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InvisibleTheFriedFrog
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Registered: 03/20/14
Posts: 10
How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows?
    #21697048 - 05/19/15 03:08 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I've been lurking on this message board for quite some time now, and one thing I've noticed is how literally everything I've ever done has always been at least 2x if not 3x as slow as other people's grows. Now I know what you are going to tell me; it's genetics, temperature, humidity, FAE, gas exchange, but believe me, I've tried almost everything.

It's not genetics because I've used multispore for every inoculation which means I'm rolling the dice again for every jar, could the odds be that much against me? Highly unlikely.

It's not temperature because I've been experimenting at different room temperatures and with/without incubator, with pretty much identical results. (both colonization and fruiting)

It's not gas exchange because I've experimented with different sized holes in the jar lids, again, identical results.

It's not FAE because I've been fanning in different ways with the same shitty results every time.

Humidity I have not been able to vary as I'm using perlite in a sg fc, but I would say it's on average at about 96-98% RH.

Substrate is the standard recipe 2:1:1 verm:brf:water. I've also experimented with different moisture contents and vermiculite grain sizes. And no, I'm not packing my substrate too tight.

My results are, pretty much always:

-Time from inoculation to birth: 7-8 weeks
-Then they spend usually 1-2 weeks in the FC and one or two shitty pins show up.
-The pins take at least a week to mature.
-Harvest per 1/2 pint is usually 2 shitty dry grams at most
-Second, third flushes produce next to nothing.

I started doing wbs to see if that went better - inoculated 6 quart jars about 3 weeks ago, they are now at about 15-20% colonization :mad:

What the hell is going on here? I've been pursuing this hobby for more than a year now and I just can't figure it out.


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InvisibleMad Season
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: TheFriedFrog]
    #21697059 - 05/19/15 03:20 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Awe bro! Seriously I've started up (against my will) 4 times now lol. 4th times the charm!

I've never done the pftek simply because I was always near horses so I just wanted to do manure right from the start. However I have had experience with bird seed, it's a quite starchy sticky clumpy mess that seems to attract bacteria or is filled with endospores. If you can rinse them well, dry them fairly well(just no standing water in the jar) and can pressure cook them for 2 hours it should be golden. At 20% if you shake the jars up, they'll be 100% in like a week.

I personally feel whole oats is a lot more fool proof with 0 clumping, no rinsing, and I would highly recommend you look into getting them.

As for the fruiting issue can we see pics of the setup and what your mist/fan schedule is? How often does the vent turn on? Do you have a fan running?


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Edited by Mad Season (05/19/15 03:27 AM)


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Invisibleplurfekt
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Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 1,919
Loc: USA
Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: TheFriedFrog]
    #21697060 - 05/19/15 03:23 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I've had both great success, and epic failures.  For the most part success though, lately just sucks.

Somewhere along the process something is going wrong.  Trial and error is how we all find our methods, some faster than others.

Multispore can often produce "duds" or yield jack-all, I've had it happen 5-6 times in a row with Hawaiians only to take prints from them, and then get huge flushes next time around.

My problem lately has been with the air (imagine that..) where I live is old and I believe there to be a high mold content, because I get contamination easy as hell doing this stuff practically fool proof, so I feel your frustration there - just lost a tub that probably would have yielded over a pound to cobweb yesterday.

Now, based on what you are telling me - try different brown rice flour, never hurts to start making your own just get used to burning out motors in your ninjas and shit quickly.

What is the humidity in your house like?  I'm glad it is summer because all winter mine was at 10%...made for some very challenging rH levels in my SGT.  Isn't just the air inside the tub you have to worry about, I know, what a PITA... I feel for those who grow in the desert or in high elevation.

That being said, probably wouldn't hurt to use some new spores/genetics, I've had that fix this same problem before as well.  I tend not to use just one variety at a time, though.  More people at the poker table playing for you means better odds, yea?

Also, no reason your jars should be taking two months to colonize.  More like 3-4 weeks tops, and with liquid culture a hell of a lot faster - check out sugar in the raw turbinado liquid cultures. (My guess low colonization temperatures, bad multi-spore pick of the litter, or both, perhaps accompanied by using the wrong brand of organic brown rice flour, or vermiculite.)  Organic = must.  Vermiculite = you want fine professional grade.  Rough stuff sucks.

And yea, some grow details would probably help, pictures, etc.


Edited by plurfekt (05/19/15 03:32 AM)


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InvisibleSoupSandwich
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: plurfekt]
    #21697064 - 05/19/15 03:32 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I think some people only post their best grows, also, people exaggerating online? Unheard of!



Also, there's some truly gifted growers here! :thumbup: :heartpump:


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Invisibleplurfekt
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Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 1,919
Loc: USA
Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: SoupSandwich]
    #21697066 - 05/19/15 03:33 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

false.  i never posted the things i was most proud of, sorta thing that attracts the wrong kinds of attention.


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InvisibleSoupSandwich
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: SoupSandwich]
    #21697076 - 05/19/15 03:38 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I don't know what you're talking about... did you think I was specifically talking about you? Hardly.

As well, read my last sentence.


Quote:

SoupSandwich said:

Also, there's some truly gifted growers here! :thumbup: :heartpump:




Again, not talking about you here. :smile:


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OfflineYaMoonSun
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Registered: 10/23/14
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Loc: NY
Last seen: 5 months, 10 days
Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: TheFriedFrog]
    #21697099 - 05/19/15 04:00 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

" I've used multispore for every inoculation "

You'll get faster results with a LC :goodluck:


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Invisibleplurfekt
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Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 1,919
Loc: USA
Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: SoupSandwich]
    #21697104 - 05/19/15 04:03 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

SoupSandwich said:
I don't know what you're talking about... did you think I was specifically talking about you? Hardly.

As well, read my last sentence.





No, I did not.  I'm just not an idiot, and I've known quite a few of those gifted growers, and the best of which never pulled out the royal flush to impress people on the internet, if they were smart they used proper crypto just to show a friend, like me, usually not even on Shroomery through some other form of communication.  I doubt Shroomery wants that kind of exposure for the sake of peoples egos, correct me if I am wrong.


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InvisibleSoupSandwich
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: plurfekt]
    #21697113 - 05/19/15 04:10 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

You're sometimes wrong, I feel. For instance, your ego right now. :tongue:


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Invisibleplurfekt
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Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 1,919
Loc: USA
Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: SoupSandwich]
    #21697133 - 05/19/15 04:24 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

SoupSandwich said:
You're sometimes wrong, I feel. For instance, your ego right now. :tongue:




Your last rating "They should have never let you back after your ban.  You contribute nothing of value to this site at all.  Just another egotistical, argumentative child lashing out at those who have actually done something.  If I had a time machine, I'd take you back to 1971 and drop your ass in Vietnam so Charlie could skullfuck you."

Labeled "Troll"

I'd have to concur.  Bye bye


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Offlinefares
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Registered: 04/26/15
Posts: 43
Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: plurfekt]
    #21697138 - 05/19/15 04:28 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Change your spores print source, or buy lc or agar plate or clone a wild one (ideally)
And make sure all your ingredients are organic and don't forget to use distilled water or hard boil pipe water for 15 minutes to kickoff any cl


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Invisibleplurfekt
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Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 1,919
Loc: USA
Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: fares]
    #21697148 - 05/19/15 04:37 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Here are some shots I took recently of a Penis Envy 6 SITR LC I've had culturing for a bit.



Dat shittttt yo.

edit_

This is the classic baby bottle tek.  Very good for beginners, I use them for starter LC's to transfer to larger jars, or cake grows if I bother with cakes, which I don't anymore now that I have proper equipment for grains and such.



Edited by plurfekt (05/19/15 04:44 AM)


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OfflineShroominMe
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Registered: 05/03/15
Posts: 525
Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: plurfekt]
    #21697158 - 05/19/15 04:47 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I have had some success and a lot of failures.  I like to experiment too much, but that's on me :smile:

I'd suggest taking this as a challenge.  First of all, what is common to all of your grows?  As was suggested, changing spore vendors, using LC or other teks/substrates etc. 

I'd even go farther and suggest you change where you house your IC and FC.  Become absolutely fanatical about sterility.

The fact that you have had success is a good sign.  Success is in your grasp!!!


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OfflineCliftonGK1
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: ShroominMe]
    #21697194 - 05/19/15 05:21 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I've been playing around with spawn and hydration ratios for a few tubs, and they weren't fast.

Colonization to fruiting time took anywhere from 12 to 20 days, and fruiting took another week to 10 days after being introduced to FAE.

Three of my four conditions produced moderate flushes for the first, and reasonably heavy for the 2nd and 3rd.  One produced a reasonable 4th, while the other two were light.
The fourth condition produced a shitty first flush, a paltry second flush, and I doubt I'll see a third from it.

Experiment, document, modify.  It's home-lab science; learn from your mistakes and failures, and build off them.  I had SO MANY failures trying to go from BRF cakes to bulk tubs.  SO.  MANY.  It was disheartening, but I posted pix of things here, people pointed out what was wrong and all the symptoms I didn't recognize so that I could learn to see these things in the future.
I basically treated it like any of my other laboratory experiments, which, when I working with stuff like plasmid electroporesis, could take dozens of samples before coming up with a viable, working clone.


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InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: CliftonGK1]
    #21697433 - 05/19/15 07:45 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

OP a quick glance at your time lines and I'm actually not sure what the issue is. I'm not much of a cake guy but a week for germination and 6 to colonize is a little slow but nothing too horrible. If your using regular mouth half pints that might be tacking an extra week on.  1-2 weeks to pin is also pretty normal. If you consolidate it longer it will take less time to pin once birthed.

As for poor yields, provided you are doing a proper dunk and roll then I would either chalk it up to either poor fruiting conditions or poor luck with genetics. Usually with new growers its usually poor conditions.

I suggest you start a new grow, do a grow log on it, and take pics of everything.  That way if there is something your doing wrong we can point it out and possibly get ya some better results.


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OfflineKizzle
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #21697637 - 05/19/15 09:26 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

I started doing wbs to see if that went better - inoculated 6 quart jars about 3 weeks ago, they are now at about 15-20% colonization :mad:



That's not too bad if you're inoculating with spores, if you figure an extra week for spore germination. Once you shake them they finish up pretty quickly.


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OfflineRosen_Rot
Learning
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: Kizzle]
    #21697926 - 05/19/15 10:41 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Well I can't exactly pin point on what's wrong but for the sake of things not all of us are fast growers and lucrative, and those who are, has spent years with trial and error before they got the position and knowledge they have now.

I, for instance, had failed multiple times before I finally got the gist of things but then again I started straight onto monotubs with no experience to begin with.

I encourage you to continue trying and trying and don't ever take a no as an answer. Some of the users on here can be harsh but their hearts are in the right place.

I really doubt that people on here post only their success. This isn't facebook. I've seen countless of posts of people fucking up from minor fuck ups to huge fuck ups.

Have you tried growing in a different environment, like another apartment/modified garage space?

My suspicion would be that perhaps bacteria is what is slowing you down. Somehow I think it's getting into your grows and the myc is in a tough war nutrients. I personally wouldn't go for WBS, too dirty for me. Try oat kernels, wheat kernels and rye and see how that goes.

As mad season suggested, take pictures. I always take pictures of everything I do, for write ups and just in case I fuck up and need some advice.

I really hope you sort out this problem. I'm sorry I couldn't contribute much.

Also SoupSandwich you got bad ratings from some of the best members this forums has. When will you learn boy?


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Edited by Rosen_Rot (05/19/15 10:42 AM)


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Offlinekn33b
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: TheFriedFrog]
    #21697934 - 05/19/15 10:44 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Agar (for sure, even with MS) and (for some) liquid culture.


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OfflinecronicrFacebook
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: Kizzle]
    #21698087 - 05/19/15 11:34 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Kizzle said:
Quote:

I started doing wbs to see if that went better - inoculated 6 quart jars about 3 weeks ago, they are now at about 15-20% colonization :mad:



That's not too bad if you're inoculating with spores, if you figure an extra week for spore germination. Once you shake them they finish up pretty quickly.



:whathesaid: and once you have some colonized grain jars for masters it goes from being in your position now to having a hard time keeping up with yourself


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Invisiblewowimflabbergasted
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: cronicr]
    #21698107 - 05/19/15 11:41 AM (8 years, 8 months ago)

Right. :whathesaid:

I can go from a master jar in my fridge right now to having ounces of mushrooms in a month; usually about 10 days per step. 10 days jar colonization, 5-10 days bulk colonization, 10 days or so fruiting. Could be less with a wicked fast culture too.


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Invisible36fuckin5
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: wowimflabbergasted]
    #21698157 - 05/19/15 12:00 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

The solution to slow grows is to take a little more time and use agar to isolate a fast culture. Last time I ran PE6 I couldn't leave it alone for more than 2 hours once fruiting started or I'd have a giant mess.


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i recommend common sense and figuring it out.

These are the TEKs I use. They're all as cheap and easy as possible, just like your mom.


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OfflineMoxyOx
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Re: How the hell are you people so fast and lucrative with your grows? [Re: 36fuckin5]
    #21698279 - 05/19/15 12:44 PM (8 years, 8 months ago)

I've always had good luck with LC's. I inoculated a quart jar about 10 days ago and they're about done. Then again, I've been doing this on/off for like 4-5 years.

It takes time to get good at anything. You're going to fail, a lot. Part of the process.


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