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Invisiblekr0nik0
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: Shroomism]
    #21775329 - 06/07/15 06:14 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Without a doubt. All these years of trying to cultivate high THC strains have left most popular Sativas lacking in the CBD/CBN department.

Unfortunately I don't have the luxury here of choosing which strains/substrains come around through the black market.

Once every few months a friend of mine will get a couple strains shipped in from your part of the country so that's the only time where I know exactly what I'm getting. Blue Dream as you mentioned has been one of the very few Sativas that I'm comfortable smoking frequently. Sour Diesel as well.


--------------------

“[...]the only people for me are the mad ones,
the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk,
mad to be saved,
desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes “Awww!”



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InvisiblePsychonautica
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: kr0nik0]
    #21775335 - 06/07/15 06:16 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

There's plenty of companies out there selling pure CBD extracts on the interwebs.

My buddy has CBD e-cig fluid? Oil? Idk what that shit's called but yeah.

It doesn't get you "high" exactly, you do feel weird from it, but if you mix it with regular weed then blammos you probably got what you're lookin for in a thc cbd ratio.


--------------------
The chances of you even being born, Were forty million to one. There's two parts of the statistic And I want you to live through one
3/8/95 - 7/10/15 Rest In Paradise, Brother.
Sheekle said:
yeah, i said i was afraid of psychonautica


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Invisiblekr0nik0
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: Psychonautica]
    #21775349 - 06/07/15 06:20 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Yup... CBD juice (or ejuice or eliquid).
That's what I've been doing...Maybe you missed my post.


--------------------

“[...]the only people for me are the mad ones,
the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk,
mad to be saved,
desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes “Awww!”



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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: kr0nik0]
    #21775361 - 06/07/15 06:24 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Shit is expensive as fuck though. I wonder how hard it is to extract :strokebeard:


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InvisiblePsychonautica
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: kr0nik0]
    #21775372 - 06/07/15 06:27 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Probably just as easy as extracting THC I would imagine.

BHO still has high levels of CBD if the plant had high levels, so there's that.
Quote:

kr0nik0 said:
Yup... CBD juice (or ejuice or eliquid).
That's what I've been doing...Maybe you missed my post.




Probably, you already made fun of my pics of pubbers didn't you?

Did you not see how fucked up I am right meow? lol


--------------------
The chances of you even being born, Were forty million to one. There's two parts of the statistic And I want you to live through one
3/8/95 - 7/10/15 Rest In Paradise, Brother.
Sheekle said:
yeah, i said i was afraid of psychonautica


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Offlinelifeiswhatyoumake
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: SirShroomsAlott]
    #21775390 - 06/07/15 06:33 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

People quit smoking cigs because they realize how lame it is to be completely dependent on something that is proven to kill them, doesn't get them high anymore, makes them look and smell like shit, wastes money, and wastes time.

Think about the future, like Asante said.  Be who you want to be.

Just do it.

Quit.

Right now.

You won't regret it.

Don't look back.

Just quit.

Be strong.  You can do it!

Message me if you are having problems quitting and/or are having bad cravings.

:heart: :mushroom2:







I'd recommend not using e-cigs.  They are too new and not much is known about the long term effects.
Just truly quit all of that shit and you'll feel great and have much more free time and save money and your health.
Let your lungs be free and not always being pumped full of cigs or e-cigs.


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:rave::rave::rave: I dropped a trance track "Peace Love & Trance": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4uQBM-mRYU ; :raver2::raver2::raver2::raveface:


Edited by lifeiswhatyoumake (06/07/15 06:37 PM)


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OfflineShroomslip
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: lifeiswhatyoumake]
    #21775439 - 06/07/15 06:47 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)



--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline


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Invisible404
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: Psychonautica]
    #21775467 - 06/07/15 06:52 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomism said:
Quote:

404 said:
and for a more recent science article...

Quote:

The loss of integrity in the lung endothelial cells—the cells that make up the lining of the lungs—can contribute to lung injury and inflammation, but it is unknown what component of cigarette smoke causes lung cells to breakdown. Researchers wrote, “We investigated if nicotine, one of the hundreds of molecules present in [cigarette smoke] extracts, is sufficient to alter lung endothelial barrier function by affecting cytoskeletal regulation,” which is the cell’s internal matrix that supports cell shape and function.

The researchers exposed mice and both human and mouse cells to cigarette smoke and e-cigarette solution that either contained nicotine or was nicotine-free. Their findings shed light on how cigarette smoke damages the lungs and point directly to nicotine as the cause. “Nicotine has dose-dependent deleterious pulmonary effects that result in loss of lung endothelial barrier function, acute lung inflammation and decreased lung endothelial cell proliferation,” they wrote. The effects of nicotine were seen both in cigarette smoke and in e-cig solutions that contained nicotine.

Interestingly, nicotine-free e-cig solutions were also found to include lung-harming substances, such as acrolein. This substance, which is present in both e-cig solution and vapor, has been shown to damage the lungs by attacking the molecules that hold endothelial cells together.

“The increased use of inhaled nicotine via e-cigarettes, especially among the youth, prompts increased research into the effects on health. This research reports that components found in commercially available e-cigarette solutions and vapors generated by heating them may cause lung inflammation,” said lead researcher Irina Petrache, PhD. “The effects described characterize short-term effects of e-cig exposures. Whereas studies of long-term effects await further investigations, these results caution that e-cigarette inhalation may be associated with adverse effects on lung health.




i would not go with a vape to quit smoking if you're just going to switch to it instead for the long term.

http://www.the-aps.org/mm/hp/Audiences/Public-Press/2015/25.html




This study was debunked as bad science and was a flawed study. I'm trying to find the actual link, but basically they obtained their results the same way the flawed "formaldehyde" scare study started. They were severely overheating the devices beyond what any normal vaper would ever be able to tolerate, and were producing "dry hits". You can read about that in one of the links I posted before. And another one here. Basically, no human would be able to tolerate vaping those hits as they would burn like fuck and taste like shit.  Not to mention, they don't even mention their sources or what devices they were using, which is terrible science. They could have gotten the ejuice from China for all we know, which have had many known contamination issues, Which many of these studies have done in the past. Things like tank size, wattage/voltage, and more all have a dramatic impact on vapor production and could have an impact vis-a-vis health issues, without this information it is a completely crap study. THIS is a much more realistic comparison of the chemicals produced or inhaled during normal vaping vs cigarettes. This is also a much more realistic study.

Acrolein is produced from burning cotton. Or can be produced from propylene glycol at temperatures over 280C. Normal ecigs are not capable of even reaching 280c unless you are severely overheating the device or running outside of specs or running an unregulated device, not to mention the burning effect, which a vaper would not even be able to tolerate.  So it's pretty safe to assume the acrolein they detected, was from overheating the device and burning the cotton wick with dry hits. Which would be virtually impossible for any human to tolerate. Any vaper will tell you taking a dry hit of burnt cotton is basically the worst thing you can do and within a split second of tasting it you will gag and take it away from your mouth. The flawed formaldehyde study used the same technique and they were SEVERELY overheating the devices and producing dry hits for up to 60 seconds and feeding through a machine. All the "aldehydes" they detected were from the dry hits, and no vaper would even be able to tolerate that for half a second.

Furthermore they are doing this using cultures which may not translate to actual human effects. They also used mice which have much smaller lungs comparably and this may not at all translate to actual human use. It would have been better if they examined actual vaper's lungs and newly Vaper's lungs charting their progress and examining the extent of damage if any over time, as well as comparing it side by side to cigarettes. Instead this is a cheap study with dubious methodology. Furthermore a secondary control of just glycerine(fog machine fog juice) would have been warranted to test if any additional additives are the causes of any damage as opposed to the main vaping ingredient. It is well known in the vaping community that there are certain flavors to be avoided as they are not safe for vaping, but some unscrupulous manufacturers still use those flavors. That alone could explain the inflammation. They also rely on one manufacturer so there is no way to tell even if there is damage if it is unique to the one manufacturer's products or not. This was a cheap and mostly useless study that does not have any real depth or scope to prove one way or the other if vaping is harmful. This study also refers to propylene glycol as "antifreeze" (BS) and is clearly biased. Judging by some of the language used and vitally important omitted details, this is just another scare monger study put out by interest groups, most likely funded by Marlboro. But I can't find out who funded this study because they have it encrypted as "Funding sources: RO1HL077328 (IP); R21DA029249". Every single study I have found "proving" harmful effects of vaping has used these bad science methods and I have found has been directly funded by either Pfizer or Big tobacco companies or one of their sisters.

Of course any amount of inhalation of anything but air can cause minor lung irritation or inflammation. But how harmful is this? Well, check out the links in my sig and some of the links I posted earlier, there have been multitudes of non-biased scientific studies, on actual humans, using actual real world data. As for this particular study, it's basically complete crap for the reasons listed above. Are ecigs completely 100% safe? We don't know for complete certain yet. What we DO know, is that it is a MUCH MUCH MUCH safer alternative to smoking.





Look, i get that vaping is considerably safer than smoking... Im not disputing that. Looks like nicotine is still bad for you though. I know you wrote a lot here but i'd like to touch on the part where you said that the article i posted had somehow been debunked or so, how could that be when it was only just released on the 26th of last month? How can that be? Unless the overview alluded to those flawed studies that you mentioned... In which case why would an organization like this post an 'update' that cites flawed sources?


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InvisibleImperfect Iam
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: Shroomism]
    #21775866 - 06/07/15 08:21 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomism said:
CBD is legal in all 50 states, as long as its from industrial hemp..




HMM, maybe this is different than hemp oil, because I know for a fact it is a big deal that they are allowing the medicinal use of hemp oil in my state for epilepsy patients only here, I hope so, but hell yeah man, ur right about it being expensive as fuck!


--------------------
All you touch, and all you see, is all your life will ever be- Pink Floyd

Life is what happens while you're busy making other plans- John Lennon


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Invisiblekr0nik0
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: Imperfect Iam]
    #21775910 - 06/07/15 08:30 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

The CBD tinctures you're talking about being given out I'm assuming come from low THC strains of bud. Like Charlotte's Web here in FL. Those still contain a bit of THC as where the ones being sold online contain none.

CBD oil or ejuice that's made with industrial hemp is 100% legal in all 50 states. I buy mine right over the counter at a vape shop.

You're right about it being very expensive, but it's worth it for me. $50/15ml has lasted me a month already but I only use 1ml of it when I smoke weed and it's a high THC sativa. It's definitely not something I could afford to dose every day.


--------------------

“[...]the only people for me are the mad ones,
the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk,
mad to be saved,
desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes “Awww!”



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InvisibleImperfect Iam
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: kr0nik0]
    #21775943 - 06/07/15 08:37 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Yup, I think you are correct, thanks guys,I may look into that vaporizer thats on sale, if it's def. worth it, I'm really interested in this cbd, hemp oil, but yeah, hella expensive!


--------------------
All you touch, and all you see, is all your life will ever be- Pink Floyd

Life is what happens while you're busy making other plans- John Lennon


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: 404] * 1
    #21776183 - 06/07/15 09:25 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

404 said:
Look, i get that vaping is considerably safer than smoking... Im not disputing that. Looks like nicotine is still bad for you though. I know you wrote a lot here but i'd like to touch on the part where you said that the article i posted had somehow been debunked or so, how could that be when it was only just released on the 26th of last month? How can that be? Unless the overview alluded to those flawed studies that you mentioned... In which case why would an organization like this post an 'update' that cites flawed sources?




Ok. Perhaps some background would help.


Pfizer and big tobacco companies (Marlboro and RJ Reynolds primarily).. have been pumping millions and millions of dollars into trying to get ecigs banned. They have funded numerous studies that turned out to be complete crap science.. and this is looking like one of them.

Ok. Now read this
http://www.ecigarette-research.org/research/index.php/whats-new/whatsnew-2015/213-cell

Quote:

I have repeatedly mentioned that there is no need for vapers to waste your time and brain activity reading cell studies. In the majority of cases, the protocols and experimental procedures are irrelevant to human effects. However, over the past few days I have been repeatedly contacted by vapers asking me to comment on a new study published by the American Journal of Physiology: Lung Cellular and Molecular Physiology. The study has an equally to the journal impressive title: “Endothelial disruptive pro-inflammatory effects of nicotine and e-cigarette vapor exposures”.

Although cell studies have some value, presenting them with press statements making ridiculous claims about supposed findings and interpretations makes the whole issue look more like a joke. This is directly discrediting the value of cell research, just because e-cigarettes are a hot topic which can generate a lot of publicity. Expect to see more coming out, but please understand that I will stop commenting on such studies because the publicity accompanying them is politics and not science.




That pretty much sums it up. It should be amended to say ng/ml, but what that essentially means is that the "study" exposed the cells to nicotine concentrations up to 48 times greater (on average) than the physiological range.
Not to mention research needs to be peer reviewed and duplicated before it holds any merit to make such claims.
The study is flawed all over the place, omits vital details and uses flawed research to make sensationalist claims
Where's the distinction between 'minor irritation' and permanent damage? Or the comparison between breathing normal city air? Many things are irritating but do little or no permanent harm. Where's the study on actual human lungs? Those have already been done and more are being done all the time. This is on cells in a petri dish and mice. They use questionable methodologies to arrive at conclusions contradicting much peer reviewed research. It really shouldn't be taken seriously at all until peer reviewed and duplicated. And it probably won't be.. because it's junk science.

To top it off:
- there are no mention of any PHDs in the study
- they refer to PG as "antifreeze".  That's a completely retarded statement to make and shows a bias right there. It has been used as a COMPONENT in antifreeze in the past, but that's like saying Flour is cake. How very scientific. PG is also used in cosmetics.. as a food additive.. as a medium for inhalers and has been pumped into hospital ventilation systems for over 70 years because of its powerful antiviral properties and use as an air sanitizer.
- they were "vaping" .6mg of juice per hit, which is a ridiculous amount
- they were funded by questionable sources. I have my suspicions.
- they don't make a single mention of 1: the Ejuice used 2: what watts and volts they were running at or what devices they used. This is a BIG freaking deal. But 300C alone tells us WTF are you doing?
- they heated the vapor to 300C (572F), which is FAR beyond the boiling point of VG and explains the acrolein perfectly. Not to mention the dry hit phenomena which almost certainly occurred at 300 freaking celsius. This is about 3-5x higher than your average vaper will vape at. No person in the world vapes at temperatures that high. And they were using 25mg/ml juice.. and running it at 300C for a full minute. Hence, completely and utterly unrealistic bullshit. This is the same nail that was put in the coffin that destroyed the formaldehyde scare study. Where the fuck do they pull their testing criteria out of? Straight from their ass apparently.

the study basically tested concentrated e-cig solution on cultures of cells which in no way, shape or form can be used to draw conclusions about the safety of the vaporized solution. Secondly, it showed that there are substances in the solution that MAY cause SOME damage to lung cells, when vaped at completely ridiculous temperatures. There's no scale or basis for any kind of meaningful comparison. Is the damage greater, lesser or equal to the lung damage in regular cigarette smoke or even from say automobile exhaust or regular air? Again there's no way to draw a meaningful comparison or any meaningful conclusions from this data. Basically, it's completely worthless data and was most likely funded by Pfizer or big tobacco, just like the other studies which used similar dubious methods to produce sensationalist titles. They have a vested interest in demonizing ecigs and trying to get them banned, so they will put out whatever propaganda they can come up with. 

As for the whole "nicotine is still bad for you" thing, here is an unbiased summary of nicotine with over 250 peer-reviewed studies cited:
http://examine.com/supplements/Nicotine#summary6

TL;DR - it's about as 'harmful' as caffeine... and has slightly similar effect. And it has been very well studied. It's also linked to things like improved cognition and brain function and as an effective treatment for neurological disorders.
Not saying nicotine is completely harmless.. there are some negative things associated with it, but it is not nearly as harmful as it is made out to be in diluted form, by itself..  and there are also many positive benefits garnered from it in many different areas, which we are currently doing a lot more research on.

Sorry if I typed too much. And not criticizing you at all in case that isn't clear. It just really irks me with these BS propaganda studies with extremely questionable methods that leave more questions than answers, leaving multiple important variables out in the open or completely undefined.

The one thing they are absolutely right about with that study, is that more research needs to be done. But not the kind of "research" they are doing.


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InvisiblePsychonautica
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: kr0nik0]
    #21776229 - 06/07/15 09:34 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Try cloud 9 hemp homie.

It's so much cheaper  it's like 25 dollars for 15 mls.

Also they have cbd wax.


--------------------
The chances of you even being born, Were forty million to one. There's two parts of the statistic And I want you to live through one
3/8/95 - 7/10/15 Rest In Paradise, Brother.
Sheekle said:
yeah, i said i was afraid of psychonautica


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: Imperfect Iam]
    #21776254 - 06/07/15 09:39 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Imperfect Iam said:
Quote:

Shroomism said:
CBD is legal in all 50 states, as long as its from industrial hemp..




HMM, maybe this is different than hemp oil, because I know for a fact it is a big deal that they are allowing the medicinal use of hemp oil in my state for epilepsy patients only here, I hope so, but hell yeah man, ur right about it being expensive as fuck!




It's kind of a legal grey area. But technically, if the CBD oil is derived from industrial hemp then it can be sold in any state, hell they sell it on Amazon. If falls under a hemp product, which can be imported to all 50 states.

If it is derived from medical cannabis, then it can only be obtained in a state that has legalized medicinal cannabis, as it will still often contain small amounts of THC


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InvisiblePsychonautica
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: Shroomism]
    #21776284 - 06/07/15 09:48 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Technically industrial hemp has thc still. It's just like .05 percent.


--------------------
The chances of you even being born, Were forty million to one. There's two parts of the statistic And I want you to live through one
3/8/95 - 7/10/15 Rest In Paradise, Brother.
Sheekle said:
yeah, i said i was afraid of psychonautica


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InvisibleImperfect Iam
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: Shroomism]
    #21776286 - 06/07/15 09:49 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Yeah, I think I got confused, as the cbd oil is going to come from female plants I do believe, man I am really stoked about this cbd shit, but am kind of broke ATM, also, if there is anyway I would flunk a drug test because of it, I would be fucked! I gotta look into that vaporizer that's on sale, I wonder how much those batteries would run me?

And whoever wrote that about cloud 9, I will have to look into that, I know they made some great cannibinoids!


--------------------
All you touch, and all you see, is all your life will ever be- Pink Floyd

Life is what happens while you're busy making other plans- John Lennon


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Offlinespace walk
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: Psychonautica]
    #21776288 - 06/07/15 09:49 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I'm about to go to bed, but I wanted to hit just a couple of things I read on these recent posts.
PG is called antifreeze because Propylene Glycol is the main component of antifreeze. I am a chemist who works in an industry where we use it for its anti-freezing properties. It will help some unlike oil-based chemicals blend, much like IPA, but it also lowers their flash point. The fact that it is antifreeze shouldn't dissuade you, though. But some people are allergic to it and will break out in a rash if it touches their skin. Now picture that in your lungs. I am not allergic to it, not do I vape it in large quantities. Also, I have read many oil suppliers are switching to VG, vegetable glycerin instead.

When you vape it with weed, it does help, but you require a whole lot more (ie. one mil or so). That seems high to me anyway, maybe your stuff isn't as potent as mine. Not trying to start something, just stating. Now that I've been without bud for three weeks, I feel strong effects from the oil after just a couple of puffs.

Aaand I gtg again. I hope you guys can quit smoking cause that's freakin' hard. I've relapsed in the past back onto drugs and this time I studies texts like crazy before trying to quit. I feel different and incredibly confident. Know your enemy :wink:

Keep your heads in the sky, but your feet on the ground and best of luck to everyone!


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Knowledge is the best gift; it's fun to obtain, free to give, and priceless to receive.


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: space walk]
    #21776303 - 06/07/15 09:54 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Yeah I personally vape max VG anyway for the vapor. The only PG in my juice comes from the flavoring used, they are based in PG.. as most food based flavorings are.


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: Psychonautica]
    #21776308 - 06/07/15 09:55 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Psychonautica said:
Technically industrial hemp has thc still. It's just like .05 percent.




Yeah but it's some weird thing, it's such a low amount it's basically impossible to get high from.


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OfflineEnjoywho
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Re: I really don't know how people quit cigs. [Re: kr0nik0]
    #21776333 - 06/07/15 10:05 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

kr0nik0 said:
Just chiming in for ecigs as well.

Only thing after 12 years, pack+ a day that made me quit. Effortlessly at that.
Going on 3 months now without a cigarette and haven't had an urge for one.

The new subbox kit you posted seems like the perfect starter kit (until next week when a whole new line of mods and tanks come out lol). It's what I would get as well if I just wanted to start vaping tomorrow using a quality product.




I think I'm going to buy one of those nice vape pens. I'm sick of waking up and I literally cough out all the tar and gunk. I like smoking for a lot of reasons. But that shit sucks i'm freaking 24 I should not be weezy until I cough all the gunk out.


--------------------
"I don't give nothin' to nobody, I just pay the cost to do business." - Riley "Young Reezy"-Boondocks

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

"In the days of kings and queens I was a jester."

"And then the great lord created bears... too many bears... shoulda really dialed back on the bears." Squidbillies

"Can you start speaking words instead of your damn filthy lies!"- Louise "Bobs Burgers"


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