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Sun King



Registered: 02/15/14
Posts: 4,069
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Quote:
Cognitive_Shift said: actual oil spills.
What is an actual oil spill?
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Cognitive_Shift
CS actual




Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 29,591
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Re: Santa Barbara oil spill [Re: Sun King]
#21717175 - 05/24/15 11:19 AM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Exxon Valdez spilled 11-38 million gallons of oil into the ocean in 1989. I consider that a real oil spill. What happened in Santa Barbara is stupid as fuck and shouldn't happen, but with little bit of time removed from the event to get away from knee jerk reactions you'll realize it's TINY. So small I'd consider it an accident not an oil spill.
The BP oil spill in the U.S. Gulf, about 210,000,000 gallons were spilled.
-------------------- L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs
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ballsalsa
Universally Loathed and Reviled



Registered: 03/11/15
Posts: 20,871
Loc: Foreign Lands
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remember how much BP was trying to downplay it for the first 2 weeks?
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Cognitive_Shift
CS actual




Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 29,591
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Re: Santa Barbara oil spill [Re: ballsalsa]
#21717248 - 05/24/15 11:45 AM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
ballsalsa said: remember how much BP was trying to downplay it for the first 2 weeks?
Yeah this isn't the same thing my friend.
-------------------- L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs
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Sun King



Registered: 02/15/14
Posts: 4,069
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They already shutdown the pipeline that caused the in-actual spill. The BP spill went on for a long time.
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Kurt
Thinker, blinker, writer, typer.

Registered: 11/26/14
Posts: 1,688
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Re: Santa Barbara oil spill [Re: ballsalsa]
#21717292 - 05/24/15 12:03 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Again cognitive shift, reaction is pretty warranted if you are close enough to have seen this, and such a reaction is inspired by, and speaks to actual, factual events.
On the other hand, a reaction (dialogue) about what should and should not be heard in the media - in other words, a reaction in regards to ideas, and how they should or shouldn't be represented - this is really what shows a "knee jerk" reaction.
You can open up the paper and see things you don't care about you know. Yes news can be slanted, or indifferent to some things which are important. But just the same, news is intended to present things people would not otherwise know or care about, to their possible concern.
Anyway your way of engaging in the dialogue you think should not exist, for whatever reason, towards quietism, or towards deflating the impression of what has occured, sounds alot like the statements of oil companies, even if you may have different reasons to say what you do. What are your reasons of concern here, other than your general astuteness to political events?
In short and frankness, this is an actual event, and only a reactive response would say otherwise. Maybe you could clarify what you are saying.
Edited by Kurt (05/24/15 12:14 PM)
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Kurt
Thinker, blinker, writer, typer.

Registered: 11/26/14
Posts: 1,688
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Quote:
Cognitive_Shift said:
Quote:
ballsalsa said: remember how much BP was trying to downplay it for the first 2 weeks?
Yeah this isn't the same thing my friend.
The general response in human affairs is the same. "We are sorry" and will hope and wait for this to blow over. Like you say, it will.
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johnm214


Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 17,582
Loc: Americas
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Re: Santa Barbara oil spill [Re: Kurt]
#21717311 - 05/24/15 12:12 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kurt said: I am not sure what you are saying John. I have lived and worked here on the land for a few years, and love it. That of course doesn't exclude the land's biodiversity or ecosystems, or namely what it is.
I'm saying that I think you are being quite accurate when you identify the issue as one of personal, human, distress rather than some ecological problem.
All this concern about the environment for its own sake seems dishonest to me. Who cares if the western titmouse goes extinct? Who cares if oil covers the beaches? We do, obviously, because it looks nasty and makes it harder to catch yummy fish, and so forth, but lets not pretend there's some overarching "way its supposed to be" that we are defending.
I just find many environmentalists proclaimed defense of some natural order to be bullshit. People don't want the environment trashed for personal reasons, all this talk of defense of nature is just bullshit to cast their selfish motives in a better light and hide their motives from themselves. i.e. the animals living make us feel better but have no clear ecological significance- if they die some new equilibrium with new species will form in the future and any preference between these two points is entirely anthropocentric
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Kurt
Thinker, blinker, writer, typer.

Registered: 11/26/14
Posts: 1,688
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Re: Santa Barbara oil spill [Re: johnm214]
#21717323 - 05/24/15 12:19 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Maybe you misunderstand when I said that I think nature is best found for personally ascribed reasons. You would see that is exactly what I said if you read close to my response to you.
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story


Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Re: Santa Barbara oil spill [Re: Kurt]
#21717445 - 05/24/15 01:01 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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The "bottom line" is that once the ocean(s) are fucked, WE meaning all species, are fucked. Plankton not only feeds the oceans, but provides much of the oxygen we rely on as land creatures, for just one example. I'm not sure why anyone would defend a company that has not properly maintained their pipeline as in this case, and it failed. This in particular is a company cited many times over many years for spills. A bad of the bad offender. Why are we defending their "right" to pollute? They should face criminal charges at some point for poisoning the environment due to their negligence.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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falcon



Registered: 04/01/02
Posts: 8,005
Last seen: 1 day, 1 hour
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Re: Santa Barbara oil spill [Re: johnm214]
#21717517 - 05/24/15 01:31 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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I agree, it's anthropocentric, the loss of the diversity can be a risk for humans in local habitats and humans as a whole, if the total biomass is decreased by the loss of diversity. A new equilibrium may decrease the human population carrying capacity of environment, through mineralization of land leading to desertification.
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Kurt
Thinker, blinker, writer, typer.

Registered: 11/26/14
Posts: 1,688
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Re: Santa Barbara oil spill [Re: falcon]
#21718183 - 05/24/15 05:00 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Plains All American is among the worst violators listed by the U.S. Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Administration.
It surpassed all but four of more than 1,700 operators in safety and maintenance infractions, the federal agency said.
Hodgins suggested the comparison wasn't fair because "we're also much larger than those companies that we were compared to."
"Most of the companies that we're compared to have half the amount of pipelines" that Plains All American has, Hodgins said Friday. "So therefore, with double the number of miles of pipelines, unfortunately incidents have occurred, (and) the larger and the more of those can be realized."
If something is clearly indefensible, something to "deeply regret" (on and on) is in other consideration it is a statistic, and standard, an economy of such incidents being rationalized, what does this say?
The obvious, that a real statement is being made according to this generally privatized industry, which is either not being regulated enough, or is not being held responsible for its actions (including unintended consequences).
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ballsalsa
Universally Loathed and Reviled



Registered: 03/11/15
Posts: 20,871
Loc: Foreign Lands
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Re: Santa Barbara oil spill [Re: ballsalsa]
#21722797 - 05/25/15 09:44 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
ballsalsa said:
Quote:
Cognitive_Shift said: This isn't Kuwait folks, just a little media sensationalism.
fuck yourself. you live on the california coast? probably not. drill baby drill right? fuck that. there plenty of untapped oil and gas ON LAND where spills can at least be somewhat contained.
Quote:
Dude, the estimated 105,000 gallons of oil, 21,000 gallons along the beach.
yeah, these initial estimates are usually accurate and never understate the damage...refugio state beach closed till past labor day...what about the businesses in the area that rely on summer beachgoers to make their livings? This whole thing sucks so many bowls of dicks. The Southern California coastline is one of the last decent fisheries left in the damn world. Anyone who says that this will have no effect on fishing is a fool. the kelp forests are the flagship ecosystem around here, and kelp can't anchor to fucking oil. No Kelp Forest=no habitat for numerous species like Calico bass, kelp wrasse, etc. the marine ecosystem is already strained by unusually warm water around here, and now this... and the oil assholes are just gonna shrug and say sorry? fuck that. I just can't even express how pissed i am about this. throw the book at these dick-whacks. "oh, i'm so sorry i fucked up your state for decades to come"
 
Member banned for this post.
Don't call people names.
-johnm214
who did i call a name in this post john?
the oil assholes? the dick-whacks responsible? the fools who think it won't affect fishing?
certainly not anyone on this site, so why the ban? did you misunderstand my post?
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johnm214


Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 17,582
Loc: Americas
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Re: Santa Barbara oil spill [Re: Kurt]
#21722973 - 05/25/15 10:43 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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I don't know. I'll delete the infraction. FYI, telling people to fuck themselves is risky as well.
Quote:
Kurt said: Maybe you misunderstand when I said that I think nature is best found for personally ascribed reasons. You would see that is exactly what I said if you read close to my response to you.
No, I was agreeing w/ you. I understood your post and agree that it was an honest way to look at the situation and favor a clean environment without, imo, dishonest appeals to some pristine naturalism where endangered parasites are preserved for no other reason than that they once existed.
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story


Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Re: Santa Barbara oil spill [Re: johnm214]
#21725863 - 05/26/15 06:15 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Yeah, in fact let's do away with all parasites. We don't need them!
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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