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Offlinemusiclover420
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What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide
    #21707449 - 05/21/15 06:43 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Article

:facepalm3:

Yeah becouse its way easier to blame a plant then your own parenting...

"The parents of a University of Georgia student who committed suicide earlier this month are now speaking out about it — specifically about an unregulated drug called Kratom they say their son John Eden was addicted to, in an aim to save others from the same tragic fate.

“I had a feeling he was on the ledge, and next thing I know I get a knock on my door from a sheriff,” mom Lauren Eden tells Yahoo Parenting, through tears. He told her that John, who was a 22-year-old junior in the Navy Intelligence program, had shot himself while sitting in his truck on May 3.

In the months leading up to that day, she says, her son had come to her and asked for help with what he called an addiction to the substance, which he had initially turned to for his anxiety. She had looked into rehab programs, “but no one had never heard of Kratom,” she recalls. “And at that point we didn’t know where to turn.”

Lauren, who also has a 25-year-old daughter with her husband John, shared her son’s suicide note during an interview with WSBTV. “‘Mom and Dad, I loved you very much,’” she read. “‘Please know there was nothing you could do. I tried everything. I’ve ruined myself with drugs.”

She said he was referring to an age-old Asian herbal supplement called Kratom, which can be used as either a stimulant or a sedative depending on the dosage, and which is made from the leaves of a tree that’s native to Thailand, Malaysia, and Burma. Though a spike in usage has led to recent bans in just a handful of states, including Tennessee and Indiana, it’s not federally regulated and is easy to purchase online. Bags of Kratom, Lauren says, were found in her son’s apartment.

So how dangerous is it? That depends on whom you talk to. The Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) has placed it on its list of Drugs and Chemicals of Concern (in the same company as bath salts and the cough suppressant DXM). “It means it’s not scheduled but is one we’re aware there’s been issues with,” DEA special agent Joseph Moses tells Yahoo Parenting, noting they’ve had reports of Kratom related psychosis. “It’s more for public awareness.”

When ingested in low doses, typically as a tea or pellets, notes the DEA fact sheet on Kratom, the drug, which can be addictive, can cause increased alertness and physical energy. At higher doses, users experience sedative effects.

In addition, the fact sheet states, “Several cases of psychosis resulting from use of Kratom have been reported, where individuals addicted to Kratom exhibited psychotic symptoms, including hallucinations, delusion, and confusion. Withdrawal effects include symptoms of hostility, aggression, mood swings, runny nose, achy muscles and bones, and jerky movement of the limbs.”

In 2014, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration announced it had seized more than 25,000 pounds of raw Kratom (mitragyna speciosa) from a California warehouse, issuing a warning that the drug can have “pharmacological effects similar to morphine and other opiates.” The seizure, a spokesperson noted, “was taken to safeguard the public from this dangerous product, and FDA will continue to take aggressive enforcement actions against products that are promoted for uses that are unapproved.”

Although she knew her son had begun taking the drug, John’s mother Lauren admits, “I thought it was harmless. He bought it online.” (Indeed, a quick search for purchasing Kratom brings up many options, including a site offering eight different types for prices ranging from $45 to $78 per 4-ounce packet.)

Last year, the family of a Denver man named Guy Garcia, 36, spoke out about the drug after a seizure that killed him, apparently triggered by a Kratom overdose. Garcia’s death certificate, said his mom, listed “apparent acute mitragynine toxicity” as cause of death — a reference to Kratom’s chemical compound, mitragynine. The drug was also blamed (but not confirmed) in the deaths of several others, including a 31-year-old Montana woman and a teenage boy in Florida named Ian Mautner. “He became argumentative; his eyes would roll back in his head. He was delusional at times. He was not the same person,” his mother, Linda Mautner, told CBS Miami last year.

Florida lawmakers are now in the process of attempting to ban the drug in that state, and it’s already illegal Tennessee, Indiana, Vermont, and Wisconsin. But the efforts have ignited a seemingly small but vocal faction of Kratom supporters who say it has important health benefits. They’ve started online petitions, spoken at legislative hearings, and formed coalitions in an effort to keep it legal.

The Botanical Legal Defense, for example — which has a website, albeit with no biographical details about its organizers — is “dedicated to fighting over-reaching government criminalization of nature’s most significant gifts. Chief among these is Mitragyna speciosa (aka Kratom), a natural analgesic, muscle relaxer, anti-inflammatory, and antioxidant.” The herbal supplement, the website explains, has been “widely misrepresented as dangerous and without medical value, when the truth is that is has already been under the scrutiny of the scientific community and has been found to be not only benign, but highly therapeutic.” A series of Reddit threads on the pros and cons of Kratom contain, along with warnings of its potency, first-person accounts of how the drug was beneficial.

Still, John’s parents say they will not back down with their message. “I’m talking about our young people,” Lauren says. “This has to become illegal — or at least something that is only prescribed to someone under a doctor’s care.”

:badmanthisfeels:

:mindblown:

:doublefacepalm:


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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OfflineMistaToast
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420] * 1
    #21707508 - 05/21/15 07:05 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

What about the people that have used Kratom to get off of hard addictive drugs. Or for pain, anxiety, panic attacks, maybe even just recreational fun. People ALWAYS hafta ruin it for others.
AGypsy~


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InvisibleCognitive_Shift
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: MistaToast] * 6
    #21707530 - 05/21/15 07:13 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

"I ruined my life with kratom"  what a fucking pussy.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs


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OfflineKizzle
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420] * 3
    #21707545 - 05/21/15 07:17 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I'm pretty sure it was the hand gun that killed him not the krantom. No quest to ban those of course.


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InvisibleTrichome_Delta9
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: MistaToast]
    #21707558 - 05/21/15 07:21 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

its like we don't have personal responsibility any more. these are adults taking these drugs themselves. the kid who killed himself was probably not only using kratom and a lot can attribute to depression. the society we live in where we "demonize" drugs and pretend people are victims when really people are often taking these drugs willingly. people are the problem not drugs. educate people and maybe the kid wouldn't have beat himself of because he used drugs. im sure no one ever made him feel good enough only because he used drugs and if he cant feel comfortable in his own skin what do you think the end result will be.

we NEED to stop kicking and screaming, pointing fingers at the "bad man"(drugs) take responsibility for our actions like adults and educate.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21707571 - 05/21/15 07:23 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

The truth to why people kill themselves is really complicated, so it's easiest to have an answer and blame it on the drug.  If you have an answer at least your mental narrative of events is complete, instead of always wondering why.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs


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OfflineMinnesnowtaNice
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Kizzle]
    #21707589 - 05/21/15 07:28 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Kizzle said:
I'm pretty sure it was the hand gun that killed him not the krantom. No quest to ban those of course.





Are you serious take away our guns? That's our god given American right! Hell guns never hurt no one, we should have more guns, bigger ones with bigger rounds and no backround checks, probably should make silencers legal aswell and Jesus was from Missouri and had blonde hair and blue eyes


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we are all thought forms in a cloud of synchronistic events.




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InvisibleTrichome_Delta9
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: MinnesnowtaNice]
    #21707620 - 05/21/15 07:36 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

the reason people kill themselves is because they are uncomfortable in their skin.

that's if we are talking about voluntary suicide not accidental.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: MinnesnowtaNice]
    #21707621 - 05/21/15 07:36 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

:rofl2:

Great replies everyone :thumbup:

Glad I am not the only one who is extremely bothered by this article.

I wonder if I could find the parents info to write a "strongly worded letter" :lol:

Seriously, kratom does wonders for my depression and anxiety, I actually just turned a 70~ year old onto kratom as a natural alternative to the xanax he was taking...

I would have to agree that that guy was probably taking other drugs too. Or would have killed himself regardless of the kratom.

This scenario makes sense to me:

Person has depression issues, start staking drugs to help with the depression. Realizes drugs will just make it worse so turns to kratom as an alternative. Starts regularly using kratom to help instead of trying to fix whatever issues are making him depressed in the first place. Takes more and more kratom until he has a tolerance and the depression comes back even worse than before so he kills himself...


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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OfflineKizzle
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: MinnesnowtaNice]
    #21707633 - 05/21/15 07:39 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Of course I don't really want them to ban anything. I just wish some of these people were as adamant about the right to use a plant if it makes you feel better as they are the right to possess the means to murder someone.


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OfflineAsshat331
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Kizzle]
    #21707644 - 05/21/15 07:41 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

man what a fucking  :shitbird:


--------------------
Things change fast, but this too shall pass
Better carve it on your forehead or tattoo it on your ass
Cause who can tell, when the clock strikes twelve
If today’s become tomorrow or if it’s all just gone to hell



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OfflineMinnesnowtaNice
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21707655 - 05/21/15 07:43 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Yea that's about the best way of putting it, but there are many many different reasons people do it, I had a buddy who tried to kill himself when he was young like 13 or 14 by locking himself in his closet and setting it on fire. If you knew today you would have never guessed, I've talked to him about he said he was just depressed and had been diagnosed with clinical depression no other way of putting it, but now a totally positive guy with a good live it's just sad all these kids that off them selves before really getting a chance to work their problems out and talk to someone.


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we are all thought forms in a cloud of synchronistic events.




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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: MinnesnowtaNice]
    #21707695 - 05/21/15 07:53 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

depression is uncomfortable, its something i believe almost everyone is going through. atleast in the world im living in with the people i have in my life and most of the people i meet all seem depressed. most admit it because it so obvious. sometimes i think its just in my life and because of how i am that the people in my life all are depressed but i see other people i don't know and what not and they don't seem depressed but i don't know these people. in my life everyone i know is depressed and always bringing eachother down with negative energy. i just want more positive people in my life.

i try to stay positive but you can hide from the news forever right?

i hope i don't sound too insane.:zomgteehee:


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OfflineMinnesnowtaNice
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21707724 - 05/21/15 08:00 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Nothing insane about that at all lol you should try and find some new friends, I mean everybody is depressed, but people who are down all the time go nowhere, of course my friends are not happy go lucky cheeky fucks either so you gotta find that happy medium


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we are all thought forms in a cloud of synchronistic events.




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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21707737 - 05/21/15 08:03 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

You don't insane at all, at least not to me.

I too know tons of negative people constantly projecting that shit onto people around them, I actually just had a falling out with a friend over that.

Said friend was basically going off about how selfish everyone is, and I got fed up with him just being negative and judgmental so I tried to say how that is a lame judgement. And how even if "everyone" is selfish that's all the more reason to be positive and work on yourself, which he then was offended by me not just agreeing with him and started getting aggro. Said I was "annoying" after he started raging about it :lol: needless to say I have not been hanging out with him since then.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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InvisibleStargate
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21707745 - 05/21/15 08:04 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

On the bright side, at least he had a gun. I know what being depressed and suicidal is like. Realistically, a gun is the most humane way to commit suicide. It would be a lot faster and less painful than many other methods.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Stargate]
    #21707767 - 05/21/15 08:10 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

To me depression is a feeling like there's no possible way to be happy no matter what you do.  Luckily my depression comes and goes and I'm a real drug addict.  Never been suicidal before though, that's like a whole new level of hating yourself.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Stargate]
    #21707771 - 05/21/15 08:10 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I would say that is a sad thing man.

I have been suicidal before in the past and if I had access to a gun I might be dead right now, maybe if he had not had a gun he would be alive :shrug:


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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OfflineFreeTheSoul
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Stargate]
    #21708122 - 05/21/15 09:23 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I know people who are addicted to kratom, it saved there life.
Quote:

Stargate said:
On the bright side, at least he had a gun. I know what being depressed and suicidal is like. Realistically, a gun is the most humane way to commit suicide. It would be a lot faster and less painful than many other methods.



As morbid as that sounds you are absolutely right. I know people including myself who have tryed committing suicide multiple times and it has done damage to them/me.


RIP John Eden.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: FreeTheSoul]
    #21708156 - 05/21/15 09:30 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Think about it though, if you had a gun you/ those friends would probably be dead. Isn't that worse than some botched attempts?

Seems like to matter how gruesome and painful actually dying or losing friends/family would be worse in the end.

Also are those addicted people former opiate addicts? That seems to be a trend and I think there is something there. My theory is people who have used harder drugs need to take more and also have the addictions burned into their brains, so when exposed to a new fix it takes hold quickly.

Where as other people use it for months to years with only mild to not even noticeably withdrawals.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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OfflineAsshat331
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420]
    #21708213 - 05/21/15 09:39 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

musiclover420 said:
Think about it though, if you had a gun you/ those friends would probably be dead. Isn't that worse than some botched attempts?

Seems like to matter how gruesome and painful actually dying or losing friends/family would be worse in the end.

Also are those addicted people former opiate addicts? That seems to be a trend and I think there is something there. My theory is people who have used harder drugs need to take more and also have the addictions burned into their brains, so when exposed to a new fix it takes hold quickly.

Where as other people use it for months to years with only mild to not even noticeably withdrawals.




I used kratom to get off a light opiate addiction 2-4 hydrocodone a day for 3 years. And after my withdraws went away i did get "hooked" on kratom and took it everyday for a couple months until 5 grams no longer got me high. now i take a 3-7 day tolerance break whenever im not getting a full buzz off 5 or less grams and i have never once felt a withdraw from kratom other than the want to take like marijuana addiction and even then its more subtle i can't stand pot tolerance breaks i get so bored.


--------------------
Things change fast, but this too shall pass
Better carve it on your forehead or tattoo it on your ass
Cause who can tell, when the clock strikes twelve
If today’s become tomorrow or if it’s all just gone to hell



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OfflineFreeTheSoul
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Asshat331]
    #21708220 - 05/21/15 09:40 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Ive quit kratom a few times, the withdrawals can either be complete HELL for me or a walk in the park. It doesn't even matter how much I was taking each day, its like a coin toss up. Yes I am glad im still here to this day and am glad I had life lessons that didn't end up killing me. If I were to have turned into a vegetable I wouldn't want to be alive though that's what I was thinking when I made the last post.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Asshat331]
    #21708265 - 05/21/15 09:47 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Yeah see it like takes the place of the former addiction, making its own "addiction/ withdrawals" much much worse.

Makes complete sense.

I too like to compare it to cannabis, as it is almost all mental for me addiction wise but I can notice some physical effects if I am really abusing it.

For example trouble sleeping, lack of appetite, some moodiness though generally this is pretty short, definite boredom and desire to use it like you said.

I struggle with pot tolerance breaks myself, I generally feel good when I get myself down to several bowls a day and no joints/bongs and extracts...
:lol:

That's weird it is random for you FTS, I wonder if its some brain chemistry thing that causes that or what.

Ahhh, I was not thinking o the vegetable thing, great point! That is basically dead as far as we know especially if they never wake up.

It probably really depends on if you brain is active or not becouse I have heard stories of vegetables who remember being in a "coma"


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420]
    #21708366 - 05/21/15 10:30 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I would imagine kratom maintenance to be a healthier alternative to methadone or suboxone. 

Are there any long term studies on kratom use?


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #21708390 - 05/21/15 10:38 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Look it up man, there is research being done on it around the globe, but especially in asia where it is native.

This article has a nice selection of research at the bottom: Kratom Medical Research


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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InvisibleStargate
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420]
    #21708694 - 05/22/15 12:08 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

After I had heart surgery a few years ago, my heart stopped at the dinner table just a week afterwards. My blood stopped, my breathing stopped, and I came out of my body. We had a medical professional over that claimed me dead. Being out there was the purest bliss I had ever felt. If I was dead, I believe I would be happier. Looking back, I would rather have stayed dead.

Don't worry, I can't do it now. I have a wife and kid to take care of now. I won't let them down.


--------------------
From before I started growing gourmet mushrooms:


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: MinnesnowtaNice]
    #21708875 - 05/22/15 01:23 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

MinnesnowtaNice said:
Quote:

Kizzle said:
I'm pretty sure it was the hand gun that killed him not the krantom. No quest to ban those of course.





Are you serious take away our guns? That's our god given American right! Hell guns never hurt no one, we should have more guns, bigger ones with bigger rounds and no backround checks, probably should make silencers legal aswell and Jesus was from Missouri and had blonde hair and blue eyes




"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass." - Isoroku Yamamoto

As passionate as all the soccer moms seem, to remove gun rights would bring a host of consequences that would shed light on not only how innocent kratom is, but how deadly lack of responsibilty is as well.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Cognitive_Shift] * 1
    #21708928 - 05/22/15 01:52 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Cognitive_Shift said:
"I ruined my life with kratom"  what a fucking pussy.




Quote:

MinnesnowtaNice said:
Quote:

Kizzle said:
I'm pretty sure it was the hand gun that killed him not the krantom. No quest to ban those of course.






:thumbup:


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InvisibleTrichome_Delta9
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: MinnesnowtaNice]
    #21709342 - 05/22/15 06:50 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

MinnesnowtaNice said:
Nothing insane about that at all lol you should try and find some new friends, I mean everybody is depressed, but people who are down all the time go nowhere, of course my friends are not happy go lucky cheeky fucks either so you gotta find that happy medium





i can tell that is very true that negative people go nowhere. i am negative by association. my life in a spiral right now but im holding on to my dignity and pride as much as i can. i have an aunt who is VERY depressed, i live with her, and she hasn't gotten anywhere in life so she constantly looks at the bad in life and always has this negative undertone. seems like she tries to bring me down she will randomly come in to "talk" when all she does is passive aggressively insult me and treats me like a jinx and gives me an unwanted feeling of pity. this makes me resent my aunt and i feel bad for her but she has made my cousin into such a negative person he has no hopes and dreams and thinks he could never be anything other than a factory worker. i literally watched this kid give up his dreams and he has been conditioned to believe he cant be what he wants because im sure his moms energy. or atleast that's how it seems.

i WAS a very positive person at one point in life but things changed and now i feel stuck and like i cant get away from negative energies. i feel like this will make it so i cant achieve my goals.

example, i would wake up ready to go out meet people look for a new job and my aunt would be like "yeah its hard to get a job especially since you didn't graduate" but she does it so passive aggressively that you cant really call her a bitch or even mention that what she said was disrespectful and unnecessary.

and i know what she is saying is true but she does this in routine this negative feedback all the time shit.

but for now im stuck here with these negative energies because i don't really have much of anything in life.

again hope i make a lil sense


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OfflineConnoisseur

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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420]
    #21709388 - 05/22/15 07:21 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Oh my god this is one of my fears unfolding right before my eyes, first some kid kills himself because hes smoking too much salvia now someone does because of kratom?!

This is fucked, the government is going to have a field day over this!


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21709509 - 05/22/15 08:09 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I hear you.  I always get that in terms of money.  Like for example, a few years back I happened to find a snake that's pretty rare to find.  I came in to show my uncle and without batting an eye he asked "well how much is it worth?".. :facepalm:

Everything's always money money money,...it's like they're not even seeing what they're looking at because big las vegas style dollar signs are lit up in their eyes blinding them.  That shit does not fly, in a creative environment..


--------------------
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Amanita86]
    #21709566 - 05/22/15 08:34 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

i understand that money is important in these complex times we all live in but i agree it has gotten to a power hungry greedy point that is quite sad and causes many problems in a "free" society.

i am not TOO worried about money i don't have this overwhelming need to be powerful and rich i only wish to survive.

its hard to survive around such negative energy its hard to get anywhere when you know someone is just going to talk you out of being positive for their own sick joy.

its the misery loves company deal i live in and i could literally be happy making jokes and my cousin sees this and turns into an ass and tries to bring me down and once im down he acts all happy.


sometimes i think im going to snap... i want out of here so bad. i make plans to go out and get away from these people but then i get so low by the way they talk and the things they say.

they DWELL on the negative like i m now but they NEVER actually put positive energy in the world.

my cousin constantly acts like hes the only one in the world and has really made himself seem to have a god complex or something.

he has told me he don't think he can die once and it didn't come off jokey.

he thinks Dennis from always sunny is an alright guy but he symbolizes narcissist and god complex and many other very unlikeable characteristics.

i guess im just venting about him but really the kid brings me down. i only ever tried to expand his options in life but he ALWAYS doubts anything fun or good can happen. hes always the party pooper and i moved in with him thinking he was different from when we were younger now im stuck and its rough i am sick right now with an ear infection so i haven't even been able to look for a job.

i just want to add.. he was a virgin until very recently because he was always shallow and cared too much about what others thought or just didn't do anything that could bring an attack to his ego. well he dated a fat girl recently and he was in COMPLETE denial that she was a big girl. i don't have anything against big girls i have been with one before personally not for me though.. anyways we got into a fight one time and i called him out on it and he got very upset since then he has become even more detached from me which is alright but there is a CONSTANT tension in the house i live in and he is also a mommies boy

i just wanted to vent a bit sorry it ended up being in this thread but yeah any one know how to deal with people like this?

i do my best and positivity always trumps negativity making them look like asses but that's how the tension has been built.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9] * 1
    #21709630 - 05/22/15 08:56 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

The best way I've found is "you be you", in one ear and out the other.  Don't engage.  Focus on you and where you need to be, and keep your eyes on the horizon.  It'll be a lesson you take with you for the entirety of your life.


--------------------
:mushroom2:Orange clock, pencil:bouncysmoke:
"They threw me off the hay truck about noon...":fishing:
:mushroom2:*Mark 15:34:levitate::mushroom2::blueninja:
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Amanita86]
    #21709714 - 05/22/15 09:13 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

thank you i am planning on getting out of the house more soon. getting away from them even if i am alone just being honest its better than being with them.

im not that much of a loner i like my alone time but i also like to socialize and talk with others yknow


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21709822 - 05/22/15 09:41 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Trichome_Delta9 said:
depression is uncomfortable, its something i believe almost everyone is going through. atleast in the world im living in with the people i have in my life and most of the people i meet all seem depressed. most admit it because it so obvious. sometimes i think its just in my life and because of how i am that the people in my life all are depressed but i see other people i don't know and what not and they don't seem depressed but i don't know these people. in my life everyone i know is depressed and always bringing eachother down with negative energy. i just want more positive people in my life.

i try to stay positive but you can hide from the news forever right?

i hope i don't sound too insane.:zomgteehee:



I'm glad you said that.

I was in a much more rural area than I usually am the other week. It was really weirding me out just how genuinely nice and happy everybody there was.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #21710017 - 05/22/15 10:42 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

It doesn't really matter if he was on other drugs or not, because meth heroin xanax and even antidepressants don't make you kill yourself. I have used kratom a lot and I used it to kick a heroin habit, the withdrawals were brutal but I would make myself a smoothie of kratom and as long as I didn't vomit the whole thing up, would get near complete relief of my physical symptoms for 4-6 hours. This allowed me to keep my job, which was a big reason I had not quit sooner. I have withdrawn from opiates way too many times, and I do not believe drugs "make" you suicidal, but there was a pronounced depression that came on quickly like 12 hours after my last dose and faded along with my physical symptoms.

Maybe this poor dude just believed all the crazy shit people say about never being able to be happy again once you "ruin your brain chemistry" with drugs, and he tried to quit kratom and had withdrawal symptoms, and thought that was his life from then on, that it would never end. Kratom is effective enough to relieve heroin withdrawals, so I think long term high doses of kratom would have similar withdrawals as other opiates. I used to believe some crazy shit about drugs before I understood them.

As far as banning it, we don't ban people from breaking up and I get depressed as hell when I get dumped. We just accept that it's a feeling everyone goes through and expect people to, at the very least, survive the experience. We feel bad when they don't but attribute it to ... "they weren't well adjusted" obviously this kid wasn't. Hell, I'm not.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: OrgasmicBanana]
    #21710208 - 05/22/15 11:44 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I like how they don't point out how he was depressed and had severe anxiety problems BEFORE Kratom. Like........that isn't a big deal, or something? Yeah, it was totally the kratom and not the fact he was a ship wreck before the drug.............


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Uzziel]
    #21710262 - 05/22/15 12:02 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

it's not unheard of for parents to drug test their kids when they're living at home at 18 or bad relationships

guess everyone has to get use to the effort of using a knife/drinking beer :lol:


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Kizzle] * 1
    #21710942 - 05/22/15 03:13 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Kizzle said:
I'm pretty sure it was the hand gun that killed him not the krantom. No quest to ban those of course.




The handgun killed him as much as keyboards make typos.

He killed him.  It is utterly ridiculous to ban kratom.


--------------------
Delicious Pizza


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InvisibleAdden
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Society]
    #21711626 - 05/22/15 06:22 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Suicidal people will be suicidal.

I've not read one report like this. Eyes rolling into the back of his head? He may have been using it for a heroin and/or benzo taper to get better and just had enough. Or hell, a ton of other behavioral or familial personal issues not mentioned in the article.

Blaming this solely on Kratom is absolutely ridiculous. Unless some new study has come out that I'm unaware of I just don't know what to say. And shame on the writer for saying it's addictive, go ban caffeine or beer.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Adden]
    #21711638 - 05/22/15 06:26 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

kratom can cause depressed/low feeling a day or so after use i know from experience. i believe all drugs do that really. don't take drugs for depression its not a crutch its a damn wheel chair.

im a hypocrite btw.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21711664 - 05/22/15 06:35 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

As I said earlier in this thread that is why I don't think people should take Kratom as "a drug".

I take it daily sometimes but not to get fucked up or catch a buzz, it helps me relax and be more productive on top of making me not feel the need to smoke as much.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420]
    #21711682 - 05/22/15 06:41 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

i did kratom for a week or two straight once and it was only to get a buzz and be paralyzed.

near the end of it all i got bad hiccups from kratom and smoking weed also experienced numbness in my limbs.

also i feel like kratom enhances weed ALOT like if you have a tolerance to weed and your looking for that good high again take kratom then smoke that gets me there.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21712142 - 05/22/15 09:01 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

To the OP comment on the parents being bad did you read the story? The kid loved his parents and the parents his child. He wanted help with addiction they tried to get, but couldn't find due to lack of information thanks to the censorship of the drug war. In the end he sadly choose to end himself leaving a note that he loved his parents and it was his fault getting addicted to the drug that led to it? Seriously situations as fucked up as your comment.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: tacodude]
    #21712228 - 05/22/15 09:34 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I did read that part but that doesn't mean there wasn't tension that could have played a role.

If I offed myself I certainly wouldn't leave a not blaming it on my family, even if I felt they played a role in my depression...

Clearly there was a reason he was depressed in the first place and became addicted to drugs due to some issues he was having.

I don't see how my comment is fucked up at all, generally with articles like this there is almost always more to the story...


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420]
    #21712241 - 05/22/15 09:40 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

We have no idea what that kids situation was or his life experiences were to judge him on why he committed suicide.  I'm sure there were a hell of a lot more factors then just kratom.  There is rarely a single factor for why people decide to take out that snub nosed .38 they've been hiding in their closet and finally have the courage to get the monkey off their back.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #21713176 - 05/23/15 06:36 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

This is such poor journalism. Reminds me of the articles you see about the dangers of "flakka" "spice" or "bath salts". I can't believe this bullshit passes for news. Hopefully enough people are smart enough to see past the lies that kratom doesn't get banned but who knows at this point.


--------------------


Connoisseur said:
oh ive cried on drugs

sunshine said:
Tragic.  I told the cop not to do it but he didn't listen.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #21713316 - 05/23/15 07:39 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Cognitive_Shift said:
"I ruined my life with kratom"  what a fucking pussy.




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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: hex_enduction]
    #21713544 - 05/23/15 09:21 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

hex_enduction said:
Hopefully enough people are smart enough to see past the lies



Sometimes that right there has me worried when I stop and take a look around..


--------------------
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"They threw me off the hay truck about noon...":fishing:
:mushroom2:*Mark 15:34:levitate::mushroom2::blueninja:
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Amanita86] * 1
    #21713596 - 05/23/15 09:44 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I mean, I love my parents and they love me. Doesn't mean they didn't almost completely ruin my life with their absolutely asinine parenting


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #21713672 - 05/23/15 10:13 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

rbalzer said:
I mean, I love my parents and they love me. Doesn't mean they didn't almost completely ruin my life with their absolutely asinine parenting



Dead on!

its the generations before us started to get more careless about their children and started to think only of themselves. just being honest....


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21713842 - 05/23/15 11:23 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Well now everyone, I have some good news.  I just got an e-mail from my father with this very article attached to it, asking me if I knew what this was..

Propaganda's dropping a hell of a bomb on ole' Mitragyna speciosa.


--------------------
:mushroom2:Orange clock, pencil:bouncysmoke:
"They threw me off the hay truck about noon...":fishing:
:mushroom2:*Mark 15:34:levitate::mushroom2::blueninja:
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Amanita86]
    #21714226 - 05/23/15 01:32 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

:facepalm3:

I was worried this shit would start getting worse.

Watch them keep pumping :glittershitz: out for awhile then try to pass more bans :sad:


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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Offlinehex_enduction
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420]
    #21714325 - 05/23/15 02:07 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Oh well, I suppose this kind of reaction is inevitable with how popular kratom is getting lately and considering the historical patterns of new drugs' integration into our society. I would just hate to see kratom undergo the same bullshit cycle of prohibition and eventual acceptance as marijuana.


--------------------


Connoisseur said:
oh ive cried on drugs

sunshine said:
Tragic.  I told the cop not to do it but he didn't listen.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Amanita86]
    #21714379 - 05/23/15 02:27 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Amanita86 said:
Well now everyone, I have some good news.  I just got an e-mail from my father with this very article attached to it, asking me if I knew what this was..

Propaganda's dropping a hell of a bomb on ole' Mitragyna speciosa.



yeah I've been seeing tons of these bogus kratom articles in the past six months


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Offlinehex_enduction
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #21714594 - 05/23/15 03:39 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Looks like Kraik Madness is in full swing. I'll start really worrying when states start actually passing legislation; I'm honestly surprised it's taking so long.


--------------------


Connoisseur said:
oh ive cried on drugs

sunshine said:
Tragic.  I told the cop not to do it but he didn't listen.


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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: hex_enduction]
    #21714635 - 05/23/15 03:48 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

There's already four that have banned it if I read right, and others trying as we speak.


--------------------
:mushroom2:Orange clock, pencil:bouncysmoke:
"They threw me off the hay truck about noon...":fishing:
:mushroom2:*Mark 15:34:levitate::mushroom2::blueninja:
Gam zeh ya’avor...:sunny:


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InvisibleTrichome_Delta9
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Amanita86]
    #21714639 - 05/23/15 03:50 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

is texas or Michigan trying to ban it do you know? im stockin up on that shit for sure.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Amanita86]
    #21714640 - 05/23/15 03:51 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

:badmanthisfeels:


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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InvisibleAmanita86
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21714749 - 05/23/15 04:18 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Trichome_Delta9 said:
is texas or Michigan trying to ban it do you know? im stockin up on that shit for sure.



I'm not sure.  I want to say Florida, and somewhere up on the northeast like New Jersey or somewhere around there.  I see petitions around but cant recall 100% right now.  You might try a 'kratom petition' search and see what you come up with.


--------------------
:mushroom2:Orange clock, pencil:bouncysmoke:
"They threw me off the hay truck about noon...":fishing:
:mushroom2:*Mark 15:34:levitate::mushroom2::blueninja:
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Amanita86]
    #21714876 - 05/23/15 05:01 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I prefer kratoms sedative affect. the stimulant dose is to subtle.


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Posts: 19,563
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Trichome_Delta9]
    #21714966 - 05/23/15 05:26 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I have gotten pretty damn stimulated from it before :tongue2:

One time I took 2 caps of a extract bought from a local headshop and I went home and did like 300 pushups throughout the night.

I don't work out too much so that is quite a bit for me.

I honestly have never been too sedated from it, I get relaxed but have never been couch locked from it like cannabis does to me sometimes.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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InvisibleAmanita86
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Registered: 09/26/12
Posts: 89,464
Loc: hades
Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420]
    #21714971 - 05/23/15 05:28 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Ive gotten nods from that red vein strain.  Usually right before I hurl and then feel most excellent..


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:mushroom2:Orange clock, pencil:bouncysmoke:
"They threw me off the hay truck about noon...":fishing:
:mushroom2:*Mark 15:34:levitate::mushroom2::blueninja:
Gam zeh ya’avor...:sunny:


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Offlinehex_enduction
satta massa gana
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Registered: 01/26/14
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: Amanita86]
    #21715189 - 05/23/15 06:47 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I don't believe florida has a ban in the works, and if it does then I'm fucked as I've been eating tons of kratom lately and would hate to have my supply cut off.


--------------------


Connoisseur said:
oh ive cried on drugs

sunshine said:
Tragic.  I told the cop not to do it but he didn't listen.


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InvisibleAmanita86
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Registered: 09/26/12
Posts: 89,464
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Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: hex_enduction]
    #21715222 - 05/23/15 07:00 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Maybe its come up and didnt go through.. Like I said I just see these petitions pop up from time to time.  I havnt done much digging in the past to verify etc.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/20896295#20896295


--------------------
:mushroom2:Orange clock, pencil:bouncysmoke:
"They threw me off the hay truck about noon...":fishing:
:mushroom2:*Mark 15:34:levitate::mushroom2::blueninja:
Gam zeh ya’avor...:sunny:


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InvisibleTrichome_Delta9
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Registered: 12/30/14
Posts: 1,969
Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420]
    #21715480 - 05/23/15 08:12 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

musiclover420 said:
I have gotten pretty damn stimulated from it before :tongue2:

One time I took 2 caps of a extract bought from a local headshop and I went home and did like 300 pushups throughout the night.

I don't work out too much so that is quite a bit for me.

I honestly have never been too sedated from it, I get relaxed but have never been couch locked from it like cannabis does to me sometimes.





I take 7-14 gs of kratom for the sedative affect.

I would lay down paralyzed but not really being tired just NO motivation to move at all.


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Offlinetacodude
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Registered: 07/20/10
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Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
Re: What's Kratom? Parents Claim the Drug Drove Son to Suicide [Re: musiclover420]
    #21715531 - 05/23/15 08:28 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

musiclover420 said:
I did read that part but that doesn't mean there wasn't tension that could have played a role.

If I offed myself I certainly wouldn't leave a not blaming it on my family, even if I felt they played a role in my depression...

Clearly there was a reason he was depressed in the first place and became addicted to drugs due to some issues he was having.

I don't see how my comment is fucked up at all, generally with articles like this there is almost always more to the story...



You obviously haven't ever tried killing yourself angry and frustrated with a toxic relation with your parents whether or not their was intent to harm you as in the end that's all that mattered with the degree it's fucked your life up. That's all I really have to say.


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