all black men should we say that all black men are racist hateful murders? No, that would be racist on OUR part to say that now wouldn't it. Now do you see the idiocy of condemning groups and races for the actions of the individual?
My word that is stupid.
Yes it would be racist to say that all black men are murderous. Yes the black panthers are a racist organization as far as I know.
I am happy to condemn black people who are racists, and I never denied they're out there, nor did anyone else.
It is amazing how many of the same points I am reading in this manifesto. Funny thing, Mr. Storm Roof is not even racist. It is white people who allow blacks to be loud and obnoxious out of pity who are truly racist
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theRAPeutic
Hueman


Registered: 07/22/13
Posts: 8,702
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: moonrockmushy]
#21837045 - 06/21/15 01:37 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
moonrockmushy said:
Quote:
drege said: Thats real cute, what is he like 17? He looks like he's got mental problems. Herman bell, Mumia Abu-Jamal and Marshall “Eddie” Conway - were affliiated with the black panthers, should we conclude that the black panther movement is a group of racial merderous ideology? Moreover, since they were all black men should we say that all black men are racist hateful murders? No, that would be racist on OUR part to say that now wouldn't it. Now do you see the idiocy of condemning groups and races for the actions of the individual?
My word that is stupid.
Yes it would be racist to say that all black men are murderous. Yes the black panthers are a racist organization as far as I know.
I am happy to condemn black people who are racists, and I never denied they're out there, nor did anyone else.
It is amazing how many of the same points I am reading in this manifesto. Funny thing, Mr. Storm Roof is not even racist. It is white people who allow blacks to be loud and obnoxious out of pity who are truly racist 
Black panthers are not a racist organization. Black Panthers was started in retaliation to the KKK to protect black people and teach self defense to brothers and sisters. they are not even comparable. Nor would black panther party have even been started if it werent for the KKK lynching, bombing and instilling fear to keep blacks from voting, and keep them submissive and fearful
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Prisoner#1
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: D.M.T]
#21837050 - 06/21/15 01:38 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
D.M.T said:
Quote:
Prisoner#1 said:
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Dark_Star said: Roof should never step foot out of prison again
he also shouldnt be made as a burden to the tax payers, give him his trial, put him to death
I only advocate this if we use a rope or firing squad. With the cost of these lethal injection drugs and appeals capital punishment just isn't worth it.
rope is reusable, let's trim the fat as much as we can
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Prisoner#1
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Re: 9 dead in shooting at historic Charleston African American church [Re: theRAPeutic]
#21837065 - 06/21/15 01:43 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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theRAPeutic said: Black panthers are not a racist organization. Black Panthers was started in retaliation to the KKK to protect black people and teach self defense to brothers and sisters.
hahahaha... the KKK started as a fraternity
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they are not even comparable.
you're sure about that?
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