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Lofetospoon9
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Registered: 05/13/15
Posts: 156
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Where are my pins?
#21771214 - 06/06/15 05:26 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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Used the search, Read at least 100 threads, some helping, most didn't seem to be in my exact situation, usually their problems were more obvious.
I birthed 6 cakes a few days after fully colonized. I dunked them for 24 hours, and Rolled in verm. I put them in my perlite SGFC (Sterlite tub 4.5 inches of soaked perlite, 1/4' holes on every side, raised By 2 1/2pint jars on each corner) which is in a closet. 3 hydrometers read over 90% rh and averages at 75 degrees. And a light hangs right above 6500K 12/12
When i started then, i was misting and fanning about 4 times a day, directly at the cakes. After about 5 days They started turning blue at the edges, and has gotten Worse slowly.
I figured the bruising was from handling, but it started Pretty late, and has not gone away.
Its been 3 weeks now, no "fluffy mycelium" really, Just a little growth, a ton of bruising, and 1 pin that sprouted About 3 days ago.
My theory was i wasnt misting and fanning enough, Now, as of the last 2 days i do it almost every hour, as the moisture on The surface dries. The cakes are not light really by any means But are very blue. From everything i know so far, its not contam.
Now im thinking its the closet, but the door is open 24/7 And the terrarium isnt directly Against the wall, Just a little close.
Whats my problem? Did everything by the book (Evils take on BRF cakes) that is. Why only one pin after 3 weeks, and tons of bruising?
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
Posts: 156
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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mush madness
absorbing everything



Registered: 05/22/15
Posts: 252
Loc: Brazil
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You need to wait 7 days after fully colonized to birth
Mist lightly/ not heavily directly on the cakes and only when dry
Make sure you have 6 inch clearance on all sides
Stop handling
Go back and read the tek
Edited by mush madness (06/06/15 05:48 PM)
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Quote:
mush madness said: You need to wait 7 days after fully colonized to birth
Mist lightly/ not heavily directly on the cakes and only when dry
Make sure you have 6 inch clearance on all sides
Stop handling
Go back and read the tek
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
Posts: 156
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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The thing is i literally have never touched the Cakes except to dunk them, roll them, and to place In terrarium. And i forgot to mention i stopped misting Directly about a week and a half ago. I spray lightly over the top. And i gave my Specs, does anything /not/ go by tek? Ive read it over and over And the first 3 weeks i have been going by the T, And for 3 weeks no pins only bruising. Thats why i strayed and started Misting more. The tek itself even said to spray directy, Which is wrong. I need some further advice. And ive been spraying every hour Only /because/ they no longer appear moist at that time.
Also, they may not have been fully colonized, but 3 weeks? And still nothing?
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Bruising means they are stressed which can come from mishandling, drying out or from forceful misting. If given the proper conditions, they will propagate when they are ready to.
Edited by insanemike (06/06/15 07:22 PM)
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Lofetospoon9
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Registered: 05/13/15
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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Are you sure directly misting can cause bruising? I started To think this but dismissed it as i couldnt find sufficiant info on that. And i wouldnt Exacly say it was forceful, it was from like 5" away. And if i stopped doing this a week ago why is my bruising still there so bad? And your last sentence is exactly what im worried about. I think i have beem giving them The right conditions (75 degrees, 95 percent rh, 12/12 lighting, Misting and fanning) and no propagation. Any other ideas? I had large foil bases at first but carefully cut the corners off as Someone told me the base needs to be no bigger than the cake. Also Could the closet be a problem, even with the door open an it centered, having over a foot of space By each side? Thanks a lot for the advice
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Can we see a close up pic of your cakes? It may help determine if there is a problem or not. I've never grown in a closet before but I know that the SGFC was designed to take advantage of natural air currents in the grow room, so the more open space around the FC the better.
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Lofetospoon9
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Registered: 05/13/15
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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Yes im going to take them out of closet entirely. But the only option That leaves in my bedroom, which a cieling fan runs all the time in. Is that okay? Ive read fans in rooms messes with the Natural convection, but would a breezy room be better than a rather sill air closet? Also ill have some pics up when i get home in an hour if youll hang in with me
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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GIjoe420
N00B


Registered: 03/26/15
Posts: 51
Last seen: 5 years, 10 months
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Your holes look like they are spaced right. You are using the correct jars. Your perlite level looks to be around 4 inches. And your misting enough.
I always wait to see primordia before birthing my cakes that way you know the myc has consumed the cake and is wanting to go. I would assume 3 weeks would be enough but that would vary GREATLY depending on strand and genetics and so on. I had a cake take 3 weeks to start fruiting one time but it took like 8 weeks to colonize and another few of consolidation.
Your light cycle is fine so i'm guessing its probably not getting the fresh air it needs to evaporate the water off the surface of the substrate (one of your main pinning triggers). The trick is supplying AS MUCH FAE as possible while maintaining as much humidity as you can. The shit needs to breathe just like you. Just watch your cakes and keep them glistening. You will develop an eye for this as you go. It was hard for me to see in the beginning.
I would guess that you couldn't find good coarse perlite and picked some of the miracle grow shit up at your local box store..... Ditch that shit and get some horticultural grade stuff from one of the sponsors. Out-grow is where I shop for all my mycology needs.
I ran a regular oscillating fan in my large bedroom on the opposite side as my SGFC during my first run. It dried my cakes out.
Edited by GIjoe420 (06/06/15 08:53 PM)
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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Re: Where are my pins? [Re: GIjoe420]
#21771944 - 06/06/15 08:49 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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The ceiling fan will definitely have an effect on air current which may lead to more misting but I still think it's better than being couped up in that closet.
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chasingwaterfalls
stranger everyday
Registered: 06/01/15
Posts: 38
Last seen: 2 years, 21 days
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I do apologize if you mentioned it and I overlooked it, but did you keep the closet door closed the last few weeks? Jw
-------------------- Boy, is it fun talking about imaginary things
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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No the closet door has been opened the whole time, But the FC has been in the back, with only about 6 inches from the wall Until a few days ago i moved it closer to the door.
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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chasingwaterfalls
stranger everyday
Registered: 06/01/15
Posts: 38
Last seen: 2 years, 21 days
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One more question, sorry - is there any chance your perlite is packed down too much? Only bring it up because my first time using a SGFC, I ran water through the perlite in the FC tote I was going to use to soak it(didn't have another big container handy and was feeling too lazy to do batches in a tiny colander). My humidity went up after I had used a wooden skewer to poke through all the lower holes on my SGFC, which I had assumed had meant it fixed it by being able to have air properly flow through.
I know you mentioned you read 90%+ humidity, but IME i personally stopped trusting the few cheap thermometer/hygrometers I bought is all
-------------------- Boy, is it fun talking about imaginary things
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Okay i am using hydrometers and am getting suspicious. Thanks Mkim, thanks exactly something i wanted when i posted. Have been reading for weeks and never came across That phen. However, it just so happens, yes. That was my situation. No big colander, so i strained it through the FC. Maybe im just being Jumpy but that post blew my mind, considering i did that Exact thing, so i checked on the bottom, and i just found that The spot of perlite in/above each of these holes is turning ORANGE? None of the spots are bigger than the holes they are in/above, so it doesnt seem To be "spreading" and i was sure perlite is Nutrient zero, so it makes me think That its some kind of chem reaction, not a contam, but with a closer look, a piece of perlite In the chamber was also orange. I think your suspicion is very possible ill poke something Through the perlite and see if i can read at least an acurate difference in rh
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
Posts: 156
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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But on the other hand, what the hell is this orange stuff? Ill use the search function on this but i cant help but associate the orange stuff in The bottom of the holes, with the possibility that in is too stuffed.
Also when my service gets better ill post a lot of pictures
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
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Registered: 05/13/15
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Okay, ill post some pictures tomorrow but as of now:
Assume my problem is FAE related, Ill take the SG out of the closet, and into the room, poke out any dense perlite from the bottom, and because of the breezy room, spray more if they dry quicker.
And i am using B+, and the jars did take longer Than usual to colonize, maybe genetics is playing a part of my Problem so ill be patient but will post more as they progress Crossing my fingers
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Also thanks GI joe, got your post last for some reason
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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insanemike

Registered: 02/23/14
Posts: 4,272
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You've already accomplished the more difficult part of your grow. Which is keeping everything sterile until full colonization. Just mist and fan as needed and things will work out fine.
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metaphoric
Mr. Bater



Registered: 05/18/15
Posts: 730
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Quote:
Lofetospoon9 said:

Not to be rude but if you're looking for help do you think this pic is gonna do anyone any good? You're standing like 6 feet away from it
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 BEHOLD 
        
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chasingwaterfalls
stranger everyday
Registered: 06/01/15
Posts: 38
Last seen: 2 years, 21 days
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lol even watching RR do it in a video, there's only so many things a person can say NOT to do, right? so it was a lesson learned for me, hope it helps you - I used a thin wooden skewer, like for kabobs, and twisted/pushed through at least half a foot for the side holes, and just tried my best to loosen it up while watching the surface and the cakes. guess anything will do
but i agree, if anything, you've just delayed the process and perhaps used up some nutes, but hey, just a small delay is not bad at all compared to starting over
-------------------- Boy, is it fun talking about imaginary things
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meowshroom
EnergyPermeation

Registered: 04/28/15
Posts: 158
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I see your problem...
Allow little to no airflow around the FC.
Your sides aren't condensing. Get more water in there.
74 degrees is PERFECT.
Dunk and roll will, under the right humidity, produce airy MC within 3 days. If it does not, you're doing something wrong.
My bet is your humidity is around 70% and it needs to be 95%.
Better to have humid and stale air than non-humidy and whatever air.
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chasingwaterfalls
stranger everyday
Registered: 06/01/15
Posts: 38
Last seen: 2 years, 21 days
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Btw, I don't think sides being wet with droplets is indicative of anything more than you're either spraying the walls, or you have a temperature differential allowing for that condensation it's been emphasized here that it isn't as important as properly misting in general? which can be directly on the cakes as long as it's as fine a mist as possible, and good evaporation can occur
-------------------- Boy, is it fun talking about imaginary things
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LocN9ne
ɢᄋᄋd ԲᄋЯ ᄁᄋȚᅢΙᄁɢ ᄂᄋ₩ᄂΙԲᄐ



Registered: 04/17/15
Posts: 7,076
Loc: to the brain
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Quote:
meowshroom said:
Better to have humid and stale air than non-humidy and whatever air.
You always want constant fresh air when fruiting...fresh air exchange is a primary pinning trigger, along with full colonization...you do not want stale air.
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Q&A US vs. THEM The more I learn, the less I know.
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Re: Where are my pins? [Re: LocN9ne]
#21773972 - 06/07/15 12:59 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
Posts: 156
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
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Registered: 05/13/15
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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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The first pictures purpose was to emphasize the closet perimeters. These dont look the best, but point is some spots are VERY blue, and the surface Is very not fluffy. Also on my one pin (which seems to be growing very slow) Has started to also turn spotty blue.
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
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It sounds to be like its dead overlay, but ive heard that only happens when casing? The water almost sorta puddles on the tops of the ones that real real flat, which ive heard happens When theyre is a layer of dead cells. So my questions now are
What should i do with these cakes to get them going? A spotty blue on my pin is just bruising right it doesnt mean much? (Its slow so probably an abort anyway i guess) Can cakes overlay, or something like it? If so, what causes it? What do i do about it?
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
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Well i re-dunked them yesterday night, and Put them in a new prepared SGFC this afternoon. A good ammount of Bruising is gone, so they must have been dehydrated. But so far no apparent myc growth.
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
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/Some/ fluffy mycelium grew in the last 2 days. Lesson learned: "Light" is a subjective word. If they Are severly bruising, they probably need a dunk and Are drying out too fast. Will just make this a grow log in case another noob can take something from it.
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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mycomaniac1402
Myco Maniac :-)



Registered: 01/25/15
Posts: 257
Last seen: 2 months, 19 days
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Too much misting and excessive water can cause all that you described. Hopefully you have things squared away... Always try taking away one thing at a time to narrow down the issue. Stop misting for a day or two to see the reaction you get , then if no change go from there . Most of the time it will take about 7 to 14 days for cakes or any substrate to start throwing pins. Most issues are caused by too much water, excess bruising and small fruits. Or drying out. I tend to rely on my perlite and the substrate for moisture with a light mist once or twice a day. But this is different in every situation depending on the air in your space and dryness or humidity.
I see now after reading that it might be from drying... Hope to see theyve bounced back.
Edited by mycomaniac1402 (06/11/15 06:50 PM)
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GIjoe420
N00B


Registered: 03/26/15
Posts: 51
Last seen: 5 years, 10 months
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What kind of perlite are you using?
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Re: Where are my pins? [Re: GIjoe420]
#21794769 - 06/11/15 08:13 PM (8 years, 7 months ago) |
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Miracle grow, sadly. Im currently debating if i should Ship in more coarse perlite from a sponsor, cause i Cant find anything but miracle grow where i live.
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Yeah i think i was over spraying when i got scared of the drying out. I hardly Sprayed at all the last day or 2 and they're looking better than They have yet. I think i was spraying too little to begin with, then too much.
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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GIjoe420
N00B


Registered: 03/26/15
Posts: 51
Last seen: 5 years, 10 months
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You are WAAAAAYYYY over thinking this man. The Miracle Grow stuff has a whole lot of dust and is a fine perlite.... no good. You need to use the coarse horticultural grade stuff to get proper FAE in your set-up. So either order some from a sponsor or get to sifting what you have through a strainer with decent holes.
The shit would be at your house now if you ordered it when I first called you out on this a week ago.....
I did the EXACT SAME THING you are doing now on my first BRF run.....Happy growing..... and go ahead and order a 40 lb. bag of patience with that perlite.
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FreeWorldOrder


Registered: 12/24/13
Posts: 2,002
Loc: Indiana, USA
Last seen: 8 days, 10 hours
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Quote:
mush madness said: You need to wait 7 days after fully colonized to birth
Mist lightly/ not heavily directly on the cakes and only when dry
Make sure you have 6 inch clearance on all sides
Stop handling
Go back and read the tek
-------------------- "They who can give up essential liberty, to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin Lets Grow Mushrooms Videos PastyWhyte's Easy Agar TEK Agar's Liquid Inoculant TEK
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Alright, big bag of perlite and 40 lbs of patients Is on its way. Thanks a lot GI Jo.
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
Posts: 156
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

Registered: 05/13/15
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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Alright so sponsors shipping prices for perlite are not affordable, But i found a farmers market and got some coarse perlite. The cakes have Still yet to do anything but i calibrated my analogue hygro. And It reads 89 rh, so if it jumps when i replace the perlite ill bet rh was My problem.
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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Lofetospoon9
Stranger

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Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Indeed, my rh did jump up. Its finally 95% but we'll see if it lasts. Noticed one small Pin grew within the last couple of days so they're certainly still alive. Ive got more cakes coming soon Though that'll help answer the gene variable question.
-------------------- 1) All living things are highly organized and contain many complex chemical substances. 2) All living things contain one or more cells 3) All living things use energy. 4) Living things have a definite form and have a limited size. 5) Living things grow. 6) Living things respond to changes in the environment. 7) Living things can reproduce. 8) Living things eventually die.
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