|
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
|
insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21776385 - 06/07/15 10:16 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Pastywhyte said:

Do me a favor if some do and see if you can print anything off of them. Be really interesting to see if they can drop spores outside. I know that PE used to be able to drop spores once upon a time, even indoors.
If they do drop spores, would you like print?
|
Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: insanemike]
#21776421 - 06/07/15 10:27 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Sure man, ya know I would get ya back with something good
|
insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21776432 - 06/07/15 10:29 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
You wouldn't happen to have any texas yellow cap would you? I'm dying to get my hands on a print.
|
Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: insanemike]
#21776454 - 06/07/15 10:34 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Sorry that one is not in my collection. But you get a print offa that PE and I am sure that somewhere in my active prints or edible collection I can find something ya want I do have TMF tho, just never grown it yet. Maybe if I have time I will squeeze one in.
|
insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21776532 - 06/07/15 10:52 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
I have tmf also. Aero sent me a print. I will be putting it on agar this week. If I get the outdoor pe print, just surprise me then. I'm sure everything you have is top notch anyway.
Edited by insanemike (06/07/15 10:53 PM)
|
Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: insanemike]
#21776572 - 06/07/15 11:02 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
You got it
|
mushpunx
Fungus Punk



Registered: 04/20/14
Posts: 13,394
Last seen: 11 days, 13 hours
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21776605 - 06/07/15 11:12 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
How do vendors have such an easy time getting PE spore syringes? Ive always had to swab the gills , but I dont grow PE that much
Doing a bunch of them this month hopefully tho!
--------------------
 Amateur Mycologists United AMU Q&A
|
azur
God of Fuck



Registered: 04/21/12
Posts: 28,103
Loc: Daid
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: mushpunx]
#21776617 - 06/07/15 11:14 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
I remember when i grew them, after harvesting a tub my hands were always black with spores
|
Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: mushpunx]
#21776622 - 06/07/15 11:15 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
I don't think its easy. PE once upon a time was able to be printed. Now it could be that some vendors supplier is rocking a great isolate that drops spores. APE on the other hand has never been known to ever drop spores. Its rumored that they drop sterile water on the gills then aspirate back into the syringe. This will be a difficult thing to do while remaining aseptic.
|
Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21776646 - 06/07/15 11:21 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
uncle rico apparently fruits his monos outdoors. Beauties for sure.
Quote:
uncle_rico said:
 
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21776599#21776599
|
Mushroom_J
Hard to the Coir !



Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 774
Loc: East
Last seen: 7 years, 10 months
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21776689 - 06/07/15 11:35 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Just got my PE syringe the other day. I don't see spore clumps but I do see myc clumps. Kinda disappointed. Hopefully there are some spores in there still. Hopefully the culture/s aren't dead.
|
inski
Cortinariologist



Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 5,720
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: Mushroom_J] 2
#21776872 - 06/08/15 12:37 AM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
I suspect PE is an example of a species evolving from an agaricoid form to a secotioid form and possibly the blobs people see are it going a step further to a gastroid form, this line of evolution is quite common in many Agarics and may progress in both directions, from an agaricoid form to a secotioid form or the other way around and it's quite common for varying degrees of these forms to show up, it has been well documented in many genera, Cortinarius, Descolea, Agaricus, Leratiomyces, Russula, Pholiota, Psilocybe, Boletus, Panaeolus to name a few.
In the past many secotioid forms of these agarics were placed in their own genera but with the advent of DNA sequencing it has become evident that the majority of them fit well into already outlined and described genera.
The loss of the ability of the basidia to forcefully eject spores is a telltale characteristic of all secotioid forms of fungi.
Here, an example. A completely secotioid Psilocybe, Psilocybe weraroa

A partially secotioid Psilocybe, P. "subsecotioides", the fitting but unpublished species epithet I coined, it is more than likely only a form of P. weraroa

Both very closely related to P. subaeruginosa which would represent the agaricoid form.
What is most interesting is the study of the cause of these lines of evolution and why it happens
Edited by inski (06/08/15 03:35 AM)
|
LeopardMan
Constantly changing



Registered: 09/21/09
Posts: 5,463
Loc: A tree house
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21777184 - 06/08/15 03:17 AM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Nice informative post, inski 
Quote:
Pastywhyte said: Also funny enough brown spores aside, I do find that CRS does have otherwise common traits as well. Every grow I have ever done with them produces pins that have caramel colored caps. Never reddish or dark brown.
I can't believe this, sorry. I had caramel colored caps with B+, Z, Transkei and others, and I am sure you already know that in mycology cap color is not considered a good identification key, generally speaking.
But let's try for a moment to consider this. There are more than 50 "varieties" as far as cubes are concerned and some are honestly ridiculous, like "Fatass" and "Mckennai" (what the fuck is that? Cubes grown by McKenna in his garden?).
Acadian Coast Albino A+ Amazonian Argentina Australian B+ Blue Meanie Brasil Burma Cambodia Cambodia Gold Campinas Chile China Colorado Columbia Colombian RustSpore Costa Rica Cuba Chitwan/Nepal Dakak Beach Dancing Tiger Ecuador Ecuador ‘Yosterizzii’ Escondido F+ Fatass Golden Teacher Golden Mammoth Guadalaiara Gulfcoast Hill Billy Huatla John Allen Keepers Creeper Large Fruits Lizard King Malabar Matias Romero Mazatapec McKennaii Mexican Mexican Albino Mexican “Dutch King” Mexican Mestizo Mexican Palenque Mexican Tapalpa Mexican Tulum Mystery Fatass Oak Ridge Orissa Penis Envy 6 Penis Envy Pensacola Peru PESA PESHawaï PF Classic PF Red Spore Plantasia Mystery Puerto Rican Redboy San Bernadino Shooting stars South African South American Stropharia Syzygy Tasmanian Teonanacatl Texas Thai Thai Ban Hua Thanon Thai Ban Pang Ka Thai Koh Samui Thai Koh Samui – Super Strain Thai KS T3 Thai Na Muang Thai Lipa Yai Thai Pink Buffalo KS The Star Gazer Transkei Treasure Coast Twisted Coast US Vrigin Islands Vietnam Wollongong Z-Strain
Even if I accept the idea that you can tell CRS and maybe KSSS apart form other cubes (which I don't ), most of these varieties are pure rubbish. Can we at least agree on this? What is The Star Gazer?! A cube that tends to look at the stars?
Please everybody remember that some people want you to think that cube varieties are indeed a thing. It's not my imagination. There are vendors on these boards, people. I am not judging them, they just want to make some more money and that is understandable. But do you really want me to believe that Plantasia Mystery is different from say Oak Ridge? Come on.
--------------------
You have to die a few times before you can really live. -Charles Bukowski-
Edited by LeopardMan (06/08/15 03:28 AM)
|
inski
Cortinariologist



Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 5,720
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: LeopardMan] 1
#21777252 - 06/08/15 04:07 AM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Agreed, but of course there may be some distinct macroscopic and possibly microscopic differences between different selected strains or isolated varieties to varying degrees, just as there is with all species of fungi, flora and fauna, humans are all of the same species, look at the genetic variation there!
...so in a sense, saying a cube is a cube is not really true because there is quite a wide range of genetic variation.
A good example is the Psilocybe serbica complex, all of those species, P. bohemica, P. moravica, P. moravica var. sternberkiana and P. arcana were originally described as distinct species with fairly different macroscopic and microscopic characteristics, now DNA sequencing proves that they are all merely varieties of P. serbica and in the case of P. moravica var. sternberkiana a form of P. serbica, so macro and micro characteristics can vary quite a bit within a species, to make a good diagnosis of a species many samples from as many different locations as possible should be examined to gain a good understanding, only then can a good description be made.
|
Buck513

Registered: 04/17/14
Posts: 5,682
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: inski]
#21777258 - 06/08/15 04:10 AM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
-------------------- Fail to plan and you plan to fail. Enter the Ban Lottery
|
Machiavelliavore
Vermiculite Hater



Registered: 12/08/14
Posts: 3,038
Loc: The Sporetorn States
Last seen: 3 months, 20 days
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: LeopardMan]
#21777277 - 06/08/15 04:21 AM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
I can tell the difference between Red Boy and Oak Ridge quite easily phenotypically, and I'm not even fluent in mushroom terminology.
Red Boy tends to have a more bulbous, darker cap, while oak ridge tends to have a flatter, light cap. Red Boy also sometimes exhibits the nipple (supposedly from the PR in its genetics,) which oak ridge does not. RB has some fluffy genetics, while OR is almost entirely rhizomorphic.
I have had different experiences with the varieties as well, though I definitely cannot say those weren't subjectively influenced. What I can say is that these phenotype differences were obvious, which suggests there are probably other differences. Is there a chemical content difference, a cultivational difference, a meaningful difference, hard to say.
If you're trying to produce human runners, you can take genetics from obese white people or kenyan olympic champions and say, hey, they're all just humans, but I think we all know which kids are gonna be better at running, statistically.
--------------------
I spawned some popcorn casings and had double-overlay cause I didn't put enough hydrogen peroxide in my automated aquarium mister. I only got one mushroom so I cut off the head part where the seeds fall from and put it in a jar of LC and sprayed it all over a tin of PF cakes I made with gravel, cardboard, and bisquick in my microwave. I think it will be good cause B+ is so potent. Triggered yet? Only a square would say "a cube is a cube."
No, this does not look right...
|
LeopardMan
Constantly changing



Registered: 09/21/09
Posts: 5,463
Loc: A tree house
|
|
Quote:
inski said: Agreed, but of course there may be some distinct macroscopic and possibly microscopic differences between different selected strains or isolated varieties to varying degrees, just as there is with all species of fungi, flora and fauna, humans are all of the same species, look at the genetic variation there!
Sure there are macroscopic and possibly microscopic differences between true "strains". But we are talking prints here, not strains. What do you mean by "isolated varieties"? It's a tricky expression.
Quote:
Machiavelliavore said: I can tell the difference between Red Boy and Oak Ridge quite easily phenotypically, and I'm not even fluent in mushroom terminology.
Red Boy tends to have a more bulbous, darker cap, while oak ridge tends to have a flatter, light cap. Red Boy also sometimes exhibits the nipple (supposedly from the PR in its genetics,) which oak ridge does not. RB has some fluffy genetics, while OR is almost entirely rhizomorphic.
^ And these are exactly the kind of posts we are bound to bump into, if we take the "cube varieties" route
--------------------
You have to die a few times before you can really live. -Charles Bukowski-
|
Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: LeopardMan]
#21777362 - 06/08/15 05:09 AM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Leopard for the most part I can and will agree that many of the "strains" in your list are unremarkable. No question they are truly average with no special work or effort placed into them. I am curious as to how stable many of them are. But we can agree that they are pretty average.
Inski thanks for chiming in. Your examples regarding the p serbica complex are just what this thread needed. Where you state that some of them differ microscopically had me wondering; do you know off hand if any cubes have been found to differ microscopically depending on region?
|
blackout


Registered: 07/16/00
Posts: 5,266
Last seen: 2 months, 24 days
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: LeopardMan]
#21777363 - 06/08/15 05:09 AM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
LeopardMan said: "Mckennai" (what the fuck is that? Cubes grown by McKenna in his garden?).
I first saw Mckennaii in amsterdam. A commercial shroom and I saw no prints being sold of it. I would presume it was grown from one of the well known types and carefully selected by a commercial grower. I would then presume a grower cloned it and released it. The dutch growers have all sorts of names for stones too, while they will probably all be from the same 3-4 original mushrooms.
I expect lots of these "names" originate from the same shroom. I would guess PF classic is Syzygy. If you read up the history of types you can see some do have believable histories.
One reported difference was the ability to be grown invitro in PF jars. Hippie3 & others tried many varieties grown invitro in PF jars and found some consistently did better than other types, and this as usually MS.
|
Machiavelliavore
Vermiculite Hater



Registered: 12/08/14
Posts: 3,038
Loc: The Sporetorn States
Last seen: 3 months, 20 days
|
Re: If a cube is a cube then what about PE? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21777373 - 06/08/15 05:18 AM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Isn't a sub-cubensis supposed to have demonstrably smaller spores and typically come from a dryer climate?
Just because a difference is not meaningful does not mean it is not observable. I have no interest in discussing cap shape, but I could identify which of the two varieties I mentioned was in an MS container at fruiting. Not claiming this is possible or easy with every pair of varieties.
I doubt RR, king of a cube is a cube, would have gone to the trouble to grow puerto rican over a dead red boy print, then add rattle snake venom to facilitate the exchange of nuclei, if he thought the genetic differences were insignificant. Red Boy had the redspore trait in abundance in its genetics, surely along with other more subtle traits, and he worked to acquire them, even if it was just for fun.
Any print that can be grown out, printed again, so on and so forth, and shows the same repeatably demonstrable traits is a legitimate variety. Many of the vendor name varieties are probably just renamed isolate prints of well known regional varieties.
--------------------
I spawned some popcorn casings and had double-overlay cause I didn't put enough hydrogen peroxide in my automated aquarium mister. I only got one mushroom so I cut off the head part where the seeds fall from and put it in a jar of LC and sprayed it all over a tin of PF cakes I made with gravel, cardboard, and bisquick in my microwave. I think it will be good cause B+ is so potent. Triggered yet? Only a square would say "a cube is a cube."
No, this does not look right...
|
|