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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Douglas Howard]
    #21848344 - 06/23/15 11:11 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I'm not generally a fan a Jesse Ventura, but I completely agree with him on this.

PS - what's that picture on his shirt?

  EDIT: I just figured it out - it's Jimmy Hendrix!


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


Edited by Falcon91Wolvrn03 (06/24/15 12:06 AM)


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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #21848413 - 06/23/15 11:27 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

agreed


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #21849223 - 06/24/15 07:20 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

You are getting a little bit more reasonable. You agree with the obvious but come to the same wrong conclusion that we need more govt control over our lives.

>No, the Government has NOT blocked labeling for gmo's. 

Actually, there is a bill to do just that in congress. Some states have already blocked labeling at the state level.

>I agree it should do more to ban harmful substances in our food, but right it's catering to free markets.

Its taking bribes and approving anything that doesn't kill you right away. If it kills you in 20 years they don't care "the lab rats lived for 3 months with no problems"

>I don't know why you're laughing - he just made a compelling case for the return of big government.

Far from it. The only things I want govt to do is defend the homeland, stop nasty chems in food, pave the roads and not too much else. To you, govt constantly growing and consuming more of the economy is a good thing along with them spying on us and telling us what to do and what we are not allowed to do. More reasonable people think govt needs to be pruned back severely and soon.


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“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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InvisibleBoldAsLove
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21849359 - 06/24/15 08:26 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Actually, there is a bill to do just that in congress. Some states have already blocked labeling at the state level.





Which states? I hadn't haven't heard of a state not allowing GMO products to be labeled, but I'd be strongly against that if it is true.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21850862 - 06/24/15 02:53 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
You agree with the obvious but come to the same wrong conclusion that we need more govt control over our lives.




Is a requirement for businesses to label GMOs more or less Government?
Is a requirement to ban unhealthy additives in food more or less Government?
Is the free trade being proposed under TPP more or less Government?
Is middle class boosting legislation more or less Government?
Is regulation of Wall Street to prevent financial disasters more or less Government?

These are all things you claim to support, yet you say you're against Government intervention.  :cuckoo:

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
The only things I want govt to do is defend the homeland, stop nasty chems in food, pave the roads and not too much else.



We're in agreement.  The list above is all more Government.

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
To you, govt constantly growing and consuming more of the economy is a good thing along with them spying on us and telling us what to do and what we are not allowed to do. More reasonable people think govt needs to be pruned back severely and soon.



God damnit, stop with the straw man arguments.  I've never said any of the above.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


Edited by Falcon91Wolvrn03 (06/24/15 03:41 PM)


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #21851080 - 06/24/15 03:39 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Is deregulating of Wall Street more or less Government?



how is this more government?


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: psyconaught]
    #21851093 - 06/24/15 03:42 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

It's less.  I should have said:

"Is regulation of Wall Street to prevent financial disasters more or less Government?"

to be consistent with my other bullet points.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #21851634 - 06/24/15 05:38 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:

>Is a requirement for businesses to label GMOs more or less Government?

Its a simple regulation we already have those sort of regulations in place therefore no need for "more" govt

>Is a requirement to ban unhealthy additives in food more or less Government?

See above answer

>Is the free trade being proposed under TPP more or less Government?

How would anyone know, your hero keeps it secret but I believe its almost certainly more govt.

>Is middle class boosting legislation more or less Government?

Depends on what you are talking about.

>Is regulation of Wall Street to prevent financial disasters more or less Government?

We have that in place already, just the wrong rules

>These are all things you claim to support, yet you say you're against Government intervention.

i never said i was in favor of the tpp, stop lying. I said I was against govt intervention in our personal lives like forbidding pot. You know that very well but always play the straw game

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
The only things I want govt to do is defend the homeland, stop nasty chems in food, pave the roads and not too much else.



>We're in agreement.  The list above is all more Government.

"more"? again you say more but we can do all that with less govt. More of the false statements.

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
To you, govt constantly growing and consuming more of the economy is a good thing along with them spying on us and telling us what to do and what we are not allowed to do. More reasonable people think govt needs to be pruned back severely and soon.








And that is still true. You want govt to rape us even more on taxes, I want less taxes and just the bare necessities. You want govt to dictate wages, which is further interference in business and our lives.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21852263 - 06/24/15 08:05 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Is a requirement for businesses to label GMOs more or less Government?
Is a requirement to ban unhealthy additives in food more or less Government?
Is regulation of Wall Street to prevent financial disasters more or less Government?



Its a simple regulation we already have those sort of regulations in place therefore no need for "more" govt



See poll below.

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
i never said i was in favor of the tpp, stop lying.



I know you're against the tpp free trade agreement, which is why I asked if opposing free trade is more or less Government.

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

Stonehenge said:
The only things I want govt to do is defend the homeland, stop nasty chems in food, pave the roads and not too much else.



We're in agreement.  The list above is all more Government.



"more"? again you say more but we can do all that with less govt. More of the false statements.



See poll below.

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

Stonehenge said:
To you, govt constantly growing and consuming more of the economy is a good thing along with them spying on us and telling us what to do and what we are not allowed to do. More reasonable people think govt needs to be pruned back severely and soon.



God damnit, stop with the straw man arguments.  I've never said any of the above.



You want govt to rape us even more on taxes...
You want govt to dictate wages...



Which is neither syping nor dictating what individuals are allowed to do in their private lives.  Stop changing the argument to a straw man.
Is mandatory GMO labeling, banning unhealthy food additives, and regulation of Wall Street more Government?
You may choose only one


Votes accepted from (06/24/15 07:48 PM) to (No end specified)
View the results of this poll



--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #21853135 - 06/24/15 11:24 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I don't understand this despisement of government. Sure, there are things wrong with government. Republicans have been hard at work to make government as dysfunctional as possible so they can say, 'hey look, government doesn't work, lets get rid of it!'

Government can work just fine, if you don't have an uneducated public voting for people like John Boehner, Mitch McConnell, Sarah Palin, George H.W. Bush, Ted Cruz, Michelle Bachman, Rick Perry, Donald Trump, and on and on and on. These people aren't fit to run a whorehouse, though they involuntarily prostitute the American people regularly!

The biggest part of this big government is the exhorbitant military expenditure that has gotten WAY out of control, but right wingers wanna cut wages, take food out of impoverished children's mouths, and take away grannies social security check. Oh, and forget about our infrastructure, we're too busy rebuilding the middle east. :facepalm3:


--------------------
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Edited by Bigbadwooof (06/24/15 11:51 PM)


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #21853180 - 06/24/15 11:35 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

:congrats:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #21854174 - 06/25/15 08:42 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

The lameness is getting deep in here.

Fal, that last rant is a showcase of your usual tricks. You dodge any tough questions, you zero in on one thing you demand we talk about so you don't have to talk about anything else. Who are you to dictate what must be answered when you are the worst in the shroomery about answering questions?

I'm still waiting for an apology for saying I supported the tpp when you knew very well I didn't.

Woof, I knew you were on the extreme left but I thought you were reasonable. Why did you attack me? What makes you think the dems are good guys? Do you think the tpp is getting passed without dem votes? Do you think they don't support the wars we have going on?

>The biggest part of this big government is the exhorbitant military expenditure that has gotten WAY out of control

Helloooo, wake up and realize its been obumble pushing war since he got in. I'm not defending gop, they and the dems are the problem. Its one party with two sides, sort of like good guys vs bad guys in wrestling. They put on a show to distract you while they both push for war and other stupid shit.

> but right wingers wanna cut wages, take food out of impoverished children's mouths, and take away grannies social security check.

I missed you link to the bill they are trying to pass doing all that.

>Oh, and forget about our infrastructure, we're too busy rebuilding the middle east

Yeah, that right winger obumble needs to get the message. Funny how you always give him a free pass on everything.

I need to put both you fanatics on ignore. I can't get a single word of sense out of either one. You have both gone over the edge. Bye.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Stonehenge]
    #21854420 - 06/25/15 10:06 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
The lameness is getting deep in here.

Fal, that last rant is a showcase of your usual tricks. You dodge any tough questions, you zero in on one thing you demand we talk about so you don't have to talk about anything else. Who are you to dictate what must be answered when you are the worst in the shroomery about answering questions?



I point out all the many things you  get wrong.  Rather than responding to my points, you just say "fal is up to his old tricks again".  Since you constantly dodge my points, I tried a new approach of focusing on one point at a time.  I see that's too intense for you, and you're crying like a baby.

Now, I'll ask you for the last time (and don't dodge this):  what tough questions have I dodged that you'd like me answer for you?  I'll answer them for you, even though you're dodging my questions.

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
I'm still waiting for an apology for saying I supported the tpp when you knew very well I didn't.



I know you don't support it, and I never said you did.  I clarified that for you above.  Here it is again since you are such a poor reader:

"I know you're against the tpp free trade agreement..."

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Woof, I knew you were on the extreme left but I thought you were reasonable. Why did you attack me? What makes you think the dems are good guys? Do you think the tpp is getting passed without dem votes? Do you think they don't support the wars we have going on?



Wooof didn't even mention you in his last post, and his post wasn't even a reply to you.  He actually defended your position in saying the Government CAN do good things, which you obviously agree with given your support of food labeling, banning of unhealthy food additives, etc.

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
I'm not defending gop, they and the dems are the problem. Its one party with two sides, sort of like good guys vs bad guys in wrestling. They put on a show to distract you while they both push for war and other stupid shit.



We both agree with you on this, though Dems are more likely to pass food safety legislation.

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
but right wingers wanna cut wages, take food out of impoverished children's mouths, and take away grannies social security check.



I missed you link to the bill they are trying to pass doing all that.



Please tell us you're really not that stupid?  I guess you are, so here you go:

Cut wages:  Senate Republicans block minimum wage increase bill, Jeb Bush makes the case against the federal minimum wage
Take food from children:  GOP cuts Medicare, food stamps in new budget blueprint
Take grannies social security:  Why is GOP going after Social Security?

These are just the first articles I found.  There are hundreds to choose from.

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Oh, and forget about our infrastructure, we're too busy rebuilding the middle east



Yeah, that right winger obumble needs to get the message. Funny how you always give him a free pass on everything.



Nobody's giving him a free pass on this.  We've criticized him many times on this, but you don't listen.

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
I need to put both you fanatics on ignore. I can't get a single word of sense out of either one. You have both gone over the edge. Bye.



The irony of that post is completely lost on you.  :smirk:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #21854559 - 06/25/15 10:44 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Does anyone expect the new president next year to actually change many aspects of the economy? By that I don't mean his policies themselves will actually have a drastic change on the current rate of economics. More so though, the mass pandemonium that ensues from peoples reactions to a new president stepping in and changing policies seems to usually have a pretty big impact on everyone's behavior. I think the world went nuts over Obama being voted into office. This change in everyone views may have lead to sone extreme fanatacism among wealthy people and their change in behavior may have very well effected how the economy changed, much more so then Obamas actual policies really did.

Not I don't think Obama is an incompetent billion a day spender who's spent more money then can be printed. Oh well. I'm just saying I wonder how the next idiot who jumps into office will effect the masses of idiots. Donald Trump running for president? Anyone think he will win? Wasn't he one of the assholes saying he was going to close his business when Obama was originally elected because he disagreed with policies that would bankrupt him?

Man, political discussion forum will become a shit storm for sure during election times. It will be just like before "Romney this" and "Obama that" and mass hysteria over which asshole isn't going to ruin us when they are both greedy power hungry assholes will ensue. I personally have stopped voting anything but local since the last presidential election. Does anyone disagree with that?


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: imachavel]
    #21854587 - 06/25/15 10:51 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

If it's between Bush and Clinton, nothing will change after the election.  If someone like Bernie Sanders gets elected, then we might actually see some real change.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #21854741 - 06/25/15 11:30 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Why? First off, you think Bernie Sanders has a chance? Two, how does empowering one jerk to make everyone's decisions help change their life? What is Bernie Sanders going to change? Every day here 300,000,000 people make their own decisions. One day a president comes in who will "change some things" that probably shouldn't be changed anyway. Then 300,000,000 people start doing things different, thinking that this one guy is changing everything for them. Its all BS.

When individuals start feeling empowered and stop looking for a political leader to change their lives, maybe things will start working out differently for them.

However, anyone who spends a billion a day in office like Obama has been doing is not "fixing" anything anyway. How can anyone fix that mess? The next guy in office won't spend a billion a day?

I've got a good question for you. Is Greenpeace all over the next political campaign to change it? Has anyone bitched about these resources? How many trees need to be cut down to print a billion $1s every day? Shit, I can't even believe the Amazon is still around. Fucking wasteful if you ask me. Who gets all that money anyway? They use it to build roads? Cmon, the American highway system was completed almost 100 years ago. Is it feeding those who will work in other countries? Last I heard most are still living on crumbs in The Philippines.

Where did all that damn money go? Most consider the debt a successful venture for the cost of the quality of life for an average American. How can a problem be fixed if most people think it doesn't exist as a problem? They will vote for the next idiot who will repeat the mistakes


--------------------
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Edited by imachavel (06/25/15 11:31 AM)


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: imachavel]
    #21854818 - 06/25/15 11:51 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

>However, anyone who spends a billion a day in office like Obama has been doing is not "fixing" anything anyway.

True, and he has been spending a lot more than $1B a day, some ~12 trillions over his term

>Where did all that damn money go?

Good question, they can't even account for a lot of it. Much went down the rat hole to pay for those stupid wars we are still fighting overseas for no good reason.

>Who gets all that money anyway? They use it to build roads?

Hell no. Obumble gave it to the banks and rich folk or used it to bomb innocent people to death. When hard times come we will wish we had some of that wasted money but its all gone.

The left wing morons blindly follow obumble because he is the "peace" president with the "most transparent administration ever" if you want to believe those lies. When people finally find out how rotten the secret tpp is that obumble pushed through, they will still not wake up and will blame it on the gop which is also worthless

I'd take sanders over hillbilly or jeb any day. I'd much rather see paul get in but he is a long shot. Sanders has moved up surprisingly in the polls. Watch for the major media to start attacking him since they are shills for big corporations and the cabal that runs things.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Stonehenge] * 1
    #21855298 - 06/25/15 01:45 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Woof, I knew you were on the extreme left but I thought you were reasonable. Why did you attack me? What makes you think the dems are good guys? Do you think the tpp is getting passed without dem votes? Do you think they don't support the wars we have going on?

>The biggest part of this big government is the exhorbitant military expenditure that has gotten WAY out of control

Helloooo, wake up and realize its been obumble pushing war since he got in. I'm not defending gop, they and the dems are the problem. Its one party with two sides, sort of like good guys vs bad guys in wrestling. They put on a show to distract you while they both push for war and other stupid shit.

> but right wingers wanna cut wages, take food out of impoverished children's mouths, and take away grannies social security check.

I missed you link to the bill they are trying to pass doing all that.

>Oh, and forget about our infrastructure, we're too busy rebuilding the middle east

Yeah, that right winger obumble needs to get the message. Funny how you always give him a free pass on everything.

I need to put both you fanatics on ignore. I can't get a single word of sense out of either one. You have both gone over the edge. Bye.




I didn't attack you Stone! I was making an honest statement. I really don't understand this despisement of government. Government is a tool, just as, for instance, guns are a tool. They can be used in the manner we have just seen in South Carolina, and they can be used for deer hunting, or protection. It's all a matter of who bears that tool, and how it is used. That's why we vote. Sure we can vote for Hillary, and she will misuse that tool. Same with Jebb. However, we can vote for Bernie Sanders, and some would argue Rand Paul, and they will use those tools as a means to very different ends!

You are right about me, I am quite a leftist. I wouldn't say 'extreme' left, because I am not a communist, but we may differ in opinion there. That doesn't mean that I am an apologist for the democratic party. Most democrats are not true liberals. I am starting to see that most Republicans are also not true conservatives, also. Conservativism has mutated into some whacky sort of corporatism in this country, and it is by far the 'fringe' of the two parties. Can we agree on that?

I completely agree that the two parties are two sides of the same coin. However, I think that integrity can be found on both sides, and much more of it can be found on the left, I believe. On the right, we have Ron Paul, a man of integrity, no doubt. He stands for what he believes in, whether you agree with his views or not. On the left, we have Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders, Alan Grayson, and possibly a couple others. Not many on the left either.

This is why Fal and I want to get corporate influence out of the equation. We want to change campaign finance. That is the reason for both parties being so corporatist. They are sponsored by corporations and the wealthy. It is easier for the right to be more blatantly corporatist because they've melded corporatist values with conservative values quite seamlessly.


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"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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Offlinepsyconaught
Chemical Connoisseur


Registered: 11/04/10
Posts: 6,100
Last seen: 7 years, 2 months
Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #21855329 - 06/25/15 01:53 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Conservativism has mutated into some whacky sort of corporatism in this country, and it is by far the 'fringe' of the two parties. Can we agree on that?



I'd argue this applied to both the left and the right. They are both big government corporate fascists, they just disagree on where to grow the government.


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Think for yourself, question authority


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Offlineimachavel
I loved and lost but I loved-ftw
Male User Gallery


Registered: 06/06/07
Posts: 31,375
Loc: You get banned for saying that Flag
Last seen: 16 hours, 35 minutes
Re: Obama gets the TPP shoved up his ass... [Re: psyconaught]
    #21855356 - 06/25/15 01:59 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Kind of like the difference between the union and the confederate armies


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:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk


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