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ThingsThatAlsoFly
Random Debris


Registered: 05/18/15
Posts: 113
Last seen: 8 months, 15 days
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Sub ID
#21813358 - 06/16/15 03:04 AM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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After about a month of picking Foes in my yard and along the roads, I have finally found something worth IDing. I've been reading as much as I could possibly understand about P. Subbalteatus. I've viewed tons of ID requests, and everything the shroomery has on them. I read in one thread that you'll know a sub when you pull it from the ground by the meaty stipe. Outside of A local gas station, I found a patch that looked exactly like one from SubbedHunter420's guide, with stipe's like sticks. Then, turning them over, gills as black as coal, with grayish edges. I quickly picked most of them. As soon as I got home (some 20 min. later) I dumped them into a box lid. Bluing was very clearly visible on one stem (from grayish blue, to blue, to blue green, back to blue gray, into dark blue, and then black.), and slightly visible on others. Spore prints were taken from 9 msuhrooms that had been left best unmangled after the trip home. Of these, 4 are visible after 7 hrs. They are BLACK. I've printed hundreds of foes in the past month and always thought they were black. Now, comparing the two, I can see the difference.




Habitat: St. Louis, MO In grass at a gas station. Night watering, probably fertilized. Gills: Black, whitish gray around edges. Looks like most pictures i've seen of subs.
Stem: Didn't measure exact length, they probably ranged from 3 to 5", diameter ranging from 3-8mm. Tan, white, red, and brown in color. texture was beefy, definitely thicker than all the foes i pick in my yard. hollow, "barber pole" lines twisting around the stem visible on most bigger shrooms.
Cap: .5"-3" in diameter. Gray, red, and tan in color. Texture was either slimy, or sort of like popcorn when drying. Hydrophaneous cap margin slightly visible, i'm still waiting for the mushrooms to dry.
Spore print color: BLACK.
Bruising: Blue! (It was great to finally see it)
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Anglerfish
hearing things



Registered: 09/08/10
Posts: 18,644
Loc: Norvegr
Last seen: 3 hours, 56 minutes
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Hard to tell. Could be a mixed collection.
You'll have to provide much better pictures (lighting & focus).
Please also post a picture of the prints.
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ThingsThatAlsoFly
Random Debris


Registered: 05/18/15
Posts: 113
Last seen: 8 months, 15 days
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I will in the morning when I can get a hold of a better camera, the one on my phone blows. And all the gills were definitely blacker than anything else I've picked so far. Once I seen the black gills I started throwing out anything even remotely brown. I might take a walk back to the patch in a few hours to see what else is there while I wait, maybe get some fresh finds for the pictures. There was a whole field of grass, and I only covered 15 square feet or so.
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Anglerfish
hearing things



Registered: 09/08/10
Posts: 18,644
Loc: Norvegr
Last seen: 3 hours, 56 minutes
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Quote:
ThingsThatAlsoFly said: And all the gills were definitely blacker than anything else I've picked so far. Once I seen the black gills I started throwing out anything even remotely brown.
Gill color is not necessarily the best prerequisite for separating P. cinctulus from P. foenisecii. Young P. cinctulus may have brownish gills but a black spore print.
Check this link for comparisons: http://mushroomobserver.org/observer/index_observation?q=2aYnb
Also remember that there are other Panaeolus sp. that might superficially resemble P. cinctulus, they aren't always that easy to separate macroscopically.
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ThingsThatAlsoFly
Random Debris


Registered: 05/18/15
Posts: 113
Last seen: 8 months, 15 days
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Can you list any specifically that might grow in Missouri? The Missouri conservation department website doesn't even attempt to categorize LBMs. I searched "Missouri Panaeolus" on MO and seen panaeolus antillarum and papilionaceus. Some of the smaller ones could have possibly been p. antillarum, but the other sp doesn't look close to anything I have. Can different mushrooms grow in one "fairy ring"? I was under the impression that these "rings" were a single organism.
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ThingsThatAlsoFly
Random Debris


Registered: 05/18/15
Posts: 113
Last seen: 8 months, 15 days
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Here's the spore prints from yesterday's finds:


This is how the same camera picks up my confirmed P. Foes:

Here's the two side by side:
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ThingsThatAlsoFly
Random Debris


Registered: 05/18/15
Posts: 113
Last seen: 8 months, 15 days
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Picked some more mushrooms from same exact same area, but this time I got my dad to let me use his phone camera. Here's one I took on my phone of a mushroom growing:

And right after picking:



And here are the pics I took on my dad's phone after I got home:










 




A bunch of caps, mutilated from the trip home in my backpack:

Taking spore prints now:
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ThingsThatAlsoFly
Random Debris


Registered: 05/18/15
Posts: 113
Last seen: 8 months, 15 days
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Just realized some of the pictures didn't come through earlier, here's the two I missed: The two rougher-edged, browner mushrooms up front both had brown/tan gills that fell below the margin, but they both printed jet black as all the others. They also had lines twisting around down the thick stem like all the others.


Also, the spore prints are done:









What do you guys think?
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ThingsThatAlsoFly
Random Debris


Registered: 05/18/15
Posts: 113
Last seen: 8 months, 15 days
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Somebody? Anybody? I could really use the help here. While what I have matches all the descriptions of P. Cinctulus to me, I'd really like the input of a trusted identifier before I go eating any.
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Signeg


Registered: 06/09/12
Posts: 1,545
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Any blue bruising at the base?
I think Panaelous species are safe to eat either way but you should wait for a TI.
They do look like they could be cinctulus.
Edited by Signeg (06/18/15 08:07 PM)
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ThingsThatAlsoFly
Random Debris


Registered: 05/18/15
Posts: 113
Last seen: 8 months, 15 days
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Re: Sub ID [Re: Signeg]
#21825329 - 06/18/15 08:15 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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The first time I hit the patch, one stem turned EXCESSIVELY blue. Couldn't get a picture that night though. A few more showed a "Graying" that I think was probably bluing masked by the dark stem. The mushrooms in the higher quality pics were from the same patch, the "graying" was visible on many, but none bright blue like the first stem.
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doctorghosty
is the name of me



Registered: 09/02/10
Posts: 11,420
Loc: North GA, God's fav
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Re: Sub ID [Re: Signeg]
#21825338 - 06/18/15 08:18 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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There are no toxic Panaeolus. Only you can tell whether the prints are truly jet black or if they have any brown in them
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ThingsThatAlsoFly
Random Debris


Registered: 05/18/15
Posts: 113
Last seen: 8 months, 15 days
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Thanks for the input. My prints are for sure jet black, I was more worried about the macroscopic details adding up. Even though I can see that they all seem to match the description of P. Cinctulus, I also know how scatter-brained I can be, and thus compensate by asking those who are confident they know what they're looking at.
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doctorghosty
is the name of me



Registered: 09/02/10
Posts: 11,420
Loc: North GA, God's fav
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They are definitely Panaeolus (or at worst Panaeolina), so no worries on that brother. I hope they are cincts and you trip balls, best of luck, keep hunting, finding and posting!
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